2023 Tyni's Prospect Thread

[tynimiller]

Agree and those first round QB's are the reason that those top 4 or 5 picks are very valuable, some teams are willing to give away the farm for a shot at one of those QB's. If Rodgers is going to get traded, I just don't see the Colts giving up the #4 pick for him, since that might be giving up one of the top 2 QB's or trading back themselves. The other "fun" think about this years draft, 4 out of the next 5 picks after the Colts (#5-#9), are by QB hungry teams, that also might be wanting to move up to snag one. If they can't and their QB is gone, Gute might get a phone call from say Atlanta, asking if they will trade Rodgers for the 8th pick.

Okay so didn't want to go nuts but operated a "what if trade back" like you eluded to and wanted quick thoughts. Won't elaborate a ton on each prospect but let's say Jets trade for Rodgers we get the #13, their 4th (#112) + conditional futures.

#13 - Traded back out of it with Carolina who moved up to grab Richardson (which is not crazy unrealistic but a stretch as I don't see Richardson falling but some say may depending where Carr / Rodgers / Brady / Jimmy G go). Carolina gave us their 2nd (#39) their 3rd (#93) and 2nd in 2024 for our #15 / 7th (#244) and 2024 6th.

#15 - KC wants Bijan and trades their #30 / #62 / 2nd Round 2024 for our #15 and #93 to make it happen.

So we make first pick at #30

#30 - Strong prospect is there at 30 in Trenton Simpson...that hybrid space eating LB for off ball duties behind Campbell paired with Quay could be amazing and the prospect is just too good to pass at this point.

#39 - Rashee Rice WR...love Rice.
#45 - Mike Morris Edge
#62 - Sam LaPorta TE
#78 - Jaelyn Duncan OT
#112 - Ronnie Hickman S
#116 - Andrei Iosivas WR
#151 - Jay Ward DB
#171 - Ali Gaye Edge
#225 - Zack Kuntz TE
#234 - Tyson Bagent QB
2024 1st rounder from Carolina and
2024 2nd Rounder from KC
+whatever future conditionals from Jets for Rodgers.

Plenty of future equity for IF Love does terrible.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

Okay so didn't want to go nuts but operated a "what if trade back" like you eluded to and wanted quick thoughts. Won't elaborate a ton on each prospect but let's say Jets trade for Rodgers we get the #13, their 4th (#112) + conditional futures.

#13 - Traded back out of it with Carolina who moved up to grab Richardson (which is not crazy unrealistic but a stretch as I don't see Richardson falling but some say may depending where Carr / Rodgers / Brady / Jimmy G go). Carolina gave us their 2nd (#39) their 3rd (#93) and 2nd in 2024 for our #15 / 7th (#244) and 2024 6th.

#15 - KC wants Bijan and trades their #30 / #62 / 2nd Round 2024 for our #15 and #93 to make it happen.

So we make first pick at #30

#30 - Strong prospect is there at 30 in Trenton Simpson...that hybrid space eating LB for off ball duties behind Campbell paired with Quay could be amazing and the prospect is just too good to pass at this point.

#39 - Rashee Rice WR...love Rice.
#45 - Mike Morris Edge
#62 - Sam LaPorta TE
#78 - Jaelyn Duncan OT
#112 - Ronnie Hickman S
#116 - Andrei Iosivas WR
#151 - Jay Ward DB
#171 - Ali Gaye Edge
#225 - Zack Kuntz TE
#234 - Tyson Bagent QB
2024 1st rounder from Carolina and
2024 2nd Rounder from KC
+whatever future conditionals from Jets for Rodgers.

Plenty of future equity for IF Love does terrible.

Personally, I like having more darts for sure and I liked how you spread them out over two drafts, which makes sense when you are in rebuild. I have always run draft simulators with only accepting picks in the upcoming draft, just because I like to see what players we can get. Problem with that, if you trade back a lot and end up with 16 picks, that's probably too many picks, when, as you did, you could use some of them the following year.

One scenario I do not like is getting a "next years round 1 or round 2", unless the team trading them did really well this year and those picks would be relatively late in those rounds in 2023. However, if you shove them to the 2024 draft and that team does crappy in 2023, maybe those future picks end up being top 10 or better in each of the 2024 rounds. Much like the Lions getting a future #1 for Stafford from the Rams, they were probably thinking bottom 5 or so. Rams crap the bed and now it is a very valuable #6 pick.

 

[tynimiller]

Realistically it’s kinda the Eagles way, build equity around young QB, if he hits you’re gold for a bit. If not you have tons of picks and young ascending roster for a future QB drafted

 

[tynimiller]

So I had this guy pegged as a priority UDFA, but I'm going to dig deeper into him this week/weekend if able since the Packers have been confirmed to have met with him three times already (that's a lot at this point honestly).

All this dude has done is accumulate 13,933 yards / 97 TDS / a 60.7 completion percentage / a 137 Rating / only 37 INTs over his career at East Carolina. He can run as well with over 1100 yards total too.

 

[Pkrjones]

So I had this guy pegged as a priority UDFA, but I'm going to dig deeper into him this week/weekend if able since the Packers have been confirmed to have met with him three times already (that's a lot at this point honestly).

All this dude has done is accumulate 13,933 yards / 97 TDS / a 60.7 completion percentage / a 137 Rating / only 37 INTs over his career at East Carolina. He can run as well with over 1100 yards total too.

Does he have a name? Used your "East Carolina" clue & discovered you referred to 6'-3" 237 lb, 23 yr old left hander Holton Ahlers.

 

[tynimiller]

Does he have a name? Used your "East Carolina" clue & discovered you referred to 6'-3" 237 lb, 23 yr old left hander Holton Ahlers.

Oh man my bad. Completely spaced it, yeah that’s the man.

Dual threat extender of plays, not a true running guy but athletic and tough to bring down

 

[tynimiller]

Viliami Fehoko EDGE San Jose State 6'4' 263lbs

I'm officially christening myself a Fehoko fan at the right spot. This prospect did go to a smaller type school, but in big games and against better competition he remained one of the most disruptive type players present on the field regardless of which team you were discussing that day.

Became a full time player in 2019, and had a STRONG abbreviated 2020 for sure too...and just stacked two more awesome years further in 2021 and 2022.

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Fehoko is an absolute stud at controlling an edge - time and time again against athletic QB's on pass rush sets you watch Fehoko clearly have a controlled attack and if he needs to reset the pocket should he get too far long or outside providing a slip lane he constantly has a double hand move and spin back inside to collapse that hole or provide a QB tackle/sack at the line of scrimmage or behind. He has the sufficient strength to battle an OL and not be pushed off a spot, even if he doesn't "win" the rep.

The last two years it seemed his pass rush package has grown a lot - when he is told to pin his ears and go, there is a clear burst and quickness he showcases on snaps where in others he isn't slow, but is clearly more calculated and knows and plays to his role on those snaps.

From a pure disruption stance the steady increase illustrates what I just said as well...in 2020 - 23 QB hurries / 2021 - 34 / 2022 - 50. Not too mention in those three years this young man has batted balls on 10 occasions too - this is all before we mention the 26 sacks in those three years.

If he wasn't a slightly older prospect...I'd say he is a clear Day 2 caliber guy...but given the question of just how much untapped growth is there still I say end of Day 2/Early Day 3 is for sure the range I 100% would expect to see him go. There is a lot there to love about Fehoko, and it is clear from the growth we have already seen there is a hunger there...because it wasn't just he got stronger or older...his rush technique grew, his hand attacks were more diverse...clearly he has been putting in the work. Not too mention he has a family pedigree of athletes..and is the cousin of Vita Vea.

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[tynimiller]

Either way back to prospects:

So I did a deeper dive into the prospects at TE not named Mayer.

I'll be honest folks, I truly think Luke Musgrave could potentially come out of this TE draft class as one of the best and I wouldn't be shocked if some GMs actually think there may be more of a dynamic TE in him than Mayer even if his measurables and RAS come back what is being rumored.

Overall Luke is a prototypical TE body type at 6'6' 250lbs who historically showcased immense athleticism in high school where he played primarily defensive edge and wide receiver. He's been flexed all over in alignments at Oregon State and I envision more of the same at the next level. Oregon State was not an air attack style offense and often times Luke found himself blocking to set up rushing yards, he does so efficiently and his speed comes in handy at next level blocking (however not an overpowering presence like Darnell or Mayer prospects); he may not have any decleater level blocks at the next level but he will position himself well and has enough strength to hold or mirror defenders to seal holes long enough for the runner to slip through.

Through the air when called on Luke has excelled and his hands are one of his strongest attributes here. He truly has the stride speed of a TE that if he don't get a bump on him he can quickly take up space and stress the middle seams of a defense which opens up the entire field through the air.

Personally I'm in the same boat on Musgrave as I am on Tucker Kraft...3rd round grade, but would understand due to need if we roll one of their names out in the second round - I prefer in 2nd if we go TE to nab Darnell Washington or Dalton Kincaid but would understand it if we heard Musgrave or Kraft...both of which I have slightly ahead of Sam LaPorte from Iowa.

I should have trusted my gut then. I firmly now officially have Musgrave as actually my top TE. There simply isn’t anything I dislike about him and I see just a hair more ceiling than Mayer and his juice short and long speed is special for his size.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

I should have trusted my gut then. I firmly now officially have Musgrave as actually my top TE. There simply isn’t anything I dislike about him and I see just a hair more ceiling than Mayer and his juice short and long speed is special for his size.

Shush!!! We don't want the other 31 teams to come to this conclusion!!!!

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[tynimiller]

Shush!!! We don't want the other 31 teams to come to this conclusion!!!!

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I didn’t believe he was as fast as the tape showed….then he literally ran the 16th fastest time clocked at the senior bowl out of everyone…..now I have a friend that has confirmed he is in workouts hitting the sub 4.5 range.

Tape didn’t lie but i didn’t believe it. His juice is a whole nother level…and from a school that asked him to block far more than use his juice just screams to me

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

I didn’t believe he was as fast as the tape showed….then he literally ran the 16th fastest time clocked at the senior bowl out of everyone…..now I have a friend that has confirmed he is in workouts hitting the sub 4.5 range.

Tape didn’t lie but i didn’t believe it. His juice is a whole nother level…and from a school that asked him to block far more than use his juice just screams to me

Just from the little I have read on Musgrave I like. Sounds like he is definitely more of a project, but potentially with a bigger upside than even Mayer. Limited college playing time due to Covid and injuries. Many seem to think he is a late pick in round 2.

 

[tynimiller]

Just from the little I have read on Musgrave I like. Sounds like he is definitely more of a project, but potentially with a bigger upside than even Mayer. Limited college playing time due to Covid and injuries. Many seem to think he is a late pick in round 2.

I’ll just say many are wrong lol IMO

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

I’ll just say many are wrong lol IMO

Keep an eye on QB Hendon ****** as well. Had he not torn his ACL, might be a top 10 pick, when will he go?

Last name isn't ******....it is H00ker.

Hope the Packers don't draft him, we couldn't refer to him in any conversations by his last name, might have to just call him "hook".

 

[tynimiller]

Keep an eye on QB Hendon ****** as well. Had he not torn his ACL, might be a top 10 pick, when will he go?

Last name isn't ******....it is H00ker.

Hope the Packers don't draft him, we couldn't refer to him in any conversations by his last name, might have to just call him "hook".

I don't believe H00ker has proven he can handle a pro style offense to me. Do I like him yes, do I believe he is a Day 2 guy - no. Personally he and Jaren Hall are two guys I love, but would want to draft and stash for a bit.

 

[Pkrjones]

Are you guys aware that Hendon H00ker is 10 months OLDER than Jordan Love (who already has 3 yrs of NFL coaching)? He's an old guy with a repaired ACL...I'll pass on him as a prospect.

 

[tynimiller]

Are you guys aware that Hendon H00ker is 10 months OLDER than Jordan Love (who already has 3 yrs of NFL coaching)? He's an old guy with a repaired ACL...I'll pass on him as a prospect.

I pass from a Packers perspective period - but prospect wise I have a Day 3 fifth round grade on him but wouldn’t be shocked if a team fell for him earlier.

There is equal parts to like and dislike about him.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

Are you guys aware that Hendon H00ker is 10 months OLDER than Jordan Love (who already has 3 yrs of NFL coaching)? He's an old guy with a repaired ACL...I'll pass on him as a prospect.

25 years old is "an old guy"!

I know what you are saying and I wasn't implying that the Packers should draft him, but I do think he will go earlier than most are predicting. Many teams are now going to be looking for the Brock Purdy of the draft.

 

[tynimiller]

Yup I talk about many prospects in this thread, some of which I’d be dead set against us drafting depending upon something or few things happening. QB is one I truthfully would like Gute to not watch until fifth round….Bagent there, Tune….O’Connel…I get picking one mid to late Day3

 

[OldSchool101]

Jordan Battle seems like an ideal fit for us. He’s big 6’1”X210lb. He Runs a 4.45 40 time and he can tackle with the best of them. He’s fluid in the secondary and has ideal tackle skills. He’s also an experienced chess piece after playing in 50 games for Alabama.

 

[tynimiller]

Jordan Battle seems like an ideal fit for us. He’s big 6’1”X210lb. He Runs a 4.45 40 time and he can tackle with the best of them. He’s fluid in the secondary and has ideal tackle skills. He’s also an experienced chess piece after playing in 50 games for Alabama.

Where I struggle with Battle is this; I don't see the skills or pure range to do single high work, but I also see deficiencies in his man coverage abilities in slot assignments. He does tackle quite well and for sure when allowed to follow instincts he does quite well or can.

If Amos isn't back, and you drafted Battle I'd bet my house he'll be a Day 1 starter...the issue is, and some will get mad at me, I don't see a player too dissimilar to Ha-Ha; high floor that maybe is exactly what he is now with not a ton of growth expected. I'd say he is a slightly better version of HaHa...like if HaHa was a 7 out of 10 - Battle is 7.5

I personally wouldn't pick him till the third but most likely he goes end of 2nd. He'd be one of those picks I'll fully understand why, be excited to see if he can grow off his high-floor but have hesitancy to whether I believe my optimistic self.

 

[tynimiller]

@OldSchool101 I'd look to Sydney Brown before Battle in the 2nd round myself. While not as good of a tackler he like Battle has starter level ability but I wonder if maxed...BUT Brown illustrated exceptional skills not surrounded by Bama players - which can mean something. The reason I give nod to Brown is while Battle isn't bad at anything or great...Brown is great at coverage - this dude flat out can cover anyone; his weakness is tackling (it is improving and his strength has clearly increased allowing better leverage and hands during tackling...but that is one area he will need to improve).

Personally Branch is the cream of the crop...and then after that there are some solid but no one purely well rounded for me in Brown, Battle, Johnson, Joseph, Skinner, Smith, Robinson....

All depends what style or type of Safety we want...Jammie Robinson to me is essentially everything Battle is with better coverage and tackling skills....Skinner is the in the box beast of a safety if we want to go that route....Christopher Smith very well may be the second best all around Safety behind Branch however that offers a ton in deep zone and single high....

Brandon Joseph is clearly the brain of the group and can for sure cover deep...but severely lacked ball skills in the ND system compared to his time at NW.

If curious my thoughts on round ranges of the top 7 safeties IMO:

First Round
Branch

First/Second Round
Antonio Johnson


Second Round
Sydney Brown
Christopher Smith

Second/Third Round
Jammie Robinson

Third Round
Brandon Joseph
JL Skinner

 

[Sunshine885500]

I've dabbled sharing some thoughts elsewhere and I'll possibly bring them over to here...but I gotta start sharing thoughts of some favorite early prospects I think could be on Green Bay's radar due to their position and potential roster needs/wants for next year.

I will not do any mocks here, this will be solely for prospect profile discussions.

Tight End is a position I could see us facing some serious need at depending if Lewis decides to finally hang it up....Tonyan goes elsewhere...we could go very quickly to needing a guy that can come in and deliver.

I have TWO MASSIVE PROSPECTS I LOVE. LOVE. LOVE!!!

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Michael Mayer is a BEAST among boys at 6'4' 260-ish pounds (swear that seems light at times)

In just two seasons he has amassed receiving numbers of a tight end that you'd typically hear is just a pass receiving threat incapable of blocking yet...with 113 catches, 1290 yards and 9 TDs this dude can find the open spot, exhibits soft hands when needed, his body control to high point is uncanny for a big guy and folks...his foot efficiency makes him seem faster and perhaps more agile than he really is.

As a pass blocker folks this cat in two seasons (freshman and sophomore years) has given up ZERO pressures and ZERO sacks. ZERO. While I'd say his pass blocking is as refined as one could expect a TE to be, his run blocking suffers only slightly due to his hand strength can be improved and his high cut frame limits him just a touch...but this body can and will impose himself in the run game.

Michael Mayer is the most exciting TE prospect in years for me because of him being the ENTIRE TE room rolled into one guy. He can block, catch, quick enough to bust the seam when needed and smart enough to read a defense.

I honest to God don't care where our first round pick washes out at, if we use it on Mayer I would not hesitate to claim that pick is an A grade without hesitation. I don't care if we would trade up to make it happen...I believe he is truly going to be that elite TE that the league usually only has one or two guys like at a time.

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The second TE I am just gushing over and am just slightly less excited about is Josh Whyle of Cincinatti...and where he is slighly less of a blocker he is that much more of a burner and pass threat than Mayer (and Mayer is no slouch remember). This cat is 6'5' 245 (bet gets around 250 for this year) and has been a consistent above the rim and reliable target for Ridder the last two years. With Ridder gone and Alec Pierce as well I look for Whyle to put up at least 500 yards this year and possibly more as arguably one of the Bearcats' deadliest receiving threats for sure. This incredible TE is said to flirt with sub 4.6 speed, pairs that with a 35 1/2 inch vertical and nearly a ten and a half foot broad jump....just for reference those measurables have him building easily a 8.00+ RAS.


I know some will say I'm crazy, but I 100% say he is end of 1st round potential but I'll lock in a 2nd round grade on him right here today. I truly believe in him A TON! (Edit 1/17/2023 - Whyle was a guy I had pegged for a breakout year and IT NEVER HAPPENED. I truly still feel he has massive potential written all over him but he is a Day 3 type based on the performances and tape he put down this year.)

My bet is on Darnell Washington TE Georgia. 6'6" 264lbs and 4 6 40yd dash. He can block , powerful and can catch.

 

[tynimiller]

My bet is on Darnell Washington TE Georgia. 6'6" 264lbs and 4 6 40yd dash. He can block , powerful and can catch.

I’ve unpacked plenty

There is a lot to love in the four guys I believe should go top 50 (Musgrave, Mayer, Washington, Kincaid) and six in top 70 (Kraft and LaPorta).

Other names of guys I love at respective spots are Payne Durham, Kuntz, Willis, Whyle…Mallory intrigues me but didn’t like his tape as much but athletic beast for sure.

 

[OldSchool101]

I’ve unpacked plenty

There is a lot to love in the four guys I believe should go top 50 (Musgrave, Mayer, Washington, Kincaid) and six in top 70 (Kraft and LaPorta).

Other names of guys I love at respective spots are Payne Durham, Kuntz, Willis, Whyle…Mallory intrigues me but didn’t like his tape as much but athletic beast for sure.

These are also my favorites. I’d be elated with Mayer in Round 1 or Washington in Round 2. I think Washington is an upgrade to Jermichael Finley, who was beginning to hit strides when he was severely injured. I’m not sure Darnell will last to our #45. I’d be ok with us moving up slightly if needed in that 40 overall area.

 

[OldSchool101]

But we ask ourselves. He’s 6’6” 5/8 so can he catch? Hmmm

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