Week 10: Miami Here - Run The Table Must Start Now

[Deleted member 6794]

Packers rule out King for Sunday's game against the Dolphins. Bulaga, Cobb and Martinez listed as questionable.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

I read today Rodgers set a new record for throwaways with 32 throwaways this season up to the New England Patriots lose.

I prefer Rodgers to throw the ball away instead of taking a sack or getting intercepted.

I agree the defense is looking better, but they still have a ways to go. I believe they're 16th in yards per game, and 21st in points per game.

The Packers are currently only 20th in points allowed but there's no doubt the unit has shown improvement over past seasons.

 

[sschind]

You mean the same Greg Jennings who talked all that stuff regarding Rodgers the following season after joining Minnesota, (Rodgers chose not to say anything btw) and got owned and was seen trying to reconcile things after the game? I remember this forum having a field day after The Packers spanked the Vikings that day. But basically Jennings career was never the same after leaving Green Bay. Interesting you'd put stock into what he says considering how he left.

Then you have Jermichael "Stonehands" Finely. What I find funny is that some of you call Rodgers a prima donna but forget about the headcase Finley could be. Let's not forget about all the dropped passes he had during his time here. When he was finally able to live up to his potential, he got injured and was never seen again. Again another interesting person to stock from regarding Rodgers.

Then there's Donald Driver. Ok let's get one thing straight. Driver was NOT critical of Rodgers, all Driver said was that he held people accountable, and frankly that's what you want from your leaders. Rodgers demands excellence from his teammates as it is demanded from him. When people question Rodgers leadership, I roll my eyes because Rodgers leads by example. Now is he the best leader? That's not for me to say really, but like any leader he holds people accountable including himself. So let's not twist what Driver actually said. He wasn't critical of Rodgers in my estimation.

What I find weird is people always using these 3 examples in regards to teammates bad mouthing him to which I ask what have those players done after leaving Rodgers? Again I don't include Driver in this.

I don't recall Charles Woodson, Tj Lang, James Jones, Josh Sitton, AJ Hawk, (Looking at your Cowherd) or hell Jordy Nelson having anything negative to say regarding Rodgers after leaving Green Bay, but rather the opposite. If you're going to be critical of a QB fine. But be fair, and look at the people that have spoke positive about Rodgers rather than focus on the bad.

Also hey everyone! Nice to meet you all!

Are you a lawyer? If you can't refute the testimony try to discredit the witness.

First you say Interesting you'd put stock into what he says considering how he left. Would you say we should also disregard anything Brett Favre says considering the way he left,or anyone else who may have left under not so pleasant terms. That may include players like Ty Montgomery or Ha Ha Clinton-Dix in the near future. Should we look at anything they say and dismiss them as sour grapes?

Then you say Jermichael "Stonehands" Finely and forget about the headcase Finley could be and Let's not forget about all the dropped passes he had during his time here, as if insinuating he was making stuff up about Rodgers to make up for any shortcomings he may have had.

Then you discount what Driver had to say by saying So let's not twist what Driver actually said. He wasn't critical of Rodgers in my estimation. It's fine that you don't interpret what Driver said as being critical but lets not pretend that you know what he meant. We all read or see things and interpret them differently but unless the quote is very specific with nothing open to interpretation its difficult to say if your interpretation is any more accurate than any others.

Finally you make one last attempt to discredit what some say by pointing to the fact that others have said nothing negative or even had positive things to say. Just because some players don't respond in one way doesn't mean that those who do are wrong. I would guess that the majority of players who leave their teams would have some negative things to say about certain team mates but they don't say them because they are either not built that way or they realize nothing good can come of it.

Now, having said all that and started off by putting myself on your bad side I will say that you may very well be right. I am not saying that Aaron Rodgers is not a good leader. I think he is a very competitive person and holds everyone, himself included, to very high standards. He has, on many occasions included himself when saying "we" need to play better. I think he is very critical of players who make mistakes and it can sometimes look as if he is blaming others when in fact he may be right. "I called an out and you ran an in. You should know better" Depending on how he communicates this it may look as if he is dressing the player down but in the heat of the game it may be difficult to come up with a more tactful way of saying things. Some people are just better at that than others. I can certainly see how those critical of Rodgers in the leadership category can get that opinion but I think a lot of it simply stems from frustration at the lost opportunities and doesn't necessarily lend itself to any specific character flaws.

In an olive branch offering I'd say judging from your first post here you will be an asset to the site. Welcome and go Packers.

 

[PikeBadger]

I don't think Rodgers is a prima Donna. He may be by the time his career is over. Favre acted like a diva toward the end there, but I never held it against him. These superstar players are pampered athletes to the extreme, it's bound to affect them sooner or later on some level.

Regarding Rodgers' frustrations, I see the national sports media has been taking note of his increasing displays of frustration on the field or on the sidelines. I mean he's not in Jay Cutler area yet, but his body language has not been positive on more than one occasion. You can see the team's shortcomings are starting to get to him, and has probably also been disappointed in his own play here and there.

He needs to fix his own play first. I totally agree that he isn’t displaying the same throwing mechanics on a consistent basis like he used to. He’s definitely a creature of habit and he takes too long to correct bad habits. Someone on this coaching staff has to have told him to keep his mechanics in order if many of us are seeing it. Maybe it’s time for a QB coach or respected outsider to get in his grillworks and tell him his throwing mechanics often needlessly look amateurish.

 

[Jerellh528]

Cobb may not being able to play opens up more opportunities for EQ or Moore to step up and make some plays.

 

[PikeBadger]

I’ll just say it. Next to the 4 game losing streak this is possibly the worst stretch of games I’ve seen us play in recent history.
Don’t misunderstand me. We have a lot of potential and I am as passionate a fan this week as any game because we’re only as good as our current performance. I just think we need time to mature and we are running low on petro in 2018. Odds are we go 5-3 in the back 8 and unfortunately that doesn’t cut the mustard.
It’s unlikely we make the playoffs unless we have an epiphany. I don’t think we’re built this year to do anything but scrap for a wild card. We will know much more about how this team is built in 2 weeks.
I do however think we are on the the rise are 1 more draft and aggressive FA away from a surge (11-5 and another Divisional game) and 2 good FA and drafts from knocking on the door at the NFC Chsmpionship game.

Hmmm. I thought we actually played one of our best games against the Rams two weeks ago. Imo, pretty good performance against a good team on the road. We’d be in first place if all our games had been played at that level.

 

[PackAttack12]

Cobb may not being able to play opens up more opportunities for EQ or Moore to step up and make some plays.

So this solidifies what I mentioned in another thread, and sort of piggybacked on a point that @PackerfaninCarolina made. I want this offense to go more up tempo early and often. 11 personnel with Adams, MVS, St. Brown, Graham, Jones. With Cobb banged up and Allison out for the season essentially, it's time to speed it up and make this offense more dynamic. MVS and St. Brown might be young and there might be a learning curve, but I say lets sink or swim.

The unit I'm alluding to has the potential to be insanely dynamic and explosive.

 

[Do7]

Are you a lawyer? If you can't refute the testimony try to discredit the witness.

First you say Interesting you'd put stock into what he says considering how he left. Would you say we should also disregard anything Brett Favre says considering the way he left,or anyone else who may have left under not so pleasant terms. That may include players like Ty Montgomery or Ha Ha Clinton-Dix in the near future. Should we look at anything they say and dismiss them as sour grapes?

Then you say Jermichael "Stonehands" Finely and forget about the headcase Finley could be and Let's not forget about all the dropped passes he had during his time here, as if insinuating he was making stuff up about Rodgers to make up for any shortcomings he may have had.

Then you discount what Driver had to say by saying So let's not twist what Driver actually said. He wasn't critical of Rodgers in my estimation. It's fine that you don't interpret what Driver said as being critical but lets not pretend that you know what he meant. We all read or see things and interpret them differently but unless the quote is very specific with nothing open to interpretation its difficult to say if your interpretation is any more accurate than any others.

Finally you make one last attempt to discredit what some say by pointing to the fact that others have said nothing negative or even had positive things to say. Just because some players don't respond in one way doesn't mean that those who do are wrong. I would guess that the majority of players who leave their teams would have some negative things to say about certain team mates but they don't say them because they are either not built that way or they realize nothing good can come of it.

Now, having said all that and started off by putting myself on your bad side I will say that you may very well be right. I am not saying that Aaron Rodgers is not a good leader. I think he is a very competitive person and holds everyone, himself included, to very high standards. He has, on many occasions included himself when saying "we" need to play better. I think he is very critical of players who make mistakes and it can sometimes look as if he is blaming others when in fact he may be right. "I called an out and you ran an in. You should know better" Depending on how he communicates this it may look as if he is dressing the player down but in the heat of the game it may be difficult to come up with a more tactful way of saying things. Some people are just better at that than others. I can certainly see how those critical of Rodgers in the leadership category can get that opinion but I think a lot of it simply stems from frustration at the lost opportunities and doesn't necessarily lend itself to any specific character flaws.

In an olive branch offering I'd say judging from your first post here you will be an asset to the site. Welcome and go Packers.

Ooooo a tough customer! Alright I'm game!

1. That first point was in regards to how Greg left in which he would later on admit it was largely sour grapes on his part. Plus as I recall this was the same Jennings that signed an autograph which said Packers suck which I saw on here as well. I never mentioned anything regarding Favre but I don't ever recall him saying anything negative regarding Rodgers' effectiveness as a leader being brought into question. You're more than free to show me. Plus I never said to dismiss them did I? I just found it interesting that someone would put stock into what he said considering how he not only left, but how he backtracked after wards. Again there have been plenty other of players that left Green Bay that haven't spoken negatively regarding Rodgers and as I mentioned in my last statement if you want to criticize him that was fine, but so long as you look at the positives his former teammates have spoken about him as well, which based off the people I mentioned certainly outnumber the bad. Especially considering one is a bonafide HOF in Charles Woodson. If you want to focus on the negativity in which Rodgers has been criticized by former teammates you risk going in the Skip Bayless, Colin Cowherd territory that paints him as a bad teammate when there is evidence that points to the contrary.

2. In regards with Finley, tell me was anything I said regarding him was wrong? Again for someone who never lived up to his potential and often times was a headcase of his own, I would find it weird how he's calling someone else out. I would dare say it's hypocritical on his part. Again context. Had he gone and lived up to his potential, that certainly will give him more...credibility for lack of better words.

3. So by discounting what Driver said you're referring to what he actually said? I didn't discount anything the dude said. If you INTERPRETED as him criticizing Rodgers, that's fine. And I know for a fact that he wasn't trying to be critical on Rodgers because he flat out said he wasn't on Twitter when Packer fans inquired him about it.

4. What I find interesting is that you're saying that I'm trying to discrediting when I gave you my reasons as to why it's hard for me to take what said players in plain value. Greg was mentioned, to which I mentioned how it was from sour grapes to which he later on admitted himself. Finley was mentioned to which I said I found it hypocritical considering how much of a diva he could be, let alone the fact that he never played to his full potential and would often drop passes. Also if these players had gone on to have better careers outside of Green Bay that would be one thing, but to highly critical of someone who you had arguably your best years with is mind boggling.

5. And in regards to those who were critical of Aaron I never said they were wrong did I? You assumed I did. I even said in my original post it was fine if you wanted to take what they said into consideration, (I may have not worded it exactly like that but it's there) but so long as you do it with EVERYONE including the former teammates that had nothing but positive things to say regarding Rodgers. That way you have proper CONTEXT, and based off what was said regarding him, the good certainly outweighs any critical remarks regarding him. It's just that guys like Colin and Bayless like to manipulate and highlight on that in order to fit their narrative.

6. Dude just because you don't agree with what I said, doesn't mean your on my bad side. I welcome debates, and if there is something you bring up which I hadn't thought to consider, I'll be the first one to admit and understand where you are coming from dude. We're all Packer fans here. We bleed Green and Gold. So just because we may not necessarily see eye to eye doesn't mean I don't respect your opinion because I do. You have your concerns regarding Arodg and that's fine. I do understand that in some eyes people can see it as him being a blame deflector. We are all modeled a different way. All I can do is offer how I see things. It'll be up to you if you agree or disagree.

I accept your olive branch but rest assured. You didn't anger nor offend me. I hope I didn't with you with my thoughts. I enjoy having debates.

 

[Mondio]

Ha, I thought it said, “I enjoy having diabetes”. Why I read that, I have no idea, but now I can’t read it as anything else.

 

[Jerellh528]

So this solidifies what I mentioned in another thread, and sort of piggybacked on a point that @PackerfaninCarolina made. I want this offense to go more up tempo early and often. 11 personnel with Adams, MVS, St. Brown, Graham, Jones. With Cobb banged up and Allison out for the season essentially, it's time to speed it up and make this offense more dynamic. MVS and St. Brown might be young and there might be a learning curve, but I say lets sink or swim.

The unit I'm alluding to has the potential to be insanely dynamic and explosive.

Yeah I agree the offense has much more potential to be dynamic and explosive with the young guys in for Cobb and Geronimo.

The only reason I can think of why they don’t do a lot of high tempo, no huddle stuff is maybe they don’t have a solid grasp of the offense and what Aaron likes to do in those situations as much, or maybe they do and the coaching staff is just being cautious.

Still, it’s mid season and I would love to see some high tempo stuff, so I definitely agree. Get the offense cooking.

 

[Poppa San]

...

YOU

...

& YOU
Take it to another thread and stop cluttering up the game thread. I believe I speak for about 82% of the board when I say they'd actually prefer it to be PM's. I will say this but once.

 

[Mondio]

Yeah I agree the offense has much more potential to be dynamic and explosive with the young guys in for Cobb and Geronimo.

The only reason I can think of why they don’t do a lot of high tempo, no huddle stuff is maybe they don’t have a solid grasp of the offense and what Aaron likes to do in those situations as much, or maybe they do and the coaching staff is just being cautious.

Still, it’s mid season and I would love to see some high tempo stuff, so I definitely agree. Get the offense cooking.

up tempo and fast is awesome. you need a couple things for that to work and the Packers are lacking, or have been lacking that. #1 a healthy QB that can practice with his receivers. That just started happening 2 games ago? and was still limited for some of that time. You also need experience on the field at the play making positions. Outside of Adams, by the time Rodgers was able to practice, there really wasn't anyone else with experience with him able to run it. Graham is still learning and limited with a knee injury in this offense. MVS, EQ, Moore? Allison has been hurt and Cobb is too. He was out for over a month and now Allison is done.

I expect they'll do more as the young guys are all getting more time. They have to start being in the right place at the right time consistently, but with Rodgers being able to actually practice with them, and them actually getting snaps on the field consistently, it should get better. But up to this point, hurry up was going to be limited, I don't think it was going to work too well.

 

[Do7]

YOU
& YOU
Take it to another thread and stop cluttering up the game thread. I believe I speak for about 82% of the board when I say they'd actually prefer it to be PM's. I will say this but once.

I was only responding to something that was ON this thread originally. Nevertheless I apologize if I caused any inconvenience to you.


On the subject to the game this Sunday, I don't suspect our boys having TOO much trouble and this is a game that the doctor ordered. I believe last time these two met was Adams breakout game where Rodgers threw to him after the fake spike.

 

[Jim Lite]

At this point I wish the Packers wouldn't have given Rodgers the team check book,
and used that $$$$ to sign quality players.
Sooner or later we have to look for another qb, and I wonder if the packers jump to quickly.

He does make at least $30,000 per snap--that is if he stays healthy. More if he doesn't.

Can't blame him for looking out for #1.

 

[LambeauLombardi]

Run the damn ball today and make things somewhat easier on your QB. If you aren't going to attempt to run then there were a lot of options available via trade.

 

[PackerfaninCarolina]

Run the damn ball today and make things somewhat easier on your QB. If you aren't going to attempt to run then there were a lot of options available via trade.

Wtf? That doesn't even make any sense.

 

[Dblbogey]

The way I see it theres two possibilities. They might win or they might lose. Depends on which team shows up if they will win or not.

They could tie.

 

[Dblbogey]

You call yourself a fan? Also, I'd love to hear how Aaron Rodgers is a "prima donna".

He thinks Favre is still quarterback.

 

[Dblbogey]

Oh please, Arod is such a prima donna. Its probably the only reason why I see Brady as a better QB than Rodgers is, keeping in mind that a QB also should keep the offense motivated and focussed. Aaron often deflects blame of a broken play on his receivers, whereas occasionally he deserves (some of) it himself. He never seems critical of his own play, whereas when you see Brady being mad you clearly see he his also frustrated with himself. I don't think I can even recall Brees being upset with any of his offensive teammates, always trying to keep spirits up. Sometimes I feel like Aaron has been listening so much to Stephen A. Smith about what a god he is, he actually started to believe it..

Blah, blah, blah.
There, my post now makes as much sense as yours.

 

[Dblbogey]

Completely agree! I rewatched the entire 2011 divisional playoff game (aka the greatest game ever played by a QB) and the difference is so apparent. This dude would step into throws and throw frozen ropes on a line with such confidence and perfect mechanics. Just absolute lasers. And the confidence? Unmatched. Borderline cocky. I see a completely different guy now. He's apathetic, timid, flinging balls sidearm off his back foot. Never stepping into throws to rear back and fire. It seems like he's simply coasting off talent now. Where is the fire???

I agree he hasn't played to his usual standards, not even close, but to say he's apathetic, or just coasting is pretty silly.

 

[Jerellh528]

That’s exactly why I never wanted Tramon Williams returning punts.

 

[Lawdog]

Not even through the first half and we have a fumble on a punt and a penalty on a kickoff return.

 

[PackerfaninCarolina]

To me, you just don't pull a hot RB like that. That's as bad as pulling Steasbourg after 3 innings when he has 9 Ks. I really hate ******* MM but that is an example of why fans here are fuming at him.

Sorry but I'm in huge disagreement with pulling Jones out for that last series. It's not a matter of the RB's name. If it had been Williams ripping off those big runs I'd have wanted him to stay in. But ... No, you just don't sub out the guy who's doing damage to the opposing defense.

 

[GBowner]

To me, you just don't pull a hot RB like that. That's as bad as pulling Steasbourg after 3 innings when he has 9 Ks. I really hate ******* MM but that is an example of why fans here are fuming at him.

Sorry but I'm in huge disagreement with pulling Jones out for that last series. It's not a matter of the RB's name. If it had been Williams ripping off those big runs I'd have wanted him to stay in. But ... No, you just don't sub out the guy who's doing damage to the opposing defense.

I completely agree. That's been a big part of my disappointment in MM. We get on a roll and the next series the hot hand is on the bench. And what's with the call to go for it on 4th on our side of midfield? It's almost like MM is trying to get fired.

 

[PackerfaninCarolina]

I completely agree. That's been a big part of my disappointment in MM. We get on a roll and the next series the hot hand is on the bench. And what's with the call to go for it on 4th on our side of midfield? It's almost like MM is trying to get fired.

I didn't like that Rodgers held that ball there, but it was ridiculous to use Graham as a blocker instead of a quick pass option on that one.

But that whole series in general we were slow walking the ball. It's part of why I been jumping on the offense for not speeding up the damn tempo. If MM is fired, I want the next HC or OC to go pushing the offense to hurry to the LOS and snap it almost as soon as the blockers get set. Push the tempo faster.