Free Agency: Packers Should Green Bay Pursue?

[Dantés]

Oh I'll get you going.

It's not about distance from the ball, it's about role.

An inside backers primary role is a couple things. Unless they are blitzing, they are not rushing the ball. They are reacting to their keys. Step forward, read, react. Hit the gap if it's a run play, drop into coverage if it's a pass (zone), find man and cover him if it's a pass (man). Your iDL, and edge rushers, they are attacking on the ball.

Now some people say the OBLB is more of a coverage backer, some use it to refer to Sam, Mike, and Will as a group. I fall into the latter, but in general, it's a pretty synonymous group meaning LB's who aren't pass rushers.

You're making this whole thing more complicated than what it actually is. Terminology, positions, they change. You don't see tailbacks, or wingbacks, or flankers out there anymore. Heck, even wide receivers aren't all out wide anymore. You probably hate that there are slots, or even X WR's, Z WR's, etc, etc. Perhaps we should just call them ball catchers who sometimes block. Wait.. is that a TE too? FB's block and catch too. Hmmm...

Distinctions between positions are important. They're also relatively simple. Stop trying to make it more confusing than what it is.

Can't call them fullbacks. Fullbacks only line up halfway back. Doesn't make any sense!

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

Not that the Packers were going to pursue him (again), but interesting to note that former Badger and Packer LB Vince Biegel just got an Original Round restricted tender.

Tom Pelissero
@TomPelissero
·
20s

The #Dolphins gave LB Vince Biegel the original-round restricted tender, source said. It’s worth $2.132 million. Biegel started 10 games

 

[GleefulGary]

Not that the Packers were going to pursue him (again), but interesting to note that former Badger and Packer LB Vince Biegel just got an Original Round restricted tender.

Tom Pelissero
@TomPelissero
·
20s

The #Dolphins gave LB Vince Biegel the original-round restricted tender, source said. It’s worth $2.132 million. Biegel started 10 games

Ya know, for that much, I'd sign him to replace the Sackrell. Biegel didn't do too bad in Miami.

 

[GleefulGary]

Not that the Packers were going to pursue him (again), but interesting to note that former Badger and Packer LB Vince Biegel just got an Original Round restricted tender.

Tom Pelissero
@TomPelissero
·
20s

The #Dolphins gave LB Vince Biegel the original-round restricted tender, source said. It’s worth $2.132 million. Biegel started 10 games

Would somebody tell this guy to take me off ignore so I quit talking to myself. I need some form of sanity for the next few weeks.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

Interesting read about last years Free Agent Frenzy for the Packers.

https://www.espn.com/blog/green-bay...how-the-packers-most-expensive-march-unfolded

 

[Favre>Rodgers259]

Chris Harris Jr saying it doesn't seem like Broncos want him back. He's not elite anymore but more than serviceable. I was looking at Xavier Rhodes for the long term but Harris Jr could probably play in the league for another 3-4 years as a Nickel.

 

[AmishMafia]

Can't call them fullbacks. Fullbacks only line up halfway back. Doesn't make any sense!

We dont have fullbacks, we have out-ball-block-backs. Our FBs go out for passes. To encompass other duties, they are called OBBBs.

 

[Dantés]

With free agency (possibly) just around the corner, these are the guys that I've landed on as preferred Packers targets:

Wide Receiver: I am not stoked on this WR class as a whole, however there are a handful of guys who would be fine as depth at the right price.

• T. Sharpe, TEN: Possession receiver who moves the chains; experience with Petals; does not play ST.
• R. Higgins, CLE: Possession receiver who moves the chains; 2019 season derailed with injury; does not play ST.
• T. Gabriel, CHI: Speedster with some vertical and YAC skills; broke out in ATL with Petals; fairly productive in 2018 before CHI offense cratered last year.
• Beware: D. Robinson, KC

Tight End: I think they should get in on the Hooper market, but if it gets out of control, Lewis and a draft pick will need to suffice.

• A. Hooper, ATL: Above average as both receiver and blocker-- important dual threat player for the offense; pursuit should have a ceiling in terms of price.
• M. Lewis, GB: Good in his role as a blocker and should be the fall back if Hooper doesn't materialize.

Tackle: I have been in favor of keeping Bulaga, but it seems the team disagrees. With that in mind, they need to target reliable depth and then draft a starter.

• J. Veldheer, GB: As it seems fairly certain that Bulaga is a goner, Veldheer would be a good keep as veteran depth.

Cornerback: With the CB3 playing 70+% snaps in today's NFL, the Packers essentially need to find a starter. I think Tramon should exclusively be a fallback option if the younger targets don't pan out.

• C. Harris, DEN: He will probably price himself out; could still be elite slot corner.
• M. Alexander, MIN: History with new DB coach; inside/outside versatility.
• B. Poole, NYJ: Slot corner who had his best season in 2019 with Gregg Williams, who is philosophically similar to Mike Pettine.

Linebacker: A true cover LB would allow the Packers to use a lot more nickel, and less dime, which would in turn aid the run defense.

• C. Littleton, LAR: Only true cover LB on the market; could fundamentally change the defense's capability; could get priced out.
• N. Kwiatkoski, CHI: Risk in that he has less snaps than Martinez or Schobert; reward in that he's shown to make more impact plays in limited sample.
• D. Campbell, ATL: Recent struggles possibly explained by playing out of position (D. Jones oft injured); outside shot at fitting in a cover LB role.

Interior Defensive Line: With a glut of good options, the Packers should be able to bolster the run defense with a solid veteran addition at a good price. There are several good options that I'm not even listing.

• S. Harris, DEN: 3T disruptive player.
• G. McCoy, CAR: 3T disruptive player.
• M. Collins, DAL: 3T disruptive player.
• M. Brockers, LAR: 1T in sub and potential 5T in 3-4; coming off a down year, but has been great run defender in the past.
• A. Robinson, DET: 1T in sub and potential 5T in 3-4; coming off a down year, but has been great run defender in the past.

 

[swhitset]

I think if we were seeing WR's leaving Green Bay and playing well elsewhere, you would have a stronger argument that Rodgers is mostly to blame. However, that isn't the case. I asked this before and nobody answered, what WR's haven't played up to their potential in Green Bay and then go elsewhere and thrive?

zero.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

ok, so whether it's number 1 or number 2 highest paid is not really the point. The point lets not be the team dumb enough to pay an average player as if he's the best...again.

Hooper isn't elite but one of the best receiving tight ends in the league and at 25 years old still an ascending player.

He had a couple nagging injuries, which may have caused his lapse in play but he was a solid guy for multiple years before that. A new environment could do wonders for him. The only other competition he has is Ronald Darby who is coming off a torn ACL from this season and Darqueeze Denard.

Just like Kirksey this COULD be where the injury history drives the price down, but pays off dividends. A 2 year contract wouldn't be a bad roll of the dice. Tramon isn't getting any younger and Josh Jackson is in bust territory.

There are several other free agent cornerbacks the Packers should be interested in before thinking about talking to Rhodes.

Would fix a lot of problems. Plus him wrecking his former team would be fun. Him and Clark together, whooooo. Wouldn't have to blitz much.

Joseph is still a good player but with him turning 32 years old during next season Gutekunst should be hesitant to offer him decent money.

Personally, I rank TE as a lesser need than most packer fans. I am not sold on Hooper at $12-14 million/yr over four years, and think Sternberger, Lewis, Tonyan, and a draft pick will serve the packer well for the cost.

While the Packers would save a lot of cap space by entering next season with Tonyan, Sternberger, Lewis and a rookie at tight end that group doesn't inspire any confidence to be improved over last season.

Chris Harris Jr saying it doesn't seem like Broncos want him back. He's not elite anymore but more than serviceable. I was looking at Xavier Rhodes for the long term but Harris Jr could probably play in the league for another 3-4 years as a Nickel.

Harris would be a significantly better signing than Rhodes at this point.

 

[HardRightEdge]

J. Veldheer, GB: As it seems fairly certain that Bulaga is a goner, Veldheer would be a good keep as veteran depth.

Or maybe the starter, but depth might be more appropriate role given his history. You have to wonder if after getting any revitalized love of the game beaten out of him after a few Sundays and rough Monday mornings he starts thinking retirement wasn't a bad idea in the first place.

I'm struggling to think of a player who retired and then came back to play at his previous performance level for any extended period of time.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

I'm struggling to think of a player who retired and then came back to play at his previous performance level for any extended period of time.

Brett Favre...oh wait, did he really retire before being shipped out to the Jets?

 

[HardRightEdge]

Brett Favre...oh wait, did he really retire before being shipped out to the Jets?

Well, he did play 16 games in 2007 and then again in 2008, so I think the answer is "no". I can't recall if he showed up to OTAs or training camp on time with the Jets if not doing so counts as "momentarily retired".

It might have turned out quite differently if the Jets had not given him a private locker room. Or would we call that an office? Man cave?

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

The News for the Vikings gets even "Better". Cousins is refusing to take a team friendly extension of his contract, one that would give the Vikings more cap space this year.

https://vikingsterritory.com/2020/g...e-team-friendly-extension-offers-from-vikings

 

[Dantés]

Or maybe the starter, but depth might be more appropriate role given his history. You have to wonder if after getting any revitalized love of the game beaten out of him after a few Sundays and rough Monday mornings he starts thinking retirement wasn't a bad idea in the first place.

I'm struggling to think of a player who retired and then came back to play at his previous performance level for any extended period of time.

He really hasn't been a starter at a high level since 2016. I think it would be totally foolish to enter the season with him as Plan A.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

I'm surprised that we haven't heard any news on Lane Taylor. With the savings of cutting him, a backup, pretty sizable ($4.6M), he seems like a no brainer to cut. However, they may just hang on to him as insurance, until after Free agency and the draft to see where they are at with the OL needs. It appears they will only owe him an additional $62.5K if he is on the roster longer than than another week, so might be cheap insurance until they find out if they have enough starters and depth worked out.

 

[HardRightEdge]

He really hasn't been a starter at a high level since 2016. I think it would be totally foolish to enter the season with him as Plan A.

Veldheer could be plan A- or B+ in competition with a Day 1 or 2 pick. Is it necessary to have a RT play at a "high level" if the team is improved in other areas? Even a #30 rookie pick is likely to take quite a few lumps, or worse as that last #48 pick evidenced.

Adequate may be enough. As stated before, I'm more concerned about Veldheer's state of mind through the next 16+ games than what he did in 2017 or 2018. The Packers will have a some kind of handle on that.

We can't keep pinballing from one free agent name and position to another, talking about all the possibiities as though they all can be filled with "high level" players in free agency and the uncertainty of rookies. "Adequate veteran" will have to serve in some cases. I see no reason to not have Veldheer on this long pick list.

Mercifully, we'll have greater clarity next week.

 

[Dantés]

Here's another candidate that is really interesting to me:

Dennis Kelly, OT, Tennessee

Kelly is a 30 year old, 6'8" 320 lb swing tackle.

He played 376 snaps at right tackle for LaFleur in 2018 and did well.

He played 352 snaps at left tackle for the Titans this past season and reported played well again.

So he has versatility and familiarity with the offense.

 

[Dantés]

Veldheer could be plan A- or B+ in competition with a Day 1 or 2 pick. Is it necessary to have a RT play at a "high level" if the team is improved in other areas? Even a #30 rookie pick is likely to take quite a few lumps, or worse as that last #48 pick evidenced.

Adequate may be enough. As stated before, I'm more concerned about Veldheer's state of mind through the next 16+ games than what he did in 2017 or 2018. The Packers will have a some kind of handle on that.

We can't keep pinballing from one free agent name and position to another, talking about all the possibiities as though they all can be filled with "high level" players in free agency and the uncertainty of rookies. "Adequate veteran" will have to serve in some cases. I see no reason to not have Veldheer on this long pick list.

Mercifully, we'll have greater clarity next week.

I would say it's necessary for RT not to be a total unmitigated disaster, and going with Veldheer as the primary starter could end up being one in my opinion. He's injury prone, and older players struggle to maintain when asked to take on a heavier work load.

 

[HardRightEdge]

I would say it's necessary for RT not to be a total unmitigated disaster...

I'd agree with that. It's hard to think of a position on the field where that's not the case. The most acute weakness is the one that tends to be exploited. Veldeer managed 12 starts in 2016, 13 in 2017, and what amounts to a year of mostly R&R except for 35 snaps and a padded practice here or there.

If signed, maybe that Day 1 or Day 2 rooke beats him out. All the better. It could turn out to be Turner, you know, and we'd rather not see that.

 

[HardRightEdge]

Here's another candidate that is really interesting to me:

Dennis Kelly, OT, Tennessee

Kelly is a 30 year old, 6'8" 320 lb swing tackle.

He played 376 snaps at right tackle for LaFleur in 2018 and did well.

He played 352 snaps at left tackle for the Titans this past season and reported played well again.

So he has versatility and familiarity with the offense.

Maybe. Or they let Conklin walk and keep Kelly to start at RT.

 

[HardRightEdge]

I'm surprised that we haven't heard any news on Lane Taylor. With the savings of cutting him, a backup, pretty sizable ($4.6M), he seems like a no brainer to cut. However, they may just hang on to him as insurance, until after Free agency and the draft to see where they are at with the OL needs. It appears they will only owe him an additional $62.5K if he is on the roster longer than than another week, so might be cheap insurance until they find out if they have enough starters and depth worked out.

That last sentence. The situation is fluid. They might hold onto him all the way through the draft. Maybe beyond. He could have trade value, even if only for a 2021 Day 3 pick, if somebody finds themselves in need of a LG who can play LT in a pinch once the draft is said and done. $4.5 mil cost to for one year with no overhang might look attractive to somebody on a budget needing a stop gap solution.

People forget how surprised his own teammates were in how well he performed at LT filling in for Bakhtiari for a couple of games a couple years back. Not somebody you'd want to throw out there for 16 games but a guy you can expect to not kill you (or your QB) in a pinch.

Young, versatile, adequate. How's that biceps injury shaping up? I couldn't say.

 

[Dantés]

I'd agree with that. It's hard to think of a position on the field where that's not the case. The most acute weakness is the one that tends to be exploited. Veldeer managed 12 starts in 2016, 13 in 2017, and what amounts to a year of mostly R&R except for 35 snaps and a padded practice here or there.

If signed, maybe that Day 1 or Day 2 rooke beats him out. All the better. It could out to be Turner, you know, and we'd rather not see that.

I think it's easier to win a game with a terrible running back or wide receiver than tackle.

Veldheer has been an increasingly injury prone and declining player for some time now. At 33, I think it would be a mistake to think that his 98 snaps late last year is what he would be for a full season.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

I prefer Taylor's type of contract over the ones where the big roster bonus kicks in a few days after the new league year starts. I realize players love the big roster bonus's to occur soon after the new league year starts, but I really wish that there could be a compromise to this and they don't kick in until say June 1. This gives a team more time during Free Agency and the draft to evaluate their needs. It would kind of create a Second Free Agent Time period to occur after June 1. Players would still have adequate time to find a new team before camps open up and maybe not be that high paid vet that instead gets cut on Sept. 1st, because the team already was committed to all of his bonuses well before they could accurately assess their situation back in March.

To add to that....this was just posted:

Tom Pelissero
@TomPelissero
·
46s

One impact of a possible delay to start of league year: Many players have roster bonus payments or salary vesting tied to 3rd day, 5th day, etc. So those players, in addition to pending free agents, could have to wait -- for weeks, months, perhaps indefinitely -- to get paid.

 

[AmishMafia]

Predictions for the first 24 hrs of free agency?


We sign 3 guys:

TE Austin Hooper 5yrs/$60M
ILB Nick Kwiatkoski 4yrs/$38M
DL Andrew Billings 2/$6M



Tough to guess. I thought Amos was a possible target, and ZSmith was a long shot. I didnt see the other 2 as even possible targets.