Bears studs n duds

[Magooch]

Tonyan just seems limited this year. Catches the ball well, but man he just can't seem to do anything with the ball afterwards. Can't run away from anyone and doesn't break any tackles. He's pretty much just tackled where he catches it.

They cannot seem to get him in space. Is he half a step slower from that ACL? Seemed like he was more open as a rookie. Maybe not having as many other weapons to cover defenses can give him more attention.

I kind of just get the sense that he's a guy who needs to be "schemed open" and not really one who can "make his own plays" if you know what I mean.
And of course that becomes more difficult when you don't have as many weapons and/or as many threats for defenses to respect.
Maybe he has slowed down a bit due to injury though, I don't know. I would agree that we're having a hard time getting him open and getting him the ball...but would also agree that when he *does* get it, it feels like there's absolutely nothing to be done with it.

Just for comparison however...

2020 (Breakout 11 TD season): 52 rec / 586 yards (11.3 yards/rec, 9.9 yards/target), 4.3 yards after contact per rec, 7.7 yards average depth of target
2022: 45 rec / 372 yards (8.3 yards/rec, 6.6 yards/target), 4.4 yards after contact per rep, 5.4 yards average depth of target

 

[BrokenArrow]

I continue to be impressed with Watson. It seems like he is getting more comfortable out there.

I think if not for the early injuries and if Watson had been able to fully participate in training camp and played the whole season he would be in position to smash Randy Moss's rookie records.

 

[lambeaulambo]

Studs:

Watson - speed kills, and he has it.

Dillon - looked like he did last year for most of the year. Chi D was gassed and he put the pedal down.

Cobb - for not waving his arms being wide open the entire 2nd half.

Buggy - for at least watching part of the game while in full focus of a looming disaster in Qatar.

Duds:

Jaire - EqSB cooked him. Taking plays off and peeking into the backfield instead of covering for the majority of the game. The pick was well played though.

Edge Rushers - losing contain and not staying home. Clay Matthews used to be notorious for the same play.

All in all, it wasnt a stink bowl but glad to see this team still has some fight. I didn't see any of our players eating hot dogs on the bench which is a plus. Here is to the all time leading nfl franchise in wins. I will do a shot of nyquil for good measure.

 

[swhitset]

I would be curious to see what the analytics/data said the probabilities were.

I guess one way of looking at it is that arguably the worst-case scenario if we go for two and fail is that we end up tying and going to OT. Being up 7 if we failed the 2pt conversion I really doubt that Chicago would go for the win and go for two if they had scored. I think they would almost certainly take the 1pt and tie it up there, but who knows.

Guess you pretty much just have to ask what is more likely:

1. We convert the 2 pt and go up 9 and make it a two possession game
2. We attempt the 2pt and fail, we're up 7 and Chicago can tie with a TD+PAT or potentially go ahead with a TD+2PT
3. We convert the 1pt and go up 8 and Chicago need to score and convert 2pt to tie
4. We attempt the 1pt and fail, same outcome as (#2)

I suspect that LaFleur was probably not terribly confident in our defense at that point and if that's the case it does make more sense to try and force them to score on two separate possessions

For the record… im fine with the decisions they made..
but frankly, it might have been better for Watson to kneel down at the 1 yard line instead of scoring.

 

[PackAttack12]

Tonyan just seems limited this year. Catches the ball well, but man he just can't seem to do anything with the ball afterwards. Can't run away from anyone and doesn't break any tackles. He's pretty much just tackled where he catches it.

I don't think he completely trusts that ACL yet. You can tell he's playing it a little safe.

 

[Heyjoe4]

Studs are the Bears for still sucking.

It's amazing isn't it. All those years when Cutler was our MVP and they still suck.

Then again I remember the 70s and 80s, Ditka, the Refrigerator, and #34. So the last 30 years has been great payback. (Although I still like Walter Payton.)

 

[Heyjoe4]

I don't think he completely trusts that ACL yet. You can tell he's playing it a little safe.

It really can take two years to recover from an ACL because of the physical and psychological trauma. First year is physical recovery - a LOT of hard work. First year back is full of concern that it didn't heal properly and a second tear is coming. Third year should be ok.

But Tonyan had one great year, one injured year, and this year. The whole team pretty much sucks with the exception of Jones, so I say wait another year (but take ND's Mayer if he's there in round 1 when they pick).

 

[Heyjoe4]

To me it's still the tale of 2 halves. Either they play well in the first and lousy in the 2nd. Or lousy in the first and much better in the 2nd.

I continue to be impressed with Watson. It seems like he is getting more comfortable out there.

When Doubs comes back if he can pick up where he led off, we could have some good receivers.

I only remember Rodgers throwing to Tonyon once. I wish they would incorporate him a little more.

I thought that both RBs played well. But it looked like Jones was fighting through some injury.

All in all a great way to enter the Bye.

Jones was definitely hurting. He kept playing, but Dillon saved the run game for a change. Hopefully Jones gets better with the bye.

 

[Heyjoe4]

For the record… im fine with the decisions they made..
but frankly, it might have been better for Watson to kneel down at the 1 yard line instead of scoring.

They were only up 20-19 when Watson scored, right? I don't remember how much time was left or how many TOs the Bears had. It must have been around 2 or 3 minutes left. I think even a veteran receiver takes the TD there.

I understand your point. I still think it's better he scored. And imagine the adrenaline rush he was on.......

 

[Magooch]

I would wager it's perhaps one of those "intangibles" situations. Analytics/data might tell you the "right" move (at least as it relates to that specific game's win percentage) is to go down and run out the clock but at the same time I could see it where scoring a big-moment TD against your rivals as a rookie could very well be an important step for Watson's confidence, development, etc. Both outcomes may have ultimately got us the win, one might've been "safer" than the other but I'm glad he got another score logged; big-picture I might suspect that to be the more beneficial course of action when it comes to player-development.

 

[OldSchool101]

I would wager it's perhaps one of those "intangibles" situations. Analytics/data might tell you the "right" move (at least as it relates to that specific game's win percentage) is to go down and run out the clock but at the same time I could see it where scoring a big-moment TD against your rivals as a rookie could very well be an important step for Watson's confidence, development, etc. Both outcomes may have ultimately got us the win, one might've been "safer" than the other but I'm glad he got another score logged; big-picture I might suspect that to be the more beneficial course of action when it comes to player-development.

Yeah, that goes with the concept of staying with the flow of the game. Watson and Dillon (and #12) were tearing up the field pretty good.

I was surprised the passing game was working so well on either side. There was one clip where it looked like a 15MpH driving wind, which also makes the cold bite a little more.

 

[Heyjoe4]

I would wager it's perhaps one of those "intangibles" situations. Analytics/data might tell you the "right" move (at least as it relates to that specific game's win percentage) is to go down and run out the clock but at the same time I could see it where scoring a big-moment TD against your rivals as a rookie could very well be an important step for Watson's confidence, development, etc. Both outcomes may have ultimately got us the win, one might've been "safer" than the other but I'm glad he got another score logged; big-picture I might suspect that to be the more beneficial course of action when it comes to player-development.

Agreed. And it might have been different in a playoff game, a SB. But two teams likely going nowhere decided to give their fans a very spirited game. I know they get paid well to do that. It's still good to see that rivalries, especially this rivalry between the two most winning teams in football, still survives.

 

[swhitset]

They were only up 20-19 when Watson scored, right? I don't remember how much time was left or how many TOs the Bears had. It must have been around 2 or 3 minutes left. I think even a veteran receiver takes the TD there.

I understand your point. I still think it's better he scored. And imagine the adrenaline rush he was on.......

The clock was under 2 minutes… Rodgers even said that he asked Lefleur right before running the play if he wanted a kneel down or a score …. So it was definitely on the table .

 

[Heyjoe4]

The clock was under 2 minutes… Rodgers even said that he asked Lefleur right before running the play if he wanted a kneel down or a score …. So it was definitely on the table .

That's interesting. They were in field goal range, meaning the Bears would've needed a TD. But they could have kneeled and run the clock down for that. I'm happy with the way it turned out.

 

[milani]

That's interesting. They were in field goal range, meaning the Bears would've needed a TD. But they could have kneeled and run the clock down for that. I'm happy with the way it turned out.

I guess when you are 4-8 you need to have some fun somehow.

 

[Heyjoe4]

I guess when you are 4-8 you need to have some fun somehow.

That's what I'm thinking. And it made Rodgers' salute more interesting.

 

[pacmaniac]

The way I think about it is if you miss the two; they tie it easily. If you make the one; they have to get a TD and a two. Yes, it is basically over if you make the two; but it is like flipping a coin on making it. Just seems smarter to me to take the one. But it worked out.

Agree. Not only does failing to make the 2-point conversion make it easy for the Bears to tie the game, but more and more teams are going for 2 at the end to win the game instead of going to overtime. Not like the Bears are making the playoffs, so they might as well go for it. What are the chances Joe Barry would stop the Bears last second 2-point conversion attempt?

 

[Deleted member 6794]

The way I think about it is if you miss the two; they tie it easily. If you make the one; they have to get a TD and a two. Yes, it is basically over if you make the two; but it is like flipping a coin on making it. Just seems smarter to me to take the one. But it worked out.

I definitely prefer them going for the dagger in such situations. Of course it could have gone wrong but I like the mentality of being aggressive.

I would say Alexander redeemed himself with a big interception.

Alexander is the highest paid cornerback in the league. There's no excuse for giving up two long completions against receivers like EQ and Harry.

It would have been a huge issue against a better opponent.

For the record… im fine with the decisions they made..
but frankly, it might have been better for Watson to kneel down at the 1 yard line instead of scoring.

I'm fine with that decision as well as the Bears still had all of their timeouts remaining.

That's interesting. They were in field goal range, meaning the Bears would've needed a TD. But they could have kneeled and run the clock down for that. I'm happy with the way it turned out.

As mentioned above, the Packers wouldn't have been able to run the clock down as the Bears had all of their timeouts remaining.

That's what I'm thinking. And it made Rodgers' salute more interesting.

Up until Sunday I was convinced Rodgers would return for next season. But that salute for sure looked like him saying goodbye to the fans at Soldier Field.

 

[Heyjoe4]

Agree. Not only does failing to make the 2-point conversion make it easy for the Bears to tie the game, but more and more teams are going for 2 at the end to win the game instead of going to overtime. Not like the Bears are making the playoffs, so they might as well go for it. What are the chances Joe Barry would stop the Bears last second 2-point conversion attempt?

The Packers have consistently broken our collective heart in the playoffs. The worst for me, and one that will be hard to top, was the loss in the 2014 NFCCG against the Seahags.

But that playoff loss to the Niners in 2021 is up there. Playing at home in nasty winter conditions and a bunch of guys from CA come to GB and win without scoring an offensive TD. And I agree, Rodgers had plenty of chances. It did come down to STs but it never should have gotten to that. That loss still hurts. Well, they all do......

 

[gopkrs]

Up until Sunday I was convinced Rodgers would return for next season. But that salute for sure looked like him saying goodbye to the fans at Soldier Field.

I thought it was simply saying that we won again and the game's over

 

[Schultz]

I would be curious to see what the analytics/data said the probabilities were.

I guess one way of looking at it is that arguably the worst-case scenario if we go for two and fail is that we end up tying and going to OT. Being up 7 if we failed the 2pt conversion I really doubt that Chicago would go for the win and go for two if they had scored. I think they would almost certainly take the 1pt and tie it up there, but who knows.

Guess you pretty much just have to ask what is more likely:

1. We convert the 2 pt and go up 9 and make it a two possession game
2. We attempt the 2pt and fail, we're up 7 and Chicago can tie with a TD+PAT or potentially go ahead with a TD+2PT
3. We convert the 1pt and go up 8 and Chicago need to score and convert 2pt to tie
4. We attempt the 1pt and fail, same outcome as (#2)

I suspect that LaFleur was probably not terribly confident in our defense at that point and if that's the case it does make more sense to try and force them to score on two separate possessions

To me it all came down to did MLF believe GB had a better chance of converting a 2pter or in stopping a 2pter.

 

[milani]

To me it all came down to did MLF believe GB had a better chance of converting a 2pter or in stopping a 2pter.

The scenario is what determines the decision. You have a 4-8 vs. a 3-9 team. You are up against a banged up, talent depleted defense who let the Jets destroy them. And it is the Bears, one of the few teams in the league who tend to be good to us year after year. And we have so little if anything to lose. So have some fun.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

I thought it was simply saying that we won again and the game's over

Possibly, but for some reason I had a different impression about it.

 

[Heyjoe4]

I thought it was simply saying that we won again and the game's over

Are you referring to Rodgers' salute? Yeah I didn't read much into it. It was a classy way to say "I still own you all."

The scenario is what determines the decision. You have a 4-8 vs. a 3-9 team. You are up against a banged up, talent depleted defense who let the Jets destroy them. And it is the Bears, one of the few teams in the league who tend to be good to us year after year. And we have so little if anything to lose. So have some fun.

Yeah it was more like practice for a 2 pt conversion than a necessity.

 

[milani]

Are you referring to Rodgers' salute? Yeah I didn't read much into it. It was a classy way to say "I still own you all."

Yeah it was more like practice for a 2 pt conversion than a necessity.

Yes. It was. But hey. Even if the Bears watched the film of the Giant game in which Rodgers ran virtually the same play to Mad Dog for a TD they STILL would not know how to cover it.