The Case for Paying Aaron Jones

Should the Packers Extend Jones (assumes he would accept contract comparable to the one mentioned)


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Sunshinepacker

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I like Jones as well but running backs aren't valuable enough for it to make sense to sign him to a lucrative deal.

What do you consider "lucrative"? Ekeler is making $6.1m per year and Gurley is making $5.5m per year; I'd be okay if the Packers paid Jones that much IF Dillon doesn't prove he can be an excellent pass catcher, blocker, and runner this year. Now, that's assuming the Packers are trying to help Rodgers win a title rather than tread water until Love becomes QB. Jones is better than both Ekeler and Gurley (when accounting for injuries) and depriving this team of its only other elite playmaker (aside from Adams) to save $6m a year doesn't really make a ton of sense. Again, this is based on the possibility that Dillon doesn't prove he can be an elite RB in year one and none of the younger receivers make a big jump (I think it likely that someone does prove to be above-average but there is a chance that none of them do). If Dillon proves he can be a three-down RB then let Jones walk.

No, I don't think that Jones should get a contract in the $8m per year range (what Gordon and Drake are making) but I also think Jones is better than either of them, so perhaps he walks anyway to a team that's not as cap constrained as the Packers.
 
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HardRightEdge

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Just for the record, Ekeler's counts $5 million towards the cap during the first season of his contract. In addition the Chargers play in Los Angeles at this point ;).
My bad. That should have been dead cap not cap cost which does alter the argument somewhat. But if you don't see a clear path to either a cap-backloaded or cap-frontloaded deal, you're not going to find one in a flat deal. I'm sure I'll at some point refer to the "Oakland" Raiders which should not require apology. ;)
 
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What do you consider "lucrative"? Ekeler is making $6.1m per year and Gurley is making $5.5m per year; I'd be okay if the Packers paid Jones that much IF Dillon doesn't prove he can be an excellent pass catcher, blocker, and runner this year. Now, that's assuming the Packers are trying to help Rodgers win a title rather than tread water until Love becomes QB. Jones is better than both Ekeler and Gurley (when accounting for injuries) and depriving this team of its only other elite playmaker (aside from Adams) to save $6m a year doesn't really make a ton of sense. Again, this is based on the possibility that Dillon doesn't prove he can be an elite RB in year one and none of the younger receivers make a big jump (I think it likely that someone does prove to be above-average but there is a chance that none of them do). If Dillon proves he can be a three-down RB then let Jones walk.

I would be fine with the Packers offering Jones a deal like the one Ekeler signed with the Chargers. Unfortunately I don't think that will be good enough to keep him in Green Bay.

No, they can still be a contender if Love proves to be the talent they think he is.

At some point down the road??? Yes. In 2020??? No.
 

McKnowledge

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I think Aaron Jones should get a 4yr/28M extension, and they might want to do it now. With AJ Dillon signing his rookie deal (https://www.nfl.com/news/packers-2nd-round-rb-aj-dillon-inks-rookie-deal) both would blend the perfect mixture of talent, skill, and timing. Greatly benefiting the Packers.

The respective talents of Dillon and Jones theoretically work in harmony giving the team a fitting moniker of Thunder and Lightning.

Dillon will bring the boom, shedding tackles during physically prime years on a reasonable contract.

Jones could realize his potential as hybrid back; with excellent receiving skills, speed, and elusiveness.

The timing of these contracts would maximize the prime years of these players for the Packers.
 

Heyjoe4

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"Don't pay running backs" is the conventional wisdom of the moment in the NFL. And with good reason. The majority of big money extensions paid to the position have been disastrous lately.

The Rams recently incurred a ton of dead money in order to move on from Todd Gurley. The Falcons are giving up 6M in cap space this year for Devonta Freeman not to play for them. Lev Bell's deal looked awful in year one. The Cardinals regretted paying David Johnson until they found someone stupid enough to take on his contract.

So with Aaron Jones entering the last year of his deal, the Packers are confronted with a choice-- pay a RB a lucrative second contract, or let him walk?

Here is the case for keeping him.

Usage: Aaron Jones is entering year four in the league with 534 touches to his name, or 178/season. Another season comparable to 2019 will mean he will have 819 touches to his name by the time he lands that second contract, or 205/season.

This is not a lot of wear and tear. For comparison, Todd Gurley accrued 914 touches by the end of year 3, or 305/season and 1,229 touches by the end of year 4 (307/season). Even Devonta Freeman, who didn't play much as a rookie, was at 714 touches by the end of year 3-- 180 more than Jones.

At Jones' current rate (based on 2019 workload, not the average of his first three year-- 280 touches/season), Jones wouldn't top Gurley's year four number (1,229 touches) until the second year of his extension.

So point #1 for keeping him is that he just hasn't had the heavy workload so far that would make him "damaged goods" on a second deal.

Skill-set: As a runner, Jones' style is virtually a perfect fit for what this offense wants to accomplish. However, runners who fit a primarily zone rushing attack aren't that rare. The real argument that emerges to me in regards to skill-set is his receiving ability.

Jones demonstrated on a number of occasions that he is a pretty rare talent as a receiving back. Most RB's in the NFL can catch short passes in the flats, via screens, or as an outlet in the short middle. Jones ran routes down the field and made catches that traveled 30+ yards in the air.

For an offense that wants to run and pass effectively out of formations and play action that looks identical, this is an extremely useful skill set, and one that isn't easily replaceable.

Market: The running back market is depressed and will continue to be depressed. Teams are going to shy away from paying backs as they see what's going on with current extensions. This should push the price tag down in terms of annual cost and length of commitment.

Austin Ekeler just got paid 4/24.5 with 13.75 Gtd at signing. That's 6.125/season. The team can cut him after two seasons with a small dead cap hit (3M) and after three seasons with half of that (1.5M).

Some might think that Ekeler isn't a good comparison, but consider their production last year:

Jones: 285 touches for 1558 total yards, 5.5 yds/touch
Ekeler: 224 touches for 1550 total yards, 6.9 yds/touch

So let us assume that maybe Jones slots in just above Ekeler because he's more a focal piece of the ground game. That would potentially look like this:

4/28 with 16 Gtd at signing, 7M/season. With a similar structure in which it's easy to get out of the contract after year 2, I think that would be a great move for the Packers.

The high water mark of the deal, cap wise, would be 3.5% of the total cap (with the number getting smaller as the cap ceiling gets bigger). It would lock Green Bay in to his age 26 and 27 seasons, and essentially give them a team option for his age 28 and 29 seasons.

If Jones would accept that deal or something like it, I think GB should jump on it.
Interesting. Assuming for this that the cap is $200 mil, that $6.5 mil/year. I gotta believe he’s gonna get better offers than that on the open market, no?
 

Heyjoe4

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I think Aaron Jones should get a 4yr/28M extension, and they might want to do it now. With AJ Dillon signing his rookie deal (https://www.nfl.com/news/packers-2nd-round-rb-aj-dillon-inks-rookie-deal) both would blend the perfect mixture of talent, skill, and timing. Greatly benefiting the Packers.

The respective talents of Dillon and Jones theoretically work in harmony giving the team a fitting moniker of Thunder and Lightning.

Dillon will bring the boom, shedding tackles during physically prime years on a reasonable contract.

Jones could realize his potential as hybrid back; with excellent receiving skills, speed, and elusiveness.

The timing of these contracts would maximize the prime years of these players for the Packers.
I think if GB could do an extension like that, and Jones agreed, it would get done in a minute. I just have a feeling Jones is gonna be looking for north of $10 mil/year. So make the offer you suggest NOW.
 

tynimiller

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I think Aaron Jones should get a 4yr/28M extension, and they might want to do it now. With AJ Dillon signing his rookie deal (https://www.nfl.com/news/packers-2nd-round-rb-aj-dillon-inks-rookie-deal) both would blend the perfect mixture of talent, skill, and timing. Greatly benefiting the Packers.

The respective talents of Dillon and Jones theoretically work in harmony giving the team a fitting moniker of Thunder and Lightning.

Dillon will bring the boom, shedding tackles during physically prime years on a reasonable contract.

Jones could realize his potential as hybrid back; with excellent receiving skills, speed, and elusiveness.

The timing of these contracts would maximize the prime years of these players for the Packers.

Unless he sees a serious injury ZERO chance he is that cheap.
 

gbgary

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Unless he sees a serious injury ZERO chance he is that cheap.
and why sign him at all if that happens. too late to trade him now so i'm guessing they'll let him play out this season and see what happens. would be great if dillon kicks butt. would make losing him painless. he's said they've talked contract extension. someone will have to go if that happens though.
 

tynimiller

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and why sign him at all if that happens. too late to trade him now so i'm guessing they'll let him play out this season and see what happens. would be great if dillon kicks butt. would make losing him painless. he's said they've talked contract extension. someone will have to go if that happens though.

I wouldn't make the case to sign him if a serious injury happens, I'm merely saying that is the only way he is that cheap for anyone.
 

thequick12

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"Don't pay running backs" is the conventional wisdom of the moment in the NFL. And with good reason. The majority of big money extensions paid to the position have been disastrous lately.

The Rams recently incurred a ton of dead money in order to move on from Todd Gurley. The Falcons are giving up 6M in cap space this year for Devonta Freeman not to play for them. Lev Bell's deal looked awful in year one. The Cardinals regretted paying David Johnson until they found someone stupid enough to take on his contract.

So with Aaron Jones entering the last year of his deal, the Packers are confronted with a choice-- pay a RB a lucrative second contract, or let him walk?

Here is the case for keeping him.

Usage: Aaron Jones is entering year four in the league with 534 touches to his name, or 178/season. Another season comparable to 2019 will mean he will have 819 touches to his name by the time he lands that second contract, or 205/season.

This is not a lot of wear and tear. For comparison, Todd Gurley accrued 914 touches by the end of year 3, or 305/season and 1,229 touches by the end of year 4 (307/season). Even Devonta Freeman, who didn't play much as a rookie, was at 714 touches by the end of year 3-- 180 more than Jones.

At Jones' current rate (based on 2019 workload, not the average of his first three year-- 280 touches/season), Jones wouldn't top Gurley's year four number (1,229 touches) until the second year of his extension.

So point #1 for keeping him is that he just hasn't had the heavy workload so far that would make him "damaged goods" on a second deal.

Skill-set: As a runner, Jones' style is virtually a perfect fit for what this offense wants to accomplish. However, runners who fit a primarily zone rushing attack aren't that rare. The real argument that emerges to me in regards to skill-set is his receiving ability.

Jones demonstrated on a number of occasions that he is a pretty rare talent as a receiving back. Most RB's in the NFL can catch short passes in the flats, via screens, or as an outlet in the short middle. Jones ran routes down the field and made catches that traveled 30+ yards in the air.

For an offense that wants to run and pass effectively out of formations and play action that looks identical, this is an extremely useful skill set, and one that isn't easily replaceable.

Market: The running back market is depressed and will continue to be depressed. Teams are going to shy away from paying backs as they see what's going on with current extensions. This should push the price tag down in terms of annual cost and length of commitment.

Austin Ekeler just got paid 4/24.5 with 13.75 Gtd at signing. That's 6.125/season. The team can cut him after two seasons with a small dead cap hit (3M) and after three seasons with half of that (1.5M).

Some might think that Ekeler isn't a good comparison, but consider their production last year:

Jones: 285 touches for 1558 total yards, 5.5 yds/touch
Ekeler: 224 touches for 1550 total yards, 6.9 yds/touch

So let us assume that maybe Jones slots in just above Ekeler because he's more a focal piece of the ground game. That would potentially look like this:

4/28 with 16 Gtd at signing, 7M/season. With a similar structure in which it's easy to get out of the contract after year 2, I think that would be a great move for the Packers.

The high water mark of the deal, cap wise, would be 3.5% of the total cap (with the number getting smaller as the cap ceiling gets bigger). It would lock Green Bay in to his age 26 and 27 seasons, and essentially give them a team option for his age 28 and 29 seasons.

If Jones would accept that deal or something like it, I think GB should jump on it.

Well duh haha they should jump on it. But Jones is gonna want more obviously. How many touchdowns did ekeler have?
 
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Not to be ticky-tacky, but we don't know that.

I'd say the chances of it pretty damn low (approaching zero) but we don't actually know.

With no rookie quarterback having won or even taken his team to the Super Bowl I'm pretty confident Love wouldn't be the first one if called upon.
 

tynimiller

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I have always felt Jones isn't resigning for less than $9M/Year.

The Henry contract means less to me than some might consider seeing as how he is an entirely different back and literally their offense IMO. However, a workhorse like him, with the amount of work on his body still garnering that much does strengthen my thoughts on Jones.
 

gopkrs

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Aaron Jones says his agent is in discussions with management. Now would actually be the time to do it since he is in his final year.
 

Sunshinepacker

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Henry's contract shouldn't be a benchmark for Jones, Henry touches the ball a LOT more than Jones. If the Packers can re-sign Jones for ~ $8m a year, that would be a steal; then they would just need to redraft their second round.
 

gopkrs

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Henry's contract shouldn't be a benchmark for Jones, Henry touches the ball a LOT more than Jones. If the Packers can re-sign Jones for ~ $8m a year, that would be a steal; then they would just need to redraft their second round.
He is fun to watch. I cannot judge what the draft situation will look like next year from this vantagepoint. But I think our 2nd round draft pick and Aaron could compliment each other very well. Right now (and I hope this year proves me right), I put Aaron Jones in the same sentence as Alvin Kamara.
 

thequick12

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He is fun to watch. I cannot judge what the draft situation will look like next year from this vantagepoint. But I think our 2nd round draft pick and Aaron could compliment each other very well. Right now (and I hope this year proves me right), I put Aaron Jones in the same sentence as Alvin Kamara.

And that's exactly why he's not signing for 8 m per. Minimum he signs for 10 m per and that would be a steal. He has almost the exact stats as kamara rushing. He's behind in receiving but thats because of targets not talent. I could see jones catching 60 to 80 passes this season. Especially if Dillion turns out to be a player. I'd then expect to see them on the field together more than Jones and Williams were, with Jones splitting out wide more. Could be real dangerous play action offense, if Rodgers can start hitting those shot plays again with consistency
 
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HardRightEdge

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Mixon signed a 4 year / $48 mil extension. Including this season, his cap cost is about $50 mil over 5 years.

Mixon's deal is cap-backloaded as you'd expect. His cap number goes from $3.9 mil this year to $8.5 mil in 2021 then $11.5 mil in 2022. The key to this deal is there's only $10 mil in guarantees, all in the signing bonus. There's cap savings after 2021, dead cap drops to $5.5 mil after 2022. Cincinnati is buying his services for 2020-2022, 3 years @ $29.3 mil cap cost including that $5.5 mil 2023 dead cap.

A week ago there were reports that the Saints would be willing trade Kamara if they could not come to terms. He'd been sitting out practices, possibly contract related. Now it's reported they are close to a deal. The Saints might have sweated him down some. Players can get nervous entering real contact without a deal. Anyway, Jones would come in somewhere under Kamara but not a whole lot. The Packers may be sweating Jones down some as well. There are a couple of numbers Jones' agent will be emphasizing: 19 TDs + 4 TDs.

Even if you keep Jones' 2021 cap number around Mixon's $8.5 mil, you're up to $188 mil in cap commitments for 2021 for only 39 players in what may be $175 mil cap year.
 

tynimiller

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Even if you keep Jones' 2021 cap number around Mixon's $8.5 mil, you're up to $188 mil in cap commitments for 2021 for only 39 players in what may be $175 mil cap year.

This has been on my mind frequently lately...we are staring down the barrel of some very hard decisions and/or cuts I fear, or trades (less likely).
 

tynimiller

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Now granted Wagner is as good as gone...only 1.5 dead. I think Lowry could even be even with 3M dead...but otherwise we are paying him double that.

There isn't many other options for savings outside of restructures and/or trades....
 
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