The Jordan Love Thread

[Schultz]

You are absolutely correct. My guess is they did not know that either one of those things would happen. Look I hated the pick. Still do. I just refuse to use hindsight as my reason why.

 

[OldSchool101]

Aside of free agency (with the Packers not having a lot of money to spend in the 2020 offseason) a first round pick is the most precious capital to improve a team. It doesn't make a lot of sense to spend it on a player who will most likely never have an impact for all of his rookie deal while pissing off your franchise quarterback in the process.

See this is where we are on separate ends of the spectrum.

I don’t claim to know what the situation is there at GM in 2020 like you do. Really think Brian was just trying to **** off Aaron Rodgers?
I think that’s a very accusatory attitude.

Here’s a guy in Brian Gutenkunst who I feel like anyone who knows anything in the league highly respects him as a GM. But @captainWIMM thinks he operates on malice just because he didn’t get what he wanted personally. Brian took a stab at QB, big whoop Dee doo doo.

I’m not going to take a GM and repeatedly condemn him to Sheol because I think I didn’t like 1 draft selection, like you do regularly.
Even if he struck out with #10??
I still wouldn’t do that. I look at a persons full body of work rather than nitpick to try to find 1 selection they missed on and pretend like I could’ve done a better job over the last 5 seasons. He’s a GM and human!

Even if Love gets cut tomorrow? Brian Gutenkunst gets a B+/A- rating
If Love works out he gets a solid A to A+ rating as a GM. Gluten had perfected trades that garnered us an extra Day 1 selection at minimal cost and you just bust his chops for this lone selection? Brian got us that much in an early career trade back. As far as I’m concerned that was a bonus pick.

How would you rate Brian Gluten letter grade? Overall

 

[tynimiller]

Bottomline many felt Aaron was beginning a regression....a prospect the scouts and Gute liked fell beyond where they thought he should.....

That intersection happened and they grabbed him.

It is just one of those where timing was one thing and reality played out another (Rodgers has resurged big time).

 

[OldSchool101]

Bottomline many felt Aaron was beginning a regression....a prospect the scouts and Gute liked fell beyond where they thought he should.....

That intersection happened and they grabbed him.

It is just one of those where timing was one thing and reality played out another (Rodgers has resurged big time).

I’m curious how would you guys rate Brian Gluten letter grade? Overall

 

[tynimiller]

I’m curious how would you guys rate Brian Gluten letter grade? Overall

Drafting wise? Personnel/Team building wise? Overall?

 

[OldSchool101]

Drafting wise? Personnel/Team building wise? Overall?

Overall. In a C+ Scale being league average

 

[longtimefan]

Drafting wise? Personnel/Team building wise? Overall?

Talking about Gute..
Pretty quietly, the Eagles shopped Reagor for months,”: Rapoport said Wednesday on NFL Total Access. “At one point, I thought they were going to end up dealing him to the Packers around the time of the draft.”

You must be logged in to see this image or video!

Ian Rapoport
@RapSheet
·
Follow
From @NFLTotalAccess: The #Eagles worked for months to trade WR Jalen Reagor, including talks with the #Packers during the draft, before sending him to the #Vikings. Meanwhile, Alex Leatherwood was claimed by the #Bears, Sony Michel lands with the #Chargers.

 

[OldSchool101]

Talking about Gute..
Pretty quietly, the Eagles shopped Reagor for months,”: Rapoport said Wednesday on NFL Total Access. “At one point, I thought they were going to end up dealing him to the Packers around the time of the draft.”

You must be logged in to see this image or video!

Ian Rapoport
@RapSheet
·
Follow
From @NFLTotalAccess: The #Eagles worked for months to trade WR Jalen Reagor, including talks with the #Packers during the draft, before sending him to the #Vikings. Meanwhile, Alex Leatherwood was claimed by the #Bears, Sony Michel lands with the #Chargers.

I think GB has got their feelers out there at WR/TE. They Could make a move as the season progresses also, in event of injury/illness type situation.

 

[Sunshinepacker]

I’m curious how would you guys rate Brian Gluten letter grade? Overall

B-

Been very good in the first few rounds, less than magnificent in later rounds...excluding the Love pick I'd give him an 'A' but choosing Love over players who would have helped the Packers win another Super Bowl (I'm convinced that with either Pittman or Higgins the Packers win the Super Bowl last year) costs him a grade-and-a-half; btw, this assuming that Love becomes a top-10 QB, if that doesn't happen then the grade plummets to a 'C-'.

 

[tynimiller]

Sorry overall if you have Gute that low I think you’re expectations are for Jesus Christ himself to be GM.

Outside the Love slip up (clearly Rodgers didn’t continue regressing and making this pick not needed)….the man has hit on all big FA signings (Preston, Z, Turner, Amos, Campbell) and continued to flip depth spots finding us Rasul.

He managed to keep Rodgers in town even though they both seem to have known Adams was on way out and pulled serious draft equity for Adams.

Draft wise in just his few drafts I’d argue he pulled the best CB, one of the best OL guys in that stretch, appears to have grabbed one of the best centers, an Edge rusher that already is a BEAST and making noise for challenging being in tier one of them…

Solid starters in Runyan jr, Stokes, and seemingly Tom now to replace another starter out the gate in Newman.

The Yosh project ended with a starting capable tackle.

Just too many things to think he flirts with anything lower than a B or B+ even from a hater

 

[PikeBadger]

I still think that drafting Love was a very solid pick. My biggest complaint about any of Gutekunst's draft picks is Savage. I'll respectfully give Savage this season to prove me wrong but he looks like a 3rd round calibre pick to me at best. I think that the 20th pick in the 2019 draft should have netted us a better player than Savage. I think the scouts missed on him. Too many flaws.

 

[OldSchool101]

this assuming that Love becomes a top-10 QB, if that doesn't happen then the grade plummets to a 'C-'.

So you dinged him from an A all the way to a B- because he drafted Love with a Late Day 1 selection, but then if Love isn't a near-elite QB you ding him again to a C- overall? Remind me not to take any of your classes if you are a Professor!

My biggest complaint about any of Gutekunst's draft picks is Savage.

I actually agree here.
Although I have a strange way of looking at that. Gute had actually gritted his teeth in a trade back the season before from #14 to #27 overall and then traded his #76 and 6th rounder to move up to #17 overall (perfected the Jaire Alexander deal)
In that craft move? he garnered an EXTRA Day 1 selection in 2019 that was used on Darnell, so in actuality?? He pretty much traded a #76 (missed on Mason Rudolph) and a 6th rounder to get Savage.
So with that in mind, what draft grade would you put on that Darnell selection using a #76 and a later 6th rounder?
Also what grade would we put on Jaire Alexander at #14 (missed on Derwin James) overall? (to be fair, our original selection)

 

[Mondio]

I think Savage has shown on more than one occasion why he was drafted where he was, but has a problem with consistency. I still have high aspirations for him. If he "gets it" he has all the tools to be the best safety we've had since Nick Collins.
ETA: Gute is much better than a C. Just this offseason, I thought our run was over. Guys were going to be leaving, contracts needing to be worked, no money available etc. and here we are. Crafty drafting, really good use of re-writing contracts etc and here we are talking about super bowl aspirations again. Average GM's don't lead that. They bumble and find themselves unemployed soon after. He's shown this a few times now.
ETA: I'm really tired of this backspace glitch that gets rid of all my spaces WTFlip is going on?

 

[Sunshinepacker]

So you dinged him from an A all the way to a B- because he drafted Love with a Late Day 1 selection, but then if Love isn't a near-elite QB you ding him again to a C- overall? Remind me not to take any of your classes if you are a Professor!

He gets paid millions of dollars to not screw up one of the most important tasks of his job, the draft, especially Day one. So, yeah, you screw those up and cost The team a Super Bowl, it’s generally considered a bad thing.

 

[OldSchool101]

He gets paid millions of dollars to not screw up one of the most important tasks of his job, the draft, especially Day one. So, yeah, you screw those up and cost The team a Super Bowl, it’s generally considered a bad thing.

You don't know that. You are just upset at the outcome of season.

 

[Schultz]

He gets paid millions of dollars to not screw up one of the most important tasks of his job, the draft, especially Day one. So, yeah, you screw those up and cost The team a Super Bowl, it’s generally considered a bad thing.

The way I look at it is if one Day1 mistake in the draft cost a team a SB then everything else that GM did had to have been A+ work.

 

[Sunshinepacker]

You don't know that. You are just upset at the outcome of season.

Yeah, i do. Having a very good #2 receiver on a team that features only two players with more than 2 targets (and one of them was a rb) would have opened up the offense quite a bit. Considering how close the game was with the terrible group of receivers, outside of Adams, i’m very confident in believing they beat the Rams and the Bengals on their way to the title.

 

[Sunshinepacker]

The way I look at it is if one Day1 mistake in the draft cost a team a SB then everything else that GM did had to have been A+ work.

Much of it is, Rodgers isn’t but the rest pretty much is. Excluding the Love selection and what it’s cost the team, I’d give him an ‘A’.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

See this is where we are on separate ends of the spectrum.

I don’t claim to know what the situation is there at GM in 2020 like you do. Really think Brian was just trying to **** off Aaron Rodgers?
I think that’s a very accusatory attitude.

Everybody knows what the situation was entering the 2020 draft. The Packers were coming off making it to the NFCCG, having had limited cap space to make moves in free agency. There was absolutely no reason to spend the team's most precious asset on a backup most likely not playing any significant snaps for all of his rookie deal.

I don't think for a second Gutekunst drafted Love to **** off Rodgers but in my opinion he tried to force the issue of finding another elite quarterback like Wolf and Thompson did instead of waiting for the perfect opportunity to arise.

Brian took a stab at QB, big whoop Dee doo doo.

Yes, it's a big thing trading up in the first round to select a backup instead of using it on a player capable of making an immediate impact for a team coming off making it to the NFCCG. We're not talking about a day three selection here.

I’m not going to take a GM and repeatedly condemn him to Sheol because I think I didn’t like 1 draft selection, like you do regularly.
Even if he struck out with #10??
I still wouldn’t do that. I look at a persons full body of work rather than nitpick to try to find 1 selection they missed on and pretend like I could’ve done a better job over the last 5 seasons. He’s a GM and human!

Even if Love gets cut tomorrow? Brian Gutenkunst gets a B+/A- rating
If Love works out he gets a solid A to A+ rating as a GM. Gluten had perfected trades that garnered us an extra Day 1 selection at minimal cost and you just bust his chops for this lone selection? Brian got us that much in an early career trade back. As far as I’m concerned that was a bonus pick.

How would you rate Brian Gluten letter grade? Overall

I would rate Gutekunst's tenure as a B at this point with the Love selection being the only reason he doesn't deserve an A.

But don't fool yourself, if the Packers don't end up winning another Super Bowl as long as Rodgers is around and Love doesn't live up to his draft position that move will be the one Gutekunst will be remembered for.

As a side note, for the most part I agree a general manager shouldn't be mainly evaluated for a single move. But that was just such a stupid one it's tough to ignore it.

It is just one of those where timing was one thing and reality played out another (Rodgers has resurged big time).

The Packers front office gets paid millions of bucks to evaluate players. They should have known Rodgers was still capable of performing at an elite level. Period.

Gute had actually gritted his teeth in a trade back the season before from #14 to #27 overall and then traded his #76 and 6th rounder to move up to #17 overall (perfected the Jaire Alexander deal)
In that craft move? he garnered an EXTRA Day 1 selection in 2019 that was used on Darnell, so in actuality?? He pretty much traded a #76 (missed on Mason Rudolph) and a 6th rounder to get Savage.
So with that in mind, what draft grade would you put on that Darnell selection using a #76 and a later 6th rounder?

While you're right that Gutekunst traded away a third and sixth rounder (as well as some positions in the first round) to receive an additional first rounder you still need to evaluate the player selected with that pick as a first rounder. The Packers would have been much better off selecting Deebo Samuel with it for example.

 

[tynimiller]

The Packers front office gets paid millions of bucks to evaluate players. They should have known Rodgers was still capable of performing at an elite level. Period.

You expect perfection, got it. That’s an impossible thing to achieve, of course you still pursue it but seriously I think done amazingly well usually knowing when a player is entering their twilight time period -

As much as I hated it they got it right on Nelson, Jennings, Jones and even Cobb to a lessor degree.

Morgan Burnett also comes to mind. I feel like they’ve done quite well evaluating how good the older guys on the roster seem to be projecting.

 

[OldSchool101]

I would rate Gutekunst's tenure as a B at this point with the Love selection being the only reason he doesn't deserve an A.

Thats not too far off what I've seen. I think he could have handled Rodgers better, but he's a relatively young GM and Rodgers is a relatively tough one to handle.
I'm not sure if you know, but I had us taking a WR. However, looking back at Brians moves? He doesn't strike me as a GM who misses the dart board on players too often. He had a reason he drafted Love and if he didn't stick to his guns (against fan mutiny) I would not respect him or his leadership.

As far as the expenditure of a #26 selection?? This is my balance sheet on that:

Darnell Savage (bonus) + Jordan Love + Kendall Donnerson cost us a #26 overall + #76 overall + 6th rounder (given up to get back to #18 overall) We have to give Brian credit for garnering us (Savage and Donnerson t be fair) for a #76 + 6th rounder in expense

As far as #18 vs #14 overall and the J'aire selection?? That was still an A/A+ selection either way so arguing that point is trivial at best

We never lost a Day 1 pick because we got a bonus in similar draft packaging and used it on Savage and Donnerson. Each move feeds off the next years moves and anyone that doesnt think GM's look past the current season is kidding themselves. Had Brian not moved to achieve that bonus Savage pick in 2019???? We would have NOT drafted a Day 1WR either way! Id argue we would more likely get a Safety instead of Jordan Love. We rarely choose WR when we have desperate need at Defense

The full body of work is what we should judge a GM by, not 1 or 2 singular moves to fit our narratives. B+/A- if Love fails. A+ if he succeeds

 

[longtimefan]

You must be logged in to see this image or video!

 

[longtimefan]

Gute just was trying to push out aaron

Or they saw him declining in his ability and had a great idea he was looking to get out unless things changed.

Whats more believable

 

[gopkrs]

I turned on NFL Network and the preseason KC game was on. It was late 1st half and I made it a point to watch Love closely through the end of the 3rd quarter. I think his footwork looked good. He did seem to throw off one foot when he was running forward to escape pressure and then stop to throw, but backing up looked very smooth. I guess he could put more of his whole body into it when he throws. I bring that up because someone talked about his footwork being bad. I disagree.

 

[Jayzee1981]

Is this our Fantasy draft thread or the “I don’t care if Jordan Love is in the HOF” he still sucks thread. I’m old and senile and forgot