Bad news for the Vikings

[Pokerbrat2000]

IMO Bradford is going to need time and game reps to even get up to speed and comfortable with yet another offense. He may need that second year to start playing up to his potential.

 

[El Guapo]

The Vikings also have one of the easiest schedules in the league. The only difference between our schedules is that they play us twice, the Panthers, and Cardinals. Our two non-same games are against the Seahawks and Falcons. While it's not an easy start for Minnesota, they at least should be able to weather the storm with AP and their defense until Bradford is ready to roll.

I at least feel slightly more confident about Mrs. El Guapo's surprise decision to buy tickets to the Packers/Vikings game at the new stadium.

 

[lambeaulambo]

I fully expect the new stadium to implode...lol....just remember they have to bring in a trophy case this year to hold the Lombardi Trophy for one game, and then it gets taken out...replaced by the Tommy Kramer 3.2/near beer stand...LOL

 

[adambr2]

I've got to think this move indicates Teddy is doubtful for next season. I can't see a healthy Bridgewater being a backup in Minnesota, nor can I see them having a $17M backup QB.

That's another advantage that this trade takes away from the Vikings, having a cheap starting QB on a rookie contract. 17M extra in cap space burned next year than if they simply had a healthy Bridgewater.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

I'm not sure that Bradford will be ready Week 1.

The Vikings have a rough start to the schedule with games against Green Bay and Carolina in the first two weeks. Personally I would let Shawn Hill start until Bradford feels confident and comfortable.

FWIW the Vikings depth chart currently lists Shaun Hill as the starter. Minnesota plays at Tennessee in week 1 before facing the Packers and Panthers.

Looking ahead to 2017, what do the Vikings do with Bradford once Teddy is able to play again?

One thing to consider is that $4 million of Bradford's 2017 base salary is fully guaranteed.

 

[ExpatPacker]

Bradford was about as good as the Vikings were going to get on such short notice, and he will probably make them competitive.

Trading a 1st rounder is a lot, but you don't get a QB for nothing. Plus the Vikings have a lot of talent and giving up a 1st rounder isn't going to hurt them that bad.

 

[El Guapo]

FWIW the Vikings depth chart currently lists Shaun Hill as the starter. Minnesota plays at Tennessee in week 1 before facing the Packers and Panthers.

True but they have to have something there. Zimmer has publicly stated that he won't name the starter until he has to, which is just shenanigans to make the Titans prepare for two QBs. I don't think that it's much of a mystery that Hill will start though. I would spend 90% of my time preparing for that, and wouldn't be too worried if it's Bradford.

 

[Curly Calhoun]

True but they have to have something there. Zimmer has publicly stated that he won't name the starter until he has to, which is just shenanigans to make the Titans prepare for two QBs. I don't think that it's much of a mystery that Hill will start though. I would spend 90% of my time preparing for that, and wouldn't be too worried if it's Bradford.

I would think Hill would be the week one starter, but sooner or later they'll turn things over to the guy they just gave up two high draft picks for, regardless of performance.

Sam Bradford's career numbers, thus far:

http://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/B/BradSa00.htm


It ain't pretty.....



Shaun Hill's:

http://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/H/HillSh00.htm

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

Wow.....

"No matter whether it’s Shaun Hill or Sam Bradford, the quarterback who hands it to Adrian Peterson Sunday will be the 12th starter he’s taken handoffs from with the Vikings."

So when Bradford starts the following week, that will make it 13. Didn't realize its been such a merry go round with starters up there in VisQueen land.

 

[Curly Calhoun]

Wow.....

"No matter whether it’s Shaun Hill or Sam Bradford, the quarterback who hands it to Adrian Peterson Sunday will be the 12th starter he’s taken handoffs from with the Vikings."

So when Bradford starts the following week, that will make it 13. Didn't realize its been such a merry go round with starters up there in VisQueen land.

Well, there was Brett, and Christian Ponder, and Josh Freeman, Joe Webb, Matt Cassel, Donovan McNabb, Gus Ferrotte, T-Jack.....I'm missing a few.

The best they had was Brett, and he only gave them one good year. Other than that, mediocre to downright ugly.

 

[sschind]

True but they have to have something there. Zimmer has publicly stated that he won't name the starter until he has to, which is just shenanigans to make the Titans prepare for two QBs. I don't think that it's much of a mystery that Hill will start though. I would spend 90% of my time preparing for that, and wouldn't be too worried if it's Bradford.

Would preparing for Hill be that much different than preparing for Bradford? What I mean is is their skill set that much different. Its not like one is a guy who can beat you with his legs and the other can throw with the best of them.

Hill and Bradford are average QBs and I don't think a DC will have to knock himself out preparing for either one over the other. Prepare to stop Peterson and if you can do that the the game is 90% won regardless of who is at QB.

 

[bigbubbatd]

Bradford was about as good as the Vikings were going to get on such short notice, and he will probably make them competitive.

Trading a 1st rounder is a lot, but you don't get a QB for nothing. Plus the Vikings have a lot of talent and giving up a 1st rounder isn't going to hurt them that bad.

Not sure about that last part. They will have a ton of guys come up for contracts in the next couple years and they will need cheaper players. They are fine now and probably in 2017 but what happens in 2018 and 2019 when Rhodes, Joseph, Floyd, Barr, Bradford/Bridgewater, Griffen, Kendricks, Diggs, Hunter etc all become fas over two years. You will want young cheap talent so you can let some walk. Add in the need to address 3-4 spots on the oline, get a new 3 down back (or else McKinnon needs to be added to fas above), figure out qb, etc and you have some money that will need to be spent.

I like the Vikings young defensive talent but they are lacking young talent on the offensive side. Not sure I see a single true pro bowl type player in their young offensive group.

 

[Raptorman]

Not sure about that last part. They will have a ton of guys come up for contracts in the next couple years and they will need cheaper players. They are fine now and probably in 2017 but what happens in 2018 and 2019 when Rhodes, Joseph, Floyd, Barry, Bradford/Bridgewater, Griffen, Kendricks, Diggs, Hunter etc all become fas over two years. You will want young cheap talent so you can let some walk. Add in the need to address 3-4 spots on the oline, get a new 3 down back (or else McKinnon needs to be added to fas above), figure out qb, etc and you have some money that will need to be spent.

I like the Vikings young defensive talent but they are lacking young talent on the offensive side. Not sure I see a single true pro bowl type player in their young offensive group.

I wouldn't worry about it. In 2018 they are currently projected to have $104 million in cap space. That's about $30 million more than what the Packers are projected to have. I think they will be ok.

 

[bigbubbatd]

I wouldn't worry about it. In 2018 they are currently projected to have $104 million in cap space. That's about $30 million more than what the Packers are projected to have. I think they will be ok.

I understand they will have more cap space but they will also have a ton of guys who if they are pro bowl type defenders will be looking at 10 million a year plus deals. That sucks up a cap quickly. Especially when you realize the vikings don't even have a qb under contract. That is 10 to 20 percent of that cap space right there. The Packers have less space but bigger pieces under contract.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

Not sure about that last part. They will have a ton of guys come up for contracts in the next couple years and they will need cheaper players. They are fine now and probably in 2017 but what happens in 2018 and 2019 when Rhodes, Joseph, Floyd, Barr, Bradford/Bridgewater, Griffen, Kendricks, Diggs, Hunter etc all become fas over two years. You will want young cheap talent so you can let some walk. Add in the need to address 3-4 spots on the oline, get a new 3 down back (or else McKinnon needs to be added to fas above), figure out qb, etc and you have some money that will need to be spent.

I like the Vikings young defensive talent but they are lacking young talent on the offensive side. Not sure I see a single true pro bowl type player in their young offensive group.

While I agree that trading away a first rounder hurts every single team in the league it seems the Vikings will be fine with the salary cap.

 

[bigbubbatd]

While I agree that trading away a first rounder hurts every single team in the league it seems the Vikings will be fine with the salary cap.

I am sure you and raptor are right. He is a Viking fan so he knows his team much better and you know cap stuff. I just look at what the don't have under contract like any qbs, a lt, guys like barr, Rhodes, and Griffen (or any pass rusher) and I think those are some expensive positions. We live in a world where Brock osweiler makes 18 million a year. So without a qb, either tackle, a couple wrs, a rb, and then those defensive studs it seems like the money will go fast

 

[Deleted member 6794]

I am sure you and raptor are right. He is a Viking fan so he knows his team much better and you know cap stuff. I just look at what the don't have under contract like any qbs, a lt, guys like barr, Rhodes, and Griffen (or any pass rusher) and I think those are some expensive positions. We live in a world where Brock osweiler makes 18 million a year. So without a qb, either tackle, a couple wrs, a rb, and then those defensive studs it seems like the money will go fast

There's no doubt the Vikings will need a lot of the available cap space to sign players at the positions you mentioned. It's actually too early to make an educated guess about how the situation will work out for Minnesota but as of right now it seems they should be fine.

 

[El Guapo]

As for the lack of young talent on offense, I would disagree. Bridgewater was an emerging talent but with the knee he won't get a big contract. So if he comes back that will be a $$$ bargain for the Vikes. Most importantly is their WR corp. They have alot to prove but Diggs, Johnson, and Thelen form a pretty good trio of WRs that are all solid #2's. If Treadwell pans out to be worthy of his first round status that will elevate the rest.

I've said it forever, but Minnesota's biggest weakness is their Oline. They've hampered Teddy's growth as he has to scramble and make quick, short passes to avoid getting killed. The second biggest weakness has been their WRs. Johnson played hurt most of last year and Kyle Rudolph was returning to form and Diggs was emerging. Without a true #1 WR Bridgewater had been in a double-whammy bad situation, with little to throw to and little time to do it. Things were looking better this year until the knee injury.

Their defense is top tier and AP is still elite. The big thing this season will be to see how they react when down by multiple scores. Do they have the horsepower at QB and WR to comeback or will they have to slug it out with defense and RBs?

 

[Deleted member 6794]

As for the lack of young talent on offense, I would disagree. Bridgewater was an emerging talent but with the knee he won't get a big contract. So if he comes back that will be a $$$ bargain for the Vikes. Most importantly is their WR corp. They have alot to prove but Diggs, Johnson, and Thelen form a pretty good trio of WRs that are all solid #2's. If Treadwell pans out to be worthy of his first round status that will elevate the rest.

I don't think there's any reason to make any of the Vikings positional groups any better than they are.

Packers fans would be up in arms if the team somehow ended up with a receiving corps lacking talent like the Vikings' one.

 

[Curly Calhoun]

As for the lack of young talent on offense, I would disagree. Bridgewater was an emerging talent but with the knee he won't get a big contract. So if he comes back that will be a $$$ bargain for the Vikes. Most importantly is their WR corp. They have alot to prove but Diggs, Johnson, and Thelen form a pretty good trio of WRs that are all solid #2's. If Treadwell pans out to be worthy of his first round status that will elevate the rest.

I've said it forever, but Minnesota's biggest weakness is their Oline. They've hampered Teddy's growth as he has to scramble and make quick, short passes to avoid getting killed. The second biggest weakness has been their WRs. Johnson played hurt most of last year and Kyle Rudolph was returning to form and Diggs was emerging. Without a true #1 WR Bridgewater had been in a double-whammy bad situation, with little to throw to and little time to do it. Things were looking better this year until the knee injury.

Their defense is top tier and AP is still elite. The big thing this season will be to see how they react when down by multiple scores. Do they have the horsepower at QB and WR to comeback or will they have to slug it out with defense and RBs?

I think the biggest worry for the Vikes is the ticking clock and shrinking window - Their offense is still built around AP, and that can't last forever. He's 31, and while he for now remains a top-tier running back, history indicates his days at playing at a high level are likely numbered. His losing one and potentially two years with Teddy Bridgewater has to be disconcerting for them.

Green Bay, on the other hand, has again one of the youngest teams in the NFL. And while Aaron Rodgers is 32, history also indicates over-thirty quarterbacks hold up a lot better than over-thirty running backs.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

Green Bay, on the other hand, has again one of the youngest teams in the NFL.

According to the Journal Sentinel the Packers current roster is the youngest of the team in the last 30 years and possibly ever at 25.08 years per player.

 

[El Guapo]

http://www.startribune.com/after-roster-cuts-vikings-no-longer-among-nfls-youngest-teams/392282331/
According to the Star Tribune, they have the 31st oldest roster in the league despite efforts to get younger.

 

[AmishMafia]

Bradford was about as good as the Vikings were going to get on such short notice, and he will probably make them competitive.

Trading a 1st rounder is a lot, but you don't get a QB for nothing. Plus the Vikings have a lot of talent and giving up a 1st rounder isn't going to hurt them that bad.

Mark Sanchez was cut and they could have gotten him for free. I would rate him slightly better than Bradford. Their stats are similar but Sanchez is a stronger leader and has more success.

To date, Bradford has never won a playoff game and I doubt that changes this season.

 

[AmishMafia]

http://www.startribune.com/after-roster-cuts-vikings-no-longer-among-nfls-youngest-teams/392282331/
According to the Star Tribune, they have the 31st oldest roster in the league despite efforts to get younger.

Isnt 31st oldest the same as being the 2nd youngest?

 

[bigbubbatd]

I don't think there's any reason to make any of the Vikings positional groups any better than they are.

Packers fans would be up in arms if the team somehow ended up with a receiving corps lacking talent like the Vikings' one.

Yeah in what world are Johnson and Thelien number 2 types? Johnson has done very little in the NFL. Similar to Thelien who had been much more a special teams player. Even Diggs only had one game over 55 yards the second half of last year. Diggs had a terrific 4 game stretch but the last 8 were nothing special. 27 catches for 300 yards over those 8 games.

If wouldnt call Bridgewater emerging by putting up almost identically below average numbers between year one and year two. He was a very limited passer

The wr core has 3 guys who are probably one of the worst and least proven starting 3 in the NFL. Treadwell could change that but Johnson and Thelien are not likely to change that view