All the draft complaining...let's look over the past 10 seasons...

[OldSchool101]

So, when the front office and coaches said they see Deguara as Kyle Juszczyk, who is a fullback, you just figured, nahhh, I like him as a TE more?

Really?
Are you so eager to get your point across that you’d split hairs on something so trivial as me calling a Josiah Deguara a TE? Looking around at some of these petty complaints I can see that these are hard times for folks.. we obviously need to reciprocate a bit so we don’t drive each other mad before they find a vaccine! , so If that irks ya enough to challenge his position designation? then I’ll tell ya what., whenever we discuss him going forward I’ll do my best to reference Josiah as a RB if that makes you more receptive.

https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/D/DeguJo00.

https://www.nfl.com/prospects/josiah-deguara/32194445-4770-3400-9fe2-

https://www.packers.com/team/players-roster/josiah-deguara/
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Josiah_Deguara


https://thedraftnetwork.com/player/josiah-deguara/C3YabgX51G

https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/players/playerpage/2181108/josiah-deguara

I think it’s relevant I included the proprietary Packer site just in case. I figured the Packers would know even if everyone else was wrong about his position designation.
From here on out he’s a RB! No exceptions and I better never see you make the slightest reference to our TE group with him.

 

[RRyder]

Deguara.

Out of curiosity, how many snaps does a player need to have to be considered a starter? This can be grouped by position instead of in general.

Speaking for myself (not counting QB or OL) I'd say 35ish% of the teams snaps

 

[GleefulGary]

Speaking for myself (not counting QB or OL) I'd say 35ish% of the teams snaps

Is that including ST's, or just offensive/defensive snaps?

I'm really curious as to what people think. Seems to me like the days of players receiving all or almost all the snaps are kind of gone. Haven't checked any data to back that up though.

 

[RRyder]

Really?
Are you so eager to get your point across that you’d split hairs on something so trivial as me calling a Josiah Deguara a TE? Looking around at some of these petty complaints I can see that these are hard times for folks.. we obviously need to reciprocate a bit so we don’t drive each other mad before they find a vaccine! , so If that irks ya enough to challenge his position designation? then I’ll tell ya what., whenever we discuss him going forward I’ll do my best to reference Josiah as a RB if that makes you more receptive.

https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/D/DeguJo00.

https://www.nfl.com/prospects/josiah-deguara/32194445-4770-3400-9fe2-

https://www.packers.com/team/players-roster/josiah-deguara/
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Josiah_Deguara


https://thedraftnetwork.com/player/josiah-deguara/C3YabgX51G

https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/players/playerpage/2181108/josiah-deguara

I think it’s relevant I included the proprietary Packer site just in case. I figured the Packers would know even if everyone else was wrong about his position designation.
From here on out he’s a RB! No exceptions and I better never see you make the slightest reference to our TE group with him.

In fairness he's an H Back which in the most laziylest definition of the position a hybrid FB/TE so you're both right

 

[RRyder]

Is that including ST's, or just offensive/defensive snaps?

I'm really curious as to what people think. Seems to me like the days of players receiving all or almost all the snaps are kind of gone. Haven't checked any data to back that up though.

Total offensive snaps they're available for.

In an ideal scenario most positions rotate in and out alot so even a starter that plays alot should really only hit around 65-70%.

The "quasi fill in starter" id say normally falls in the 35-40% range

 

[Deleted member 6794]

You are contradicting yourself. Dillon isn’t competition to Aaron Jones. Seeing Dillon as “stealing snaps” from A.J. Is laughable.

Actually the Packers won't line up with both Jones and Dillon on the field for a lot of snaps.

RB’s run block for other players and each other.

They hardly do that at all.

I'm really curious as to what people think. Seems to me like the days of players receiving all or almost all the snaps are kind of gone. Haven't checked any data to back that up though.

For example, only six tight ends (Kelce, Waller, Ertz, Rudolph, Witten and Kittle) played 75% of the offensive snaps last season.

 

[tynimiller]

But anyway I think you missed the context of the complaints....current picks do not help the team right now.

You do not rebuild when you should be aiming for the SB, so irrespective of whether Love/Dillon end up being boom or bust, this is a missed opportunity.

And I would say you missed the context of this thread and the reviewing of draft picks over the past few years.

 

[Sunshinepacker]

Really?
Are you so eager to get your point across that you’d split hairs on something so trivial as me calling a Josiah Deguara a TE? Looking around at some of these petty complaints I can see that these are hard times for folks.. we obviously need to reciprocate a bit so we don’t drive each other mad before they find a vaccine! , so If that irks ya enough to challenge his position designation? then I’ll tell ya what., whenever we discuss him going forward I’ll do my best to reference Josiah as a RB if that makes you more receptive.

https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/D/DeguJo00.

https://www.nfl.com/prospects/josiah-deguara/32194445-4770-3400-9fe2-

https://www.packers.com/team/players-roster/josiah-deguara/
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Josiah_Deguara


https://thedraftnetwork.com/player/josiah-deguara/C3YabgX51G

https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/players/playerpage/2181108/josiah-deguara

I think it’s relevant I included the proprietary Packer site just in case. I figured the Packers would know even if everyone else was wrong about his position designation.
From here on out he’s a RB! No exceptions and I better never see you make the slightest reference to our TE group with him.

Ok, you win, yes A TE. And, after having spent so much time proving that, can you now explain how that position should mean he makes a decent impact his rookie season? Give me the list of all the late third round TEs that have had good rookie seasons. I mean, if saying he's a TE was this important, there must be a reason, right?

To be clear, making an impact at FB as a rookie is probably easier than at TE.

 

[Pugger]

Graham played 638 snaps on offense, Lewis 498 last season. Deguara should at least surpass Lewis' total to be considered a starter.

You are contradicting yourself. Dillon isn’t competition to Aaron Jones. He’s more complimentary to him.. ok ok. yes they are both RB’s but with nearly opposite skill sets. Seeing Dillon as “stealing snaps” from A.J. Is laughable. No wonder why you feel threatened by him. Let me ask you this.. Was Marcades Lewis stealing snaps from Jimmy Graham?
According to you need 1 TE and 1 RB so they won’t steal snaps from each other. Haha. That’s pretty funny actually!!

What was your reaction that our RB was the 2nd leading receiver? Tied for yardage and #2 in receptions. and have you forgotten that RB’s have to pass block? RB’s run block for other players and each other. You’ve turned the position 1 dimensional.

You’re logic of a 1 RB system goes against everything that MLF is doing. Aaron Jones cannot be on the field for 1,100 snaps. He was at near maximum capacity with 662 snaps and that’s a healthy Aaron Jones.

I suspect Jones will be even more effective if he is fresher because he isn't playing as many snaps. IMO it is a good thing to have 2 types of backs. Most teams try to.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

I suspect Jones will be even more effective if he is fresher because he isn't playing as many snaps. IMO it is a good thing to have 2 types of backs. Most teams try to.

Actually only six other teams had a backup running back getting more touches than Williams last season.

 

[Pugger]

Actually only six other teams had a backup running back getting more touches than Williams last season.

I have a feeling Dillon will be seeing more touches this year than Williams did last year.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

I have a feeling Dillon will be seeing more touches this year than Williams did last year.

I don't think that will happen.

 

[GleefulGary]

I don't think that will happen.

Another bet?!

 

[GleefulGary]

Aaron Jones has played more than 12 games once in his career, has had injuries multiple times, and isn't built to take a heavy load.

Jamaal Williams is a career 3.9 YPC back.

Dillon is gonna get plenty of snaps and touches.

 

[RRyder]

Actually only six other teams had a backup running back getting more touches than Williams last season.

And the Packers were one of the worst offenses in the league with Rodgers QBR being absolutely dreadful when Jones was replaced by Williams. (When Jones was in both Rodgers and the Packers offense as a whole could actually have been argued as elite when looking at those on/off numbers)

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&sou...gQIBBAB&usg=AOvVaw00IvhsKV6_XA2q_gZXI7zI&cf=1

So I'm not not sure what you're arguing. It would seem lowering the drop-off from RB1 to RB2 would not only make sense but be labeled a priority

Hell at the risk of blasphemy on this board, simply by going off those stats, you can argue RB2 was a bigger need then any other position on offense outside of replacing Bulaga (not saying I'm arguing that but you could)

 

[Mavster]

Rb2 as the biggest need on a team that was horrific against the run. LOL

 

[GleefulGary]

Rb2 as the biggest need on a team that was horrific against the run. LOL

You have a hard time with nuanced discussion, don't you?

 

[Packer Fan in SD]

Rb2 as the biggest need on a team that was horrific against the run. LOL

The only player to have 19 tds last season besides McCaffery was Jones. Jones backups average to below average carries will also become a free agent. Both areas will be a concern, it comes down to what those paid to handle these things think they should do. If they think the RB was a better value than whatever other player was available then they have their job on the line.

 

[RRyder]

You have a hard time with nuanced discussion, don't you?

He also missed the part where I said "on offense" and that I wasn't even necessarily arguing it. Only that you could

 

[Deleted member 6794]

Another bet?!

Bring it on.

Aaron Jones has played more than 12 games once in his career, has had injuries multiple times, and isn't built to take a heavy load.

Jamaal Williams is a career 3.9 YPC back.

Dillon is gonna get plenty of snaps and touches.

On the other hand Jones never missed more than four games in a season as well.

Williams had 39 receptions last year which is close to twice the number Dillon had during his college career.

So I'm not not sure what you're arguing.

I was replying to another poster suggesting that most teams in the league limit the touches of their starting running backs compared to the Packers. That's not true though.

Hell at the risk of blasphemy on this board, simply by going off those stats, you can argue RB2 was a bigger need then any other position on offense outside of replacing Bulaga (not saying I'm arguing that but you could)

It should have been pretty obvious that adding another starting wide receiver should have been more important than a backup running back.

 

[GleefulGary]

Bring it on.



On the other hand Jones never missed more than four games in a season as well.

Williams had 39 receptions last year which is close to twice the number Dillon had during his college career.


It should have been pretty obvious that adding another starting wide receiver should have been more important than a backup running back.

Great! I'll enjoy this bet too.

Not sure what you're trying to say with the Jones stat? Are you arguing he's not injury prone? That he should get more touches? What's your point?

And yes, Williams caught some balls. Again, your point? Do you think he'll play over Dillon?

I think we could say that WR and RB were both needs, and one got addressed more than the other. Hopefully it works out. It's not what I would've done, but I'm not going to act like it's the dumbest thing in the world either.

 

[Sunshinepacker]

Really?
Are you so eager to get your point across that you’d split hairs on something so trivial as me calling a Josiah Deguara a TE? Looking around at some of these petty complaints I can see that these are hard times for folks.. we obviously need to reciprocate a bit so we don’t drive each other mad before they find a vaccine! , so If that irks ya enough to challenge his position designation? then I’ll tell ya what., whenever we discuss him going forward I’ll do my best to reference Josiah as a RB if that makes you more receptive.

https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/D/DeguJo00.

https://www.nfl.com/prospects/josiah-deguara/32194445-4770-3400-9fe2-

https://www.packers.com/team/players-roster/josiah-deguara/
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Josiah_Deguara


https://thedraftnetwork.com/player/josiah-deguara/C3YabgX51G

https://www.cbssports.com/nfl/players/playerpage/2181108/josiah-deguara

I think it’s relevant I included the proprietary Packer site just in case. I figured the Packers would know even if everyone else was wrong about his position designation.
From here on out he’s a RB! No exceptions and I better never see you make the slightest reference to our TE group with him.

He's 6'2", 242 lbs. Perhaps the coaches intend to foolishly play him like a TE. I hope not though, because physically he is NOT a TE in the NFL. Among TEs in the NFL here's where he ranks:
Height: 4th percentile
Weight: 8th percentile
Arm length: 7th percentile
Hand size: 3rd percentile

https://packerswire.usatoday.com/20...xcited-about-third-round-pick-josiah-deguara/

Quote from Matt LeFleur: "We will try and emulate some that stuff in terms of how the 49ers use (Kyle) Juszczyk,” LaFleur said.

Fine, maybe he did't call him a FB, but when you say you're going to use him like another team's FB, I think he's probably closer to FB than TE. Now, when I say FB I'm not talking FB like William Henderson; FBs today catch more passes and run more routes. However, I would shocked to see him lining up on the line of scrimmage more than in the backfield.

Last year, Juszcyk (who LaFleur has said Deguara will be used like), had 154 snaps as a receiver and blocked in the running game 309 times. With Deguara's physical build, usage like that is much more reasonable than an in-line TE.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

Not sure what you're trying to say with the Jones stat? Are you arguing he's not injury prone? That he should get more touches? What's your point?

And yes, Williams caught some balls. Again, your point? Do you think he'll play over Dillon?

In my opinion it's a bit harsh to label Jones as injury prone after he missed eight games in three seasons. The point I was trying to make is that while it's true he only played in more than 12 games once you should have noted that he never played in less either.

As I've mentioned in several posts I'm not convinced Dillon will move past Williams on the depth chart this season.

 

[Heyjoe4]

I don't think that will happen.

Interesting prediction. I like the Dillon pick (it took a while for me to get there), and if he doesn’t get more touches than Williams then I agree it was a lousy pick - essentially using 2nd round capital on a #3 RB. We’ll have to revisit this at the end of the season, assuming of course there is a season....... Anyway, I think Dillon gets more touches than Williams.

 

[Heyjoe4]

In my opinion it's a bit harsh to label Jones as injury prone after he missed eight games in three seasons. The point I was trying to make is that while it's true he only played in more than 12 games once you should have noted that he never played in less either.

As I've mentioned in several posts I'm not convinced Dillon will move past Williams on the depth chart this season.

I wouldn’t put Jones in the “chronically injured” category either. He could be subject to more injuries if he gets too many carries. If MLF plays it right, 15-20 carries per game would be about the max for him. He’s just not built to be a 3-down back.