Official Denver studs and duds

[Poppa San]

Officials: Dalton Risner was guilty of the most blatant instance I've ever seen of pulling a running into the endzone and they let the TD stand.

Mark Tauscher during his post game coverage Q&A seemed to imply this isn't a penalty anymore.

 

[greengold]

After reviewing this a number of times, here are some other thoughts:

Stud: Tremon Smith - Came in and saved the 60 yd return by DEN from becoming a TD. He’s got the same kind of ranging speed that Savage brings to the table.

Stud: ELGTON JENKINS - loved seeing Aaron Jones hand him the ball to spike it after Jones’ last TD run. This is one happy group of players, and Elgton did a great job yesterday.

 

[DarkHelmet]

I was driving so I had to listen on the radio. From that vantage point one of my biggest duds was the way the Packers' second offensive series ended. They had scored on the opening drive, then held Denver and forced a punt, then had a decent offensive series going, got over midfield. Then:

A running play that lost 3 yards. I seem to recall McCarren saying that Jimmy Graham whiffed on a block on this play.

Then an incomplete pass (way over the target -- slippery ball?)

Then the play clock ran down and they had to use a timeout. Hate that sort of sloppiness.

Then another incomplete. (to Allison -- either dropped or missed)

Then a punt. I don't like punting inside midfield, but Scott is good, so maybe we can pin the Broncs deep. Punt IS good . . . but Brown runs into the returner and the Broncs get 15 yards. They go on to score a touchdown and tie the game.

That sequence was bad football. It made me angry listening to it.

• 1st & 10 at DEN 40
  (8:56 - 1st) A.Jones right end to DEN 43 for -3 yards (K.Jackson).
  
  
• 2nd & 13 at DEN 43
  (8:15 - 1st) (Shotgun) A.Rodgers pass incomplete deep left to R.Tonyan.
  
  
• (8:07 - 1st) Timeout #1 by GB at 08:07.
  
• 3rd & 13 at DEN 43
  (8:07 - 1st) (Shotgun) A.Rodgers pass incomplete short middle to G.Allison.
  
• 4th & 13 at DEN 43
  (8:02 - 1st) J.Scott punts 35 yards to DEN 8, Center-H.Bradley, fair catch by D.Spencer. PENALTY on GB-T.Brown, Fair Catch Interference, 15 yards, enforced at DEN 8.

 

[PackFan2]

been saying that for a month.

Ive been saying that for years! Since the draft of years of Shazier ('14), Ted Thompson was not willing to draft linebackers to match modern day FAST football. Instead going for dudes like Jake Ryan, Nate Palmer and Sam Barrington who are too slow to cover. Glad we are changing into modern football, however we are still lacking that dynamic ILB, (We want Oren Burks to be that guy but Im not too high on Burks).

 

[PackFan2]

Stud: Defense, JK Scott.

Dud: MVS (the drops), play-calling (Need to get the ball in Davante Adams hands somehow).

I love how our defense is coming together and playing as a unit. The unsexy thing to talk about is our special unit. JK Scott continues to pin the opponents in their own endzone. Hope he keeps it up during the wintertime. *Still waiting for our offense to tick

 

[greengold]

I was driving so I had to listen on the radio. From that vantage point one of my biggest duds was the way the Packers' second offensive series ended. They had scored on the opening drive, then held Denver and forced a punt, then had a decent offensive series going, got over midfield. Then:

A running play that lost 3 yards. I seem to recall McCarren saying that Jimmy Graham whiffed on a block on this play.

Then an incomplete pass (way over the target -- slippery ball?)

Then the play clock ran down and they had to use a timeout. Hate that sort of sloppiness.

Then another incomplete. (to Allison -- either dropped or missed)

Then a punt. I don't like punting inside midfield, but Scott is good, so maybe we can pin the Broncs deep. Punt IS good . . . but Brown runs into the returner and the Broncs get 15 yards. They go on to score a touchdown and tie the game.

That sequence was bad football. It made me angry listening to it.

• 1st & 10 at DEN 40
  (8:56 - 1st) A.Jones right end to DEN 43 for -3 yards (K.Jackson).
  
  
• 2nd & 13 at DEN 43
  (8:15 - 1st) (Shotgun) A.Rodgers pass incomplete deep left to R.Tonyan.
  
  
• (8:07 - 1st) Timeout #1 by GB at 08:07.
• 3rd & 13 at DEN 43
  (8:07 - 1st) (Shotgun) A.Rodgers pass incomplete short middle to G.Allison.
• 4th & 13 at DEN 43
  (8:02 - 1st) J.Scott punts 35 yards to DEN 8, Center-H.Bradley, fair catch by D.Spencer. PENALTY on GB-T.Brown, Fair Catch Interference, 15 yards, enforced at DEN 8.

Hey DH, you know what it really was? It was Aaron Rodgers realizing when things get really hot, and I mean REALLY hot, he has one of the NFL’s top punters to turn to, rather than taking a pounding, a loss, or possibly giving up a TO. Seriously. I think we may see more sequences like that this season, and I’m OK with that!

I’m 100% certain that proved demoralizing to that DEN defense. Bringing their best stuff.... zeros in the stat sheet, and a clean uniform for Rodgers. Smart ****.

Who knew we would be seeing new strategeries like THAT? Nothing lost. Gives the D a blow. And, we flip field position, while getting the film on the oppositions’ best stuff - uh, not working - to make our own adjustments to. Brilliant. New blood.

Again, that’s some smart ****.

 

[Heyjoe4]

Ive been saying that for years! Since the draft of years of Shazier ('14), Ted Thompson was not willing to draft linebackers to match modern day FAST football. Instead going for dudes like Jake Ryan, Nate Palmer and Sam Barrington who are too slow to cover. Glad we are changing into modern football, however we are still lacking that dynamic ILB, (We want Oren Burks to be that guy but Im not too high on Burks).

My guess - Gluten fixes ILB in FA next year.

 

[Sunshinepacker]

I kind of feel like ppl are being overly critical of the ILB position; the projected starter is injured, to be clear, it is the least valuable position on the defense (seriously, edge rusher, DT, corner, and safety all rank above ILB). Yeah, it stinks that the Packers only have one pretty good ILB in Martinez, but the defense seems to be doing okay right now.

 

[greengold]

Agree Sunshine, but I’ll add Ty Summers is far better than people give him credit for.

Stud: Matt LaFleur. When asked why Vitale wasn’t given the ball to finish the TD: “He’s got to score. You can’t get tackled at the half-yard line.”

BTW LaFleur is impressing the H outta me with his command of this team thus far. Pretty cool to see and already exceeds my expectations.

 

[Pugger]

This cannot be emphasized enough. The defensive overhaul that he's been able to make in just two offseasons is extremely impressive, and to your point, acquired 4 starters just this offseason alone.

If Gute can be as successful adding talent to the offense this team will be even better in the future.

 

[Dantés]

I kind of feel like ppl are being overly critical of the ILB position; the projected starter is injured, to be clear, it is the least valuable position on the defense (seriously, edge rusher, DT, corner, and safety all rank above ILB). Yeah, it stinks that the Packers only have one pretty good ILB in Martinez, but the defense seems to be doing okay right now.

I think most are just pointing out the trouble it's in with the top three options all injured.

 

[GleefulGary]

Agree Sunshine, but I’ll add Ty Summers is far better than people give him credit for.

Which is why he hasn't played a defensive snap yet.

 

[greengold]

Which is why he hasn't played a defensive snap yet.

That’s great you feel that way. My thinking on it is very different.

LaFleur & Pettine have been diligent in using only their most trusted players Games 1-3 for the majority of snaps.

Summers has been in on the majority of STs snaps. At some point I think he will be brought in for D snaps. Led all NFL ILBs in tackles during preseason with a nice INT return for a TD. Pretty sure he’s OK.

 

[GleefulGary]

That’s great you feel that way. My thinking on it is very different.

LaFleur & Pettine have been diligent in using only their most trusted players Games 1-3 for the majority of snaps.

Summers has been in on the majority of STs snaps. At some point I think he will be brought in for D snaps and I think he will do fine.

Right. BJ Goodson, who is a scrub, came in and played pretty much right away. You telling me he's one of their most trusted already?

Summers is fine on special teams, but we're a team that has a weakness at ILB and he can't get on the field. It's blatantly obvious he's not as good as you think he is. Hell, if Curtis Bolton didn't get hurt, Summers probably doesn't make the team.

 

[gopkrs]

That’s great you feel that way. My thinking on it is very different.

LaFleur & Pettine have been diligent in using only their most trusted players Games 1-3 for the majority of snaps.

Summers has been in on the majority of STs snaps. At some point I think he will be brought in for D snaps. Led all NFL ILBs in tackles during preseason with a nice INT return for a TD. Pretty sure he’s OK.

Now all Summers has to do is learn to tackle someone one on one.

 

[HardRightEdge]

Oh, you & Sunshine have got to explain why! I’m dying to hear....

King was beaten on stop-and-go routes for big plays two weeks in a row. It's a vulnerability until proven otherwise.

 

[OldSchool101]

King was beaten on stop-and-go routes for big plays two weeks in a row. It's a vulnerability until proven otherwise.

He’s been what I call “porpoising” up and down
But he’s a micro player version of this entire macro team, whereas he’s leaning at getting better with time IMO.
Like many young players in the league, he needs more continuity and seasoning.

 

[greengold]

Right. BJ Goodson, who is a scrub, came in and played pretty much right away. You telling me he's one of their most trusted already?

Summers is fine on special teams, but we're a team that has a weakness at ILB and he can't get on the field. It's blatantly obvious he's not as good as you think he is. Hell, if Curtis Bolton didn't get hurt, Summers probably doesn't make the team.

I’m entitled to my own opinion. You don’t like it.

Funny, you’re crowning Bolton a better player after one preseason game where he showed well... uh, how different.

I felt Pettine made a mistake starting Goodson without more familiarity with his scheme and teammates, and I previously said that.

You’re entitled to your opinion.

 

[greengold]

King was beaten on stop-and-go routes for big plays two weeks in a row. It's a vulnerability until proven otherwise.

My point is: show me a top CB who DOESN’T get beat for a couple of gains in one game early in his career. He didn’t struggle the entire game as was intimated.

 

[RRyder]

That’s great you feel that way. My thinking on it is very different.

LaFleur & Pettine have been diligent in using only their most trusted players Games 1-3 for the majority of snaps.

Summers has been in on the majority of STs snaps. At some point I think he will be brought in for D snaps. Led all NFL ILBs in tackles during preseason with a nice INT return for a TD. Pretty sure he’s OK.

After all the preseason wonders that havent been able to anything after the real games start I've always wondered why people continue to fall back on these performances

I like Summers but Bolton was definitely better suited for the WILB. In any case until he actually gets real snaps we probably shouldnt anoint him as a legit NFL player just yet

 

[HardRightEdge]

So you think Jaire saw Diggs beat King at the beginning of his route and then he decided to leave his own responsibility before the ball was thrown in order to try and provide help? Cool story

Alexander himself said he messed up. I love Jaire. It's ok to point out when a player you like messes up. Both he and King got beat on a play. It really is ok

Yes and no. After looking at this play over a dozen times in slo-mo on the coaches tape, here's my breakdown.

• Savage and Alexander were set about 10 yards deep on this 3rd. and 13 play, with Williams set in front of them about 5 yards deep over a 3 receiver in-line bunch: the TE, Theilen and Bebe. Savage was set just inside the hash, Alexander just inside the numbers.
• Martinez and Fackrell were lined up at ILB and showed blitz, then dropped into short zone coverage with Redmond and Amos coming on the blitz off the right side.
• As the play evolves, we see King in man coverage on Diggs, everybody else in zone.

Here's where it gets interesting.

• Off the snap, we see Alexander giving Savage a hand signal. He's indicating to Savage to pick up Bebe and then bolts to the end zone.
• Did Alexander see the TE stepping back off the snap indicating max protection? Did he see Thielen not releasing off the snap as though he was there to chip if necessary with Williams in position to cover on a delayed release? Did he see this max protection off the snap as freeing himself up to find work with the obvious place to find it downfield, with that max protection saying it's going deep? I would think so.

So, did he leave his man? No. He was in zone coverage on the opposite side of the field. Whether you'd call him a zone corner or the outside safety on that play with Redmond blitzing is a distinction without a difference. Did he see King was beaten? No. He was off and running after that hand signal off the snap.

What I see is brilliant bit of read and react to the max protection with a bit of split second coverage orchestration thrown in. Did Alexander mess up? Well, I'm sure he's disappointed in letting the ball go through his hands for TD. Would PFF grade that play a minus? Maybe.

The question to ask is how many cornerbacks in this league would even be at the ball from that position and that initital responsibility on this play? D*mn few. It was pretty remarkable, actually.

 

[HardRightEdge]

My point is: show me a top CB who DOESN’T get beat for a couple of gains in one game early in his career. He didn’t struggle the entire game as was intimated.

He’s been what I call “porpoising” up and down
But he’s a micro player version of this entire macro team, whereas he’s leaning at getting better with time IMO.
Like many young players in the league, he needs more continuity and seasoning.

There's also the question of his zone awareness. We had that sideline throw where he was low in a low/high coverage where he quit on the vertical sideline route looking around to see who else might be coming his way. There isn't time for, "wait, what?"

I'm not talking about what he might become. I'm talking about who his is now, and there are holes in his game. Not as many as in his rookie season, which is encouraging, but holes nonetheless.

 

[GleefulGary]

I’m entitled to my own opinion. You don’t like it.

Funny, you’re crowning Bolton a better player after one preseason game where he showed well... uh, how different.

I felt Pettine made a mistake starting Goodson without more familiarity with his scheme and teammates, and I previously said that.

You’re entitled to your opinion.

No. I'm saying Bolton is better because:

1) He plays a different position. He can play next to Martinez.
2) Bolton played ahead of Summers post Burks injury.

It's just simple math.

 

[greengold]

No. I'm saying Bolton is better because:

1) He plays a different position. He can play next to Martinez.
2) Bolton played ahead of Summers post Burks injury.

It's just simple math.

Really, it is no big thing. We are all just fans, we have our own favorite players here and there. Cheers bud.

 

[greengold]

Yes and no. After looking at this play over a dozen times in slo-mo on the coaches tape, here's my breakdown.

• Savage and Alexander were set about 10 yards deep on this 3rd. and 13 play, with Williams set in front of them about 5 yards deep over a 3 receiver in-line bunch: the TE, Theilen and Bebe. Savage was set just inside the hash, Alexander just inside the numbers.
• Martinez and Fackrell were lined up at ILB and showed blitz, then dropped into short zone coverage with Redmond and Amos coming on the blitz off the right side.
• As the play evolves, we see King in man coverage on Diggs, everybody else in zone.

Here's where it gets interesting.

• Off the snap, we see Alexander giving Savage a hand signal. He's indicating to Savage to pick up Bebe and then bolts to the end zone.
• Did Alexander see the TE stepping back off the snap indicating max protect? Did he see Thielen not releasing off the snap as though he was there to chip if necessary with Williams in position to cover on a delayed release? Did he see Minnesota in this max protect off the snap freeing himself up to find work with the obvious place to find it downfield, with max protection saying it's going deep? I would think so.

So, did he leave his man? No. He was in zone coverage on the opposite side of the field. Whether you'd call him in a corner or the outside safety on that play is a distinction without a difference. Did he see King was beaten? No. He was off and running after that hand signal off the snap.

What I see is brilliant bit of read and react to the max protection with a bit of split second coverage orchestration thrown in. Did Alexander mess up? Well, I'm sure he's disappointed in letting the ball go through his hands for TD. Would PFF grade that play a minus? Maybe.

The question to ask is how many cornerbacks in this league would even be at the ball from that position and that initital responsibility on this play? D*mn few. It was pretty remarkable, actually.

Phenomenal play by Jaire Alexander, and he said he lost it in the sun. Had he not, I’m sure he would have had the INT.