Abbrederis & Jannis are better than Jones & Adams.

[Patriotplayer90]

Remember the pass by Russell Wilson in overtime to beat the Packers? That was a great pass at a huge moment.

Remember Rodgers missing Jordy Nelson in that same game for a touchdown on a simple out to the left? We had to kick a FG instead.
Remember Rodgers missing Greg Jennings in overtime in the last playoff game at Arizona where we DID get the ball first? Jennings also got open deep, as the Seahawks receiver did, but Rodgers overthrew him. Two plays later, we lost, when Rodgers fumbled.

Also, as pointed out by the Press-Gazette and mentioned here somewhere, in this loss to the Cardinals, there were key plays where Rodgers forced the ball to a guy who wasn't open, ignoring wide open Janis and/or Abbrederis on the failed plays.

My point is this: Rodgers is, perhaps, the best QB in the NFL. But he's not been playoff-clutch, and in close playoff games like the 2 losses to Arizona, to Seattle, those misses end seasons.

So let's ignore those 5 INTs thrown by Russell before that and ignore when Rodgers took them down the field for a game-tying field goal when the rest of the team imploded. That was a clutch moment, and Rodgers delivered. How can you criticize Rodgers for his play before the final moments of the game, yet you praise Russell who nearly single-handedly lost it within the same time?

If you consider every single drive a "clutch" drive and criticize every mistake a player makes during the game, then nobody is clutch. If you look at the final drive that Rodgers has the ball in his hands in the past 3 playoff games, how can you say that he let the team down? Throws one of the best passes in NFL history as time expires to tie the game. That's clutch.

 

[OldSchool101]

I can't say I disagree... I just can't make a good argument to get rid of anyone else. They won't keep 7. Who is your vote with?

I think the way Monty came on strong in his rookie year (albeit limited) makes him a valid choice. I also see the obvious in Jordy and Cobb.
I think they'll keep 6 WRs
I'd love to see a surprise pick at receiver (e.g, day 2 draft pick if there is someone who is a vertical threat that slips rounds) We clearly need to surround Aaron with better talent. Although JJ is nearing his age threshold he still is a fantastic possession guy. If the price is right I think it'd be wise to keep him on a 1yr deal at or near minimum Salary.
I'd beef up Janis to 235+pounds and move him to TE, he's shown us his physicality and I think his speed would still be a factor in YAC Which we clearly need to improve on in the TE area.
I'd get Abby more involved at KR which is where I think we originally thought he could be an option before his rookie
season ending injury.
So Jordy, Cobb, Monty, Then a battle for the other 3 spots with a FA pick or draft, pick, Davante, Jones and Abby.
I'd be in support of cutting JJ only if he is either overpriced or we acquire a deep caliber threat opposite Nelson

 

[LarrysCrookedFinger]

We've gotten used to Rodgers accurately hitting a receiver 40+ yards down the field over his career but these throws areb't easy to make. It's obvious to me Janis has troubles adjusting to a not perfectly thrown ball.

A fly route should be thrown so the ball hits a WR in stride. When it is underthrown, the receiver has to slow down so that the defender catches up and when that happens there is a very low chance of making the catch. I find it hard to believe you fault Janis here.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

A fly route should be thrown so the ball hits a WR in stride. When it is underthrown, the receiver has to slow down so that the defender catches up and when that happens there is a very low chance of making the catch. I find it hard to believe you fault Janis here.

I don't criticize him for not catching the ball because I'm well aware of the fact that's it's awfully tough to do it on an underthrown ball. Him reacting way too late and not adjusting properly is what has me worried.

 

[Patriotplayer90]

A fly route should be thrown so the ball hits a WR in stride. When it is underthrown, the receiver has to slow down so that the defender catches up and when that happens there is a very low chance of making the catch. I find it hard to believe you fault Janis here.

By the point where they started implementing the Janis plays, defenses had figured us out and we weren't able to do anything consistently or get in a rhythm on offense. You take shots like that when you are hot, not when you can't move the ball or you've run out of other ideas.

 

[LarrysCrookedFinger]

I don't criticize him for not catching the ball because I'm well aware of the fact that's it's awfully tough to do it on an underthrown ball. Him reacting way too late and not adjusting properly is what has me worried.

I must say I've seen every snap of every game and I haven't seen anything to indicate he has any habit of reacting way too late, at least not by any angles shown on TV. In what way would you have him adjust to an underthrown ball that would be any different? Often underthrown balls end up intercepted and I may be wrong here but I don't recall any of Rodgers' underthrown passes to him being picked. I believe Janis was at least able to get a hand on each of them.

 

[LarrysCrookedFinger]

By the point where they started implementing the Janis plays, defenses had figured us out and we weren't able to do anything consistently or get in a rhythm on offense. You take shots like that when you are hot, not when you can't move the ball or you've run out of other ideas.

IMO, you take them when the receiver is open.

 

[Sky King]

Watch the plays where both Montgomery and Janis misjudged the long passes. When an object comes directly from behind it is by far the most difficult to track, if you ever see it at all. Not just for NFL WRs but also for baseball outfielders running straight back for a deep fly. It's the X factor that made Willie Mays' incredible catch so awesome and immortal. The bar at the Nellis AFB is named "Check Six" for a damned good reason.

When evaluating Montgomery and Janis or any other receiver who has had trouble tracking the long ball coming-in from directly behind remember to keep that in perspective. If one game (no matter how spectacular) does not a career make, then neither should one lousy misjudged pass. Even the best of them will drop those more often.

 

[PackerDNA]

Watch the plays where both Montgomery and Janis misjudged the long passes. When an object comes directly from behind it is by far the most difficult to track, if you ever see it at all. Not just for NFL WRs but also for baseball outfielders running straight back for a deep fly. It's the X factor that made Willie Mays' incredible catch so awesome and immortal. The bar at the Nellis AFB is named "Check Six" for a damned good reason.

When evaluating Montgomery and Janis or any other receiver who has had trouble tracking the long ball coming-in from directly behind remember to keep that in perspective. If one game (no matter how spectacular) does not a career make, then neither should one lousy misjudged pass. Even the best of them will drop those more often.

Exactly. Can't think of a more difficult catch to make then over the shoulder.

 

[OldSchool101]

The more I Reflect on Janis' production. I am stunned that we didn't get him more involved earlier this year.

 

[adambr2]

The more I Reflect on Janis' production. I am stunned that we didn't get him more involved earlier this year.

Especially given the offensive struggles this year.

You have to call that a failure on the part of the coaching staff. I get that we don't see the guys practice, but given how long we saw our offense struggle this year, it's incredibly stubborn that they didn't try to get other personnel involved.

 

[Mondio]

The more I Reflect on Janis' production. I am stunned that we didn't get him more involved earlier this year.

I give the kid credit, he made some very nice catches in that last game, and I"m not talking about the 2 that were as close to being misses as they were hits. he made some tough catches, something he didn't do much this year, even when given the opportunity. The reason he wasn't involved seemed obvious to me, though I never got to watch practice, but the words coming out seemed to paint a picture of a guy that still didn't know the play book, with maybe a little dash of hands issues.

When you put that guy in, and he runs an open slant and the ball goes right off his hands, you're not as likely to use him again like you are with someone that has more of a history, especially given the fact that he's not doing much else right in practice. Fading on a route, coming back to the QB, breaking and running straight out or in at a designated spot, timing, when to break, when to look and how to do a lot of things are important in playing WR, and up until the last game, he didn't show many signs of being able to do anything other than run fast. I'm still not convinced he will either. It's not as if our offense was on fire and the oline protections were some of the best i've seen from them all year that game. I think a healthy Cobb and Adams would have produced a lot more under those circumstances.

 

[Sky King]

The Packer pass offense was predictable. They lined-up the same receivers over and over. They saw the same defense over and over. They struggled getting open over and over. Coincidence?

 

[Patriotplayer90]

I give the kid credit, he made some very nice catches in that last game, and I"m not talking about the 2 that were as close to being misses as they were hits. he made some tough catches, something he didn't do much this year, even when given the opportunity. The reason he wasn't involved seemed obvious to me, though I never got to watch practice, but the words coming out seemed to paint a picture of a guy that still didn't know the play book, with maybe a little dash of hands issues.

When you put that guy in, and he runs an open slant and the ball goes right off his hands, you're not as likely to use him again like you are with someone that has more of a history, especially given the fact that he's not doing much else right in practice. Fading on a route, coming back to the QB, breaking and running straight out or in at a designated spot, timing, when to break, when to look and how to do a lot of things are important in playing WR, and up until the last game, he didn't show many signs of being able to do anything other than run fast. I'm still not convinced he will either. It's not as if our offense was on fire and the oline protections were some of the best i've seen from them all year that game. I think a healthy Cobb and Adams would have produced a lot more under those circumstances.

I hope what we saw this year wasn't a healthy Adams. What I'm worried about is that he was exposed, and that CBs will start playing him in man coverage and jamming him since he isn't physical or very fast. Janis needs a ton of work, but Adams does as well IMO because he doesn't have the physical tools to be much of a mismatch. He'll need to be aggressive instead of being tied up and pushed around by 180 pounds CBs.

 

[Sky King]

I hope what we saw this year wasn't a healthy Adams. What I'm worried about is that he was exposed, and that CBs will start playing him in man coverage and jamming him since he isn't physical or very fast. Janis needs a ton of work, but Adams does as well IMO because he doesn't have the physical tools to be much of a mismatch. He'll need to be aggressive instead of being tied up and pushed around by 180 pounds CBs.

It takes two to three of them to have a chance to slow him down as a gunner. There's no reason in my mind to think that he somehow gets weak and timid just because he's playing at WR.

 

[Patriotplayer90]

It takes two to three of them to have a chance to slow him down as a gunner. There's no reason in my mind to think that he somehow gets weak and timid just because he's playing at WR.

I was referring to Adams.

 

[Sky King]

I was referring to Adams.

My mistake. TT's mistake, too.

 

[bigbubbatd]

I dont fully understand the love Jeff Janis gets from a segment of the fanbase. Yes he is fast but until the last game he consistently ran incorrect routes and didnt make the catches when he got the chance. Even in the great playoff game he had there was a play in the red zone where he definitely ran the wrong route if you look at McCarthy and Rodger's after the play. The guy has talent but he wasnt playing because he didnt know where he was supposed to be on the field. Why would have the team played him if that was the case?

The hope is that he takes the playbook more seriously and builds upon his great game against arizona

 

[sschind]

The more I Reflect on Janis' production. I am stunned that we didn't get him more involved earlier this year.

I'm not really. After Cobb went down and with Peterson covering Jones that left Abby and Janis as pretty much our only two WRs to catch passes. I am not surprised that their numbers were good. They did step up but under those circumstances I can't say that their production make me think it was a coming out performance or anything like that. It was great and it was promising but I don't necessarily see it as proof he should have been playing more all along. It was one game.

I hope what we saw this year wasn't a healthy Adams. What I'm worried about is that he was exposed, and that CBs will start playing him in man coverage and jamming him since he isn't physical or very fast. Janis needs a ton of work, but Adams does as well IMO because he doesn't have the physical tools to be much of a mismatch. He'll need to be aggressive instead of being tied up and pushed around by 180 pounds CBs.

People need to remember that Adams was being lauded after his playoff performance in Dallas last season as well before they start anointing Janis as anything. Is it promising? Of course. Is it something to build on? certainly. But its not a career or even a trend. Like I said it was one game.

 

[Patriotplayer90]

I'm not really. After Cobb went down and with Peterson covering Jones that left Abby and Janis as pretty much our only two WRs to catch passes. I am not surprised that their numbers were good. They did step up but under those circumstances I can't say that their production make me think it was a coming out performance or anything like that. It was great and it was promising but I don't necessarily see it as proof he should have been playing more all along. It was one game.



People need to remember that Adams was being lauded after his playoff performance in Dallas last season as well before they start anointing Janis as anything. Is it promising? Of course. Is it something to build on? certainly. But its not a career or even a trend. Like I said it was one game.

This was the lone chance that Janis got, though. Adams has 2 years of starts he had maybe 1 game that was as good. And he had the same luxury of most of the attention being focused elsewhere, so I'm not sure how that could be used against Janis and Abbrederis.

 

[bigbubbatd]

This was the lone chance that Janis got, though. Adams has 2 years of starts he had maybe 1 game that was as good. And he had the same luxury of most of the attention being focused elsewhere, so I'm not sure how that could be used against Janis and Abbrederis.

That just isn't true. Janis got chances but he proved he didn't know the playbook. Janis wasn't on the field because the coaching staff and qb didn't trust him. He has talent but when given chances looked lost. I fully hope he turns the corner but the idea he didn't get chances is wrong. He may not have been in a lot of plays but when he was in he didn't do anything to look like he belonged

 

[bigbubbatd]

The article is pretty clear why Janis wasnt on the field earlier. There is a reason why Rodgers lobbied for Abby over Janis

"In the past month, receivers coach Alex Van Pelt said, the light bulb has started to turn on for Janis. He’s running crisper, cleaner routes. There are fewer mistakes.

Slowly, Janis’ consistency in practice has led to more snaps. He played 20 at the Minnesota Vikings, 12 against the Chicago Bears. In both games, his biggest plays came on special teams: a 70-yard kickoff return against the Vikings, a 64-yard kickoff return against the Bears.

It starts in the meeting room,

With the film rolling, Janis is able to gain perspective into how Rodgers sees the game. On certain plays, Janis said, Rodgers expects receivers to run routes a specific way. Rodgers will ask questions, and receivers better have the right answers. If not, trust isn’t built.

Janis hasn’t always had the right answers.

“I don’t know if he’s ever ripped into me,” Janis said, “but just body language-wise you know when he’s mad at you. You know when you’re wrong, and you know what to do next time. I think that’s the biggest thing, is realizing when you’re wrong and talking with him about it, and then going out and fixing it.”

http://www.packersnews.com/story/sp.../?hootPostID=b62ad7eb03ded566eb06e367100b7626

 

[Deleted member 6794]

I must say I've seen every snap of every game and I haven't seen anything to indicate he has any habit of reacting way too late, at least not by any angles shown on TV. In what way would you have him adjust to an underthrown ball that would be any different? Often underthrown balls end up intercepted and I may be wrong here but I don't recall any of Rodgers' underthrown passes to him being picked. I believe Janis was at least able to get a hand on each of them.

Janis has to learn to use his massive catching radius to catch balls not perfectly thrown. To do that he has to react better to underthrown balls, the QB not getting picked throwing his way isn´t good enough.

Watch the plays where both Montgomery and Janis misjudged the long passes. When an object comes directly from behind it is by far the most difficult to track, if you ever see it at all. Not just for NFL WRs but also for baseball outfielders running straight back for a deep fly. It's the X factor that made Willie Mays' incredible catch so awesome and immortal. The bar at the Nellis AFB is named "Check Six" for a damned good reason.

When evaluating Montgomery and Janis or any other receiver who has had trouble tracking the long ball coming-in from directly behind remember to keep that in perspective. If one game (no matter how spectacular) does not a career make, then neither should one lousy misjudged pass. Even the best of them will drop those more often.

I agree that it´s tough to properly track deep balls but as an NFL receiver mostly only capable of running a deep route Janis has to do a better job to get on the field more often.

 

[OldSchool101]

I dont fully understand the love Jeff Janis gets from a segment of the fanbase. Yes he is fast but until the last game he consistently ran incorrect routes and didnt make the catches when he got the chance. Even in the great playoff game he had there was a play in the red zone where he definitely ran the wrong route if you look at McCarthy and Rodger's after the play. The guy has talent but he wasnt playing because he didnt know where he was supposed to be on the field. Why would have the team played him if that was the case?

The hope is that he takes the playbook more seriously and builds upon his great game against arizona

I understand that and at one time stood by that argument. There's something going on behind the scenes that were not privy to.
My argument is that when you practice mainly on ST and with a 2nd team Offense, the timing and production when you suddenly get starting playing time with the 1st team as a primary WR is rarely going to be an immediate and smooth transition to 1st team production.
I'd love for someone to prove me wrong and show me evidence that Janis has played with the 1st team unit half as much as an Adams etc..
Let's compare Apples to Apples

 

[TJV]

I don't know what was going on with Adams - at times it looked to me like he wasn't trying hard enough to get open, but regarding Janis IMO the issue was in practice and in the meeting room.