Official Studs n Duds Bears

[Pokerbrat2000]

I said it before the draft and I am sticking to it. Fields is just another in a long line of OSU QB's that look like the real deal in college and then fail in the NFL. If you look at the other 10+ players that are usually on offense for OSU and their success in the NFL, you can understand why the OSU QB always shines in that offense.

Maybe Fields will come around and be a top QB, but given that he is a Bear QB, I hope my predication comes true.

 

[AmishMafia]

You truly gotta stop looking at stats and W/L columns to base an entire stance on. Both Dak and Russ were later round picks when it comes to QBs, to a team with a better constructed rosters and Russ especially had an elite Defense. What Fields is exhibiting are traits those two would be the ceiling they direct one to. It isn't saying he will become one of them, but anyone that studies football or watches deeper than just as a fan can see it.

Yup.

And it's not just his physical skills. He shows a great attitude, leadership, and eagerness to improve.

I did not like a single QB the Bears have had in the last 30 years. From Cutler, Trubisky, to their other high pick failures. But this Fields has the potential to be a franchise player, unlike the others. As you said, doesn't mean he will be great, just that he is currently on that trajectory.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

Stud: This guy! He must be scoring big time outside the stadium!

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[tynimiller]

Matt Lafleur- Did you not self scout during the bye? 6 runs in the first half. Then when we started running in the 2nd half the offense hummed.

I think by design MLF will never lock in on one attack plan and to be honest it is a MASSIVELY frustrating thing at times like last night's first quarter attack plans. Granted early on our OL seemed to incapable of much of anything for a time.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

Lucky for the Packers that they were playing Da Bears last night, a better team and we don't get the W. Whether its the first game of the year or coming off of a bye, the Packers need to be better when there is that long gap between games. As much as I want home field throughout the entire playoffs, I might be fine finishing second in the NFC, not have a bye week and take our chances that the #1 seed gets knocked off in week 2 or we can beat them on the road in the NFCCG.

 

[KiDcUdI]

Lucky for the Packers that they were playing Da Bears last night, a better team and we don't get the W. Whether its the first game of the year or coming off of a bye, the Packers need to be better when there is that long gap between games. As much as I want home field throughout the entire playoffs, I might be fine finishing second in the NFC, not have a bye week and take our chances that the #1 seed gets knocked off in week 2 or we can beat them on the road in the NFCCG.

My issue is we are in the past quarter of the season. We need to be getting hot now. Last night was just the same.

 

[tynimiller]

My issue is we are in the past quarter of the season. We need to be getting hot now. Last night was just the same.

We need to get healthier, I think the better part will come along with that naturally. I hope at least.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

I think that the offense settled in just fine last night and all season has been playing better with each game. Injuries hasn't been kind to the OL for sure and losing a WR and TE hasn't helped either. The Defense is having its ups and downs, I wasn't particularly impressed with them in the first half last night, but the second half was a strong defensive performance until garbage time.

I think if we get Bahk, Myers, Alexander and Z dog back, without having more key players go down, this is going to be a really good team come the playoffs. Special teams worries me the most. That might be the difference to winning a SB and getting knocked out of a playoff game.

 

[mradtke66]

I'm not sure what the answer is for special teams. When I see play that bad, I can't help but think the coach is lacking, but on the other hand, when I see such bad play from players, should I blame the coach?

This is kind of where I am. Is he drawing up good schemes? I don't think we as fans can know. Head coach should be able to pass/fail that after the season.

Is he teaching his guys the right things? Are they fired up? Again, that sounds like a HC call.

Obviously something is going wrong on game day. My only real nit is what is the mistake? Are they correctable ones? Or have they been corrected and the players in question are trash?

The kick out of bounds, that looks like Crosby slipped or something? Or just an intentional squib-ish kick that went wrong? I have a hard time blaming anyone for a "trick shot" that Crosby ended up putting a little too much english on. Bad outcome, but was it a bad decision? (I'd vote no.)

Place kicking was fine.

Kick/punt coverage was poor. Why though? I don't just say (not you specifically Mondio, the royal you) "coaching." What part of it? To my eye, the backside left their lanes when the kicker started to go right and when he reversed field, outside contain man was too far in.

Kick return...what a mixed bag. On one hand Taylor messed up. Is he just not the kind of person who should be returning kicks because he doesn't have the right kind of awareness? On the other, he was probably worried about the kick dying on the 5 yard line?

Amari...even worse. Either he needs to be pulled and/or he needs a jugs machine at home to catch punts. I couldn't catch a punt to save my life, but I know the theory behind it. It doesn't look anything like what he tried on that muff. The counterpoint to his terrible muffs is that he averaged 14 yard per return last night. That implies to me once he has the ball in his hand, the light might finally be starting to turn on.

If we're going to replace him, who on the roster can do it? We just tried Taylor. It went poorly. We tried Cobb. He muffed it too and now he's on IR. I'd like to sign Ervin, but is he healthy yet?

That kind of brings me to where I am right now. More questions than answers. The one thing I am feel pretty confident about is we don't have a good returner on the roster. We don't even have that crafty vet to fair catch it and not mess something up right now. That's not a coaching problem, that's a GM issue. Similarly, if the HC won't let the STC use the entire 52 man roster (obviously we exclude the Qb) on his units, and he's got trash players, how is that the STC's fault?

The second musing I have is that grouping special teams under one coach makes it easy to be lazy with criticism. Blocked kick? Special teams sucks. Returner fumbles? Special teams sucks. Half the coverage guys spontaneously combust, which results in the other team running one back for a TD? Special teams sucks. With special teams basically being a team within the team (2 coverage, 2 return, place kicking units) it *almost* makes sense to have a dedicated assistant for coverage, returns, and place. There probably isn't enough work for 3 special teams coaches, but with the split between DT and EDGE position coaches, safeties vs. corners on some teams already, I wouldn't be surprised if it happens someday.

And then there is the whole thing that I don't know of a single team that employs a kicking or punting coach who *actually* knows how to kick or punt. My understanding is those guys come into the league knowing their job or pay for private coaching in the offseason...

TL, DR: I gots more questions than answer.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

With special teams basically being a team within the team (2 coverage, 2 return, place kicking units) it *almost* makes sense to have a dedicated assistant for coverage, returns, and place. There probably isn't enough work for 3 special teams coaches

Good post, but in response to this, there are several people (assistants) under Drayton, which is what Drayton was, under Zook and then Mennenga. You are correct, is not an easy job, especially when your roster is turning a lot of bodies due to injuries. However, when your organization continually fields special teams units that are consistently at the bottom of the rankings, it goes beyond players. I can see if the Packers had a Lions like team, then yeah, you probably have shitty players on special teams.

There is no doubt that players are making individual mistakes, but when that happens over and over again and it is different players each time, you gotta point the finger at coaching and eventually a bigger finger at the guy who hires the coach that fails.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

LOL at Benkert's Tweets before and after the game. That after game one was to prove he had "played" in a game.

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[swhitset]

You truly gotta stop looking at stats and W/L columns to base an entire stance on. Both Dak and Russ were later round picks when it comes to QBs, to a team with a better constructed rosters and Russ especially had an elite Defense. What Fields is exhibiting are traits those two would be the ceiling they direct one to. It isn't saying he will become one of them, but anyone that studies football or watches deeper than just as a fan can see it.

I just finished rewatching the game. Unfortunately, I have to agree with you. Fields really showed a lot of poise as well as athletic ability. He really seemed to have that “it” factor when it comes to keeping a play alive. When past Bears QBs would fold and panic when the rush would put on pressure… Fields always seemed to find a solution. Sometimes it would be to rum out of trouble, other times… he would find a last minute receiver. The Bears were outmatched in this game… and without the poor special teams of the Packers … it would have been a complete blowout…. but that would not have been because the Bears don’t have a QB.

 

[mradtke66]

There is no doubt that players are making individual mistakes, but when that happens over and over again and it is different players each time, you gotta point the finger at coaching and eventually a bigger finger at the guy who hires the coach that fails.

Picking on you as I hate absolutes and you statement reads dangerously close to an absolute (to me anyway)...

It could still roster and/or MLF being unwilling to allow starters on special teams. Also possible with all of our screwy injuries, we're really 1 or 2 guys away from not being so bad on coverage. For example, if we had our 1 and 4 OLBs healthy, we might not have a pair of replacement-level players playing so much.

It's also worth remembering that with college rosters being so large, many rookies have never had to be a special teams grunt since high school. Possibly not even then.

It's entirely possible that Drayton is trash--we have plenty of evidence that special teams are not good and he's a common part of all special teams.

Less likely, but still possible, is that Drayton is an excellent special teams coach and our guys are just the worst. In fact, a lesser STC would have our kickoff team kicking towards the wrong endzone (I admit this is exceedingly unlikely. Mostly throwing out some humor here, but it should at least be considered.)

What strikes me as most likely is that our specialists are a mess right now. Or have been bouncing between "mess" and "acceptable" for most of the season and that is making a perfectly average looking STC look worse than he is. Bojo hadn't been holding well, we replaced our LS, and Mason is a little older, so his kickoffs are getting shorter and the bad holds are probably messing with his head. We don't have a returner, at least not yet.

My gut: if Mason didn't have those misses, which Drayton probably has the least amount of influence on, we would have a much better overall baseline impression of STs overall. And if so, we'd still be very grumpy about last night, but the doom and gloom wouldn't be there.

Let's try a similar exercise. You are given control over Drayton's mind. He's a robot under your control. You must coach the Packers through Drayton the next two weeks. (Silly constraint for a silly situation so you don't have him quit or similar). What do you do, specifically, to correct our special team woes? I put the question to you so specifically so you don't, pardon the pun, punt and say "change players." Tell me which position or player your swapping in and for who. I put the specific qualification around it so:

a) we find out if you (or anyone for that matter) knows which players even play on which special teams and where they line up (I know i don't know all 9 on any given set with a LS)

b) really look at what can actually be done from a roster position.

 

[Packermudgeon]

You'd have to invent a brand new word to definitively describe the special teams because dud isn't nearly strong enough.

Maybe something that sounds a little bit like Fustercluck.
Or if you prefer an acronym....F U B A R comes pretty close.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

Let's try a similar exercise. You are given control over Drayton's mind. He's a robot under your control. You must coach the Packers through Drayton the next two weeks. (Silly constraint for a silly situation so you don't have him quit or similar). What do you do, specifically, to correct our special team woes?

Not to point out something that is too obvious, but I never said that I would be a better special teams coach than Drayton. So my first question for you; "How much do I get paid to figure all this out in the next few weeks?" I like your exercise, but I am not qualified to perform it. That would be something MLF would ask the guys he is bringing in to interview for the position.

All that said, I will lay down some parameters. Of course I or Drayton or any new coach couldn't just "punt" and swap out every player that is currently on special teams. To complicate things further, we are 14 weeks into the season and this is the kind of stuff you try and figure out in August, when you have a 90 man roster and healthy, fresh bodies.

All special teams coaches are faced with the same daunting task every season. The task of taking the "scraps" that they are given after cutdowns and try to assemble decent groups for all their special team units. Then during the season , deal with guys being pulled out, because suddenly they are either injured or are promoted to starters. It is called adapting, something every positional or unit coach has to learn how to coach through. Maybe this is where Drayton has had a hard time adapting? Scott is released and a new punter/holder and long snapper this season. Lots of injuries and shuffling of the roster, produces new players on special teams. Again, all coaches in the NFL face these obstacles and the fact that we are now on our 4th straight special teams coach (Slocum, Zook, Mennenga, Drayton) that seems to not be able to do his job very well tells me that MM, TT, Gute and MLF for whatever reason, have been asleep at the wheel when it comes to hiring competent guys for the job.

I'm going to say one other thing and it probably won't be very popular with some. Look at the quality of depth of our WR room over the last several years. If you Google "Best gunners in the NFL" you will find that out of the top 5 that are considered best of all time, 4 of them are WR's. These are usually your #4-6 WR's on the depth chart. Notice how many of the mistakes by Packer players on special teams are made by WR's? Well Packer fans, we haven't had a lot of quality mid to low depth WR's on the team and I think that might be part of the problem.

 

[Mondio]

I don't know who we use for returns. as far as I can tell we don't have a natural kick or punt return man that I've seen with this team. Rodgers could be, but he just seems to freeze out there. He's thinking way too much and not just playing. The kid can catch a punt, but he's not doing it cleanly even very often it seems anymore. He's losing confidence to me.

But who else?

 

[mradtke66]

Not to point out something that is too obvious, but I never said that I would be a better special teams coach than Drayton. So my first question for you; "How much do I get paid to figure all this out in the next few weeks?" I like your exercise, but I am not qualified to perform it. That would be something MLF would ask the guys he is bringing in to interview for the position.

I do like someone who can admit that. I know that I too am not qualified. My "twist" though, is if we are not qualified to do his job, how are we qualified to know he's not good at his? This is meant to be tongue in cheek. I'm just trying to point out of if we cannot identify what he's doing wrong, how are we to reliably assign blame to him? In the real world, you can do everything right and lose. Or do most everythinig wrong and still win.

the fact that we are now on our 4th straight special teams coach (Slocum, Zook, Mennenga, Drayton) that seems to not be able to do his job very well tells me that MM, TT, Gute and MLF for whatever reason, have been asleep at the wheel when it comes to hiring competent guys for the job.

This is the part where I am leaning towards, though it might not be their inability to hire good a good STC. Persistent issues across GM and head coaches imply to me a lack of budget to hire a STC or a roster deficiency. Or both. Or something else that we just can't see.

I'm going to say one other thing and it probably won't be very popular with some. Look at the quality of depth of our WR room over the last several years. If you Google "Best gunners in the NFL" you will find that out of the top 5 that are considered best of all time, 4 of them are WR's. These are usually your #4-6 WR's on the depth chart. Notice how many of the mistakes by Packer players on special teams are made by WR's? Well Packer fans, we haven't had a lot of quality mid to low depth WR's on the team and I think that might be part of the problem.

This particular case isn't something I was considering but is the sort of issue I'm suggesting when I talk about roster issues. Sure, we harp on being really deep into the chart at OLB, but your observation might be more important. How many other minor deficiencies are covered up on offense/defensive starters, but magnified on special teams?

 

[JK64]

You'd have to invent a brand new word to definitively describe the special teams because dud isn't nearly strong enough.

I think Preston Smith used some of the words at halftime directed towards Special Teams and Defense.

I believe Pete Daugherty asked MLF if he was going to fire the ST coach today haha

 

[JK64]

: we all know who the villian(s) are ST you are a liability, a cut that needs to be stitched up NOW MLF, unbelievable how something is so bad the organization will not address b4 the season is over, DO IT NOW! It was bad watching this crap show

MLF was making excuses for ST last night. What a joke.

 

[JK64]

Lazard's best game of the season too after a rough stretch

I was happy to see Lazard play well last night. I've given him duds the last two weeks. This week stud.

 

[JK64]

Do we even have practice time dedicated to special teams?

MLF was asked that question. He said they practice a lot.

 

[tynimiller]

Without watching the game I could easily predict most folks studs every week and most of their duds as well just with the stat lines….

 

[gopkrs]

Oh yeah,
dud...wasting a time out when they should have just kicked the field goal anyway which would have put them up by two scores. Not to mention, saving 5 yards down there is not worth the time out.

 

[Schultz]

So who is going to have a better career? Fields or Love? Whom is in a better position to succeed in the NFL? Which one of the 2 would you rather have on your roster?
Asking for a relative.
Thanks in advance.

 

[Pugger]

Agree with most everything above but need to add:


Stud: Mercedes Lewis. Could have been one if his best games as a Packer.

Fields - kid is fun to watch. Not ready to say the Bears finally got a QB, but he may be giving us troubles over his career.

OL coach - can't believe with all of our preferred starters out, we were still fielding an effective unit. Lucky their DT was out. May have been another story.

Dud refs - I thought we got some lucky calls. When Amari muffed the punt my understanding is the player has to get back inbounds right away which I thought he did. Saw bear line up offsides one play - how can they miss that?

As far as Special Teams go: this is on the coaches. Consistently making mistakes by multiple players - either get the players up to speed or get different players in there. Either it's Drayton for skill/preperation, MLF for not providing better ST guys, or maybe Gute for not getting a few ST aces at the bottom of the roster. I think it is mostly Drayton.

On that play the Bears player went out of bounds on his own.