Assistant Coach Tracker

[Sunshinepacker]

Monken is interviewing with Lafleur for OC in Green Bay.

https://mobile.twitter.com/JimOwczarski/status/1083816134447632384

He'd be a fun hire!

 

[PackAttack12]

Monken is interviewing with Lafleur for OC in Green Bay.

https://mobile.twitter.com/JimOwczarski/status/1083816134447632384

This would be a really good get for LaFleur. I'd be impressed.

 

[Mondio]

The answer we will never have with Hayward is "would he be the same player had he stayed in Green Bay"? Personally, I don't think he would have, his improvement was too large just to attest to "he must have really worked hard in the off season". So then you are left asking "Was it the Packer DC/Scheme or the assistant coaches inability to get him to that next level?" Had TT been holding a crystal ball, no way does Hayward get out of Green Bay. So either the coaches didn't know what Hayward was capable of or if they did, they didn't let TT know, nor did they get him playing at his full potential.

Another player example is Davon House. He really wasn't all that much in Green Bay. He leaves and plays much better in his first year in Jacksonville. He statistically wasn't all that great his second season in Jacksonville, but that had a lot to do with a new DC switching to zone and 2 guys named Jalen Ramsey and Prince Amukamara. He comes back to Green Bay and for the most part, was just so so his first year and last year looked pretty bad before being injured.

House was as injured here his first stint as his second. But I think much of it was scheme related. Until the end of the year when it was who's that, Alexander some and tony brown out there with guys they signed off the street 2 weeks prior, I thought the difference in the defensive secondary was pretty obvious just from a broken play stand point. They happen to everyone, but prior to this year, they seemed to happen every time the other team needed a chunk of yards, and even when they didn't.

This season, I almost **** my pants the first few times we had some obvious "coverage sacks" because nobody was open and our lackluster pass rush was able to eventually get home. and they did it with a lot of youth back there and still with a fair number of injuries and no pass rush so they had to take a guy out of coverage to blitz. I thought the difference between this year and last was pretty obvious. Myself I attribute that to the scheme. much of our passing woes in the past were flat out busted plays.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

Like I have always said, I like Joe Whitt as a guy. Seems like a likable, nice person. I also realize the Packers see something in him and he will probably stick around. If he does stick around, I hope he proves me completely wrong, because I just don't see much on the field that tells me he is all that good at teaching and motivating guys.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

House was as injured here his first stint as his second. But I think much of it was scheme related. Until the end of the year when it was who's that, Alexander some and tony brown out there with guys they signed off the street 2 weeks prior, I thought the difference in the defensive secondary was pretty obvious just from a broken play stand point. They happen to everyone, but prior to this year, they seemed to happen every time the other team needed a chunk of yards, and even when they didn't.

This season, I almost **** my pants the first few times we had some obvious "coverage sacks" because nobody was open and our lackluster pass rush was able to eventually get home. and they did it with a lot of youth back there and still with a fair number of injuries and no pass rush so they had to take a guy out of coverage to blitz. I thought the difference between this year and last was pretty obvious. Myself I attribute that to the scheme. much of our passing woes in the past were flat out busted plays.

I will say one thing in agreement with you and I don't know if it supports your stance or doesn't, but it just amazes me as to how many guys have passed through our secondary in the last 5 or so years. Has to be double or more of any other positional group? Maybe Captain has some numbers?

 

[pacmaniac]

Monken is interviewing with Lafleur for OC in Green Bay.

https://mobile.twitter.com/JimOwczarski/status/1083816134447632384

If Monken gets the job, how long would he stay? One year? Because he already interviewed for HC positions, can't imagine he would stick around as OC for long if the Packers turn around their offense.

 

[GreenNGold_81]

If Monken gets the job, how long would he stay? One year? Because he already interviewed for HC positions, can't imagine he would stick around as OC for long if the Packers turn around their offense.

That's a legit concern, I think the positives would outweigh any negatives. They'd have to ensure whichever QB coach they get can absorb enough to take over the next year.

 

[ls1bob]

Playing devil’s advocate here. Maybe Whitt hasn’t been able to do well with the secondary because of how the front 7 played and how their scheme was drawn up by Capers. This past year with Pettine was a learning curve getting to know him and where to put his players in a position to make plays? I don’t know,if Pettine wants to keep him,it means they are on the same page IMO.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

If Monken gets the job, how long would he stay? One year? Because he already interviewed for HC positions, can't imagine he would stick around as OC for long if the Packers turn around their offense.

That isn't a bad problem to have.

Trying to think of the last Packer coach that got "hired away".

 

[azrsx05]

If Monken gets the job, how long would he stay? One year? Because he already interviewed for HC positions, can't imagine he would stick around as OC for long if the Packers turn around their offense.

That's a great point. But I think that would be a great problem to have.. If people are trying to take your coaches, that means your probably doing something right. I'd be ok with him coming in here 1 season and sharing his knowledge and possibly showing someone internal how he runs the offense and they both get promoted if he leaves.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

Playing devil’s advocate here. Maybe Whitt hasn’t been able to do well with the secondary because of how the front 7 played and how their scheme was drawn up by Capers. This past year with Pettine was a learning curve getting to know him and where to put his players in a position to make plays? I don’t know,if Pettine wants to keep him,it means they are on the same page IMO.

I think that is a fair analysis if you are only looking at the defense as a whole and only grading it on what they do as a unit. My problem has been more with the individual attributes of guys he coaches. Heads not in the game all the time, missed tackles, blown coverage, technique, etc. So yes, the entire defense hasn't been that stellar for quite awhile, but you have to start dissecting the parts in order to fix it.

When a car engine fails, you don't just say "well, bad engine, what do we do?" You find out what part of the engine is malfunctioning.

Goes without saying, if Whitt is retained, whoever makes that decision likes him, knows a lot more than I do and hopefully makes the right call.

 

[Dantés]

I rarely watch Chargers games, but have seen a few. He should have been better, he was in his 5th year as opposed to 1st in the NFL. And I know numbers don't tell the whole picture, but games, passes defensed and INT's were basically his rookie season in GB.

He was shadowing an shutting down #1 receivers to an extent second only to Patrick Peterson at the time. It was a massive leap in production from his last season in Green Bay and drastically superior to his rookie year.

 

[Dantés]

Monken is interviewing with Lafleur for OC in Green Bay.

https://mobile.twitter.com/JimOwczarski/status/1083816134447632384

Yay!!!

 

[ls1bob]

I think that is a fair analysis if you are only looking at the defense as a whole and only grading it on what they do as a unit. My problem has been more with the individual attributes of guys he coaches. Heads not in the game all the time, missed tackles, blown coverage, technique, etc. So yes, the entire defense hasn't been that stellar for quite awhile, but he have to start dissecting the parts in order to fix it.

When a car engine fails, you don't just say "well, bad engine, what do we do?" You find out what part of the engine is malfunctioning.

Goes without saying, if Whitt is retained, whoever makes that decision likes him, knows a lot more than I do and hopefully makes the right call.

I don’t know who is in charge of teaching tackling,turning your head around when the ball is in the air (ball awareness) two big faults I have seen from out DB’s and Safeties,but they are parts that need improvement. Who knows if the driver abused the transmission and caused the failure or used the wrong fluid and caused the problem.( I own a transmission shop so I used that analogy) You are 100% correct on your last sentence, I hope the powers to be make the right call.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

That's a great point. But I think that would be a great problem to have.. If people are trying to take your coaches, that means your probably doing something right. I'd be ok with him coming in here 1 season and sharing his knowledge and possibly showing someone internal how he runs the offense and they both get promoted if he leaves.

Yup and a sign of a successful organization when everyone wants to hire away your coaches. The part that the teams doing the hiring have to be careful with, is thinking a certain coach had a bigger role in the success than he actually did.

I always feel this way about drafting college players too. People love pointing out players from Bama, Ohio State, Clemson, etc., sure chances are that the obvious standouts are going to be decent in the NFL, but some of the "other guys" probably look a lot better than they actually are, just because of the players and coaches around them.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

He was shadowing an shutting down #1 receivers to an extent second only to Patrick Peterson at the time. It was a massive leap in production from his last season in Green Bay and drastically superior to his rookie year.

I'm sure he just spent a lot of time in the weight room to improve that much.

 

[Dantés]

If the Packers are successful in 2019, then you can bet that Monken would only be here one season, but that would be an awesome get as an OC. I actually preferred him as a HC candidate to LaFleur.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

If the Packers are successful in 2019, then you can bet that Monken would only be here one season, but that would be an awesome get as an OC. I actually preferred him as a HC candidate to LaFleur.

If that pathway is in Monken's master plan, than I can't think of a better team (currently looking for an OC) for him to "use" as his springboard to a HC job in 2020.

 

[Mondio]

He was shadowing an shutting down #1 receivers to an extent second only to Patrick Peterson at the time. It was a massive leap in production from his last season in Green Bay and drastically superior to his rookie year.

I will concede he was better. I don't regularly watch the chargers. But his rookie and probably only completely healthy season his numbers were as good as his best in San Diego. My point being, he was no slouch here either. I'm not going to go back and see who he was covering in what game or what he did, but you don't get to 20+ passes defended and 6 INT's by not being good. Then he had issues with his wonderful hamstring. and again, I rarely watch the chargers, but it seems he's no where near that production this year, what gives?

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

it seems he's no where near that production this year, what gives?

I'm sure Dantés will have a more complete explanation, but it seems that Hayward is still playing well, he just has really good players around him in King, James, Davis and Addae, so he might not be wowing everyone with stats as much as in the past.

As I look at the components of the Chargers secondary, it sickens me to see that besides Derwin James, its comprised of a lot of relatively young mid round and UDFA's. Of course Hayward was a 2nd Rd. pick by the Packers.

 

[Dantés]

I will concede he was better. I don't regularly watch the chargers. But his rookie and probably only completely healthy season his numbers were as good as his best in San Diego. My point being, he was no slouch here either. I'm not going to go back and see who he was covering in what game or what he did, but you don't get to 20+ passes defended and 6 INT's by not being good. Then he had issues with his wonderful hamstring. and again, I rarely watch the chargers, but it seems he's no where near that production this year, what gives?

I haven't watched him at all so I couldn't tell you. But I would say that production is an unreliable measure for a corner. Low numbers can be a sign that you're erasing receivers and not getting targeted.

I have no dog in this fight. I'm not a Whitt defender or critic. I have no idea. All I can say is I saw Hyde before and after he left and the difference was stark.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

I have no dog in this fight. I'm not a Whitt defender or critic. I have no idea. All I can say is I saw Hyde before and after he left and the difference was stark.

It's never been a "fight", just a healthy discussion which I have actually enjoyed with Mondio and a few others. My gut tells me that Whitt will be retained, so hopefully the secondary rocks next year and I will finally be able to shut my mouth.

 

[Dantés]

It's never been a "fight", just a healthy discussion which I have actually enjoyed with Mondio and a few others. My gut tells me that Whitt will be retained, so hopefully the secondary rocks next year and I will finally be able to shut my mouth.

Just a figure of speech

 

[Mondio]

I haven't watched him at all so I couldn't tell you. But I would say that production is an unreliable measure for a corner. Low numbers can be a sign that you're erasing receivers and not getting targeted.

I have no dog in this fight. I'm not a Whitt defender or critic. I have no idea. All I can say is I saw Hyde before and after he left and the difference was stark.

I think you meant Hayward. I don't think Hyde is any different than he was here other than a position switch.

 

[PackAttack12]

I haven't watched him at all so I couldn't tell you. But I would say that production is an unreliable measure for a corner. Low numbers can be a sign that you're erasing receivers and not getting targeted.

Exactly.

Pro Bowls for defensive players aren't always reflective in statistics. And the measure of a defensive player isn't always in statistics.