Packers trade Jayrone Elliott to Cowboys

[Deleted member 6794]

Seriously?? Sam Shields: Pro Bowler. Tramon Williams: Pro Bowler. Cullen Jenkins: Think we get to the SB without big man? Lane Taylor: Stepped right in when Sitton was let go and just got paid.

Laugh all you want about Brice and Allison. You seem to think every player has to be an All Pro or something. There are more than a handful of teams both those guys would start for and I feel both can and will have an impact on this team, this season. I think my work here is done...

G P G

There's absolutely no doubt that Thompson deserves credit for signing Sam Shields, Lane Taylor and Tramon Williams (technically he was signed as a street FA) in undrafted free agency but while you might be inclined to believe that the Packers have had a lot of success in this area you have to realize that the team hasn't been more successful than most other franchises.

FWIW Cullen Jenkins was actually brought in with Mike Sherman being the team's general manager.

 

[SoonerPack]

There's absolutely no doubt that Thompson deserves credit for signing Sam Shields, Lane Taylor and Tramon Williams (technically he was signed as a street FA) in undrafted free agency but while you might be inclined to believe that the Packers have had a lot of success in this area you have to realize that the team hasn't been more successful than most other franchises.

FWIW Cullen Jenkins was actually brought in with Mike Sherman being the team's general manager.

I believe Jenkins would fall into the category I was referring to which was WE, i.e. The Packers. I never specified which GM. So the Packers are middle of the road when it comes to hitting on UDFA's?

 

[Deleted member 6794]

I believe Jenkins would fall into the category I was referring to which was WE, i.e. The Packers. I never specified which GM. So the Packers are middle of the road when it comes to hitting on UDFA's?

I would have to dig a little bit deeper into the matter to make a truly fair evaluation but the Packers didn't gain any superstars out of undrafted free agency like other teams did in Tony Romo, Jason Peters, Wes Welker, James Harrison, Antonio Gates, Jeff Saturday, London Fletcher, Cameron Wake or Donald Penn to name a few.

 

[SoonerPack]

I would have to dig a little bit deeper into the matter to make a truly fair evaluation but the Packers didn't gain any superstars out of undrafted free agency like other teams did in Tony Romo, Jason Peters, Wes Welker, James Harrison, Antonio Gates, Jeff Saturday, London Fletcher, Cameron Wake or Donald Penn to name a few.

So it's the lack of a true "superstar" that formulates your argument. Each of the listed above came from separate teams so it's not as if one particular team is crushing it when it comes to picking the next great one from the UDFA pool. I am judging UDFA performance on what you get out of guys you didn't expect to get much out of or invest much in other than a few thousand dollars. I would say your examples are much more the exception than the rule and judging teams success in UDFA's solely on superstar status may not be the best way to gauge their effectiveness in this arena or lack-thereof. Per the usual, we are on differing sides of the argument. No shocker there... G P G !

 

[Deleted member 6794]

So it's the lack of a true "superstar" that formulates your argument. Each of the listed above came from separate teams so it's not as if one particular team is crushing it when it comes to picking the next great one from the UDFA pool. I am judging UDFA performance on what you get out of guys you didn't expect to get much out of or invest much in other than a few thousand dollars. I would say your examples are much more the exception than the rule and judging teams success in UDFA's solely on superstar status may not be the best way to gauge their effectiveness in this arena or lack-thereof. Per the usual, we are on differing sides of the argument. No shocker there... G P G !

There's absolutely no doubt that the players I mentioned are the rare exception to the rule. It was your claim that the Packers were more successful in undrafted free agency than most other teams in the league, one you haven't been able to support with any facts. FYI, if I remember correctly a total of 104 undrafted players started at least eight games in 2016 with only two having played for Green Bay in Lane Taylor and Ladarius Gunter.

 

[HardRightEdge]

I would have to dig a little bit deeper into the matter to make a truly fair evaluation but the Packers didn't gain any superstars out of undrafted free agency like other teams did in Tony Romo, Jason Peters, Wes Welker, James Harrison, Antonio Gates, Jeff Saturday, London Fletcher, Cameron Wake or Donald Penn to name a few.

Yeah, I think if you look at rosters across the league you'll find many UDFAs. It's basic math.

Teams average about 7.5 picks per year including comps. That means 240 drafted players come into camp each year whereas there are 1696 spots on 53 man rosters. If there no UDFAs playing, the league would need to be populated with 7 entire draft classes. The league does come close to that.

A lot of these UDFA guys cycle in and out of the league, in and out of PS, and in and out of rosters. If you look at the bottom of rosters where guys back up, play special teams or don't make the game day roster, they are fairly plentiful. They may not be THAT teams UDFA post-draft singings, but they are somebody's.

Teams that don't go in for free agency will have more, those that favor FA will have fewer.

Now. if one wants to look at UDFA stars, then go right ahead. As for the Packers, we're now going back to 2010 with Shields to find a "star". That's 7 years now. When you bring 25 to camp every year x 7 years = 175 opportunities, hitting on one looks like random chance.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

Seems like once you get out of about the 4th round, finding a quality player is pretty much "random chance". TT doesn't do much more than any other GM, by signing a bunch of UDFA's to fill the roster. What TT and the Packers may be doing, for the good or bad if it, is keeping more UDFA's either on the 53 or the PS than a lot of teams? I have no stats to prove that either way, nor do I follow the other 31 teams to be sure of it. However, its seems like at some point in the season, due to injuries or whatever, we are seeing an over reliance on UDFA's to be expected to step in and step up.

But I will go back to my original premise, I do like having multiple 7th round picks from the aspect of they basically give you the "pick of the litter" of players that most likely will be UDFA's and otherwise, free to sign with any team. What happens to them after they get to Green Bay, is pretty much a crap shoot. We have had some successes and some "failures"....really an UDFA isn't much of a failure, unless you hold on to them too long and having to rely on them ends of being a bad thing.

 

[SoonerPack]

There's absolutely no doubt that the players I mentioned are the rare exception to the rule. It was your claim that the Packers were more successful in undrafted free agency than most other teams in the league, one you haven't been able to support with any facts. FYI, if I remember correctly a total of 104 undrafted players started at least eight games in 2016 with only two having played for Green Bay in Lane Taylor and Ladarius Gunter.

You win bud. I am opening a new Allstate agency and combing through rosters just isn't in the cards right now so I will take your word on it. For the record: The Packers are middle of the road when it comes to UDFA success. Hit on some, lose on most. Now we can move on to our next disagreement...Good things. G P G!

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

You win bud. I am opening a new Allstate agency and combing through rosters just isn't in the cards right now so I will take your word on it. For the record: The Packers are middle of the road when it comes to UDFA success. Hit on some, lose on most. Now we can move on to our next disagreement...Good things. G P G!

Good luck with your new venture SP! Any chance you will steal AR away from State Farm?

 

[SoonerPack]

Good luck with your new venture SP! Any chance you will steal AR away from State Farm?

Thanks so much. This has been a dream of mine for a while so my buddy and I decided to go for it. Exciting times!

Hopefully we can get AR to make the switch at some point. AAARON ROOODGERS!!

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

Thanks so much. This has been a dream of mine for a while so my buddy and I decided to go for it. Exciting times!

Hopefully we can get AR to make the switch at some point. AAARON ROOODGERS!!

If AR isn't available, I believe Urkle is looking for work......can you imagine the policies he could sell! He doesn't have the Gold belt, but check out those gold suspenders!

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[AmishMafia]

If AR isn't available, I believe Urkle is looking for work......can you imagine the policies he could sell! He doesn't have the Gold belt, but check out those gold suspenders!

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That is your second time you are in here pimping Urkle for employment. Be honest, are you his dad?

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

That is your second time you are in here pimping Urkle for employment. Be honest, are you his dad?

Busted! Stevie was a good boy and has worked hard to hone his craft!

 

[SoonerPack]

If AR isn't available, I believe Urkle is looking for work......can you imagine the policies he could sell! He doesn't have the Gold belt, but check out those gold suspenders!

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I have reached out to his agent. I couldn't get the phone number but did get an email: [email protected]

WAAIIIITTTTT A MINUTE...

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

I have reached out to his agent. I couldn't get the phone number but did get an email: [email protected]

WAAIIIITTTTT A MINUTE...

You guys sniffed me out....damn it.....but you know what they say......"Family Matters!"

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[SoonerPack]

You guys sniffed me out....damn it.....but you know what they say......"Family Matters!"

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[Dantés]

Let's get this thread back on track fellas.

We need to discuss the trade of my son, Jaryonne Elliott, to the Dallas Cowboys.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

Let's get this thread back on track fellas.

We need to discuss the trade of my son, Jaryonne Elliott, to the Dallas Cowboys.

ummm sir....although we aren't suppose to point out smelling (intended) mistakes.....are you sure your son "Jaryonne" is a football player?

 

[Dantés]

ummm sir....although we aren't suppose to point out smelling (intended) mistakes.....are you sure your son "Jaryonne" is a football player?

You gonna sit there and tell me that I can't spell my own son's name?

 

[Deleted member 6794]

Seems like once you get out of about the 4th round, finding a quality player is pretty much "random chance". TT doesn't do much more than any other GM, by signing a bunch of UDFA's to fill the roster. What TT and the Packers may be doing, for the good or bad if it, is keeping more UDFA's either on the 53 or the PS than a lot of teams? I have no stats to prove that either way, nor do I follow the other 31 teams to be sure of it. However, its seems like at some point in the season, due to injuries or whatever, we are seeing an over reliance on UDFA's to be expected to step in and step up.

I believe the Packers either having kept more undrafted players on the 53 entering the season or promoted a higher amount of them during the season was a direct result of the team having signed less free agents than other clubs in the past.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

You gonna sit there and tell me that I can't spell my own son's name?

No, I am sure you were the National Spelling Bee Champion, right before winning the Heisman, getting drafted #1 and on your way to the HOF, did some Super Bowl GMing, coaching and also won the 4th season of Survivor, while writing a Best Selling Novel and having your first album go Diamond.

Sir....yes.....you can spell and sing....."Jaryonne" my wayward son........

 

[Dantés]

No, I am sure you were the National Spelling Bee Champion, right before winning the Heisman, getting drafted #1 and on your way to the HOF, did some Super Bowl GMing, coaching and also won the 4th season of Survivor, while writing a Best Selling Novel and having your first album go Diamond.

Sir....yes.....you can spell and sing....."Jaryonne" my wayward son........

Thank you for admitting that. That was very big of you.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

I believe the Packers either having kept more undrafted players on the 53 entering the season or promoted a higher amount of them during the season was a direct result of the team having signed less free agents than other clubs in the past.

Agreed and the ramifications of that decision reared their ugly head. The one benefit of the 2016 Season, since it's done and we can't change it, was that quite a few young guys and guys who needed it, got some valuable experience, especially in the secondary.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

Thank you for admitting that. That was very big of you.

I had to....for Gandhi is my father.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

Agreed and the ramifications of that decision reared their ugly head. The one benefit of the 2016 Season, since it's done and we can't change it, was that quite a few young guys and guys who needed it, got some valuable experience, especially in the secondary.

While that's definitely true I don't expect Gunter, who played the most snaps of any cornerback in 2016, to receive significant playing time going forward. The perceived starters in the Packers secondary entering this season didn't play a ton of snaps at the NFL level last season though.