Fire Capers

[Deleted member 6794]

If players are being coached correctly and still can't understand these things, then the player isn't very coachable/talented or the coach needs to find a new way to teach them.

If players are being coached correctly and still make mistakes like the Packers defense then those guys aren't talented enough to play in the NFL. It will be of utter importance to truly evaluate the reasons behind them messing up consistently.

 

[HardRightEdge]

When you put 90 % of your eggs in the draft and development basket and your drafts are subpar them it's time to go play golf.

Funny you should say that. I did a quick check here before heading to the course myself!

This fall weather in Buffalo is exceptional; we must enjoy it while we can.

 

[PackerDNA]

How quickly we forget just last season, when the defense was good, to fit a narrative. Or how about early this year, when the defense was playing decently despite injuries and the offense couldn't do anything and the OFFENSE was why the team was losing games? Whole coaching staff needs to go, considering that with the players available, the offensive staff is doing FAR worse than the defensive coaches.

If they're up against subpar offences and 3rd string QB's, they look good. Otherwise, incompetent.

 

[PackerDNA]

Funny you should say that. I did a quick check here before heading to the course myself!

This fall weather in Buffalo is exceptional; we must enjoy it while we can.

Still having good weather in Buffalo in mid November? That is a surprise.

 

[PackAttack12]

If they're up against subpar offences and 3rd string QB's, they look good. Otherwise, incompetent.

Yeah, in games where we've given up 27 or more - Stafford, Prescott, Ryan, Luck, Mariota

In games we've given up less than 27 - Bortles, Badford, She-li, collection of Chicago crap,

 

[PikeBadger]

While I agree with your assessment on those 2 particular plays, some of that is actually coaching. While the coaches can't physically make the plays on the field, that is up to the players, the coaches are the ones responsible for teaching these guys their assignments, techniques, etc. If players are being coached correctly and still can't understand these things, then the player isn't very coachable/talented or the coach needs to find a new way to teach them. This growing epidemic of missed assignments, missed tackles, dropped passes, missed throws, etc also leads me to believe that a good portion of this is mental preparation before and during a game and somewhere along the line, coaches and players aren't doing that.

The overall play of the veterans on this team has been very spotty and inconsistent. Very disappointed in the apparent lack of on-field leadership. They and the coaching staff have allowed this all to turn into a four alarm conflagration. Starting to look like a completely lost season though I still hold out hope if we can quickly get some of our injured starters back and someone takes charge inside that locker room. The Vikings are in free fall as well and I still hold out hope that the Lions will be the Lions we all know and love. If we can get about 5-6 guys back from injury and things slowly start coming back together, who knows? Seattle still has potential injury issues and Dallas's defense is thin in depth. I'm still going to hope for the best and not rule out a miraculous late season turnaround.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

If players are being coached correctly and still make mistakes like the Packers defense then those guys aren't talented enough to play in the NFL. It will be of utter importance to truly evaluate the reasons behind them messing up consistently.

I totally agree with this, especially the last part that I underlined. When one player makes a glaring mistake, one such as what Whitehead made on the opening kickoff against the Colts, it's a pretty easy thing to say "ok, this guy just doesn't have the fundamentals down, back to basics for him". But when a whole team, including vets., are making mistakes over an extended period of time, you really have to take a long hard look at the coaches. We all know what this group of 53 is capable of, especially the corp players and IMO their poor play over this long extended period isn't because they lack talent.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

The overall play of the veterans on this team has been very spotty and inconsistent. Very disappointed in the apparent lack of on-field leadership. They and the coaching staff have allowed this all to turn into a four alarm conflagration. Starting to look like a completely lost season though I still hold out hope if we can quickly get some of our injured starters back and someone takes charge inside that locker room. The Vikings are in free fall as well and I still hold out hope that the Lions will be the Lions we all know and love. If we can get about 5-6 guys back from injury and things slowly start coming back together, who knows? Seattle still has potential injury issues and Dallas's defense is thin in depth. I'm still going to hope for the best and not rule out a miraculous late season turnaround.

Optimistic thinking for sure and I have shared that same feeling as well. But I am beginning to think there are too many "ifs" that have to happen and aren't happening for this to turn itself around. It all started last year with "IF Jordy hadn't gotten hurt" and has kind of snowballed into becoming our new anthem. Picking up new IF's almost on a weekly basis.

 

[HardRightEdge]

Still having good weather in Buffalo in mid November? That is a surprise.

Mid-to-high 50's this week capped off with high 60's this coming Friday. Then the string runs out.

 

[Poppa San]

High mid-to-high 50's this week capped off with high 60's this coming Friday. Then the string runs out.

Will you just STOP bringing sunshine and warm feelings into a thread devoted to *****ing and moaning?

 

[HardRightEdge]

Will you just STOP bringing sunshine and warm feelings into a thread devoted to *****ing and moaning?

My apologies. I got the pique out of my system earlier in the week. Anyway, how many more ways are there to say "fire Capers!"

 

[Poppa San]

My apologies. I got the pique out of my system earlier in the week. Anyway, how many more ways are there to say "fire Capers!"

abschütteln Capers
kvitte seg med Capers
Ondoa Capers
liberarsi di Capers
zbaviť sa Capers
thoát khỏi Capers
--I ran out of patience googling it but I know there are quite a few --

 

[HardRightEdge]

abschütteln Capers
kvitte seg med Capers
Ondoa Capers
liberarsi di Capers
zbaviť sa Capers
thoát khỏi Capers
--I ran out of patience googling it but I know there are quite a few --

I guess Elizabeth Barrett Browning got it wrong. I've made adjustments where necessary.

How do I fire thee? Let me count the ways.
I fire thee to the depth and breadth and height
My soul can reach, when feeling out of sight
For the ends of Being and ideal Grace.
I fire thee to the level of everyday's
Most quiet need, by sun and candle-light.
I fire thee freely, as men strive for Right;
I fire thee purely, as they turn from Praise.
I fire thee with a passion put to use
In my old griefs, and with my childhood's faith.
I fire thee with a love I seemed to lose
With my lost saints, --- I fire thee with the breath,
Smiles, tears, of all my life! --- and, if God choose,
I shall but fire thee better after death.

 

[HardRightEdge]

Or maybe just an old fashioned exorcism:

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[Deleted member 6794]

abschütteln Capers

Trust me, you don't want to abschütteln Capers.

 

[easyk83]

Let's not forget folks Capers has a track record. Brilliant initial success then a complete collapse in his unit. How is it that Capers was able to field a top flight defense in 2010 but has been unable to replicate that success of late?

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

I think the most frustrating part of the Defense and its issues for me has been the amount of resources put towards it via the draft and its apparent lack of improvement. In 2012, our first 6 picks were on Defense. Only 2 guys are still on the team (Perry(1) and Daniels (4)). Every draft since then has seen our #1 pick go to a defensive player. Considering the talent that was already on Defense at the time of this push to improve it, the results are pathetic. Not only has the defense not improved, but as a result, IMO the offense has suffered from lack of high picks being used to improve it. Starting last year we are now beginning to feel the effects of not having any new player on the offense that was picked higher then 53rd (Adams) since 2010 when Bulaga was chosen in the first round. Bulaga and AR are the only 2 Packers on offense that were chosen in the first round.

 

[Un4GivN]

Let's not forget folks Capers has a track record. Brilliant initial success then a complete collapse in his unit. How is it that Capers was able to field a top flight defense in 2010 but has been unable to replicate that success of late?

Pretty easy to answer....

These guys never played a full season for Green Bay after that

Cullin Jenkins - in there with Raji was huge. Never had 2 dominant players there again.
Nick Collins - People forget this guy was on his way to hall of fame career.
Nick Barnett - Better than anything we have now. Not completely dominant but above average.

These played the best seasons of their careers that year.

Tramon Williams - In his prime playing out of his mind
Charles Woodson - Should have been DPOY, was better than Polamalu. Maybe the best year of a HoF career.

The defense was just much more complete in that year. We never replaces Nick Collins with a player of that caliber in the years since at any position in the secondary. HaHa and Burnett combined don't do as much for the team as Collins did on his own.

People haven't wanted to face this, but the defense just isn't all that talented... Plus they are either not smart or not coached well because they never seem like they know what their assignment is. Too hard to tell which it is from the outside.

The one thing I do know, is no defensive scheme of the face of the earth, has cornerbacks that are 10 yards off of their assignments... I'm sure the scheme is solid, but whether it is being coached to a way that the players understand. That's another story.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

Pretty easy to answer....

These guys never played a full season for Green Bay after that

Cullin Jenkins - in there with Raji was huge. Never had 2 dominant players there again.
Nick Collins - People forget this guy was on his way to hall of fame career.
Nick Barnett - Better than anything we have now. Not completely dominant but above average.

These played the best seasons of their careers that year.

Tramon Williams - In his prime playing out of his mind
Charles Woodson - Should have been DPOY, was better than Polamalu. Maybe the best year of a HoF career.

The defense was just much more complete in that year. We never replaces Nick Collins with a player of that caliber in the years since at any position in the secondary. HaHa and Burnett combined don't do as much for the team as Collins did on his own.

People haven't wanted to face this, but the defense just isn't all that talented... Plus they are either not smart or not coached well because they never seem like they know what their assignment is. Too hard to tell which it is from the outside.

The one thing I do know, is no defensive scheme of the face of the earth, has cornerbacks that are 10 yards off of their assignments... I'm sure the scheme is solid, but whether it is being coached to a way that the players understand. That's another story.

Good assessment and Burnett and Matthews are the only 2 defensive players from 2010 that are still with the team. Even with all the draft picks we have thrown at the defense, as well as FA signings of Peppers and Guion, we have struggled with talent, execution and depth. So either Teddy doesn't know what he is doing or the coaches don't know how to coach.

 

[Sunshinepacker]

If they're up against subpar offences and 3rd string QB's, they look good. Otherwise, incompetent.

So you're saying that the Packer's defense isn't as good against good offenses?? Not to be argumentative but that's true of all but maybe 2-3 defenses in the NFL.

The Giants aren't actually a bad offense but the Packer held them to 221 total yards in week 5.

And here's the kicker...the Packers held the Falcons to their second lowest yardage total of the season; the Packer's defense gave up a grand total of only 5 more yards than the Seahawks (and the Packers were on the road while the Seahawks were at home). I know facts can ruin the narrative and it's really easy to focus on the most recent week and forget the rest of the season, but the Packers defense hasn't been nearly as bad as people want to claim. Now, Capers has been putting together the pass defense with duct tape and bailing wire so perhaps the league has figured out how to exploit a defense that is severely lacking in talent at every level. Now that CM3 is out we can finally see that Perry really isn't anything that offenses need to worry about and Mike Daniels is literally the only player on the defense who anyone would rank as "very good" for his position.

 

[Un4GivN]

Good assessment and Burnett and Matthews are the only 2 defensive players from 2010 that are still with the team. Even with all the draft picks we have thrown at the defense, as well as FA signings of Peppers and Guion, we have struggled with talent, execution and depth. So either Teddy doesn't know what he is doing or the coaches don't know how to coach.

I agree... There have been too many top of the draft misses. And while it didn't immediately impact the team, the more veterans that leave we get to see what these highly drafted players amounted to in their 3rd 4th 5th seasons. And overall it is very underwhelming.

That is the bad side of draft and develop. If you miss for years, you don't see the consequences till later. But they can be brutal when piece by piece those players have to start.

 

[PackerDNA]

So you're saying that the Packer's defense isn't as good against good offenses?? Not to be argumentative but that's true of all but maybe 2-3 defenses in the NFL.

The Giants aren't actually a bad offense but the Packer held them to 221 total yards in week 5.

And here's the kicker...the Packers held the Falcons to their second lowest yardage total of the season; the Packer's defense gave up a grand total of only 5 more yards than the Seahawks (and the Packers were on the road while the Seahawks were at home). I know facts can ruin the narrative and it's really easy to focus on the most recent week and forget the rest of the season, but the Packers defense hasn't been nearly as bad as people want to claim. Now, Capers has been putting together the pass defense with duct tape and bailing wire so perhaps the league has figured out how to exploit a defense that is severely lacking in talent at every level. Now that CM3 is out we can finally see that Perry really isn't anything that offenses need to worry about and Mike Daniels is literally the only player on the defense who anyone would rank as "very good" for his position.

I'm saying it's a paper tiger- that after you get past the smoke and mirrors, it's not a good defense at all.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

I agree... There have been too many top of the draft misses. And while it didn't immediately impact the team, the more veterans that leave we get to see what these highly drafted players amounted to in their 3rd 4th 5th seasons. And overall it is very underwhelming.

That is the bad side of draft and develop. If you miss for years, you don't see the consequences till later. But they can be brutal when piece by piece those players have to start.

Agreed and as I posted elsewhere, by using so many top picks as well as the sheer numbers of picks since 2012 on the defense, we are seeing how it has affected the talent (lack of) on offense.

 

[Sunshinepacker]

I'm saying it's a paper tiger- that after you get past the smoke and mirrors, it's not a good defense at all.

And yet the actual play of the defense, prior to the past two weeks, has actually been pretty good considering the players the team was fielding. Is calling something a "paper tiger" a way of excusing actual performance from early in the season so that we can only focus on two games?

 

[PackerDNA]

And yet the actual play of the defense, prior to the past two weeks, has actually been pretty good considering the players the team was fielding. Is calling something a "paper tiger" a way of excusing actual performance from early in the season so that we can only focus on two games?

No, it's focusing on their overall performance for some time now and their overall lack of talent and impact players.