Valdes-Scantling

[Deleted member 6794]

Is he tho? No, so it is true. Gives us nothing just like I said

There's no doubt MVS needs to make more plays to have an impact.

 

[XPack]

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3:20 - 3:30 A slightly under thrown pass, but good WRs would make the adjustment.

 

[DarkHelmet]

Our new Derrick Mayes? Fast, could be breakaway guy, but somehow never is?

I'd rather target Lazard. Maybe even Kumerow.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

MVS has been a disappointment for me this season, but I also think the expectations for him were probably too high, in this his second year. Sure he is a deep threat, but is he the WR that can be relied on to pick up the first down, get open when Rodgers is scrambling or make a nice run after a short catch? Right now with a catch rate of less than 50% (23/47) but an average of 18.6 yds/catch, he seems to be a one trick pony.

I think its up to MLF to rethink how he seems to be using MVS, deep routes are fine once in awhile, but get him more involved in the short passing game and hope he breaks one with his speed. Make the defenses worry more about him in that way and eventually he will be able to break wide open for a deep pass.

Right now, MVS has less YAC than Jimmy Graham, something is wrong with that.

 

[HardRightEdge]

MVS has been a disappointment for me this season, but I also think the expectations for him were probably too high, in this his second year. Sure he is a deep threat, but is he the WR that can be relied on to pick up the first down, get open when Rodgers is scrambling or make a nice run after a short catch? Right now with a catch rate of less than 50% (23/47) but an average of 18.6 yds/catch, he seems to be a one trick pony.

I think its up to MLF to rethink how he seems to be using MVS, deep routes are fine once in awhile, but get him more involved in the short passing game and hope he breaks one with his speed. Make the defenses worry more about him in that way and eventually he will be able to break wide open for a deep pass.

Right now, MVS has less YAC than Jimmy Graham, something is wrong with that.

Rodgers prefers throwing to Lazard. And that's the way it's going to be for the rest of this season at least.

Lazard started getting more snaps in week 7, with week 9 the exception. Last 3 games:

Lazard: 30, 52, 37
MVS: 11, 30, 18

 

[tynimiller]

Rodgers prefers throwing to Lazard. And that's the way it's going to be for the rest of this season at least.

Lazard started getting more snaps in week 7, with week 9 the exception. Last 3 games:

Lazard: 30, 52, 37
MVS: 11, 30, 18

100% agree. However, MVS ain't going anywhere and that trust can always come back as we've seen with AR before.

 

[HardRightEdge]

100% agree. However, MVS ain't going anywhere and that trust can always come back as we've seen with AR before.

I don't believe the trust has ever been there. I think it was in camp or early in the season where Rodgers said MVS didn't know what he was doing last season. What he didn't say is that MVS knows what he's doing now.

But you're right...it's not like he won't be in camp next season. He might do better with a different QB but I can't imagine there's much if any trade value.

 

[HardRightEdge]

Right now, MVS has less YAC than Jimmy Graham, something is wrong with that.

That's not a good way to look at it. RBs and TEs tend to have higher YAC as a percentage of yards gained. It's the nature of the balls they're thrown.

Adams: 5.0 YAC per catch; YAC = 40.0% of yards

MVS: 5.9 YAC per catch; YAC = 30.9% of total yards

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

That's not a good way to look at it. RBs and TEs tend to have higher YAC as a percentage of yards gained. It's the nature of the balls they're thrown.

Adams: 5.0 YAC per catch; YAC = 40.0% of yards

MVS: 5.9 YAC per catch; YAC = 30.9% of total yards

My point was, with MVS's speed, the Packers should be trying to get him open on shorter routes and hope to cash in on getting him some open turf to run. Maybe they did early in the season? Whatever the case, he doesn't seem to get open short to medium range very often and if he catches a ball in traffic, he is tackled quickly. While I don't have any hard stats on this, I would say his YAC have been much more uncontested yards than Adam's.

All that said, I agree with your post on Lazard and the fact that he hopefully turns out to be the #2 WR that we had hoped to have with G-Mo or MVS. I know people really are pulling for Jake K. but I just see him as another good story and not really a starting WR.

 

[tynimiller]

I don't believe the trust has ever been there. I think it was in camp or early in the season where Rodgers said MVS didn't know what he was doing last season. What he didn't say is that MVS knows what he's doing now.

But you're right...it's not like he won't be in camp next season. He might do better with a different QB but I can't imagine there's much if any trade value.

100%, we have to remember we are dealing with a 2nd year guy that no one thought was gonna walk in and light the world unfire. The raw skillz are there...we just gotta hope he puts it together at some point. I think realistically at this point expected him to be the role of a #2 is a 2020 dream at the earliest...but I feel he's more in line to be that solid #3 or #4 guy.

 

[Mondio]

I just don't see anything that different this year, from what i saw last year. I want to see growth

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

I just don't see anything that different this year, from what i saw last year. I want to see growth

I would agree and parrot that to include this season, from beginning to end. Both G-Mo and MVS have been disappointing most of the season. I don't see any way that G-Mo is resigned, unless he some how really steps it up between Sunday and the end of the season or there is just no interest in him as a FA and we sign him later at close to vet. Min.

The clock is still ticking on MVS and if we had better options, he wouldn't even be seeing the field very often. Given that he is on a rookie contract and the position is pretty thin, he will have at least 1 if not 2 more years to prove he is an NFL WR.

You contrast them with a guy like Lazard, who didn't even make the 53 and it is even more disappointing at how little those 2 players have improved, despite being handed the starting position.

 

[gopkrs]

I don't think they use Allison correctly. He should not be inside ever (except maybe to block). He should be outside where he can run some square outs.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

I don't think they use Allison correctly. He should not be inside ever (except maybe to block). He should be outside where he can run some square outs.

or sitting on the bench

Sorry, GMO hasn't impressed me much at all.

 

[Favre>Rodgers259]

I think MVS partially is still trying to adjust to the speed of the game and the level of competition in addition to learning the playbook.

At South Florida his speed was enough, which is why he was considered raw coming out of college.

Noteable DBs in the American: Shaquill Griffin

Lazard is a polar opposite.

Lazard was a 4 star athlete in HS, the No. 1 Recruit in the state of Iowa, and the 7th ranked WR in the nation. He followed in both his father's and brothers footsteps to Iowa State, but had offers to Notre Dame, Nebraska, Stanford, California, and Iowa.

Lazard was a 4 year starter at Iowa State and went up against the likes of Rasul Douglas, Karl Joseph, Xavien Howard, Daryl Worley, Quandre Diggs, Justin Gilbert, and Jason Verrett during his career.

I'd say Lazard cut his teeth in the Big 12.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

MVS has been a disappointment for me this season, but I also think the expectations for him were probably too high, in this his second year. Sure he is a deep threat, but is he the WR that can be relied on to pick up the first down, get open when Rodgers is scrambling or make a nice run after a short catch? Right now with a catch rate of less than 50% (23/47) but an average of 18.6 yds/catch, he seems to be a one trick pony.

I think its up to MLF to rethink how he seems to be using MVS, deep routes are fine once in awhile, but get him more involved in the short passing game and hope he breaks one with his speed. Make the defenses worry more about him in that way and eventually he will be able to break wide open for a deep pass.

Right now, MVS has less YAC than Jimmy Graham, something is wrong with that.

I highly doubt MVS' route running is precise enough to get open on short routes, a reason why he's mostly used on deep ones at this point. Unfortunately he hasn't been able to catch a long ball neither over the past few weeks.

 

[AmishMafia]

The raw skillz are there...we just gotta hope he puts it together at some point. I think realistically at this point expected him to be the role of a #2 is a 2020 dream at the earliest...but I feel he's more in line to be that solid #3 or #4 guy.

Here are the top 5 WRs AR has had during his career:


Donald Driver
Devante Adams
Jordy Nelson
James Jones
Greg Jennings

Here are their numbers (in random order) for their first two years:


Rec/yds/tds
A. 55/686/4
B. 67/676/3
C. 98/1,550/15
D. 61/1008/4
E. 88/930/4

Now, see if you can guess which one is MVS. Adams? ( And MVS will build upon these numbers the next couple of weeks.)


MVS had early success before anyone thought possible. But he was very raw coming out. I don't know if he will break into the top 5, but he is a long way from topping out at this point.

Only 1 of these players was a standout by year 2.

 

[Favre>Rodgers259]

MVS may have not "topped out yet", but potential is attractive only for so long.

Maybe it's me, but it seems like over the years the Packers have gotten away from schemeing for their players. Brett Favre mentioned several times over his career that there were plays for Driver, Freeman, Ferguson, Walker, etc. Did McCarthy and now LeFleur not do that anymore? While not necessarily the best idea(especially if defenses pick up on it) but maybe a little bit of gadgetry here and there would go a long way towards getting him to produce on the field.

 

[AmishMafia]

MVS may have not "topped out yet", but potential is attractive only for so long.

Maybe so, but it sure isn't 2 years. As I thought my stats showed, at this point in his career his numbers are very comparable and exceeds Adams, Jones, Driver, and Nelson. Only Jennings made an impact early. The early signs are that MVS can be a great to very good WR. It just takes some time.

 

[thequick12]

Rodgers prefers throwing to Lazard. And that's the way it's going to be for the rest of this season at least.

Lazard started getting more snaps in week 7, with week 9 the exception. Last 3 games:

Lazard: 30, 52, 37
MVS: 11, 30, 18

Mvs also suffered an ankle injury and although he had the short catch and long run td against Oakland after the injury, hasn't done much since being injured.

An ankle injury scan ruin a wrs season happened to Jennings his rookie year, happened to Adams his second year etc.

At this point you're correct I'd assume lazard will be the number 2 wr going forward this season. Probably won't be either of them next season. As hopefully a wr will be selected in the first 2 rounds of the 2020 draft.

If I was the coach I'd target mvs once a game with that play action shot play that used to be a TD to Nelson everytime for awhile. If Rodgers can lead mvs that could provide similar results because wether it's the ankle or just who he is mvs is a straight line guy right now but that doesn't mean he's worthless

 

[Deleted member 6794]

Here are the top 5 WRs AR has had during his career:


Donald Driver
Devante Adams
Jordy Nelson
James Jones
Greg Jennings

Here are their numbers (in random order) for their first two years:


Rec/yds/tds
A. 55/686/4
B. 67/676/3
C. 98/1,550/15
D. 61/1008/4
E. 88/930/4

Now, see if you can guess which one is MVS. Adams? ( And MVS will build upon these numbers the next couple of weeks.)


MVS had early success before anyone thought possible. But he was very raw coming out. I don't know if he will break into the top 5, but he is a long way from topping out at this point.

Only 1 of these players was a standout by year 2.

I'm not convinced MVS will add to those numbers until the end of this season as he has only two catches for 11 yards over the past five games while his snap count has significantly declined.

In my opinion fans are disappointed in him because he has regressed for whatever reason lately.

 

[tynimiller]

Here are the top 5 WRs AR has had during his career:


Donald Driver
Devante Adams
Jordy Nelson
James Jones
Greg Jennings

Here are their numbers (in random order) for their first two years:


Rec/yds/tds
A. 55/686/4
B. 67/676/3
C. 98/1,550/15
D. 61/1008/4
E. 88/930/4

Now, see if you can guess which one is MVS. Adams? ( And MVS will build upon these numbers the next couple of weeks.)


MVS had early success before anyone thought possible. But he was very raw coming out. I don't know if he will break into the top 5, but he is a long way from topping out at this point.

Only 1 of these players was a standout by year 2.

You will never hear me say I give up on him. I just think folks are expecting stud #2 out of guy that truly is raw at best still, talented 100% and I've also brought up his stats for first two years is awesome really.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

I'm not convinced MVS will add to those numbers until the end of this season as he has only two catches for 11 yards over the past five games while his snap count has significantly declined.

In my opinion fans are disappointed in him because he has regressed for whatever reason lately.

Well said and once I read it, captured my feeling. I think we all know that it takes a few seasons to catch on in Green Bay as a WR, so in the back of our minds we cut young receivers some slack. MVS's reduced playing time is a pretty good indicator to me that the coaches are more confident in Lazard and MVS is going to have to prove himself worthy of more snaps. So as you said, I doubt we see that change much this season, unless there is an injury to someone ahead of him.

All that said, I hope we see a guy head into the off season bound and determined to improve his game and he comes back in 2020, along with EQ and makes for a very competitive camp at the WR position. I have said it before and I will say it again, I wasn't very impressed with the group of WR's that the Packers started this season with and hope to see them add a FA and a high round rookie to really elevate the position up a notch or two.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

I have said it before and I will say it again, I wasn't very impressed with the group of WR's that the Packers started this season with and hope to see them add a FA and a high round rookie to really elevate the position up a notch or two.

The pickings will most likely be pretty slim in free agency next offseason, therefore the draft should be the way to improve the talent level at wide receiver next offseason.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

The pickings will most likely be pretty slim in free agency next offseason, therefore the draft should be the way to improve the talent level at wide receiver next offseason.

Given the lack of talent at the position now, I hope that we don't have to just rely on a rookie, even a high round one, to improve in 2020 at WR. I do think a high pick needs to be used for the future of the position though.

Hard to tell who will actually be available in Free Agency at this point, guys get signed, guys get cut, etc. I wouldn't close the door on the idea of finding a solid #2 WR outside of the draft.