Tramon Williams is coming back to Green Bay

[Pokerbrat2000]

Playing man coverage on the island is the same no matter where you go.

Well if you believe the media and posters, the DC, the scheme and the other 10 players around him has something to do with a guy being JAG or Pro Bowler, I think there is some truth to that.

 

[HardRightEdge]

Well if you believe the media and posters, the DC, the scheme and the other 10 players around him has something to do with a guy being JAG or Pro Bowler, I think there is some truth to that.

The DC and the scheme has nothing to do with playing man coverage on the isliand. The other ten players? Sure.

 

[HardRightEdge]

it was a good pass because Baldwin beat him badly on the inside and all Wilson had to do was lay it right there he blew that coverage

It was Kearse, not Baldwin, and it was pretty good coverage:

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[Pokerbrat2000]

The DC and the scheme has nothing to do with playing man coverage on the isliand. The other ten players? Sure.

Considering how crappy the Cleveland defense was in the 2 seasons (2015 and 16) that Tramon was there, I would still stick to my original comment, I'm not that worried about what he did or didn't do in Cleveland.

 

[Mondio]

a guy is going to go inside or outside, the coverage was good. I'll take coverage like that all game long. The only thing that beats that coverage is a perfect pass, sometimes it happens. Too long it's incomplete, too short it's picked off. He was there, but it was a perfect pass and he did a great job in securing the catch. I'd still take that coverage from everyone all day long and we'd have an outstanding pass defense.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

a guy is going to go inside or outside, the coverage was good. I'll take coverage like that all game long. The only thing that beats that coverage is a perfect pass, sometimes it happens. Too long it's incomplete, too short it's picked off. He was there, but it was a perfect pass and he did a great job in securing the catch. I'd still take that coverage from everyone all day long and we'd have an outstanding pass defense.

Last year you would have seen Randall trailing 5 yards behind and HaHa standing alone watching from the corner of the endzone. Isn't going to take much to improve our secondary.

 

[HardRightEdge]

Considering how crappy the Cleveland defense was in the 2 seasons (2015 and 16) that Tramon was there, I would still stick to my original comment, I'm not that worried about what he did or didn't do in Cleveland.

They don't call it the "island" for nothing. There is no scheme, there is no DC, there's just you and him.

That said, a lousy pass rush will hurt a CBs advanced metrics, a good one helps. On the other hand, if the other coverage guys suck, some metrics like PFF's yards surrendered per coverage snap will be helped since the opposing QB will pick on those other sucking guys.

Zone coverage is something else. Then everything matters. But a perimeter corner is least challenged when he's got top side help in low-high coverage and relases his guy at 15 yards. He doesn't have to worry about flipping, limiting separation and making a play on a deep ball. His play is in front of him.

I believe it is axiomatic that if you want a good pass defense you need good perimenter man coverage corners. There's no way around it. And those skills are scheme independent.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

After being released last year from Cleveland, Williams had this to say about playing in Cleveland:

"From the start of training camp to the beginning of the season, they were going in a different direction. And it came a point during the season to where I wanted to be released. That's why we got released because it wasn't a stable spot. It's not a stable spot. You don't know who's going to be the coaches from year to year, and I didn't know that so I didn't want to be one of those veterans who is stuck in a spot and at the end of the day, I'm not going to be able to get a job because I was on a bad team. That's why I wanted to get out of there."

So add to my list of "coaches, scheme, 10 players".......individuals mental state of mind. Sucks playing on a perennial losing team with a front office that is lost...you are right HRE....he was feeling like Tom Hanks and being all alone on an island most of the time.

 

[HardRightEdge]

I didn't want to be one of those veterans who is stuck in a spot and at the end of the day, I'm not going to be able to get a job because I was on a bad team. That's why I wanted to get out of there."

He wanted out? Evidently the feeling was mutual.

The statement about not being able to get a job if he stuck around in Cleveland another year to age 36 on a bad team doesn't make a lot of sense since he was already on a bad team and was looking for a job at age 35. Guess what? He found one despite his worst fears.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

He played at Cleveland for $7M/season, but then took a substantial discount to play for Arizona last year at $2M.

It's not surprising that Williams received more money from the Packers than he did in Arizona as he had a great season in 2017. I believe it's too much money for a 35-year old cornerback though.

EJ Gaines signed a one year deal with Cleveland that is worth up to $5M. I guess it's the "going rate" for mid tier CB's?

I was surprised that Gaines signed a contract like that, considerig he's nine years younger than Williams.

There is now talk of bringing House back.

https://www.totalpackers.com/2018/03/packers-reportedly-interested-in-re-signing-davon-house/

I truly hope the Packers go in a different direction than House at cornerback.

It was Kearse, not Baldwin, and it was pretty good coverage:

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We disagreed about that before

 

[rmontro]

Williams he had good coverage on that play with his hand in there. Wilson just happened to drop it on a dime. It should have never gotten that far.

I believe that, because for everything that GB did to lose that game, Wilson was playing out of his mind.

 

[Half Empty]

I think Cleveland might have to pay a little extra to get guys to go there

Isn't that often the knock on GB in fetching free agents?

 

[HardRightEdge]

We disagreed about that before

I agree we disagreed. But I do not agree to disagree.

 

[HardRightEdge]

I believe that, because for everything that GB did to lose that game, Wilson was playing out of his mind.

3 picks in his first 7 passes, I think it was (out of his mind bad). Out of his mind good in those last 5 minutes exploiting a defense and special teams that lost focus.

 

[elcid]

5m a season is simply too much

 

[HardRightEdge]

5m a season is simply too much

When you see an absolute need for a veteran/leadership presence, it beats Oakland paying Nelson $13 mil in gurantees over two years. At this juncture, if you need that vet presence, beggars can't be choosers.

 

[OldSchool101]

I agree 5M at CB is generally reasonable. I guess we’ll find out soon the fine contract details but either that way, we needed this type of signing.

We are still down Morgan, Im not sure we can automatically say that him vs. a more inexperienced S in Josh is a wash so the S position is still somewhat suspect.

The one thing I’ve noticed overall up to now? we have been shifting resources. We basically shifted from WR to TE. Then by adding Mo and losing Morgan we’re shifting and reallocating upfront pressure. It’ll be interesting to see if that trend continues.

I’d love to see another Veteran CB in that backfield. Then, in the draft, we can continue that strategy by going after a premier Edge type player or at the very least an ILB that can shore up that front 7. This would mitigate our opponent’s big play ability through constant pressure from all angles, thus taking some pressure off the Secondary area.

 

[HardRightEdge]

I agree 5M at CB is generally reasonable. I guess we’ll find out soon the fine contract details but either that way, we needed this type of signing.

We are still down Morgan, Im not sure we can automatically say that him vs. a more inexperienced S in Josh is a wash so the S position is still somewhat suspect.

The one thing I’ve noticed overall up to now? we have been shifting resources. We basically shifted from WR to TE. Then by adding Mo and losing Morgan we’re shifting and reallocating upfront pressure. It’ll be interesting to see if that trend continues.

I’d love to see another Veteran CB in that backfield. Then, in the draft, we can go after a premier Edge type player or at the very least an ILB that can shore up that front 7 in order to mitigate our opponent’s big play ability through constant pressure from all angles.

With no movement on Matthews' contract, if there was ever any intention of doing so, bolstering the edge looks more like a draft consideration with each passing day. There is no cap for an impact player at this juncture without cutting somebody. Even then that would be the ultimate "win now" move given that the cap picture for 2019 isn't looking very good either and that would take another significant bite out of it with the kind of multi-year contract an impact player would get.

Having Matthews on the roster at this price suggests more 3-4 hybrid sets such as the 4-3 under the Packers were using more in the last couple of years. So far, there's no indication that's changing with no place for Matthews in a 4-3.

With Graham, it's not so much a shift of WR to TE as a shift from a different kind of receiver. I don't think you're going to see Graham in-line very much, and when you do you won't get much in the way of blocking out of him. Old dogs and new tricks don't mix. You're going to see Graham in the slot and wide a disproportionate amount of the time. They're trying to recreate the Finley affect but with a guy declining in speed.

Coverage speed at ILB is needed if Jones is heading to SS full time. I think the more reasonable expectation would be Brice at SS, assuming he's healthy, and Jones moving around at coverage ILB and dime safety. Jones is going to have up his football IQ to play that ILB role which is pretty demanding in terms of play recognition.

 

[Dantés]

This tedious hand-wringing over the cap is both hilarious and exhausting.

Overthecap and Spotrac both have the Packers with 47M in cap space next offseason (if you figure upon this year’s cap ceiling of 177M). That puts them right at 15th/16th in the league.

They only have one guy of all their 2019 free agents who might warrant a sizeable extension: Haha Clinton-Dix. And even that depends on whether he rebounds with Pettine.

I’ve run into many would-be cap gurus around the Internet, but never have I found anyone who was so intent to make a really stable cap situation look horrendous. I have no idea where this agenda is coming from, but it’s a joke.

 

[hallzi43]

Ya I have no doubt that they will be able to easily manage the cap pretty well throughout the rest of Rodgers tenure and then after that it really doesn't matter. Question isn't whether we can find the money but more for who. We could use a draft that hits this season.

 

[melvin dangerr]

It was Kearse, not Baldwin, and it was pretty good coverage:

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I stand corrected, but still the coverage wasn’t good enough to prevent a TD..

 

[gbgary]

5m a season is simply too much

it's not too much if that's what the market is. prices only go up. this isn't 2010.

his contract most likely has an out after one year anyway.

 

[thequick12]

I agree we don't know how much he got guranteed. My guess would be about 3 million. So most likely his cap number is very reasonable in 2018 no more than 3.5 million. And cutting him after the season would only result in 1.5 million of dead money in 2019. However I think he's gonna have a great season back in Green Bay and with that defensive line in front of him. Cb is a position that's often played well by old guys.

 

[sschind]

This tedious hand-wringing over the cap is both hilarious and exhausting.

Overthecap and Spotrac both have the Packers with 47M in cap space next offseason (if you figure upon this year’s cap ceiling of 177M). That puts them right at 15th/16th in the league.

They only have one guy of all their 2019 free agents who might warrant a sizeable extension: Haha Clinton-Dix. And even that depends on whether he rebounds with Pettine.

I’ve run into many would-be cap gurus around the Internet, but never have I found anyone who was so intent to make a really stable cap situation look horrendous. I have no idea where this agenda is coming from, but it’s a joke.

To bad its only 2018 and not next off season. I don't think too many people are wringing their hands over next year. They are concerned about getting through this year first and we have considerably less than 47 million.

 

[HardRightEdge]

This tedious hand-wringing over the cap is both hilarious and exhausting.

Overthecap and Spotrac both have the Packers with 47M in cap space next offseason (if you figure upon this year’s cap ceiling of 176 M. That puts them right at 15th/16th in the league.

Actually, overthecap.com shows about $60 million in cap space for 2019 which assumes a $14 million bump over the current $176 million in cap space:

https://overthecap.com/salary-cap/green-bay-packers/

What you evidently did not notice is that 2019 cap covers only 29 players under contract with T. Williams data not yet posted. For the math-challenged, that's 24 short of full deck, a PS or any cap in reserve. Those 29 players do not include guys named Matthews, Cobb, Clinton-Dix, your buddy Wilkerson, Montgomery, Brice and Ryan, the very same guys expected to play a primary or secondary role in your "win now" season and you expect to magically replace them with that money. And fill out the roster. The cost of players keeps going up, and the cost of core and impact players is going up faster than the cap.

There's always the possibility of a 10 win season so long as Rodgers is around assuming his shoulder does not cause him difficulties. With a QB of that caliber, you reckon you start at 8-8 and work your way up from there with some measure of personnel competency and reasonably decent roster health.

I suppose many are OK with 10 wins, getting to the playoffs, and then seeing what happens. I wouldn't question 10 wins this year, but how's that "seeing what happens" thing been working lately?

Does anybody honestly think this is as a good a roster as those going back 2, 3, 4. 5 years? No, it isn't. And it's getting worse next year. Expending limited cap space on aging short time FAs makes the 2019 situation that much more concerning in their half measures.

There's a way out of this bind, which the brain trust is making more acute: two outstanding drafts providing a mix of starters and impact players in their rookie and second seasons. The way things are going, it looks more like reaching to fill needs.

Exhausting? For some, perhaps. Hillarious? Not so much. One might question the state of mind that finds hilairty in something so exhausting. Anyway, you can get used to it or ignore it, but the cap updates will continue.