Defending Janis

[Deleted member 6794]

Now with Janis, he blows by the CB and the Safety is forced to help... Thats what Jordy does too. Even when he didnt catch the ball, He helped others get open....

Thats what we were missing...

NFL defensive backs don't have a lot of troubles defending a receiver capable of running only a single route perfectly even if that player is extremely fast. Nelson gets open because he's a crisp route runner and has the skill set to use the entire route tree to separate from defenders.

That's why opponents need to shift a safety towards Nelson's side while a fast cornerback doesn't need any help defending Janis. It's completely ridiculous to compare the two.

 

[yooperpackfan]

I will be very very happy to be proven wrong

I firmly believe that you and many others will be.

 

[bigbubbatd]

NFL defensive backs don't have a lot of troubles defending a receiver capable of running only a single route perfectly even if that player is extremely fast. Nelson gets open because he's a crisp route runner and has the skill set to use the entire route tree to separate from defenders.

That's why opponents need to shift a safety towards Nelson's side while a fast cornerback doesn't need any help defending Janis. It's completely ridiculous to compare the two.

One just needs to watch Nelson run a post pattern to see how ridiculous the comparison is. The other thing Janis does not seem to grasp is when Rodgers is going back shoulder. Nelson always seems to know. That route keeps defenders honest as well. Crisp cuts and the ability to know when Rodgers is going back shoulder is huge for Nelson. As of now Janis has neither.

 

[Kitten]

Agreed, Rodell!!! I'm excited for what Janis is going to bring to the top ranks of our WR core! As mentioned he's also a secret weapon on special teams.

 

[gopkrs]

What I thought was a main reason our receivers had such problems getting open last year was that there was no one who could really get deep. (maybe Montgomery can but he does not seem to be able to look for the ball well). Anyway, the DBs could cover tight right from the line of scrimmage and not have to worry too much about getting beat deep. This means they have a lot of flexibility with how they set up their pass D. (and it did not help that RRodgers cannot separate from linebackers). At least Janis should be able to force them to be more conservative which should help out the other W/Os. And the new TE should be able to fly by linebackers.

 

[PikeBadger]

Right and both Driver and Schroeder may have been more developed from a skill/scheme standpoint coming in. Neither Driver nor Schroeder had Janis' physical ability and I don't think either coasted as much as he did from a skill standpoint in college. Of course maybe it was just that Driver and Schroeder played with a QB who was more willing to play Sandlot style. Rodgers' low interception totals are a reflection of the precision he demands from the passing game.

Bear in mind that Driver didn't have his breakout season until his 4th year in the league.

I do think that the difference in QB's was a factor . I think Schroeder was every bit Janis' equal in physical ability. If I remember correctly Schroeder only played his senior year at Div. 3 LaCrosse. He was probably more raw than Janis imo.

 

[bigbubbatd]

What I thought was a main reason our receivers had such problems getting open last year was that there was no one who could really get deep. (maybe Montgomery can but he does not seem to be able to look for the ball well). Anyway, the DBs could cover tight right from the line of scrimmage and not have to worry too much about getting beat deep. This means they have a lot of flexibility with how they set up their pass D. (and it did not help that RRodgers cannot separate from linebackers). At least Janis should be able to force them to be more conservative which should help out the other W/Os.

Teams dont shift coverage to a guy that can only run a go route. Janis wont open anything up until he proves he can run other routes. Our coaching staff isnt stupid. There is a reason he didnt see the field. And there is a reason when he did see the field he was very unproductive prior to the Arizona game

 

[yooperpackfan]

As of now Janis has neither.

Oh, he will and you will like it!

 

[Mondio]

I do think that the difference in QB's was a factor . I think Schroeder was every bit Janis' equal in physical ability. If I remember correctly Schroeder only played his senior year at Div. 3 LaCrosse. He was probably more raw than Janis imo.

He was an athlete pure and simple. Played football one year because he had some eligibility left. I don't know how many times he was a track and field national champ, but it was more than a couple.

 

[easyk83]

Just read up on Bill Schroeder, I forgot just how fast he was. While Janis has elite NFL speed, Schroeder had generational speed. Janis ran a 4.42 40 at the combine, Schroeder ran a 4.26. Schroeder really was fast enough to just run go routes and Favre was more open to lead targets sandlot style as opposed to throwing to a spot on the field. Now that I think about I swear I recall reading that Schroeder occasionally clocked into the 4.1s.

Janis isn't quite as fast but he's also a bigger stronger and more physical player. 220 versus 206. Janis has flashed a willingness to play over the middle whereas Bill was strictly a sideline guy. So for Janis routes matter a more but he might have a higher ceiling.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

LOL....again....I can see why people would love to be able to compare Janis with Bill Schroeder. But besides hope, not sure what people are hanging their hats on to do this.

Schroeder had 304 career receptions for 4,583 yards and 28 TD's

Janis has 11 career catches for 224 yards and 2 TD's (101 yards and 1 TD coming off of 2 hail mary's)

 

[gopkrs]

If Janis is only as good as Schroeder was...that really is not all that much. As to Ds not having to help out over the top on a speed receiver...that is just wrong.

 

[rodell330]

We won't have to worry about Janis or Jordy moving safeties because Cook will do that. If you have a good tightend it opens up things just as much. Why do you think the Patriots can get away without having an elite wr? They are the first team that could legitimately line up two pro bowl tighteneds when that idiot Hernandez was there.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

Agreed, Rodell!!! I'm excited for what Janis is going to bring to the top ranks of our WR core! As mentioned he's also a secret weapon on special teams.

Janis is already well respected as a special teamer and for sure known to all coordinators in the league.

I do think that the difference in QB's was a factor . I think Schroeder was every bit Janis' equal in physical ability. If I remember correctly Schroeder only played his senior year at Div. 3 LaCrosse. He was probably more raw than Janis imo.

LOL....again....I can see why people would love to be able to compare Janis with Bill Schroeder. But besides hope, not sure what people are hanging their hats on to do this.

Schroeder had 304 career receptions for 4,583 yards and 28 TD's

Janis has 11 career catches for 224 yards and 2 TD's (101 yards and 1 TD coming off of 2 hail mary's)

It seems a lot of Packers fans have forgot about how Schroeder's career worked out. Bill was drafted in 1994 and spend his first season on the Packers practice squad. In 1995 the Patriots signed him but was put on injured reserve. Schroeder then pla ed a season in the World League of American Football (later re-named NFL Europe) for a season before finally playing in his first NFL game with the Packers in 1997 having a total of two receptions that season.

Compared to him Janis has done way more during his first two seasons after getting drafted.

As to Ds not having to help out over the top on a speed receiver...that is just wrong.

An opponent only needs an equally fast defensive back to cover a speedy receiver only capable of running a go route. No help over the top needed.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

Compared to him Janis has done way more during his first two seasons after getting drafted.

Was trying to keep that quiet so as not to fan the flames!!

 

[gopkrs]

The only player I have seen lately who was capable only of running a go route was Jones. And that only down sidelines. And he was not that fast. If you try and watch anyone else too close; he will get a step or two on you and if you don't have help over the top...bye bye. If a W/O truly has speed...the D better respect it. And then you do not need the absolutely crisp route running that some of you are talking about. Just normal crisp. Again not saying Janis will be the guy. Just talking about problems we had last year at w/o.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

The only player I have seen lately who was capable only of running a go route was Jones. And that only down sidelines. And he was not that fast. If you try and watch anyone else too close; he will get a step or two on you and if you don't have help over the top...bye bye. If a W/O truly has speed...the D better respect it. And then you do not need the absolutely crisp route running that some of you are talking about. Just normal crisp. Again not saying Janis will be the guy. Just talking about problems we had last year at w/o.

Jones struggled getting open late in the season as well but he for sure is capable of running a lot more routes than just a go. Once again, if you put a defender on Janis who is as fast as the Packers receiver he won't get open because of his speed. He will have to run a crisp route to achieve that, something he hasn't shown the ability to so far.

 

[bigbubbatd]

The only player I have seen lately who was capable only of running a go route was Jones. And that only down sidelines. And he was not that fast. If you try and watch anyone else too close; he will get a step or two on you and if you don't have help over the top...bye bye. If a W/O truly has speed...the D better respect it. And then you do not need the absolutely crisp route running that some of you are talking about. Just normal crisp. Again not saying Janis will be the guy. Just talking about problems we had last year at w/o.

Jones could run more than a go route and one specific route was the back shoulder. Jones was on the same page with Rodgers so defenders had to be tight on him. Janis has not been thus far

 

[gopkrs]

Yeah, the back shoulder on a go route and once the opposition figured that out, all they needed was one guy to watch him all game. That was why his production fell to just about zero for the 2nd half of the season. Slow and very very rarely did anything but run up the sideline. I'll never forget his first game against the bears or that he almost lost the Super Bowl with Pit. There was a reason he did next to nothing with other teams after he left GB the first time.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

Yeah, the back shoulder on a go route and once the opposition figured that out, all they needed was one guy to watch him all game. That was why his production fell to just about zero for the 2nd half of the season. Slow and very very rarely did anything but run up the sideline. I'll never forget his first game against the bears or that he almost lost the Super Bowl with Pit. There was a reason he did next to nothing with other teams after he left GB the first time.

In contrast to a go route a perfectly executed back shoulder throw is close to impossible to defend. While Jones production drop off in the second half of last season he still had 26 receptions for 407 yards and two touchdowns over the last eight games of the regular season as well as 7 catches for 81 yards at Washington in the playoffs. In addition he had a career high 73 receptions playing for Oakland in 2014, I wouldn't call that production next to nothing.

It's ridiculous to accuse Jones of nearly losing the Super Bowl after he caught five of six targets during the game. What did he do during that game justifying you posting something like that???

 

[bigbubbatd]

In contrast to a go route a perfectly executed back shoulder throw is close to impossible to defend. While Jones production drop off in the second half of last season he still had 26 receptions for 407 yards and two touchdowns over the last eight games of the regular season as well as 7 catches for 81 yards at Washington in the playoffs. In addition he had a career high 73 receptions playing for Oakland in 2014, I wouldn't call that production next to nothing.

It's ridiculous to accuse Jones of nearly losing the Super Bowl after he caught five of six targets during the game. What did he do during that game justifying you posting something like that???

Jones dropped a sure to that would have given the Packers a huge cushion but so did Jordy. The Packers wrs had some struggles that game but they made enough plays. They could have won by much more though

 

[Deleted member 6794]

Jones dropped a sure to that would have given the Packers a huge cushion but so did Jordy. The Packers wrs had some struggles that game but they made enough plays. They could have won by much more though

I know Jones dropped a ball that could have resulted in a touchdown but that happened with the Packers leading by 11 early in the second half. Suggesting the team nearly lost the game because of it is ridiculous.

 

[bigbubbatd]

I know Jones dropped a ball that could have resulted in a touchdown but that happened with the Packers leading by 11 early in the second half. Suggesting the team nearly lost the game because of it is ridiculous.

Oh I agree. I do remember being crushed by that drop because if he catches it the Packers go up 18 which would have been huge. But he played well enough. Jones had drops early in his career but he really turned it around

 

[PikeBadger]

Just read up on Bill Schroeder, I forgot just how fast he was. While Janis has elite NFL speed, Schroeder had generational speed. Janis ran a 4.42 40 at the combine, Schroeder ran a 4.26. Schroeder really was fast enough to just run go routes and Favre was more open to lead targets sandlot style as opposed to throwing to a spot on the field. Now that I think about I swear I recall reading that Schroeder occasionally clocked into the 4.1s.

Janis isn't quite as fast but he's also a bigger stronger and more physical player. 220 versus 206. Janis has flashed a willingness to play over the middle whereas Bill was strictly a sideline guy. So for Janis routes matter a more but he might have a higher ceiling.

Schroeder made some some absolutely phenomenal catches and was clearly an elite athletic talent. Imo, he had very little football savvy, was not innately a wide receiver who had a good feel for the position like Antonio Freeman or Greg Jennings who seemed very natural at the position. Schroeder benefitted greatly by having Favre as his QB. I think he would have struggled much more with a QB like Rodgers. Imo, fast is fast, and Janis and Schroeder are essentially equal in football speed.
I think mentally and personality wise, Favre and Schroeder were more likely to connect.

 

[adambr2]

Schroeder made some some absolutely phenomenal catches and was clearly an elite athletic talent. Imo, he had very little football savvy, was not innately a wide receiver who had a good feel for the position like Antonio Freeman or Greg Jennings who seemed very natural at the position. Schroeder benefitted greatly by having Favre as his QB. I think he would have struggled much more with a QB like Rodgers. Imo, fast is fast, and Janis and Schroeder are essentially equal in football speed.
I think mentally and personality wise, Favre and Schroeder were more likely to connect.

Makes sense. Conversely, I think Janis would have fit in more quickly in the style of an offense with a gun slinging quarterback. In a Rodgers' led offense he needs to learn to be a WR first.