Packers vs Saints Preseason Game 2: Game Thread

[Heyjoe4]

Well if the 49'ers release Garoppolo, which it appears that they will, if they can't work a trade.....I'm sure some here would prefer the Packers cut Love and sign Jimmy G.

I don't think the Niners can work a trade for Garropolo. My guess is that at least for this season, he'll be a very expensive backup.

 

[OldSchool101]

I’ve never fully understood decisions our FO makes on aging players. While I understand the general principle of moving on from a player a year too early is better, I don’t think that’s the case at HOF QB, HOF WR or the like. The Jerry Rice types you milk every last drop until they are empty.
I don’t know the talk going on for the last couple of seasons “behind the scenes” with #12. My hypothesis is that Rodgers gave our FO reason to believe he wasn’t committed anymore. The specific and public threats of retirement or being traded did not help his longevity with GB. His personality can sometimes be a bit vindictive in nature, but employers have to take threats seriously.
That said. We can “like” the response or “not like” that response (which ended up being our FO drafting of a QB with relatively limited resources). Having a late Date 1 selection is rarely enough firepower to get a quick reliable answer. So the next scenario I’d go “high ceiling” with medium firepower. There are risks involved. All this said, I’m going to guess it was the right thing to do. Can you imagine had Rodgers bailed out with no immediate answers? We’d be even more furious with Brian for allowing that.

I just don’t see beating up a GM for only doing what he thought was a reasonable response to a major predicament. Especially now that we actually got a best case outcome. We negotiated with #12 to buy his allegiance for a reasonable $$ .
We also have that “high ceiling” guy starting to get primed at QB. At this rate, if Jordan keeps a slow and steady improvement, we’ll have 2 options at starting QB by 2023-2024. That’s really almost an ideal scenario when a team has a 40 year old at the helm. I’m guessing many franchises would love to be in our shoes at QB room.
As far as Jimmy G. I wouldn’t trade a 23 year old making 3.3M to overpay Garapolo $30M, which really isn’t much better upgrade, to be frank

 

[Pkrjones]

I don't think the Niners can work a trade for Garropolo. My guess is that at least for tis season, he'll be a very expensive backup.

If Garoppolo isn't starting the 9'ers will either trade or cut him and save $25.5Mil on the cap. On 9/11 @ noon his $24.2Mil salary becomes guaranteed ~ Lynch won't allow that to happen, IMHO. Agree with Mondio that Garoppolo offers GB nothing more than Love, and IMHO Love's ceiling is much higher.

 

[Heyjoe4]

I’ve never fully understood decisions our FO makes on aging players. While I understand the general principle of moving on from a player a year too early is better, I don’t think that’s the case at HOF QB, HOF WR or the like. The Jerry Rice types you milk every last drop until they are empty.
I don’t know the talk going on for the last couple of seasons “behind the scenes” with #12. My hypothesis is that Rodgers gave our FO reason to believe he wasn’t committed anymore. The specific and public threats of retirement or being traded did not help his longevity with GB. His personality can sometimes be a bit vindictive in nature, but employers have to take threats seriously.
That said. We can “like” the response or “not like” that response (which ended up being our FO drafting of a QB with relatively limited resources). Having a late Date 1 selection is rarely enough firepower to get a quick reliable answer. So the next scenario I’d go “high ceiling” with medium firepower. There are risks involved. All this said, I’m going to guess it was the right thing to do. Can you imagine had Rodgers bailed out with no immediate answers? We’d be even more furious with Brian for allowing that.

I just don’t see beating up a GM for only doing what he thought was a reasonable response to a major predicament. Especially now that we actually got a best case outcome. We negotiated with #12 to buy his allegiance for a reasonable $$ .
We also have that “high ceiling” guy starting to get primed at QB. At this rate, if Jordan keeps a slow and steady improvement, we’ll have 2 options at starting QB by 2023-2024. That’s really almost an ideal scenario when a team has a 40 year old at the helm.

I think Gluten really believed Rodgers was on his last legs when he drafted Love. And just like Wolf and TT had made their marks by bringing in franchise QBs, Gluten had to make his mark.

It turns out he was wrong, but that's not his fault. There were fans who were thinking the same thing. And then Rodgers goes out and wins two consecutive MVPs in his late 30s. Maybe he'll make it three. Go figure.

As far as replacing an aging star a year too early, I believe in that. The tricky part is figuring out exactly when that time has come. It would be nice if players stayed with one team for their entire careers, but that's a fantasy. The FO sees a guy on his way out, the player sees himself as having at least several more years. But it does look like Rodgers will finish his career in GB. That's rare.

 

[Heyjoe4]

If Garoppolo isn't starting the 9'ers will either trade or cut him and save $25.5Mil on the cap. On 9/11 @ noon his $24.2Mil salary becomes guaranteed ~ Lynch won't allow that to happen, IMHO. Agree with Mondio that Garoppolo offers GB nothing more than Love, and IMHO Love's ceiling is much higher.

I didn't know that Garropolo's salary wasn't guaranteed until 9/11/2022. In that case, agreed they'll cut him if they can't trade him.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

If Garoppolo isn't starting the 9'ers will either trade or cut him and save $25.5Mil on the cap. On 9/11 @ noon his $24.2Mil salary becomes guaranteed ~ Lynch won't allow that to happen, IMHO. Agree with Mondio that Garoppolo offers GB nothing more than Love, and IMHO Love's ceiling is much higher.

Yeah, the 9'ers won't be keeping him, way to much savings by letting him go. I said the Packers and Garoppolo tongue and cheek. I'm fine with waiting out the Love pick and see what happens. If Rodgers goes down, I don't think it is going to make a big difference as to who the next Packer QB is this season, since any hopes of a SB will be lost.

 

[OldSchool101]

I think Gluten really believed Rodgers was on his last legs when he drafted Love. And just like Wolf and TT had made their marks by bringing in franchise QBs, Gluten had to make his mark.

It turns out he was wrong, but that's not his fault. There were fans who were thinking the same thing. And then Rodgers goes out and wins two consecutive MVPs in his late 30s. Maybe he'll make it three. Go figure.

As far as replacing an aging star a year too early, I believe in that. The tricky part is figuring out exactly when that time has come. It would be nice if players stayed with one team for their entire careers, but that's a fantasy. The FO sees a guy on his way out, the player sees himself as having at least several more years. But it does look like Rodgers will finish his career in GB. That's rare.

I agree with almost everything you said here. As a side note, Rodgers was still under firm contract and Love was a known project. Another avenue to handle an aging QB is to keep him and groom a contingency plan. But yeah I agree, Rodgers productivity did drop substantially in 2018-2019 and had it dropped again in 2020 we could’ve been in a predicament.

I think Brian could’ve handled the situation better, but that’s just merely my opinion. I would’ve involved #12 before choosing a QB out of respect for him and what he’s accomplished. That’s just me though. It’s not always what we do, it’s how we go about doing it that people remember.

 

[Heyjoe4]

I agree with almost everything you said here. As a side note, Rodgers was still under firm contract and Love was a known project. Another avenue to handle an aging QB is to keep him and groom a contingency plan. But yeah I agree, Rodgers productivity did drop substantially in 2018-2019 and had it dropped again in 2020 we could’ve been in a predicament.

I think Brian could’ve handled the situation better, but that’s just merely my opinion. I would’ve involved #12 before choosing a QB out of respect for him and what he’s accomplished. That’s just me though. It’s not always what we do, it’s how we go about doing it that people remember.

 

[Heyjoe4]

I guess it's one thing for "Brian" to let Rodgers know he's probably gonna take a QB in the draft, and another thing to get Rodgers opinion on who to select. Gluten knows who the prospects are much better than Rodgers, and it's Gluten's team after all. I still think Gluten ****** up by not involving Rodgers more, but that's in the past and now Rodgers seems to be all in. And at $50 mil/year he should be.

I'll worry more about who GB's next QB is when that time actually comes. Hell it could be next year or three years from now. Love may decide he's waited long enough and demand a trade, or more likely a release due to lack of trade value. Gluten is the GM and it's his job to give MLF the guys ne needs. Good luck when it comes to QB. I'm not sure who the next Packers's QB will be. I'm doubtfiul it will be Love, but I don't care if he can step up and prove he's the guy.

 

[longtimefan]

Two things. 1) It's not that Love can't make good throws, clearly he can. It's about consistency, and making accurate throws on the the basic ones. I was listening on the radio and on the first or second drive Love missed a throw and McCarren was going on about how it's a throw an NFL QB just has to make. 2) Looking like a backup / low level starter isn't the same as looking like a solid NFL QB. How much weight you give his trajectory vs how much weight you give his current level and his weaknesses will determine your current opinion of him.

So rock says one negative statement and thats all you hear?

 

[longtimefan]

I think Garropolo is a better QB than Love, and that's based mostly on regular season and playoff game experience. I also think Garropolo is starting-QB material in the NFL, but in the last tier as far as ability, whatever that is. He's not gonna take a team to the SB.

But it wouldn't work in GB because Garropolo, even after taking a huge pay cut, is gonna be too expensive for a backup. It just won't work. Maybe some day, but not until Garropolo can be proven to be no more than a backup.

Love is the guy for now, and by that I mean the guy who will replace Rodgers. We don't know when Rodgers will call it a day, hell Rodgers probably doesn't know. So unless Gluten has another guy he's considering, Love is it.

It was interesting - MLF was being interviewed after the Saints game and he was asked what he thought of Etling. I was kinda stunned when MLF said Etling's play was making their decision tougher. I assume that means the decision on who will be the backup. I think that's just MLF using the press to play mind games with Love.

Why is it always negative notions people pick when it comes to these things?

Why couldnt it be if he meant do we keep him on the squad or on ps, or trade him

You and others need to understand love is the back up and I believe 2024 is the starter

This the quote?

And he’s a hell of a worker. Every day after practice, he’s out there throwing to some of our equipment managers and getting guys in the right spot because you don’t get the reps that you need. And so he loves this. He loves it. He is fully invested, fully committed to be the best player he can be. It’s tough

 

[Heyjoe4]

Why is it always negative notions people pick when it comes to these things?

Why couldnt it be if he meant do we keep him on the squad or on ps, or trade him

You and others need to understand love is the back up and I believe 2024 is the starter

This the quote?

And he’s a hell of a worker. Every day after practice, he’s out there throwing to some of our equipment managers and getting guys in the right spot because you don’t get the reps that you need. And so he loves this. He loves it. He is fully invested, fully committed to be the best player he can be. It’s tough

I'm just repeating an MLF quote. My interpretation is one way to look at it. As for other interpretations, they're not gonna keep 3 QBs on the 53, MLF is not gonna stress about keeping a QB on the PS. C'mon. He's putting some pressure on Love. And he should.

 

[longtimefan]

I'm just repeating an MLF quote. My interpretation is one way to look at it. As for other interpretations, they're not gonna keep 3 QBs on the 53, MLF is not gonna stress about keeping a QB on the PS. C'mon. He's putting some pressure on Love. And he should.

Lmao..pressure? He doesnt need to apply any. Come on now.

And I asked if that was his quote. If that was the quote, then your so engrained love is done that any thing can be negative

 

[Deleted member 6794]

If Rodgers retires after this year, well unless something miraculous happens, Love is the guy.

I'm quite sure the Packers would bring in competition for Love if Rodgers retires after this season.

It was interesting - MLF was being interviewed after the Saints game and he was asked what he thought of Etling. I was kinda stunned when MLF said Etling's play was making their decision tougher. I assume that means the decision on who will be the backup. I think that's just MLF using the press to play mind games with Love.

There's absolutely no doubt Love will be the Packers' backup quarterback this season. Etling might have a chance to stick around on the practice squad though.

I don’t know the talk going on for the last couple of seasons “behind the scenes” with #12. My hypothesis is that Rodgers gave our FO reason to believe he wasn’t committed anymore. The specific and public threats of retirement or being traded did not help his longevity with GB. His personality can sometimes be a bit vindictive in nature, but employers have to take threats seriously.
That said. We can “like” the response or “not like” that response (which ended up being our FO drafting of a QB with relatively limited resources). Having a late Date 1 selection is rarely enough firepower to get a quick reliable answer. So the next scenario I’d go “high ceiling” with medium firepower. There are risks involved. All this said, I’m going to guess it was the right thing to do. Can you imagine had Rodgers bailed out with no immediate answers? We’d be even more furious with Brian for allowing that.

Rodgers didn't hint on wanting to retire or be traded before the Packers selected Love though. Even after that Rodgers stayed quiet for the entire 2020 season. Therefore the timeline you suggested isn't accurate by any means.

I just don’t see beating up a GM for only doing what he thought was a reasonable response to a major predicament. Especially now that we actually got a best case outcome. We negotiated with #12 to buy his allegiance for a reasonable $$ .

Actually the best case scenario would have been to win a Super Bowl in any of the past two seasons. Most of every prospect available at #30 would have improved the team's chances of achieving that.

I think Gluten really believed Rodgers was on his last legs when he drafted Love. And just like Wolf and TT had made their marks by bringing in franchise QBs, Gluten had to make his mark.

Unfortunately I believe that Wolf and TT having had tremendous success acquiring Favre and Rodgers led to Gutekunst forcing the issue of trying to find his own guy.

I'll worry more about who GB's next QB is when that time actually comes. Hell it could be next year or three years from now. Love may decide he's waited long enough and demand a trade, or more likely a release due to lack of trade value.

The Packers won't release Love next offseason as his salary is fully guaranteed.

 

[Heyjoe4]

Now I need to get something off my chest. Every time someone posts anything even resembling a negative comment about Love, they get chastised. So for the record, here's what I see:

Love is, at his best, an average backup QB in the NFL. He might break through to be a starter someday, but not based on his three PS performances since being drafted, and limited regular season experience. Not even close. He has three PS games to play next year, and barring a miracle, I don't think he will improve enough to be a quality starter. If Rodgers stays, Love will be the backup. If Rodgers leaves, as Cap noted, Gluten will bring in competition for the starting job. Love hasn't come close to winning that.

Gluten simply jumped the shark when he moved up to draft Love. It's one of the few mistakes he's made as a GM. He needed to make his mark as a GM, and he missed. It happens. Fortunately Rodgers was nowhere close to being done.

Thankfully the next game we see will be in Minnesota in the opener with Rodgers at QB. For all of our sakes, I hope he stays healthy and I hope the Packers have another great year.

And that's it from me regarding Love until next summer, or heaven forbid, we see him in a regular season game in other than a mop up role. I actually hope that all of us who have questioned Love's ability are wrong and he's GB's third HOF QB in a row. I'm happy to be wrong about this. But I just don'e see it happening with Love.

So there you go. you can continue to rave about this guy, tell me (again) how wrong I am about him - that's all fine, have at it. But I'm done commenting on this topic for now. Full Stop.

 

[Heyjoe4]

I'm quite sure the Packers would bring in competition for Love if Rodgers retires after this season.



There's absolutely no doubt Love will be the Packers' backup quarterback this season. Etling might have a chance to stick around on the practice squad though.



Rodgers didn't hint on wanting to retire or be traded before the Packers selected Love though. Even after that Rodgers stayed quiet for the entire 2020 season. Therefore the timeline you suggested isn't accurate by any means.



Actually the best case scenario would have been to win a Super Bowl in any of the past two seasons. Most of every prospect available at #30 would have improved the team's chances of achieving that.



Unfortunately I believe that Wolf and TT having had tremendous success acquiring Favre and Rodgers led to Gutekunst forcing the issue of trying to find his own guy.



The Packers won't release Love next offseason as his salary is fully guaranteed.

Where have you been Cap?!? I missed your nitpicking (no, not really). Anyway, I hope you were on holiday in the Swiss Alps or something fun.

I don't know about you, but I'm ready for the season to start. Every season opener now may be Rodgers' last, so we better enjoy that while it lasts. I'm encouraged by the defense and anxious to see what they've got - and equally anxious to see if Bisaccia has stopped the bleeding on STs. Could this be the year where the D outright wins a few games?

As for the WR group, well I'm grateful that one of the rookies - Doubs - has stepped up big time. I hope that continues. I think it will be a while though before we see much from Watson, given his limited time in camp and the PS.

Is Crosby's knee problem enough to end his career? Don't know but it's really strange he didn't kick in the PS. I don't even know who his backup would be. I think they've looked at a few guys.

And the really good news about the regular season is that we can stop speculating on the backup QB situation, well at least until next summer.

That's it. Welcome back and Go Packers!

 

[longtimefan]

No speculation on back up.. Its love..

No one can prove it was a mistake to draft him until he has a chance to start.

No one knows what was going on behind the scenes.. So to say he was a mistake is wrong imo. Just as me saying he will be a great or good player is wrong.

 

[Poppa San]

I don't even know who his backup would be.

Unless there was a kicking competition in someone else's camp I didn't pay attention too, I'd guess the backup is the guy that kicked in KC game.

 

[OldSchool101]

Rodgers didn't hint on wanting to retire or be traded before the Packers selected Love though. Even after that Rodgers stayed quiet for the entire 2020 season. Therefore the timeline you suggested isn't accurate by any means.

It’s very naive to think that #12 just woke up one Spring morning in 2021 and became upset. Like nearly every controversy or soured relationship in life, the stuff had been brewing for years. Gluten hiring Love and Rodgers holding out was only the culmination of a near decade of singular events. Its obvious you feel compelled to choose years and years of selective amnesia to defend your position though. (I’ve been waiting 3 years to use that sleepy emoticon so thank you?!)

Actually the best case scenario would have been to win a Super Bowl in any of the past two seasons. Most of every prospect available at #30 would have improved the team's chances of achieving that.

I noticed something interesting about you. You play both sides of an argument to fit your narrative.

You say on 1 side essentially.. “Rookies can’t help a team, we need PROOF!” You do it to a fault also.
However, when it supports your narrative? you imply a 2020 Rookie WR will turn the tide to Win a Super Bowl?? (See your above comment)

Which one is it? I’d really like to know
1. Do rookie WR’s push a team to Super Bowl levels? Correct me but didn’t we just choose one at #34 overall??

Gluten simply jumped the shark when he moved up to draft Love. It's one of the few mistakes he's made as a GM. He needed to make his mark as a GM, and he missed. It happens. Fortunately Rodgers was nowhere close to being done.

It’s easy to criticize a person (or in this case and entire personnel staff) without having any knowledge whatsoever of the circumstances involved. As casual fans we have a minuscule amount of knowledge of the events leading up to the draft. But I suppose it’s fun to try to act like we knew better than them on some virtual level.

PS. I’m glad you’re done discussing it so I have one less person to wrestle!

 

[Deleted member 6794]

Where have you been Cap?!? I missed your nitpicking (no, not really). Anyway, I hope you were on holiday in the Swiss Alps or something fun.

Maybe I didn't post for a day or two over the past few weeks but not enough time passed in between posts for me to having been on a vacation

Is Crosby's knee problem enough to end his career? Don't know but it's really strange he didn't kick in the PS. I don't even know who his backup would be. I think they've looked at a few guys.

It seems Crosby is on pace to be ready for the season opener. I fully expect him to be the team's kicker this season once again.

I guess the Packers will try to stash Ramiz Ahmed on their practice squad to have another kicker around.

It’s very naive to think that #12 just woke up one Spring morning in 2021 and became upset. Like nearly every controversy or soured relationship in life, the stuff had been brewing for years. Gluten hiring Love and Rodgers holding out was only the culmination of a near decade of singular events.

I don't think there's any truth to that at all. Rodgers was pretty adamant about wanting to play his entire career for the Packers as well as playing into his 40s before Love was drafted.

He decided to keep quiet in the best interest of the team during the 2020 season but he lost his composure after they lost to the Bucs in the NFCCG.

Gutekunst only having been in charge for two years at the time Love was drafted strongly indicates Rodgers' issues with him had been going on for a decade.

I noticed something interesting about you. You play both sides of an argument to fit your narrative.

You say on 1 side essentially.. “Rookies can’t help a team, we need PROOF!” You do it to a fault also.
However, when it supports your narrative? you imply a 2020 Rookie WR will turn the tide to Win a Super Bowl?? (See your above comment)

Which one is it? I’d really like to know
1. Do rookie WR’s push a team to Super Bowl levels? Correct me but didn’t we just choose one at #34 overall??

Please show me a single post in which I mentioned a rookie can't help a team. I spare you a lot of time, you won't be able to find one.

 

[Schultz]

It’s very naive to think that #12 just woke up one Spring morning in 2021 and became upset. Like nearly every controversy or soured relationship in life, the stuff had been brewing for years. Gluten hiring Love and Rodgers holding out was only the culmination of a near decade of singular events. Its obvious you feel compelled to choose years and years of selective amnesia to defend your position though. (I’ve been waiting 3 years to use that sleepy emoticon so thank you?!)

I noticed something interesting about you. You play both sides of an argument to fit your narrative.

You say on 1 side essentially.. “Rookies can’t help a team, we need PROOF!” You do it to a fault also.
However, when it supports your narrative? you imply a 2020 Rookie WR will turn the tide to Win a Super Bowl?? (See your above comment)

Which one is it? I’d really like to know
1. Do rookie WR’s push a team to Super Bowl levels? Correct me but didn’t we just choose one at #34 overall??

It’s easy to criticize a person (or in this case and entire personnel staff) without having any knowledge whatsoever of the circumstances involved. As casual fans we have a minuscule amount of knowledge of the events leading up to the draft. But I suppose it’s fun to try to act like we knew better than them on some virtual level.

PS. I’m glad you’re done discussing it so I have one less person to wrestle!

I hate handicap matches.

 

[Heyjoe4]

Maybe I didn't post for a day or two over the past few weeks but not enough time passed in between posts for me to having been on a vacation



It seems Crosby is on pace to be ready for the season opener. I fully expect him to be the team's kicker this season once again.

I guess the Packers will try to stash Ramiz Ahmed on their practice squad to have another kicker around.






I don't think there's any truth to that at all. Rodgers was pretty adamant about wanting to play his entire career for the Packers as well as playing into his 40s before Love was drafted.

He decided to keep quiet in the best interest of the team during the 2020 season but he lost his composure after they lost to the Bucs in the NFCCG.

Gutekunst only having been in charge for two years at the time Love was drafted strongly indicates Rodgers' issues with him had been going on for a decade.



Please show me a single post in which I mentioned a rookie can't help a team. I spare you a lot of time, you won't be able to find one.

Yeah I guess we will have another season of Crosby and that's fine as long as his performance doesn't decline. I'm not sure about his injury or if he had his knee scoped. I thought he did but might be confusing him with Watson.

I do hope they can get Ahmed past waivers and put him on the PS. It was only the PS but he looked pretty good. Finding a franchise kicker is just hard. Spend a #3 or #4 pick and it's a pretty big risk. And no one will trade a franchise kicker, not for value anyway.

 

[Pkrjones]

The Panthers are in need of a kicker & kicking the tires of Eddie Piniero today. Ahmed was perfect over 2 games, 3 FG's & 3 Extra Pts. If cut I'm not sure he'd make it thru waivers. I hope Gute keeps Crosby on PUP for first 4 weeks & rolls with Ahmed...allows a month for Crosby to further heal and for Gute to decide future kicker.
Ahmed either needs to kickoff out of the end zone OR hang it higher giving coverage team a better chance to get down field.

 

[Heyjoe4]

The Panthers are in need of a kicker & kicking the tires of Eddie Piniero today. Ahmed was perfect over 2 games, 3 FG's & 3 Extra Pts. If cut I'm not sure he'd make it thru waivers. I hope Gute keeps Crosby on PUP for first 4 weeks & rolls with Ahmed...allows a month for Crosby to further heal and for Gute to decide future kicker.
Ahmed either needs to kickoff out of the end zone OR hang it higher giving coverage team a better chance to get down field.

So Ahmed can't kick the ball into or out of the end zone? Given the Packers' current level of STs play, that could be disastrous. But we don't know if Crosby can still do that either.

I don't think they'll keep two kickers on the 53. They'll have to roll the dice with Ahmed and waive him. Hopefully he clears.

Eddie Piniero - that name sounds familiar. Is he like a serial kicker-of-last-resort for the NFL? You know, the guys who are stocking shelves at Ace Hardware when they get a call for a tryout. LOL. It does happen. I think that's how Kurt Warner got his start, or restart, in the NFL.

 

[Pkrjones]

So Ahmed can't kick the ball into or out of the end zone? Given the Packers' current level of STs play, that could be disastrous. But we don't know if Crosby can still do that either.

Against KC Ahmed was kicking off 6-7 yds deep into the end zone (line drives) & KC ran it out. He either needs another 3 yds OR work on hang time. I believe Crosby usually hangs it high but ball only gets between end zone & 5 yd line forcing run backs. Crosby's touchback rate has been between 45-62% over last 4 years - higher than I would've expected prior to looking it up.