Improving the Defense for 2017....How and Who?

[mradtke66]

Woodson had great anticipation and superior ball skills...even when his foot speed declined he had above average instincts when it came to jumping or undercutting routes. Again, Gunter Will NEVER be a slot corner so please stop inputting that ideal. With Williams and Shileds they had speed And quickness and ball skills. Again Gunter would never work out in the slot. In case you guys may have missed it? Capers never put him in the slot. Everyone seems to be over looking the reasons why smh.

...I never suggested putteing Gunter in the slot. I don't mind him on the team, but ideally as the "nickel" who pushes one of the starters to the clot CB position. Ala what we did with younger Williams and Shields. He can survive as the no. 2 outside corner.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

Honestly unless we can pick up a decent number 1 CB in FA then I don't see us as truly having a number 1 cornerback.

My thoughts exactly. Although rare, especially with TT, I wouldn't rule out a trade for #1 CB either.

 

[easyk83]

My thoughts exactly. Although rare, especially with TT, I wouldn't rule out a trade for #1 CB either.

True number one much less lockdown corners are rare birds and teams do not give them up easily. Perhaps a good number 3 corner who is at the end of his K and too pricey to retain. Perhaps trade for an Al Harris type.

 

[easyk83]

...I never suggested putteing Gunter in the slot. I don't mind him on the team, but ideally as the "nickel" who pushes one of the starters to the clot CB position. Ala what we did with younger Williams and Shields. He can survive as the no. 2 outside corner.

Depending on the scheme Gunter would be a good slot corner, but thats the problem... that's all he is. Ideally we'd have a number 3 who eventually could turn into a 2 or even a 1.

 

[swhitset]

First thing is Gunter should be cut. He wasn't a draft pick, so it's not like your throwing away a draft pick in his third season. There's really no point in keeping him around now...they've gotten a look at him for nearly an entire season...he's not the answer at corner. No need to waste a practice squad spot on him either. He can't play in this league running a 4.7. Hawkins, Dorleant, Herb W should be kept on the practice squad. Those are guys who can run and can help out on special teams if they need to be activated.

Clay Matthews would be asked to restructure. He's definitely not worth 16 million a season. Giving him 10-11 is still very generous but that would be my offer. He's a one trick poney who's not very good against the run. He's become a liability against running teams because he's not strong enough against good tackles to get off blocks, and he typically over runs the play. I'm really starting to wonder if this guy really was on PEDS and his play suffered once he got off??

Julius Peppers can still play...but I'd offer him the veteran minimum unless another team like New England or Seattle is willing to pay him more to have a REAL shot at a ring. It would be nice to be able to keep him tho because he's a great locker room guy who can help the youngsters and come in on passing downs only.

Nick Perry is interesting because he's finally shown that he can get you double digit sacks. He's also very good against the run. He's just always guaranteed to miss time because you know he's going to get hurt at some point and be out. I'd give him 8 mil per year for 4 yrs to stay in Green Bay. But I'm willing to bet another teams who's desperate for pass rushers will throw more money at him and he will jet.

I'd release Guion and move Daniels to NT. He's not a pass rusher so there's no need to have him as a DE. Let him collapse the pocket and play the run like he already does. I'd move Lowry to that D -end spot. I've like what I've seen on his little it of snaps. He should be playing more.

Definitely drafting a corner in the first rd. A corner!! Not a safety or a tweaner...a guy who can open his hips and turn and run and was a college corner! The experiments have to stop. Randall is only good in zone...but if he is asked to play man to man he's toast. He's always turned around, and he's soft in coverage. He is not the #1 corner.

Rollins will be the fifth corner. I honestly can't remember one good play the guy made all year. He's just as bad in man as Randall and he's another guy who can't seem to run with anyone. If he wasn't a second rd pick he'd be cut with Gunter. His lack of awareness when locating the deep ball is hard to watch. Teams completed a high percentage of pass attempts on this guy and he was never able to recover

Micah Hyde is definitely the best of the bunch. Which isn't saying much ...but he can play every spot in the secondary and he's an above average return guy ..which adds value to his stock. If he was a 4.4 guy he'd be really good because he does have good instincts and he locates the ball pretty well. But he's another guy who just seems to always be in chase mode.

Cut Joe Thomas and Groom Burnett to play his role. I think Burnett plays way better the closer to the line of scrimmage he is. Then you can bring in Brice. Thomas isn't any good against the run anyways and he's only average in coverage. He's a guy who can be replaced.


Sign a corner. DRC or Revis will probably be available. If either guy is willing to make what Sam Shields made bring him in. I like DRC because he's fast and won't get beat deep. He can catch the ball as well.

I'd draft another pass rusher in the second. A guy who can play the run as well.

I don't agree with all of this, but there is some good stuff in here...so I clicked agree to try and counter all those disagrees lol.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

True number one much less lockdown corners are rare birds and teams do not give them up easily. Perhaps a good number 3 corner who is at the end of his K and too pricey to retain. Perhaps trade for an Al Harris type.

Unless they discover a cure for concussions and Sam Shields is on the field for opening day, I highly doubt that no matter what the Packers do in the off season that there isn't going to be some concern at the CB position. We are going to need some growth from Randall, Rollins and Gunter (debatable, yes I have been reading) as well as at least one more talented (than them) player. Even with that, we learned quickly this season that one injury can completely expose our secondary.

A lot has been said that losing Shields was huge and while I think it was, I am not so sure that even with Sam on the field, our secondary would have been drastically better, but probably just good enough to have won a game or two more.

 

[swhitset]

Honestly hes for sure not beating out Burnett, Hes not beating out HaHa hes not beating out Micha Hyde hes not beating out kentrell brice and I think the rookie marwin evans would give him a run for his money at saftey. Randall best bet is to compete for a job at corner and if he cant hold a spot then the packers need to do away with him.

I really want t disagree with this considering his draft position.... but I can't.

 

[easyk83]

Unless they discover a cure for concussions and Sam Shields is on the field for opening day, I highly doubt that no matter what the Packers do in the off season that there isn't going to be some concern at the CB position. We are going to need some growth from Randall, Rollins and Gunter (debatable I have been reading) as well as at least one more talented (than them) player. Even with that, we learned quickly this season that one injury can completely expose our secondary.

A lot has been said that losing Shields was huge and while I think it was, I am not so sure that even with Sam on the field, our secondary would have been drastically better, but probably just good enough to have one a game or two more.

I think Randall has a bounce back year like Adams, plays well but with occasional brain farts and mistakes. Rollins if healthy has the makings of being a good slot corner. Being above average at the number 3 spot might partially make up for the lack of a true number 1.

I think with Sam on the field that the coaches could have been more conservative with Rollins and Shields and hopefully could have let those guys get healthier before returning to the field. Also we could have given our other corners more help from the safeties.

 

[easyk83]

I really want t disagree with this considering his draft position.... but I can't.

It's way too early to write Randall off, just like it was with Davante Adams last season.

 

[swhitset]

Unless they discover a cure for concussions and Sam Shields is on the field for opening day, I highly doubt that no matter what the Packers do in the off season that there isn't going to be some concern at the CB position. We are going to need some growth from Randall, Rollins and Gunter (debatable, yes I have been reading) as well as at least one more talented (than them) player. Even with that, we learned quickly this season that one injury can completely expose our secondary.

A lot has been said that losing Shields was huge and while I think it was, I am not so sure that even with Sam on the field, our secondary would have been drastically better, but probably just good enough to have won a game or two more.

as long as we are doing the what if.... can we make that game be the last one they played?

 

[RicFlairoftheNFL]

I'm not gonna get into who's but how's, and to me it's simple. You have to decide you're gonna go with Blake and Jake in the middle make Thomas your primary back up. To me he's a Brad Jones type guy, great backup, lousy starter. You then HAVE TO HAVE TO HAVE TO look at free agency to find a cornerback maybe 2. Rollins should be your dime and no higher next year. Also I would move Gunter to safety. We know Burnett will drop off and be trade bait or a final cut down fatality in the next 2 years. Gunter needs to be ready to take that spot at that time. I wouldn't mess with the D-Line too much, that's the one area this year I was really impressed with.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

as long as we are doing the what if.... can we make that game be the last one they played?

If you are talking about Randall and Rollins, my guess is they both will be back and hopefully better. But given they were #1 and #2 picks, I don't see them going anywhere too soon.

 

[PackerFanLV]

I really want t disagree with this considering his draft position.... but I can't.

Yeah man let him compete at corner, bring a vet in and draft a cb ,this years draft is filled with good CB's. If this happens it will be hard to see randall making the team, MM needs to do whats best for the team. From the looks of it Gunter has a better chance than randall and thats not saying much because I think Gunter is just as bad but hes been covering opposing teams number 1 wr soooo idk.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

I would like to hear from the guy(s) who scouted and recommended that the Packers draft Rollins and Randall. Anyone know what these guys are saying now? Randall played at Arizona State and Rollins at Miami of Ohio. Maybe Highsmith recruited Randall and Gissendaner Rollins?

Not saying either are a complete bust, but someone needs to explain their thought processes.

 

[easyk83]

Yeah man let him compete at corner, bring a vet in and draft a cb ,this years draft is filled with good CB's. If this happens it will be hard to see randall making the team, MM needs to do whats best for the team. From the looks of it Gunter has a better chance than randall and thats not saying much because I think Gunter is just as bad but hes been covering opposing teams number 1 wr soooo idk.

Hyde is a generalist who lacks the speed to play outside, Gunter lacks the speed out there and I don't think Rollins is really a plus athlete outside either. Randall will make the team next year unless he falls off in practice as well as games. He'll be given every shot to improve and if he's healthy next camp I think he'll look like a different player.

 

[Poppa San]

Also I would move Gunter to safety. We know Burnett will drop off and be trade bait or a final cut down fatality in the next 2 years. Gunter needs to be ready to take that spot at that time.

Burnett is most likely slotted to play ILB from here out as a coverage player. The quick LB, that is how he played a lot of snaps earlier this season. Sort of how Woodson played safety his last season or two. Always line up in the box. Bring a third safety / CB on the field. That is why it looks like the Packers are playing a lot of nickel. The SS is playing LB. I don't know if Gunther has the physical size to play that same position which would allow Burnett to cover more in the traditional SS/FS spot. The "Woodson" position -to coin a phrase- is where a LB/safety athletic tweener may get drafted. Kind of a quicker Joe Thomas type.

 

[PackerFanLV]

Hyde is a generalist who lacks the speed to play outside, Gunter lacks the speed out there and I don't think Rollins is really a plus athlete outside either. Randall will make the team next year unless he falls off in practice as well as games. He'll be given every shot to improve and if he's healthy next camp I think he'll look like a different player.

I agree with you 100 percent about gunter and rollins but it says a lot that Gunter have been holding opposing teams #1 WR and randall on the other hand getting fried by teams 2nd and 3rd WRs. Only way I can see randall making the team is if MM and TT does nothing in the FA market.

 

[sdh09e44]

First thing is Gunter should be cut. He wasn't a draft pick, so it's not like your throwing away a draft pick in his third season. There's really no point in keeping him around now...they've gotten a look at him for nearly an entire season...he's not the answer at corner. No need to waste a practice squad spot on him either. He can't play in this league running a 4.7. Hawkins, Dorleant, Herb W should be kept on the practice squad. Those are guys who can run and can help out on special teams if they need to be activated.

Clay Matthews would be asked to restructure. He's definitely not worth 16 million a season. Giving him 10-11 is still very generous but that would be my offer. He's a one trick poney who's not very good against the run. He's become a liability against running teams because he's not strong enough against good tackles to get off blocks, and he typically over runs the play. I'm really starting to wonder if this guy really was on PEDS and his play suffered once he got off??

Julius Peppers can still play...but I'd offer him the veteran minimum unless another team like New England or Seattle is willing to pay him more to have a REAL shot at a ring. It would be nice to be able to keep him tho because he's a great locker room guy who can help the youngsters and come in on passing downs only.

Nick Perry is interesting because he's finally shown that he can get you double digit sacks. He's also very good against the run. He's just always guaranteed to miss time because you know he's going to get hurt at some point and be out. I'd give him 8 mil per year for 4 yrs to stay in Green Bay. But I'm willing to bet another teams who's desperate for pass rushers will throw more money at him and he will jet.

I'd release Guion and move Daniels to NT. He's not a pass rusher so there's no need to have him as a DE. Let him collapse the pocket and play the run like he already does. I'd move Lowry to that D -end spot. I've like what I've seen on his little it of snaps. He should be playing more.

Definitely drafting a corner in the first rd. A corner!! Not a safety or a tweaner...a guy who can open his hips and turn and run and was a college corner! The experiments have to stop. Randall is only good in zone...but if he is asked to play man to man he's toast. He's always turned around, and he's soft in coverage. He is not the #1 corner.

Rollins will be the fifth corner. I honestly can't remember one good play the guy made all year. He's just as bad in man as Randall and he's another guy who can't seem to run with anyone. If he wasn't a second rd pick he'd be cut with Gunter. His lack of awareness when locating the deep ball is hard to watch. Teams completed a high percentage of pass attempts on this guy and he was never able to recover

Micah Hyde is definitely the best of the bunch. Which isn't saying much ...but he can play every spot in the secondary and he's an above average return guy ..which adds value to his stock. If he was a 4.4 guy he'd be really good because he does have good instincts and he locates the ball pretty well. But he's another guy who just seems to always be in chase mode.

Cut Joe Thomas and Groom Burnett to play his role. I think Burnett plays way better the closer to the line of scrimmage he is. Then you can bring in Brice. Thomas isn't any good against the run anyways and he's only average in coverage. He's a guy who can be replaced.


Sign a corner. DRC or Revis will probably be available. If either guy is willing to make what Sam Shields made bring him in. I like DRC because he's fast and won't get beat deep. He can catch the ball as well.

I'd draft another pass rusher in the second. A guy who can play the run as well.

I would love if DRC was brought in but how do we know he could be available? Did you see the pro football focus post like I did, it said the Giants might part ways with him. Did you see it anywhere else?

 

[swhitset]

If you are talking about Randall and Rollins, my guess is they both will be back and hopefully better. But given they were #1 and #2 picks, I don't see them going anywhere too soon.

lol agreed but I was actually referring to your supposition that with shields they might have won one or two more games. I was just wishing those games could have been the last game and the Super Bowl lol

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

lol agreed but I was actually referring to your supposition that with shields they might have won one or two more games. I was just wishing those games could have been the last game and the Super Bowl lol

Yes, 2 more wins would have been nice, but.....

2 more regular season wins (or one against Atlanta) and we would have been hosting Atlanta at Lambeau in the NFCCG. This is what Rodgers alluded to in a recent interview, being prepared and playing all 16 games to win, going all in. Not sure if having a healthy Shields all year would have made the difference, but if you look at just that one regular season game in Atlanta, it may have.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

Kind of a quicker Joe Thomas type.

You had me until you said THAT ! LOL

I don't know, I hope I am wrong about Joe Thomas. I really didn't like him at all in 2015 and even though I saw a few things from him in 2016, I just don't see him as anything more than a special teams player and for depth at ILB.

 

[Firethorn1001]

Only way I can see randall making the team is if MM and TT does nothing in the FA market.

So.. basically saying that Randall is on the team.

 

[rodell330]

I would love if DRC was brought in but how do we know he could be available? Did you see the pro football focus post like I did, it said the Giants might part ways with him. Did you see it anywhere else?

I actually think I saw it on one of their message boards from one of the fans. I would think their fans would know more about the state of their team and players than us. If you saw it and Giants fans were talking about it...it's probably got a lot of truth to it. My main concern is some other team that has a need for a corner like Dallas or Seattle will throw more money his way than TT who doesn't even really like free agency anyways. But the Packers need to do whatever they can to get a guy like DRC if he does become available...because Corner is right at the top in terms of NEED for the defense who stinks. If he was to go to Seattle their secondary would be scary good.

The Packers truly need to take an entirely different approach to their defense. They need to start adding and drafting guys with edge and some nasty. This has got to be the softest defense in the NFL. But then again, theyvtake after the persona of their D.C. . New blood is needed.

 

[Dantés]

I think the DRC story was started by an article that Over the Cap floated out there. It didn't have any basis in anything other than their own speculation that his cap hit could lead to his release. They compile lists of players who could be cut. DRC was the last player on their corner list, and even they mentioned that it's unlikely. It would actually only save 4.5M against the cap. So I think it's just filler content.

 

[rodell330]

Lacy's comp pick would likely be a 5th or 6th rounder. Not all that juicy. But yeah, Ted like's his picks. I just don't think that will really factor much into the decision. They either want him back for a # or they don't. A 5th or 6th round comp pick isn't going to tip the balance.



To be fair, I'm pretty sure it was you who were suggesting we play Janis at cornerback. Sometimes, people suggest things that just don't make any sense.

I apologize that you missed the sarcasm and humor in that. The team was very thin at corner btw.