Roster Statuses heading into 2024...

[tynimiller]

LOL....we were thinking along the same lines. Saw your post after I posted mine. Yeah, if the Packers are playing .500 ball at the trade deadline and someone wants to pony up a 2nd rounder for Stokes, I am all in. I just wouldn't trade him away NOW, unless the coaches thought that he really won't ever be a quality starter.

No you trade him also if you feel you have three capable guys in him, Valentine and King (plus Jaire who for sure is). You ain’t paying Stokes after season so if you can flip say him and a fifth for a teams second because they have a need do it and have a second top 64 pick for a Green Bay draft party

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

No you trade him also if you feel you have three capable guys in him, Valentine and King (plus Jaire who for sure is). You ain’t paying Stokes after season so if you can flip say him and a fifth for a teams second because they have a need do it and have a second top 64 pick for a Green Bay draft party

If the Packers are 8-1 and Stokes is playing really well, I would have a tough time with wanting to see him being traded away. Yes, his contract is up at the end of the season, but the Packers could tag him in a number of different ways and still recoup draft picks for him. Would I want to have 2 big CB salaries in 2025 and beyond? Probably not, but I could think of worse problems. Like Alexander going down in Dec. and suddenly a 14-1 team has a weakness.

I will also say this. Stokes is playing for MILLIONS of dollars this season. His future contract will either be 7 figures or 8. He has everything to gain. Jaire on the other hand is playing only to stay at the top of his position, he already made bank. So the motivation for Stokes is high, as is the payoff. Barring injuries (again), this will be a throw everything he has at it season for Stokes.

 

[tynimiller]

If the Packers are 8-1 and Stokes is playing really well, I would have a tough time with wanting to see him being traded away. Yes, his contract is up at the end of the season, but the Packers could tag him in a number of different ways and still recoup draft picks for him. Would I want to have 2 big CB salaries in 2025 and beyond? Probably not, but I could think of worse problems. Like Alexander going down in Dec. and suddenly a 14-1 team has a weakness.

I will also say this. Stokes is playing for MILLIONS of dollars this season. His future contract will either be 7 figures or 8. He has everything to gain. Jaire on the other hand is playing only to stay at the top of his position, he already made bank. So the motivation for Stokes is high, as is the payoff. Barring injuries (again), this will be a throw everything he has at it season for Stokes.

I don't disagree and it may seem I do, but it for sure is something a good GM would have to be aware of and consider if the right call comes in. A LOT though for that scenario to play out would depend more on how King and Ballentine are doing because they'd instantly likely have to between them find a legit NFL CB for when need arises, Carrington would have to absolutely be that dude still.

Truthfully if we find ourselves in that situation.....what makes more sense? A team calls and says they'd give us a 2nd for Stokes and a fifth OR

What if a team wants a CB with more years of control and someone asks for Jaire + a fifth for their first rounder???

All hypotheticals of course, but when you're trying to think where Packers could find themselves in a situation of too many guys that appear to have a log jam of talent...I actually believe CB could end up being more that than even the WR room almost...





Even if this scenario plays out, keep Stokes and have a high end comp pick coming in 2026 draft....Gute and such would know that as a luxury to potentially move some in 2025 as well...

Stokes legit is playing this year to be just wealthy or STUPID wealthy...

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

What if a team wants a CB with more years of control and someone asks for Jaire + a fifth for their first rounder???

You are scaring me.

I was actually thinking the same and was going to say "I might consider offloading Jaire before Stokes, if they were both playing equally well."

You are correct. Lots of variables, lots of scenarios and I think we both know that Gute's mind is probably turning all of them, over and over each day. Again, it is a very good problem to have when we as fans are talking about things in this light and not "Who the hell do we really have to cover Jefferson and other top receivers?"

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

Speaking of Jefferson, this was impressive to read. Now, if he and the Vikings only had a good QB.

https://athlonsports.com/nfl/minnes...xpected-living-situation-140-million-contract via @athlonsports

 

[Thirteen Below]

Truthfully if we find ourselves in that situation.....what makes more sense? A team calls and says they'd give us a 2nd for Stokes and a fifth OR

What if a team wants a CB with more years of control and someone asks for Jaire + a fifth for their first rounder???

Of the two, I'd be inclined to go for the 2nd option - assuming both are healthy and playing well. Jaire's 2 years older, and his next contract will be substantial. And if just one of the newer kids seem ready to take the next step, it might be a gamble worth taking.

All hypotheticals of course, but when you're trying to think where Packers could find themselves in a situation of too many guys that appear to have a log jam of talent...I actually believe CB could end up being more that than even the WR room almost...

I've had the same thought a number of times, but was too timid to say it out loud. But if you're comfortable advancing the theory, I feel a little more brave.

I don't think it's just the CBs, but the entire defensive backfield (including safeties). The entire 3rd layer of the D has the potential to emerge as a dominant force, stacked at the moment with several young players who (several of them) show substantial hope for promising careers.

Even if this scenario plays out, keep Stokes and have a high end comp pick coming in 2026 draft....Gute and such would know that as a luxury to potentially move some in 2025 as well...

I think that for some years now, Gute has been eagerly aniticipatiing a world in which that would become a somewhat common scenario for his larger-scale personnel management strategies.

 

[Poppa San]

All hypotheticals of course, but when you're trying to think where Packers could find themselves in a situation of too many guys that appear to have a log jam of talent...I actually believe CB could end up being more that than even the WR room almost...

And to think that before Gute, we wasted how many top picks on DBs and they were at best journeymen?

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

I'd prefer not to trade any starters, at least right now. Sure maybe the Packers have some quality starting depth at CB and WR, but man, those are the 2 positions that we regularly lose guys to injuries.

Ask me again around 2 weeks before the trade deadline. If the Packers get off to a slow start and don't look like a legit Super Bowl team, then yeah, peeling off a few starters, where you have great depth, isn't a bad idea.

Now as the trade deadline nears and if the Packers ARE legit, but need say a quality player at another position, than maybe a trade for such player, for someone like Stokes, JA or a WR might make sense. However, I think most teams looking for players at the trade deadline are contenders and don't want to give up players, but future draft picks. So it might be the Packers looking to trade future picks for a quality player, in that scenario.

Gute seems to have a pretty good eye for spotting decent players that are sitting on other teams practice squads, so I wouldn't be surprised to see him improving the team during the season that way as well.

As @tynimiller and I discussed weeks ago, if Stokes does look like a real solid starter and the Packers don't resign him, they would probably get a 3rd round 2026 comp pick for losing him in Free Agency. Definitely not as good as getting a 2nd or 3rd round 2025 pick, but still something. So if keeping him for the 2nd half of the season and the playoffs is important, not trading him isn't a bad thing.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

Here I thought the kicking competition was down to Carson VS Joseph.

Appears that the Packers are bringing in Jonathan Garibay for a workout. Garibay played in the UFL this year with the Arlington Renegades after signing as an UDFA with the Cowboys in 2022. In the UFL, he went 13 of 14 on FG tries and was 3 for 3 from 40-49 yards, which was a distance Carlson struggled at (4 of 9).

Garibay also kicked a walk-off 62 yarder in college, when he played for Texas Tech.

"Garibay" in "Greenbay", has a nice ring to it.

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[Half Empty]

And to think that before Gute, we wasted how many top picks on DBs and they were at best journeymen?

However, to be fair, some were journeymen here but assets for the next team.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

However, to be fair, some were journeymen here but assets for the next team.

Hyde and Hayward are the 2 I think you are referring to? Both are currently free agents and Hayward hasn't played since Oct. of 2022. Wouldn't surprise me if both of their long and illustrious careers are over.

I agree that they had both played ok as Packers, but man they both really blossomed after leaving GB. That made losing them almost doubly worse. You invest the draft capital into them, don't resign them and they go on to have really productive years in the NFL. Whereas guys like Randall, Rollins, Dix, Jones, King, Jackson and maybe Savage, were all just wasted draft picks and high picks at that. We will see how Savage plays in Jacksonville, but the other guys, I think are all basically out of the NFL.

People always want to talk about the Love pick costing the Packers Super Bowls, but if you ask me, it was all the failed high picks that TT and Gute spent on DB's that was more to blame.

 

[OldSchool101]

Hyde and Hayward are the 2 I think you are referring to? Both are currently free agents and Hayward hasn't played since Oct. of 2022. Wouldn't surprise me if both of their long and illustrious careers are over.

I agree that they had both played ok as Packers, but man they both really blossomed after leaving GB. That made losing them almost doubly worse. You invest the draft capital into them, don't resign them and they go on to have really productive years in the NFL. Whereas guys like Randall, Rollins, Dix, Jones, King, Jackson and maybe Savage, were all just wasted draft picks and high picks at that. We will see how Savage plays in Jacksonville, but the other guys, I think are all basically out of the NFL.

People always want to talk about the Love pick costing the Packers Super Bowls, but if you ask me, it was all the failed high picks that TT and Gute spent on DB's that was more to blame.

Possibly some poor usage from Barry. Keep in mind if you shut down that last SF drive for a score and get a turnover on downs etc.

 

[OldSchool101]

I could see a trade at DB if we had a surprise. Like Kalen King coming out of nowhere and playing like a good starter while filling in rotation.

I will say Stokes thus far looks back to 100%. I realize it’s very early, but he has many reasons to put on a show. He’s going to get help from having a complete D around him AND not having to cover the WR1. Will also have a more solid rotation of Defensive Ends and sprinkling in some Safety or LB blitz. Pressure upfront and often will create a higher % of mistakes and that’s what he operated in Georgia. I won’t be surprised to see Wyatt begin to flourish. Like getting in that 7-9 sacks range from interior or some exchange of parallel pressure rate.

Now I like Valentine. But imo Stokes is a bigger and faster version of Valentine

 

[tynimiller]

Hyde and Hayward are the 2 I think you are referring to? Both are currently free agents and Hayward hasn't played since Oct. of 2022. Wouldn't surprise me if both of their long and illustrious careers are over.

I agree that they had both played ok as Packers, but man they both really blossomed after leaving GB. That made losing them almost doubly worse. You invest the draft capital into them, don't resign them and they go on to have really productive years in the NFL. Whereas guys like Randall, Rollins, Dix, Jones, King, Jackson and maybe Savage, were all just wasted draft picks and high picks at that. We will see how Savage plays in Jacksonville, but the other guys, I think are all basically out of the NFL.

People always want to talk about the Love pick costing the Packers Super Bowls, but if you ask me, it was all the failed high picks that TT and Gute spent on DB's that was more to blame.

I actually really like the idea of adding Hyde as a backup presence here if our young safeties are not playing to our liking and/or anything bad occurs to a guy.

 

[Poppa San]

Hyde and Hayward are the 2 I think you are referring to? Both are currently free agents and Hayward hasn't played since Oct. of 2022. Wouldn't surprise me if both of their long and illustrious careers are over.

I agree that they had both played ok as Packers, but man they both really blossomed after leaving GB. That made losing them almost doubly worse. You invest the draft capital into them, don't resign them and they go on to have really productive years in the NFL. Whereas guys like Randall, Rollins, Dix, Jones, King, Jackson and maybe Savage, were all just wasted draft picks and high picks at that. We will see how Savage plays in Jacksonville, but the other guys, I think are all basically out of the NFL.

People always want to talk about the Love pick costing the Packers Super Bowls, but if you ask me, it was all the failed high picks that TT and Gute spent on DB's that was more to blame.

Hyde was a 5th rd pick, not high IMO. Heyward was one we let get away though at the time we had some potential to replace him. That it didn't pan out was the kick in the ****.

 

[Thirteen Below]

Here I thought the kicking competition was down to Carson VS Joseph.

Appears that the Packers are bringing in Jonathan Garibay for a workout. Garibay played in the UFL this year with the Arlington Renegades after signing as an UDFA with the Cowboys in 2022. In the UFL, he went 13 of 14 on FG tries and was 3 for 3 from 40-49 yards, which was a distance Carlson struggled at (4 of 9).

That's not a very encouraging sign, 5 days before our first preseason game. It suggests to me that in the eyes of the coaches, nobody is really running away with it. What is this, the 6th kicker they've looked at? And they're still shopping?

I think what may be the most concerning to them is that they were hoping that Joseph and these other guys would put enough pressure on Carlson that he'd up his game and pull ahead of the others. Instead, it's the opposite - Carlson is banging just 82.5% (33 of 40), and it's Joseph who's pulling away. He's hit 36 of 40, for 90%.

Edit: at least 4, and I think 5 of his 6 whiffs have been in the 40-49 yard range, all wide to the left (although one did scuff the paint on the left upright) So in a way, that may be grounds fo optimism, because if I recall correctly there was no clear pattern to his misses - I at least recall that about 2/3 of the way through the season, he was just missing all over the place, no consistent pattern.

If Carlson doesn't make a big imnprovement in the next couple of weeks, I think Joseph is going be kicking off in Brazil.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

I actually really like the idea of adding Hyde as a backup presence here if our young safeties are not playing to our liking and/or anything bad occurs to a guy.

I really liked the idea of signing Hyde, before the draft. Now with Bullard, Williams and Oladapo the SS position is pretty full. I guess the questions are this.

1. If you sign Hyde, do you keep 6 safeties? Those 6 being Bullard, Williams, Oladapo, McKinney, Johnson and Hyde

2. If you are only keeping 5, who gets cut and hopefully slides to the PS? Oladapo is definitely a possibility. He just got on to the field and has to be way behind. However, he also might be a guy another team snags before the Packers can get him to the PS.

I like Hyde's experience and veteran leadership, I just don't think there is room on the roster for him, unless there is an injury of course.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

Hyde was a 5th rd pick, not high IMO. Heyward was one we let get away though at the time we had some potential to replace him. That it didn't pan out was the kick in the ****.

While I agree that not a lot of draft capital was lost (5th round pick) by not resigning Hyde, but keep in mind, they still had to find his replacement. That is why that whole situation, along with Hayward hurt the Packers. Had they used their crystal ball and kept those 2 players, they wouldn't have used all those 1st and 2nd round pics on what turned out to be duds.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

That's not a very encouraging sign, 5 days before our first preseason game. It suggests to me that in the eyes of the coaches, nobody is really running away with it. What is this, the 6th kicker they've looked at? And they're still shopping?

I think what may be the most concerning to them is that they were hoping that Joseph and these other guys would put enough pressure on Carlson that he'd up his game and pull ahead of the others. Instead, it's the opposite - Carlson is banging just 82.5% (33 of 40), and it's Joseph who's pulling away. He's hit 36 of 40, for 90%.

Edit: at least 4, and I think 5 of his 6 whiffs have been in the 40-49 yard range, all wide to the left (although one did scuff the paint on the left upright) So in a way, that may be grounds fo optimism, because if I recall correctly there was no clear pattern to his misses - I at least recall that about 2/3 of the way through the season, he was just missing all over the place, no consistent pattern.

If Carlson doesn't make a big imnprovement in the next couple of weeks, I think Joseph is going be kicking off in Brazil.

What is also a bit disconcerting to me is this. Every season it seems we hear something like: "The kicking unit (LS, holder, K) need more work. This is their first season as a unit and their timing is off." So if that is the case, how is that timing going to be when you have 2 LS and 5 or so Kickers working together at various parts of the summer?

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

I guess the Packers didn't workout a kicker yesterday, they worked out 3!

While Gute doesn't want to leave any stone unturned, that says something about the current kicking situation to me.

The 3 kickers were Jonathan Garibay, James McCourt and Andre Szmyt.

McCourt appears to be someone that has been "kicked around" the NFL over the last 2 seasons, but hasn't kicked a FG in a regular season game.

Szmyt is even greener. Was an UDFA of the Bears last year and didn't make it to the 1st preseason game before being waived. He kicked in the UFL this past year and was 19 of 21, missed coming at 40-49 and 50+.

 

[tynimiller]

I really liked the idea of signing Hyde, before the draft. Now with Bullard, Williams and Oladapo the SS position is pretty full. I guess the questions are this.

1. If you sign Hyde, do you keep 6 safeties? Those 6 being Bullard, Williams, Oladapo, McKinney, Johnson and Hyde

2. If you are only keeping 5, who gets cut and hopefully slides to the PS? Oladapo is definitely a possibility. He just got on to the field and has to be way behind. However, he also might be a guy another team snags before the Packers can get him to the PS.

I like Hyde's experience and veteran leadership, I just don't think there is room on the roster for him, unless there is an injury of course.

You outlined all which is why I said IF our young guys are not performing well OR an injury happens.

 

[Pkrjones]

The train on Micah Hyde has left the station, already. After season ending neck surgery in '22 he's said he'll either play 1 more season in Buffalo or retire. Gute will ride with youth, no need for re-tread vets... have plenty of vet leadership.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

You outlined all which is why I said IF our young guys are not performing well OR an injury happens.

I get that, but do you expect our young guys to be performing at a high level right out of the box? If they aren't, what do you do with them? Now if one gets injured and can be placed on IR, that protects them and would open up a "good" situation, where a guy like Hyde could be brought in. However, if its just that they need development, how do they get it? This is the "danger" of selecting 3 DB's in 1 draft, that on paper all play either a FS or SS. Can you get any of those guys to the PS without them getting poached before they land there? You can protect 4 PS members from being poached, but getting them there first, can be the big hurdle.

The good news, the Packers look to have lots of options at both SS and FS. As well as guys that can rotate into the slot. The DB room is probably looking the best that it has in years!

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

The train on Micah Hyde has left the station, already. After season ending neck surgery in '22 he's said he'll either play 1 more season in Buffalo or retire. Gute will ride with youth, no need for re-tread vets... have plenty of vet leadership.

I thought I heard that too.

But we all know, Micah would come back to play in GB and play for vet minimum, because EVERYONE loves GB!

 

[tynimiller]

I get that, but do you expect our young guys to be performing at a high level right out of the box? If they aren't, what do you do with them? Now if one gets injured and can be placed on IR, that protects them and would open up a "good" situation, where a guy like Hyde could be brought in. However, if its just that they need development, how do they get it? This is the "danger" of selecting 3 DB's in 1 draft, that on paper all play either a FS or SS. Can you get any of those guys to the PS without them getting poached before they land there? You can protect 4 PS members from being poached, but getting them there first, can be the big hurdle.

The good news, the Packers look to have lots of options at both SS and FS. As well as guys that can rotate into the slot. The DB room is probably looking the best that it has in years!

Oh I don't need high level stuff at all, but I do suspect out of our rooks we find a capable #2 starter type, but if we get hit with an injury in our next up depth or first up replacement continually falls short I won't wait for the season to slip and get a guy like Hyde. I'd be patient but not crazy patient if needed.