The Amari Rodgers Thread

[kevans74]

Has anyone with the Packers coaching staff or front office ever explained what the problem is with Amari Rodgers? Why he has nearly zero role in the receiving game even when he is healthy and rest of the receiving corps is decimated with injuries? How do you get drafted in the 3rd round and produce like an UDFA? What's the problem here?

Here's a short list I came up with off the top of my head as to why/how highly drafted WR's end up becoming busts:

- Can't learn the playbook
- Lack of speed
- Lack of size
- Poor route running
- Poor hands/drops
- Bad attitude/worth ethic
- Skills are a bad fit for offensive scheme

There's obviously more, but that's what I came up with on the spot.

So I'm wondering where Amari is failing.

Great points, for Amari a combo of some of the above for sure..

Listen, I've said this before and I'll say it again, MLF's scheme isn't "easy to learn" but it works and it's very creative. So rookie WRs, TEs, etc. have to be smart enough to LEARN MLF's scheme. That won't happen overnight obviously... and I get and respect that.

But it's been OVER a year now and what has he done?

I think that's what we are all saying right? WR, like TE, isn't necessarily easy to learn to play at the NFL level right off the bat. Not everyone is a Justin Jefferson or Tee Higgins... but eventually he's gotta do "something".

 

[milani]

Interesting point. Yeah I'm old enough to remember when almost all punts and kickoffs were returned. It made for a more interesting game. Today, the kickers and punters have refined their work, making returns much less frequent.

And with the slightly smaller rosters you had to use more than just a handful of your starting offense and defense.

 

[Heyjoe4]

I think Watson would give us a spark at KR, but they might not see extra 4-6 yards gained as a worthy risk. He’s barely used on Offense so it’s a worthy short-term scenario. Once he’s performing at WR regularly we can always revert back to whoever.

As far as dropping a ball. A player standing on the field at KR all by their lonesome isn’t going to drop the same rate as being a moving target chased by a competitor imo.
All that said, I seriously don’t think Watson fumbling Kickoffs is an issue to begin with. He did it quite often in College and never had an issue that I saw.
I believe the reason they wouldn’t put Watson back there is they want him to be a regular part of the Offense and he might be more susceptible to serious injury (as opposed to being a passing deep threat). You could kiss your two 2nd rounders away (draft spent) pretty quickly might be a plausible risk that they are looking at.

Also. We might start seeing more and more packages using #9 in our Offense as the season wears on. They also might be thinking it’s too much to put on his plate this early. Let him concentrate and not wear too many hats if you will?

Yeah all good points. Considering the very few # of kickoffs returned, I guess leaving Rodgers in is fine. If opponents think they can gain a few yards in field advantage, they might try to drop a kickoff inside the 5. It's not that big a deal. Leave Rodgers in and start using Watson as a real receiver. He's gotta learn some routes and he's gotta learn to create separation other than just outrunning a corner on a long route. And he has to improve his catching. Only way to do that is play.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

We got a long way to go to get into Jeff Janis territory. His thread was completely bizarre in length.

I'm waiting for someone to suggest we sign Janis!

 

[Schultz]

Pats returner is 3rd round rookie cornerback Marcus Jones. He wasn't even the starting returner at the start of the season, which was Myles Bryant. Also, the Pat's other rookie CB, 4th round pick Jack Jones looked pretty solid. Neither of those 2 guys should be confused with Pat's QB, Mac Jones or Bears WR Velus Jones...singer Tom Jones or TV detective, Barnaby Jones, for that matter.

I just hope the Pack have an answer for the naked bootleg if Daniel Jones plays. In London they will listen to a lot of Davey Jones, down south a lot of George Jones while I prefer Billy Paul singing about Mrs. Jones.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

One area that I think Amari fails at on offense is blocking. Seems that all the WR's and TE's are expected to block and I have seen him fail to do that a few times. Add that to not being on the same page as #12 and you have a big liability on the field.

While most Packer WR's have taken a few seasons to really come into their own, they usually at least flash potential. I've yet to see Amari do anything that makes me say "ok, he's on his way."

3rd round picks seem to be Gutes weakness, I say trade out of that round from now on.

 

[Poppa San]

Need to remember Rodgers was drafted for the slot role. As long as Cobb is making clutch 1st downs on most of his targets there isn't a spot on offense for Amari.
I am kind of surprised he didn't get the jet sweep roles when Watson was missing. They just left that out of the play list that game.

 

[Spanky]

I have no interest in having Watson return punts or kicks and it has nothing to do with his abilities. He's 4 games into his rookie season and he's already missed time with a knee injury/surgery and a hamstring injury. He needs to focus his time on getting integrated into the passing game and staying as healthy as possible.

 

[Heyjoe4]

I have no interest in having Watson return punts or kicks and it has nothing to do with his abilities. He's 4 games into his rookie season and he's already missed time with a knee injury/surgery and a hamstring injury. He needs to focus his time on getting integrated into the passing game and staying as healthy as possible.

Those are good points Spanky. Watson is struggling to do what he was drafted for, be a solid WR. So far he's been used primarily on jet sweeps. That relies on speed but you can draft guys in rounds 4 through 6 who have speed and can run jet sweeps. Watson has to develop some routes and learn how to separate from a defender and be a complete receiver. I have yet to see him do that, and I'm guessing neither has Rodgers.

It's still very early and patience is a virtue. Well, maybe not in the NFL........

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

Need to remember Rodgers was drafted for the slot role. As long as Cobb is making clutch 1st downs on most of his targets there isn't a spot on offense for Amari.
I am kind of surprised he didn't get the jet sweep roles when Watson was missing. They just left that out of the play list that game.

The problem with only using Amari for jet sweeps, is that so far he offers very little in receiving or blocking skills. So the defense might be tipped of when they only see him in there for jet sweeps. Cobb is being rotated in and out and has only seen 107 snaps out of a possible 264. I just don't think the Packers have enough faith in Amari to put him out there on offense. Even the games where they were short handed on WR's, he didn't get out there much.

 

[Pkrjones]

IF Green Bay is going to have a dedicated "return sprecialist" such as Amari Rodgers, who most will agree isn't even "average" maybe Gute needs to raid someone's PS? Maurice Alexander (4.54 speed, similar to Amari's) led the USFL in kick return yardage and was #4 in punt returns is sitting on Detroit's PS.

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[Heyjoe4]

IF Green Bay is going to have a dedicated "return sprecialist" such as Amari Rodgers, who most will agree isn't even "average" maybe Gute needs to raid someone's PS? Maurice Alexander (4.54 speed, similar to Amari's) led the USFL in kick return yardage and was #4 in punt returns is sitting on Detroit's PS.

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Sounds like a good idea to me. Especially since all the Packers want is for a guy to return kicks. Snaps on O or D would be a nice thing…….

 

[milani]

Sounds like a good idea to me. Especially since all the Packers want is for a guy to return kicks. Snaps on O or D would be a nice thing…….

I keep thinking of that player from the CFL we had on the roster last season for the Viking game in December.

 

[Heyjoe4]

I keep thinking of that player from the CFL we had on the roster last season for the Viking game in December.

I think his last name was Moore. He did a better job than Amari. Not sure why he was cut.

 

[milani]

I think his last name was Moore. He did a better job than Amari. Not sure why he was cut.

I believe he signed somewhere. He did not cost very much. I think Gute does not want just a return guy. He wants someone who can play a position as well. In this day and age why?

 

[Heyjoe4]

I believe he signed somewhere. He did not cost very much. I think Gute does not want just a return guy. He wants someone who can play a position as well. In this day and age why?

Considering how seldom they're used, I don't see a reason why a returner can't be used on O or D. On the other hand, a GM would not want to risk a top producer on O or D returning kicks, especially kickoffs, where the risk of injury is higher.

But yeah, STs has specialists for snapping, holding, and kicking. So why not have a specialist for returns?

 

[Pkrjones]

But yeah, STs has specialists for snapping, holding, and kicking. So why not have a specialist for returns?

Dallin, Rudy Ford & now Eric Wilson are ST guys who will only see D snaps if major run of injuries...so ST has many dedicated players.

 

[Heyjoe4]

Dallin, Rudy Ford & now Eric Wilson are ST guys who will only see D snaps if major run of injuries...so ST has many dedicated players.

Good point. That's one very positive change that Bisaccia brought with him. I think he brought two or three STs guys with him and I think Ford was one.

And Ford did a decent Jon Sunday when Savage went down. It's like a bonus if these guys can play more than STs. But I like the change in attitude toward STs. Frustrating, because after the 97 SB win, ya think they'd realize how important STs can be.....

 

[lambeaulambo]

Are we talking about Watson and Love? Well, do you think Bellichik would trade Frank Zappa straight up for Love? Neither do I. That kid settled down and almost got a win. Granted the running game did the most damage, but Frank Z made some nice throws when needed. So in one game Frank Z has done more than Love has done in three years, at least in terms of poise.

As for Watson, well if all we expected was MVS 2.0 without the rare catches and a guy who can motor on jet sweeps, then he fits the bill. I don't think I've seen him targeted on any other type of route through four games. Lazard, Cobb, and Doubs are at the top of this WR group and that likely won't change. I could see Doubs challenging Lazard for the #1 WR later in the season.

I'm not giving up on Watson but I don't matter. In Watson's case, Rodgers matters.

Frank died in 1993. LOL love it. He does have a resemblence to AR12 though.

 

[lambeaulambo]

Behold K Hill may be coming back. Lets see if he can return to form. As for Amari - I'm as perplexed as everyone else.

 

[Heyjoe4]

Frank died in 1993. LOL love it. He does have a resemblence to AR12 though.

Is that when Frank Z died? Wow. Seems like yesterday we were in high school listening to "It Can't Happen Here" and "Brown Shoes Don't Make It." We were in a minority.

 

[Magooch]

Has anyone with the Packers coaching staff or front office ever explained what the problem is with Amari Rodgers? Why he has nearly zero role in the receiving game even when he is healthy and rest of the receiving corps is decimated with injuries? How do you get drafted in the 3rd round and produce like an UDFA? What's the problem here?

Here's a short list I came up with off the top of my head as to why/how highly drafted WR's end up becoming busts:

- Can't learn the playbook
- Lack of speed
- Lack of size
- Poor route running
- Poor hands/drops
- Bad attitude/worth ethic
- Skills are a bad fit for offensive scheme

There's obviously more, but that's what I came up with on the spot.

So I'm wondering where Amari is failing.

Been thinking about this one a bit.
I would more or less divide this list up into physical traits/attributes and then ones that are more mental type things.
So things like speed, size, hands, etc all are pretty much physical qualities (there's a bit of a mental component to drops too, but you get the point) while stuff like scheme fit, learning the playbook, attitude, route running are more mental (similarly there's some physical component to route running, but I think you can more readily learn to be a better route-runner than you can learn to be taller, lol).

So in that sense I'm not exactly sure where the problem lies. Of course when Amari was drafted we already knew our coach and his offensive scheme/playstyle. I'd like to think that if there were any big fit concerns then we simply wouldn't have drafted him. I'd think we'd have had a fairly good idea of the qualities we'd want in a LaFleur-receiver and if he didn't have them then I don't know why we would've bothered with the pick. Maybe that speaks more to being unable to learn the playbook or simply not putting in the work to make it happen.

Physically I kind of see it both ways. On one hand...I think most scouts had a fairly high read on Amari's physical traits coming out of college. He was seen as being fairly quick, well-built, good hands, fast, strong, etc. No major red flags. At the same time he wasn't really viewed as having "elite" speed either and his build more or less limits him to projecting out as a slot WR or 'gadget' player on offense - you're not going to line him up outside to run fades or something.

But with all that said I also feel like he's definitely a player who "plays slow" whenever I've watched him and I think that's a mental thing. He looks hesitant, apprehensive - feels like a "reactive" rather than "proactive" player. So I don't think he has any glaring physical deficiencies - players with his measurables have certainly succeeded before - but until he gets some of the mental stuff ironed out it's hard to see any way it really works out for him.

 

[Heyjoe4]

Been thinking about this one a bit.
I would more or less divide this list up into physical traits/attributes and then ones that are more mental type things.
So things like speed, size, hands, etc all are pretty much physical qualities (there's a bit of a mental component to drops too, but you get the point) while stuff like scheme fit, learning the playbook, attitude, route running are more mental (similarly there's some physical component to route running, but I think you can more readily learn to be a better route-runner than you can learn to be taller, lol).

So in that sense I'm not exactly sure where the problem lies. Of course when Amari was drafted we already knew our coach and his offensive scheme/playstyle. I'd like to think that if there were any big fit concerns then we simply wouldn't have drafted him. I'd think we'd have had a fairly good idea of the qualities we'd want in a LaFleur-receiver and if he didn't have them then I don't know why we would've bothered with the pick. Maybe that speaks more to being unable to learn the playbook or simply not putting in the work to make it happen.

Physically I kind of see it both ways. On one hand...I think most scouts had a fairly high read on Amari's physical traits coming out of college. He was seen as being fairly quick, well-built, good hands, fast, strong, etc. No major red flags. At the same time he wasn't really viewed as having "elite" speed either and his build more or less limits him to projecting out as a slot WR or 'gadget' player on offense - you're not going to line him up outside to run fades or something.

But with all that said I also feel like he's definitely a player who "plays slow" whenever I've watched him and I think that's a mental thing. He looks hesitant, apprehensive - feels like a "reactive" rather than "proactive" player. So I don't think he has any glaring physical deficiencies - players with his measurables have certainly succeeded before - but until he gets some of the mental stuff ironed out it's hard to see any way it really works out for him.

Good analysis. Another thing I've noticed, and it's hard to be sure, he just doesn't seem confident in his abilities.

The lack of confidence could also extend to his teammates. If he thinks the guys in front of him aren't able to block properly, then he's going to take it on his shoulders to try and do everything. That can't work.

I do tend to think the problems are more in his head than the rest of his body. He showed up for camp in even better shape than his rookie year. I get being initially overwhelmed by the jump from college to the NFL, but that's why they have coaches.

It's a mystery. But he's going nowhere as far as I can tell. He may survive the season, but I don't expect him back next year.

 

[OldSchool101]

Good analysis. Another thing I've noticed, and it's hard to be sure, he just doesn't seem confident in his abilities.

The lack of confidence could also extend to his teammates. If he thinks the guys in front of him aren't able to block properly, then he's going to take it on his shoulders to try and do everything. That can't work.

I do tend to think the problems are more in his head than the rest of his body. He showed up for camp in even better shape than his rookie year. I get being initially overwhelmed by the jump from college to the NFL, but that's why they have coaches.

It's a mystery. But he's going nowhere as far as I can tell. He may survive the season, but I don't expect him back next year.

Fire him already!

(J/k. I just wanted you to suffer from utter shock and awe that I could agree with you)

 

[Heyjoe4]

Fire him already!

(J/k. I just wanted you to suffer from utter shock and awe that I could agree with you)

I don't know - part of me would like him gone now. But another commenter noted that if there were a better returner available, Gluten would have found him. And I suppose it's hard to cut a 3rd rounder loose after a year and 4 games. He just doesn't look like he's going anywhere.

That said, it wouldn't surprise me if a change in surroundings made a difference. I'm not dissing the GB establishment or the team, both are very good. I've made job changes in my career, or taken on new assignments that at the time I didn't care for. Some of those changes had an incredibly positive impact. Ya never know what's around the corner because you can't see him.

I do wish him the best. He's too young and too talented to have his dream end now.