Packers vs Browns Pre Season Game thread

tynimiller

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I agree , but he is suppose to bring the power .

Not how the human body works...if he cannot get momentum even started it cannot do anything.


Another separate observation was my boy Robert Rochell looks legit the part and I think may lock up a depth spot here in GB
 

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I agree , but he is suppose to bring the power .
I saw one series in Q1 where it seemed like Dillon ran two or three times, was stood up at or behind the LOS, and just went down. I don't expect him to break off a 20 yard run in those situations, but I do expect that he's strong enough to at least get a yard or three. Just not happening. Not much different than last year. Teams are going for it a lot on 4th and 1. Would be nice to have a guy to count on to get that without a lot of dancing around.
 

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Not how the human body works...if he cannot get momentum even started it cannot do anything.


Another separate observation was my boy Robert Rochell looks legit the part and I think may lock up a depth spot here in GB
Robert Rochell? Can you tell us more Ty?
 

tynimiller

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Robert Rochell? Can you tell us more Ty?

Rochell was my small school crush back in 2021 draft cycle. He was an early favorite getting a 5th round grade before testing and before additional tape. You can find an April of 2021 post of mine where I settled on him as a 3rd rounder IMO but predicted likely could see Day3:

Third Round
D'wayne Eskridge WR
Amari Rodgers WR
Ihmir Smith-Marsette WR
Tommy Doyle OT
Stone Forsythe OT
Alim McNeil iDL
Robert Rochell CB/S
Ambry Thomas CB
Benjamin St. Juste CB
Tommy Tremble TE
Ben Cleveland OG
Caden Sterns S
Osa Odighizuwa iDL
Cameron Sample DE/DT/EDGE

While a very highly toolsy and skilled athlete he had the hurdle of coming from Central Arkansas to the NFL.

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The Rams would draft him in the fourth round of that draft and truthfully he put together a rather solid rookie campaign for them albeit on limited...his second year he got out punched for much play at corner but exploded as a 70%+ type ST guy who excelled on that front but just couldn't find a spot so they released him...spent some time on Seattle's and Carolina's practice squads last season before we signed him and he quickly earned a lot of snaps on ST plays.


He left Cleveland as the highest PFF graded defensive player for GB...which is pretty slick because he also saw the fourth most snaps at 31 (Goforth 40, King 34 and AJ Jr 33 were only folks with more defensive snaps). Rochell showed what I saw in Central Arkansas a lot on saturday and that was timing of attack, while he has gathered a lot of interceptions over his years, he really seems to acknowledge and know in the moment whether he is attacking to go for the ball or attacking to disrupt.

With the log jam forming in our CB room IF Stokes is back, Valentine wasn't a fluke and King was a steal (and still Jaire out there)....I actually think Rochell for sure has the ability and the skills to be our CB5 and more valuable to us than Nixon....who continues to confirm to me he is an average corner and elite returner.
 
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Heyjoe4

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Rochell was my small school crush back in 2021 draft cycle. He was an early favorite getting a 5th round grade before testing and before additional tape. You can find an April of 2021 post of mine where I settled on him as a 3rd rounder IMO but predicted likely could see Day3:



While a very highly toolsy and skilled athlete he had the hurdle of coming from Central Arkansas to the NFL.

You must be logged in to see this image or video!


The Rams would draft him in the fourth round of that draft and truthfully he put together a rather solid rookie campaign for them albeit on limited...his second year he got out punched for much play at corner but exploded as a 70%+ type ST guy who excelled on that front but just couldn't find a spot so they released him...spent some time on Seattle's and Carolina's practice squads last season before we signed him and he quickly earned a lot of snaps on ST plays.


He left Cleveland as the highest PFF graded defensive player for GB...which is pretty slick because he also saw the third most snaps at 31 (Goforth 40, King 34 and AJ Jr 33 were only folks with more defensive snaps). Rochell showed what I saw in Central Arkansas a lot on saturday and that was timing of attack, while he has gathered a lot of interceptions over his years, he really seems to acknowledge and know in the moment whether he is attacking to go for the ball or attacking to disrupt.

With the log jam forming in our CB room IF Stokes is back, Valentine wasn't a fluke and King was a steal (and still Jaire out there)....I actually think Rochell for sure has the ability and the skills to be our CB5 and more valuable to us than Nixon....who continues to confirm to me he is an average corner and elite returner.
Thanks for all the info on Rochell Ty, much appreciated. Central Arkansas? Is Arkansas even big enough to have a central region? OK I'm kidding but yeah, not exactly a great pedigree for the NFL. Your analysis was confirmed when the Rams took him in round 4.

Can't have enough solid CBs on the team. I do agree that Nixon is, at best, an average CB but a stud as a returner. Sounds like Rochell is also a solid STs guy. I'll watch his progress in the PS. Thanks again for spotting what might be a diamond in the rough.
 

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Thanks for all the info on Rochell Ty, much appreciated. Central Arkansas? Is Arkansas even big enough to have a central region? OK I'm kidding but yeah, not exactly a great pedigree for the NFL. Your analysis was confirmed when the Rams took him in round 4.

Can't have enough solid CBs on the team. I do agree that Nixon is, at best, an average CB but a stud as a returner. Sounds like Rochell is also a solid STs guy. I'll watch his progress in the PS. Thanks again for spotting what might be a diamond in the rough.
UCA was in the Southland Conference with Stephen F. Austin and Lamar. They recently joined the Atlantic Sun with smaller southeastern schools
 

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It’s not just McCarthy. Jon Gruden once scolded Max Crosby for that also. Yes. He was told to use his Max Pad level when down low.;)
Watching the first 4 handoffs to Dillon I saw a defense that knew it was coming, a blown up offensive line, and no one else in the backfield like a FB to provide the target block. To gain anything significant on those plays you would have to be Adrian Peterson, see there was no hole, and suddenly break to the outside and turn on the Jets. That is not Dillon. Any of those plays would have been perfect for play action or a QB rollout. Neither HOFers Jimmy Taylor or Paul Hornung would have gained any more on those plays unless someone was in the backfield providing the initial block.
 

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So I've rewatched the All 22 film a couple times and reviewing as much as a novice person could do here's a few takeaways from me (unasked for lol):


Positives (gonna focus more on the non-normal ones many have said):

Andre Dillard did very well truthfully. He isn't nearly the run blocker we'd necessarily like him to be, but (knock on wood) his feet, technique and ability in pass pro was excellent. We absolutely don't need to have a season where Dillard is one of our best tackles...but if he can be that dependable back up or spot starter - that is a massive win.

Royce Newman....look I was team cut him, UNTIL they reworked his contract - the second they did that, what you have is hopefully an experienced backup that has actually a lot of starts under their belt, which is not an easy or normal thing to have. He did quite well this game as well.

Sean Rhyan stacks two more preseason games like this he is likely that inside swing piece - I thought he handled the center work quite well and that actually surprised me.

Monk and Caleb Jones struggled on a few reps, but oddly Monk put some excellent snaps on film at LG/C and RG all in one game. Many of us said when he was drafted, he legit can be that iOL swing piece of the future and this was a small snippet of it.

Heath - Malik pops when you start reviewing routes, blocks and decisions made when he didn't get the ball thrown to him. I have said it before and I strongly feel Heath can be that WR4/5 Lazard type guy absolutely without a doubt.

Lloyd - limited but that dudes' juice is different. I am predicting our "trick" is Lloyd to IR and keep Wilson when declaration of roster is made...


Negatives

I said it when Joseph was signed - if Anders clears waivers absolutely keep him here but Joseph is the best kicker on the roster - only reason you pick Anders is hope and future, not now.

Nixon - Bullard is our best slot corner...and some others are fast fighting for the role of the second best. He is a better version of Jarret Bush folks...premiere ST guy, who relies on playmaking bursts to hide his inconsistency on the defensive side.

Anthony Johnson Jr. is going to (fail) to tackle his way to the roster if he continues this...
 

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So I've rewatched the All 22 film a couple times and reviewing as much as a novice person could do here's a few takeaways from me (unasked for lol):


Positives (gonna focus more on the non-normal ones many have said):

Andre Dillard did very well truthfully. He isn't nearly the run blocker we'd necessarily like him to be, but (knock on wood) his feet, technique and ability in pass pro was excellent. We absolutely don't need to have a season where Dillard is one of our best tackles...but if he can be that dependable back up or spot starter - that is a massive win.

Royce Newman....look I was team cut him, UNTIL they reworked his contract - the second they did that, what you have is hopefully an experienced backup that has actually a lot of starts under their belt, which is not an easy or normal thing to have. He did quite well this game as well.

Sean Rhyan stacks two more preseason games like this he is likely that inside swing piece - I thought he handled the center work quite well and that actually surprised me.

Monk and Caleb Jones struggled on a few reps, but oddly Monk put some excellent snaps on film at LG/C and RG all in one game. Many of us said when he was drafted, he legit can be that iOL swing piece of the future and this was a small snippet of it.

Heath - Malik pops when you start reviewing routes, blocks and decisions made when he didn't get the ball thrown to him. I have said it before and I strongly feel Heath can be that WR4/5 Lazard type guy absolutely without a doubt.

Lloyd - limited but that dudes' juice is different. I am predicting our "trick" is Lloyd to IR and keep Wilson when declaration of roster is made...


Negatives

I said it when Joseph was signed - if Anders clears waivers absolutely keep him here but Joseph is the best kicker on the roster - only reason you pick Anders is hope and future, not now.

Nixon - Bullard is our best slot corner...and some others are fast fighting for the role of the second best. He is a better version of Jarret Bush folks...premiere ST guy, who relies on playmaking bursts to hide his inconsistency on the defensive side.

Anthony Johnson Jr. is going to (fail) to tackle his way to the roster if he continues this...
You have always seemed to be high on Newman and from the get go on Dillard. I'm doubting both. We weren't playing Cleveland's real D. Wishful thinking.
 

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So I've rewatched the All 22 film a couple times and reviewing as much as a novice person could do here's a few takeaways from me (unasked for lol):


Positives (gonna focus more on the non-normal ones many have said):

Andre Dillard did very well truthfully. He isn't nearly the run blocker we'd necessarily like him to be, but (knock on wood) his feet, technique and ability in pass pro was excellent. We absolutely don't need to have a season where Dillard is one of our best tackles...but if he can be that dependable back up or spot starter - that is a massive win.

Royce Newman....look I was team cut him, UNTIL they reworked his contract - the second they did that, what you have is hopefully an experienced backup that has actually a lot of starts under their belt, which is not an easy or normal thing to have. He did quite well this game as well.

Sean Rhyan stacks two more preseason games like this he is likely that inside swing piece - I thought he handled the center work quite well and that actually surprised me.

Monk and Caleb Jones struggled on a few reps, but oddly Monk put some excellent snaps on film at LG/C and RG all in one game. Many of us said when he was drafted, he legit can be that iOL swing piece of the future and this was a small snippet of it.

Heath - Malik pops when you start reviewing routes, blocks and decisions made when he didn't get the ball thrown to him. I have said it before and I strongly feel Heath can be that WR4/5 Lazard type guy absolutely without a doubt.

Lloyd - limited but that dudes' juice is different. I am predicting our "trick" is Lloyd to IR and keep Wilson when declaration of roster is made...


Negatives

I said it when Joseph was signed - if Anders clears waivers absolutely keep him here but Joseph is the best kicker on the roster - only reason you pick Anders is hope and future, not now.

Nixon - Bullard is our best slot corner...and some others are fast fighting for the role of the second best. He is a better version of Jarret Bush folks...premiere ST guy, who relies on playmaking bursts to hide his inconsistency on the defensive side.

Anthony Johnson Jr. is going to (fail) to tackle his way to the roster if he continues this...
The Athletic updates their 53 man roster prediction weekly, usually a decent source. After the game with the Browns, they predict Wilson, Rochell, Ballentine, Jonathan Ford, Newman, Heath, and Toure will be cut. There were others, but I noted these guys because a) we talked about them here and/or b) they were with the team last year.

They also included Dillon on the 53 and predicted the 53 will include 3 QBs, the obvious names - Love, Clifford, and Pratt.

I was a kittle surprised that they predicted King would be kept over Ballentine (I guess King got a lot of snaps on Saturday), and was surprised they had Dillon making the 53. Other than that I wasn't very surprised by any of the predicted moves. Oh and they think the Packers will keep Carlson, also not a big surprise.

I'm sure some of these guys will clear wavers and be put on the PS.
 
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tynimiller

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You have always seemed to be high on Newman and from the get go on Dillard. I'm doubting both. We weren't playing Cleveland's real D. Wishful thinking.

Define high?

Initially Newman excelled at a rookie vs expectations....he slupped his sophomore year and just flat out didn't make it last year as a starter...if he hadn't reworked his contract to stay, he absolutely should be suiting up for another team. It was a refreshing day for him, and perhaps he finds his footing as a backup for a little while longer in the league.

Dillard also depends on what your definition of high is....do I want him to be our starter - nope...unless he strings together three preseasons where he looks this good - he may not even be our third Tackle to be called upon and that would be understandable.


*Also Glover looked much better than I thought he would be. I still think PS but I liked what I saw.
 

tynimiller

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The Athletic updates their 53 man roster prediction weekly, usually a decent source. After the game with the Browns, they predict Wilson, Rochell, Ballentine, Jonathan Ford, Newman, Heath, and Toure will be cut. There were others, but I noted these guys because a) we talked about them here and/or b) they were with the team last year.

They also included Dillon on the 53 and predicted the 53 will include 3 QBs, the obvious names - Love, Clifford, and Pratt.

I was a kittle surprised that they predicted King would be kept over Ballentine (I guess King got a lot of snaps on Saturday), and was surprised they had Dillon making the 53. Other than that I wasn't very surprised by any of the predicted moves. Oh and they think the Packers will keep Carlson, also not a big surprise.

I'm sure some of these guys will clear wavers and be put on the PS.

I don't think it's unreasonable to see a future where those guys are cut...I still think they get creative to keep wilson with a Lloyd IR designation or Dillon declared a FB role type....but yeah I think Rochell and Ballentine both are right on that bubble....and you hope one or both come back in PS if cut.
 

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I don't think it's unreasonable to see a future where those guys are cut...I still think they get creative to keep wilson with a Lloyd IR designation or Dillon declared a FB role type....but yeah I think Rochell and Ballentine both are right on that bubble....and you hope one or both come back in PS if cut.
The article also mentioned that if Lloyd's injury keeps him out for a while, they'll designate him for IR and keep Wilson.

How did Morgan play on Saturday. Nothing specific to go on, it just sounds like he's struggling. Maybe that's because it seems unlikely he'll play his natural T position.
 

tynimiller

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The article also mentioned that if Lloyd's injury keeps him out for a while, they'll designate him for IR and keep Wilson.

How did Morgan play on Saturday. Nothing specific to go on, it just sounds like he's struggling. Maybe that's because it seems unlikely he'll play his natural T position.
Morgan hasn't been struggling...and apologies but you were aware he didn't play Saturday right?

Going off memory I know Morgan, Zach Tom, Edgerrin Cooper, Jaire, Carringon Valentine, Ty'Ron Hopper, Donovan Jennings, Tyler Davis and Tucker Kraft all didn't dress for various reasons but mainly nagging non-significant injuries.
 
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In my rewatch I watched his four runs closely....contact allowed in the backfield nearly every time. My football IQ refuses to state so blindly this is a Dillon issue solely just yet. Not saying it isn't but dear lord the man wasn't barely allowed a step or two after handoff before being touched.
Either Way I’m not going to condemn him it was 1 series. I agree with you on 4th down. But the play before? He could’ve followed his OL and gotten 2 yards imo. Instead, he stopped. Then changed directions, which is fine if you need 5 yards there. He needed 1.5 yards is all. Had he barreled between blockers here he’s not even touched until he’s .5 yard from the marker. He lost .5 sec of momentum which is crucial there. Just move the chains there, at worst it’s 4th n inches. Instead he went right into penetrating traffic.
He saw that LB, then didn’t trust his blockers to develop. Which they did at LG where they play was designed.
 

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tynimiller

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Either Way I’m not going to condemn him it was 1 series. I agree with you on 4th down. But the play before? He could’ve followed his OL and gotten 2 yards imo. Instead, he stopped. Then changed directions, which is fine if you need 5 yards there. He needed 1.5 yards is all. Had he barreled between blockers here he’s not even touched until he’s .5 yard from the marker. He lost .5 sec of momentum which is crucial there. Just move the chains there, at worst it’s 4th n inches. Instead he went right into penetrating traffic.

Yeah I don't remember which snap it was, but it was clear the read was delayed by an OL pickup happening where not designed but Dillon's instinct was just flat wrong on that play for sure. Wilson had one also where he lost two where I bet Dillon washes the play better. Neither is an RB 1, but we don't need either to be.
 

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Morgan hasn't been struggling...and apologies but you were aware he didn't play Saturday right?

Going off memory I know Morgan, Zach Tom, Edgerrin Cooper, Jaire, Carringon Valentine, Ty'Ron Hopper, Donovan Jennings, Tyler Davis and Tucker Kraft all didn't dress for various reasons but mainly nagging non-significant injuries.
Thanks Ty. I only watched the start of the game and didn't know he wasn't playing. Glad to hear he's ok. Should be a v good OL this year.
 

Heyjoe4

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Either Way I’m not going to condemn him it was 1 series. I agree with you on 4th down. But the play before? He could’ve followed his OL and gotten 2 yards imo. Instead, he stopped. Then changed directions, which is fine if you need 5 yards there. He needed 1.5 yards is all. Had he barreled between blockers here he’s not even touched until he’s .5 yard from the marker. He lost .5 sec of momentum which is crucial there. Just move the chains there, at worst it’s 4th n inches. Instead he went right into penetrating traffic.
He saw that LB, then didn’t trust his blockers to develop. Which they did at LG where they play was designed.
Yeah it's a little early to be predicting Dillon's demise. What surprised me is that they ran 3 straight plays that all looked alike, straight ahead, nowhere to go. That's might be as much of a coaching problem as it is a personnel problem.

And while I'm no fan of Wilson's, he did have a good game. The five yard straight-ahead run for a TD was solid, and he broke off a 20 plus yard run I think. With Lloyd injured, Wilson has to keep capitalizing on the number of carries he'll get. Otherwise, he'll be gone or on the PS. Seems more likely Lloyd will go to IR and Wilson will be on the 53.
 
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Yeah I don't remember which snap it was, but it was clear the read was delayed by an OL pickup happening where not designed but Dillon's instinct was just flat wrong on that play for sure. Wilson had one also where he lost two where I bet Dillon washes the play better. Neither is an RB 1, but we don't need either to be.
Yep. After the 2 failed attempts with a slight delay and change of direction, Dillon actually did ok on that 4th down imo. Unfortunately there were 9 guys on the LOS there and he reached out with the ball and was maybe 1ft short. It was closer than it looked. Yet he didn’t delay on that one he straight lined it and actually got a yard, enough to risk reaching his arm out to cross the plane.

It’s like anything. The failures of earlier momentum loss caused the 4th down turnover. It’s ok. It’s 2 plays and if I’m not mistaken his very first 2 runs of the preseason. At least it didn’t count here. Just hope they use that film as a learning experience there. There’s some accountability on the TE there as he misses his block on 3rd down in that photo. Almost to the point looked like he might’ve gotten away with an arm hold in that photo. Probably not ideal blocking either which I think has been mentioned. It often takes a series of events to cause a failure
 
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I read a few guys statements here, but didn't read them all. My apologies if I'm repeating others thoughts. With that said, I have some positive takeaways and also understand that this is game one of the preseason. A lot of backups in and low level concepts.

First, the defensive line looked really good. Van Ness seemed everywhere. He was constantly in the backfield and whooping the Browns OL. Wooden seemed very disruptive as well did Wyatt. It was good to see the Brown's QB under constant pressure.

Next, the backup RB's looked really good. Wilson and Howard looked strong and had great burst. With Jacobs, Lloyd, Wilson and Howard playing well, Dillion better look out. I didn't think he would be a cut, but he looked the same as last season. He looked slow, tentative, and got tackled seemingly by the first touch of a tackler.

The WR room looks packed with talent. Yes, Melton was credited with 3 drops, but the rest of the group looked great. Wick's TD is the obvious one. He torched his guy off the line. DuBose looked like the real deal. Hicks also made a couple of plays even with his limited time on the field. I mean, we are talking 4-8 on the depth chart and they still looked good. That is some depth right there.

Couple of notes on rookies. Williams made three tackles in space. He looked aggressive and his decision making was spot on. Overall safety play looked solid. As mentioned above, Rochell looked really good. Should be a deep secondary overall. Monk played several different positions on the line and didn't struggle. He looked good at center too.

Honestly, very solid play out of a lot of players. It seems a good culture that MLF has built and everyone is buying in. Should be a fun season to watch.
 

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The Athletic updates their 53 man roster prediction weekly, usually a decent source. After the game with the Browns, they predict Wilson, Rochell, Ballentine, Jonathan Ford, Newman, Heath, and Toure will be cut. There were others, but I noted these guys because a) we talked about them here and/or b) they were with the team last year.

They also included Dillon on the 53 and predicted the 53 will include 3 QBs, the obvious names - Love, Clifford, and Pratt.

I was a kittle surprised that they predicted King would be kept over Ballentine (I guess King got a lot of snaps on Saturday), and was surprised they had Dillon making the 53. Other than that I wasn't very surprised by any of the predicted moves. Oh and they think the Packers will keep Carlson, also not a big surprise.

I'm sure some of these guys will clear wavers and be put on the PS.
I'm kind of surprised that Heath is a cut. He seems the real deal. Toure I don't see making it. I feel the Packers are very deep at WR and he's just too far down on the depth chart and doesn't seem to be making plays out there.
 

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