Kevin King

[gbgary]

Kevin King...wasn't really missed lol. an illness. a body can't sustain itself on a diet of toast alone. him and Sullivan will fight it out for the who's getting the slot job. i'm guessing King but really who knows.

 

[pacmaniac]

I know it’s pure speculation. But if GB pulls off a win there. 65% We beat KC.
They were on a downward trajectory.
That’s the part that really hurts.

We get stubborn with certain players but I can assure you many teams would’ve pulled King long before that game (or at minimum, severely revised his snap count etc..)

Agree, last year was the one SB we missed out on that I'm confident we would have won in the Rodgers era.

 

[Favre>Rodgers259]

I'm late to the party, but as I pointed out in the "shoutbox" thread, had King been on Kittle instead of Sullivan for the 3-4 plays Kittle did make, I believe King takes away at least 2 of them, if not all 4. Kittle is fast for a TE, but I don't believe he threatens King. Sullivan is woefully slow for a corner, and his height doesn't lend him any flexibility to play on the boundary. Kittle bullied him every time, King would have had the length to battle in the very least.

I know there's a lot of hate for King, and he too frustrates me at times. But he might be able to earn a living as a big slot CB, either for the Packers or somewhere else. I get he's a 2nd Round Pick, but if he can be a big nickel or dime for another 3-5 years, it's not the value you wanted, but it can be the value you needed.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

Well I think that King knew He wasn’t capable of doing the job in SF. Not wishing anything bad if he was truly sick—— but what a coincidence!!!! Lol. At any rate He WAS NOT missed! Think He will be spending the year warming the bench for all that money He is making! I have high hopes for the young guy though!

Stokes definitely seems to be an upgrade over King on the outside but I would prefer King to line up in the slot on the majority of snaps over Sullivan.

 

[AmishMafia]

Packers CB Kevin King in league's concussion protocol

Packers CB Kevin King was diagnosed with a concussion after not feeling well and missing Sunday’s game against the 49ers.

packerswire.usatoday.com

Turns out King had a concussion during the Lions game. That is why he was out of the 49er game.

So maybe it occurred when he was putting on his helmet pregame and that explains his poor play . . .

It may also be a statement about King. That concussion symptoms: grogginess, confusion, and lack of focus; wasn't seen as unusual by teammates or coaches.

 

[Favre>Rodgers259]

Also, last game I don't think I saw Jean-Charles at all. He's clearly not ready if you ask me. I was quite intrigued that Gute drafted him as he is a carbon copy of Sullivan.....although I might give SJC the nod in physicality and Sullivan the nod on ball skills.

Although we did hang in there and get the W, the depth of the secondary is still questionable to say the least. Imagine where we would be without King on a full time basis?

 

[Pkrjones]

Imagine where we would be without King on a full time basis?

Ummm... not playing from a 7 point deficit due to his poor coverage?

 

[El Guapo]

King was a stop-gap signing until we find a better CB. Unfortunately, we didn't have many better options.

 

[Dantés]

King was a stop-gap signing until we find a better CB. Unfortunately, we didn't have many better options.

It's early, but it looks like we do have a better option, at least for the CB2 spot.

Per Pro Football Reference:

Kevin King: 6 targets, 5 completions, 153 yards, 25.5 Yd per target, 1 TD, 158.3 passer rating allowed.

Eric Stokes: 9 targets, 3 completions, 27 yards, 3.0 Yd per target, 1 TD, 79.4 passer rating allowed.

 

[El Guapo]

Sure, wouldn't argue with you 100%. However, when free agency started and we knew that we didn't have the money this year, definitely won't in 2022, and could not bank on drafting a starting CB, we were left with King. The wounds from the NFCCG were still fresh, but at least we knew what we did and didn't have with King. We had a talented CB with an injury history who gets toasted at times. He knew our defense and could bridge the gap until a better option came along....

Enter Eric Stokes

 

[Arod2gjdd]

It's early, but it looks like we do have a better option, at least for the CB2 spot.

Per Pro Football Reference:

Kevin King: 6 targets, 5 completions, 153 yards, 25.5 Yd per target, 1 TD, 158.3 passer rating allowed.

Eric Stokes: 9 targets, 3 completions, 27 yards, 3.0 Yd per target, 1 TD, 79.4 passer rating allowed.

When you put it like that...

 

[Pkrjones]

... and could not bank on drafting a starting CB,...

Enter Eric Stokes

Why not? Just a matter of do you trade up in round 1, take a CB in round 1 or 2. According to most draft experts and mocks there were 4-8 immediate-starting-caliber CB's (Surtain, Farley, Horn, Samuel, Newsome, Stokes, Melifonwu, Robinson). I think Gute didn't trust his scouts to find one. That $5Mil should've been spent much more wisely.

 

[gopkrs]

According to most draft experts and mocks there were 4-8 immediate-starting-caliber CB's

imho that does not really mean there will actually be that many even playing in 3 years. And 4 to 8 is a pretty dam big range.

 

[Pkrjones]

imho that does not really mean there will actually be that many even playing in 3 years. And 4 to 8 is a pretty dam big range.

Considering we've got the #6 rated QB (+/- 1) AND he's better than King not sure what your argument is? Gute also could've considered a trade-up for Newsome of Farley, or taken Samuel at 28. There were definitely starter-quality CB's in this draft within reach so no "need" to spend $5Mil on a known marginal-at-best CB, IMHO.

 

[El Guapo]

Why not? Just a matter of do you trade up in round 1, take a CB in round 1 or 2. According to most draft experts and mocks there were 4-8 immediate-starting-caliber CB's (Surtain, Farley, Horn, Samuel, Newsome, Stokes, Melifonwu, Robinson). I think Gute didn't trust his scouts to find one. That $5Mil should've been spent much more wisely.

Draft experts? Really?!? No such thing exists. There are tv personalities that get paid to make guesses without consequences.

If we ever have a GM that drafts players in any round expecting them to be Week 1 starters....then Houston we have a problem. Drafting for immediate help is a pipe dream and dangerous. People would have been raving mad on the internet if Gutekunst went into training camp with J'aire and a draft pick as the expected starter. There is no guarantee, and that's why you lay out the Kevin King safety net.

 

[Pkrjones]

Draft experts? Really?!? No such thing exists. There are tv personalities that get paid to make guesses without consequences.

If we ever have a GM that drafts players in any round expecting them to be Week 1 starters....then Houston we have a problem. Drafting for immediate help is a pipe dream and dangerous. People would have been raving mad on the internet if Gutekunst went into training camp with J'aire and a draft pick as the expected starter. There is no guarantee, and that's why you lay out the Kevin King safety net.

You mean like Gute did with OC? Yes, we had other options for OC but the job was Myers' to lose from day 1. Other good teams are starting rookie CB's (Samuel, Melifonwu, Surtain), why is that a taboo idea for GB? If any player is expected to start early in their career it should be your 1st rounder with the highest chance.

 

[PikeBadger]

I personally wouldn't call it a taboo idea, but an option that is certainly less appealing than having an experienced NFL corner starting in game 1 of the season.

 

[Pkrjones]

Not that PFF is THE pinnacle of statistical accuracy or THE expert opinion...but King was ranked 134th best CB in 2020. 134!!!!...and he got $5Mil to come back because, God forbid, we may have to play a rookie? 134!!!

 

[gopkrs]

Not that PFF is THE pinnacle of statistical accuracy or THE expert opinion...but King was ranked 134th best CB in 2020. 134!!!!...and he got $5Mil to come back because, God forbid, we may have to play a rookie? 134!!!

So you say PFF is not great and go on to use their analysis to say the King signing was bad. For me, most of these stats and analysis are for fantasy players. And that is not the same thing as running a football team. Yes you can gleam some info out of them. But hell, I'm a fan. And I watch The Pack really close. Other teams not nearly as much.

 

[OldSchool101]

Not that PFF is THE pinnacle of statistical accuracy or THE expert opinion...but King was ranked 134th best CB in 2020. 134!!!!...and he got $5Mil to come back because, God forbid, we may have to play a rookie? 134!!!

One has to wonder why his drop in production from 2019 to last season
Of course GB made it known that they weren’t going idle at Perimeter CB as they used lots of draft capital to get his replacement. Im Wondering if the plan was all along to move him inside? It’s appearing more and more like King was put there as an insurance policy to his successor, until they could ramp Stokes up.
As others have said, I’m just not convinced we give up on him altogether, he has shown flashes of potential in downhill run support and I think he’s sn upgrade over Sullivan. Ok maybe not $5mil worth but it is what it is. King could be an average to above average #3, but the #2 is going to get picked on when you’ve got one of the best CB in the league opposite.

 

[AmishMafia]

So you say PFF is not great and go on to use their analysis to say the King signing was bad. For me, most of these stats and analysis are for fantasy players. And that is not the same thing as running a football team. Yes you can gleam some info out of them. But hell, I'm a fan. And I watch The Pack really close. Other teams not nearly as much.

PFF is a guide not a rule. Its a mathematical process and hould always be taken with a grain of salt. But the point is, he wasn't in the top 50. Or the top 100. Even if the rankings are off 20%, he is still out of the top 100. That means if talent was evenly spread throughout the NFL outside of the Packers, King would be the 4th CB on most teams and 5th on 7 teams.

And yet he is our #2 (in more ways than one).

 

[gopkrs]

PFF is a guide not a rule. Its a mathematical process and hould always be taken with a grain of salt. But the point is, he wasn't in the top 50. Or the top 100. Even if the rankings are off 20%, he is still out of the top 100. That means if talent was evenly spread throughout the NFL outside of the Packers, King would be the 4th CB on most teams and 5th on 7 teams.

And yet he is our #2 (in more ways than one).

He will be playing another position and that should make a difference. imho

 

[AmishMafia]

He will be playing another position and that should make a difference. imho

I hope so. I had high hopes for the guy. I know he can play at a high level, I have seen him do it. But those moments where he loses his focus, it's bad.

 

[milani]

You mean like Gute did with OC? Yes, we had other options for OC but the job was Myers' to lose from day 1. Other good teams are starting rookie CB's (Samuel, Melifonwu, Surtain), why is that a taboo idea for GB? If any player is expected to start early in their career it should be your 1st rounder with the highest chance.

Although many of those first year starters did start but turned out to be busts in the long run over our history of the last 4 decades.

 

[El Guapo]

Starting a rookie is not taboo if that is your only option. Gute drafted Myers but still has two guys in Jenkins and Patrick that can snap the ball, which proves my point. Ideally you don’t draft a rookie and make him your only option at a position.

We all agree that Stokes has turned out to be better than King, but going into the season without a safety net would have been foolish at any position.