Re: TT vs MS
majikman said:
tonytokes said:
majikman said:
spardo62 said:
Most of the posts on this site lately have eventually gotten around to this topic, so I would like to post some observations for discussion. We can argue over which philosophy is correct and judge the results, however we can never compare apples to apples in judging the performance of these individuals.
MS thought he had a team capable of making one more Superbowl run, with Brett Favre playing at a high level and Aman Green in the prime of his career. Accordingly, he was attempting to add players through free agency that would help him to achieve this goal. He also identifies key components of the team that he wanted to lock up so they would remain with the team rather than exposing to free agency. He was also drafting consistently in the later part of each round due to the record of the team the previous year. Unfortunately, he had significant misses in all 3 areas and never was able to get over the hump during his time with Green Bay. During this period, the players he was building around got 4 years older and had more wear and tear on their bodies.
TT took over a team that he felt was in decline and not capable of making a SB run, although they maybe could be a playoff team. This gave him 2 choices. Completely scrap and attempt to build from the ground up or continue adding pieces to keep the team competitive for the next year or two and pay the price down the road. With the exception of keeping Brett Favre at the helm, he chose the first option. Unfortunately, I do not think he can, nor should he choose option 1 if Favre is still on the roster.
I do believe that it all comes down to #4. If TT wanted to build from scratch he should have found a way to get Brett out of town, but if he truly wanted him to come back he shouldn't have relyed on so much youth(especially in the middle of the OL).
The way it stands now, the complete rebuilding cannot take place, as we have no idea what we have at QB for the future. By the same token, he is doing a disservice to Brett Favre, who can obviously still play, but has no hope with the team around him.
Hard to believe Spardo, but I totally agree with this post. MS's problem was he didn't get a good veteran receiver in GB, and instead drafted two rookies, JWalk and Ferguson. Rookies ALWAYS take time to get up to speed!
I don't think TT should have gone into full rebuild mode with Brett Favre around. It is a disservice to him. He could have tried to compete for 2-3 more years, and who knows, this year or next the Pack could have been in the SB, if TT would have gone about it the right way.
And then, when Favre retires...REBUILD THE TEAM. Why he was in an all fired hurry to scrap and rebuild now, I'll never know. But it's not like the fans would have turned against him if he tried to win now with Favre at the helm, and then rebuild the Packers.
Well, some may have turned on him, and I think you all know who you are.
because he had no clue if favre was coming back or not. believe it or not, that has a lot to do with his ability or inability to sign free agents that want to come together with favre and potentially make a last run at it.
in fact, most people were saying that brett WASNT coming back so if im a GM im putting my eggs more in that basket than any other direction. what else should he have done? it's not like he could have sat around and waited as the other teams were making moves and then jump in late in the game to take back momentum.
it just doesnt work that way and as much as i love our boy favre, he really f'd us up in making everyone wait that long. limbo isnt conducive to action, that's for sure.
That's b.s..
You could just as easily say that TT waited around and didn't sign anyone in FA in the hope that Favre would retire, and he could go about rebuilding the team "in his image".
Why they didn't sit down and honestly talk to one another, we'll never know. But it seems like it didn't happen. To put it all on Favre is just plain wrong. Maybe TT didn't want to try to build a winner with Favre, but didn't want to come out and say it. Didn't want to show his hand.
Did you ever think about that?
No. I never thought about that.
Why?
Because TT building a winner doesn't just happen because TT wants to build a winner. Every team in the NFL wants to build a winner but not every player in the league wants to play for every team.
We were a team that went 4-12 with a Hall of Fame quarterback. If I'm a free agent with high character who thinks less about money and more about winning and I have no idea if Favre is coming back (hrm, could they be even WORSE than a 4-12 team?) then I'm not too excited about going to basically Canada to play football in a city that is under 100,000 people, freezing cold and no nightlife whatsoever.
Yeah, I think Pickett was a good signing. Woodson is washed up and was looking for a paycheck, could care less about winning and definitely knows his performance wont warrant him having to play out the rest of his contract before a cut and well, Manual is just an average starter (if that), making above average money. I believe, though, that TT put some effort into it but I don't know, not getting a ton of bites from guys who want to win.
I own a business where I do a lot of "signing" or recruiting if you will and being in a city like Atlanta, there is a lot of competition and a lot of companies promising a lot of things. Often times these companies can offer more immediate rewards as far as salary, contributions, work experience and generally a more rewarding/successful environment. Sometimes not, but it's pretty obvious how winning factors into what I do and if you up the ante and change thousands to millions, I can't imagine those factors diminishing at all.
GMs are judged by how well their team does. Period. There often isnt much time to wait around and build a team in your image as you say. I think signing Robinson, Picket, Manual and Woodson just goes to show that. Compared to most NFL teams, we had to be in the top 30% of FA activity but there isn't a lot of TT PP image people in that lineup. Just desperate attempts to show that he's trying to build a winner right now.
Now I dont think his priorities are in place as evidenced by his lack of attention to the front line but effort was put in for some changes whether you agree with the moves or not.
My whole point is really that no one wants to play for a loser. No one. Only a certain type of character will go to whoever gives them the biggest paycheck and I also think that player isn't often one who contributes most to a winning attitude on a team. Add to the mix that there was no idea that Favre was coming back and losing looked even more inevitable with winning pushed back even more years.
Would you have called TT back? Take away my Packer fandom and I can matter of factly tell you that I wouldnt.
2c.
ulls up a chair so he can sit and watch this bloodbath:
