2017 Draft/FA Needs - Ranked

[PikeBadger]

Of one thing we can be sure...a 6th. straight first round pick on the defensive side. A CB, an OLB, a D-Lineman who can rush the passer. Choose your poison.

Does anybody still think Thompson drafts the best player available? That went out the window a long time ago if it ever existed at all .

It depends on how you feel draft prospects are ranked. Individually, or in groups.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

It depends on how you feel draft prospects are ranked. Individually, or in groups.

There's no doubt that teams divide draft prospects into several different groups. Therefore the ideal way to describe a GM's approach would be that he selects the player presenting the best value out of the remaining ones in the top tier with position of need being a deciding factor.

There are few examples of teams truly drafting the best player available with the Packers selecting Rodgers being one of them.

 

[PikeBadger]

There's no doubt that teams divide draft prospects into several different groups. Therefore the ideal way to describe a GM's approach would be that he selects the player presenting the best value out of the remaining ones in the top tier with position of need being a deciding factor.

There are few examples of teams truly drafting the best player available with the Packers selecting Rodgers being one of them.

Agree, however from what we've heard, Rodgers was the only player that was remaining from the highest available group. I don't recall ever hearing about other players that Thompson has drafted and how the groupings stood at that time. We have however heard things like their board was holding up well. My suspicion has always been that Clay Matthews was ranked in a grouping above pick 29 and that is why Thompson went after that pick because he felt he was getting exceptional value at 29.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

Agree, however from what we've heard, Rodgers was the only player that was remaining from the highest available group. I don't recall ever hearing about other players that Thompson has drafted and how the groupings stood at that time. We have however heard things like their board was holding up well. My suspicion has always been that Clay Matthews was ranked in a grouping above pick 29 and that is why Thompson went after that pick because he felt he was getting exceptional value at 29.

It's true Rodgers was the only player out of the top tier available once the Packers were on the clock in 2005. Therefore it was a true BPA pick.

It's possible that Matthews was as well resulting in Thompson trading up to select him.

 

[McKnowledge]

I think the Packers should seriously consider using the first round pick on Jabril Peppers if he is available. Let Morgan Burnett settle into a hybrid linebacker/safety role (depending on situation). Along with Ha Ha, play a Cover 3/ 3-4 scheme. TT isn't gonna throw money at a CB. 2nd round pick, I really think they should get a CB. 3rd round, shoot for an offensive dynamo, regardless of position. Use the rest of the draft to replenish both the O-line and the D-Line.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

I think the Packers should seriously consider using the first round pick on Jabril Peppers if he is available. Let Morgan Burnett settle into a hybrid linebacker/safety role (depending on situation). Along with Ha Ha, play a Cover 3/ 3-4 scheme. TT isn't gonna throw money at a CB. 2nd round pick, I really think they should get a CB. 3rd round, shoot for an offensive dynamo, regardless of position. Use the rest of the draft to replenish both the O-line and the D-Line.

That "scenario" only "makes any sense" if the Packers address the current needs at CB and OLB via Free Agency or a trade. Which is the way I would prefer to see those 2 needs met. If the Packers expect to "fix" their CB issues through the draft, especially by waiting until round 3, 2017 could get really ugly fast on defense.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

I think the Packers should seriously consider using the first round pick on Jabril Peppers if he is available. Let Morgan Burnett settle into a hybrid linebacker/safety role (depending on situation). Along with Ha Ha, play a Cover 3/ 3-4 scheme. TT isn't gonna throw money at a CB. 2nd round pick, I really think they should get a CB. 3rd round, shoot for an offensive dynamo, regardless of position. Use the rest of the draft to replenish both the O-line and the D-Line.

I don't believe Jabrill Peppers would solve any of the shortcomings on the Packers defense and selecting him would be wasting a first round pick.

 

[McKnowledge]

That "scenario" only "makes any sense" if the Packers address the current needs at CB and OLB via Free Agency or a trade. Which is the way I would prefer to see those 2 needs met. If the Packers expect to "fix" their CB issues through the draft, especially by waiting until round 3, 2017 could get really ugly fast on defense.

I agree with LB through free agency, maybe CB. Experience is needed with a championship caliber team such as the Packers. However, I don't think they have to "hit" on CB in the first two rounds to be successful. In fact, the draft is a crapshoot if the coaching doesn't develop the talent. FA is essential this year especially, because FA should provide proven commodities. The Packers should "just go for it" and stop relying on inexpensive youth on the defensive side.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

I agree with LB through free agency, maybe CB. Experience is needed with a championship caliber team such as the Packers. However, I don't think they have to "hit" on CB in the first two rounds to be successful. In fact, the draft is a crapshoot if the coaching doesn't develop the talent. FA is essential this year especially, because FA should provide proven commodities. The Packers should "just go for it" and stop relying on inexpensive youth on the defensive side.

I'm sure that there has been a CB drafted 29th or later in the history of the NFL that made an impact his first season. However, given how BIG that need currently is for the Packers, I would not want to risk sitting on our hands and doing nothing other than sticking with our current roster and a draft pick or two to immediately improve the mess we saw at CB last season.

 

[McKnowledge]

I'm sure that there has been a CB drafted 29th or later in the history of the NFL that made an impact his first season. However, given how BIG that need currently is for the Packers, I would not want to risk sitting on our hands and doing nothing other than sticking with our current roster and a draft pick or two to immediately improve the mess we saw at CB last season.

Hey we're both Packers fans. We want to see them reclaim the Lombardi trophy. My perspective is that why not shore up our strengths and minimize our weakness? Jabril Peppers is a BALLER pure and simple. The tape doesn't lie. He can play all DB positions efficiently. He tackles. We've got two young corners that unfortunately were injured. I think they could be studs. Honestly, why not fire the strength and conditioning staff and see where that takes us? Could you imagine Hyde (hopefully re-signed), J. Peppers, Burnett, and Ha Ha in the backfield? Look at the league. Look at our division. Is there a RB that strikes fear in the NFC North? NFC? That secondary bolstered by D. Randall and the other young guy (injured), add pass rushers, sprinkle in veteran LBs, and keep Julius Peppers as a situational QB killer...You got something. CB is really overrated if you ask me. Can't cover without a pass rush. Pass rush and willing tacklers is all the Packers defense need.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

Hey we're both Packers fans. We want to see them reclaim the Lombardi trophy. My perspective is that why not shore up our strengths and minimize our weakness? Jabril Peppers is a BALLER pure and simple. The tape doesn't lie. He can play all DB positions efficiently. He tackles. CB is really overrated if you ask me. Can't cover without a pass rush.

I have absolutely no idea how any Packers fan that watched most of the 2016 season could come away thinking that the cornerback position is overrated.

The Packers are in dire need of upgrading the position and hopefully will do that via free agency and the draft.

Jabrill Peppers struggled in coverage all of last season and didn't defend a single pass with his lone interception coming off a tipped ball. He won't be able to play every DB position effectively at the pro level.

Asa side note it's important to have a decent pass rush but it's impossible to put any pressure on a quarterback with your CBs not being able to cover receivers for at least two seconds.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

I see Peppers as a luxury pick for a team like the Patriots to be able to justify. His draft stock is all over the board, simply because he is a player without a true position, something that scares a lot of NFL GM's from spending a first round pick on.

 

[McKnowledge]

I have absolutely no idea how any Packers fan that watched most of the 2016 season could come away thinking that the cornerback position is overrated.

The Packers are in dire need of upgrading the position and hopefully will do that via free agency and the draft.

Jabrill Peppers struggled in coverage all of last season and didn't defend a single pass with his lone interception coming off a tipped ball. He won't be able to play every DB position effectively at the pro level.

Asa side note it's important to have a decent pass rush but it's impossible to put any pressure on a quarterback with your CBs not being able to cover receivers for at least two seconds.

Sure...Two seconds...Four seconds...On and on. You cannot stop or shut down a receiver. Sure...He'll catch that ball, but he's going get popped. Put the fear of Mom in him . The blown coverages this season were a result of the backups not sticking with their assignments. They were rookies. I PUT ALL THE BLAME ON THE COACHING STAFF!!! You don't have to worry about coverage with the QB consistently on his back side. And when that WR catches that ball, you hit him hard!!! Way too many YAC for opposing receivers this past season.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

Sure...Two seconds...Four seconds...On and on. You cannot stop or shut down a receiver. Sure...He'll catch that ball, but he's going get popped. Put the fear of Mom in him . The blown coverages this season were a result of the backups not sticking with their assignments. They were rookies. I PUT ALL THE BLAME ON THE COACHING STAFF!!! You don't have to worry about coverage with the QB consistently on his back side. And when that WR catches that ball, you hit him hard!!! Way too many YAC for opposing receivers this past season.

Problem with that, it appears that the same coaching staff will be back next season. So what do you do with all of these "under coached" guys who are currently on the team?

 

[McKnowledge]

Problem with that, it appears that the same coaching staff will be back next season. So what do you do with all of these "under coached" guys who are currently on the team?

Simple...Hold the coaches accountable. If the secondary or whatever unit underperforms or doesn't perform to the standards of McCarthy, then you're out. Pressure either bursts pipes or pressure makes diamonds. Put the coaches on notice. I'm just tired of the organization wasting A Rod's prime.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

The blown coverages this season were a result of the backups not sticking with their assignments. They were rookies. I PUT ALL THE BLAME ON THE COACHING STAFF!!! You don't have to worry about coverage with the QB consistently on his back side.

The Packers didn't play any rookies at cornerback aside of Hawkins for a couple of snaps. The unit struggled because of a lack of talent.

Teams have to worry about covering receivers even with a decent pass rush, especially to give your rushers enough time to pressure the quarterback.

 

[McKnowledge]

The Packers didn't play any rookies at cornerback aside of Hawkins for a couple of snaps. The unit struggled because of a lack of talent.

Teams have to worry about covering receivers even with a decent pass rush, especially to give your rushers enough time to pressure the quarterback.

This isn't Denver... where you spend big bucks on the secondary and replenish with low draft picks. This isn't Seattle... where three transcendent DBs, two of which were high draft picks matched their potential with dedication. This is Green Bay.. where talent evaluation is hit or miss, draft slots are fixed (no trade ups or trade backs) and there is never a splash and hardly a puddle in FA. TT and his staff are good at identifying pass rushers and safeties. Stick with that. Bolster the strengths. Supplement the weaknesses with FA. Let's get this damn ring!!!

 

[HardRightEdge]

It depends on how you feel draft prospects are ranked. Individually, or in groups.

I don't see how that matters. There are always several positions of need. If the "best available player" at priority #2 is deemed sufficiently better than the best available player at priority #1, that the priority #2 player is selected hardly proves the case. The reality is that the quality found at #15 or #20 depending on draft depth is not much different than that at #50. The key differentiaters are need and scheme fit. With multiple priorities, you're going to find a player in that group at a position of need.

If one wants to say "best available player among the high priority needs", then I would not argue.

We have a record of at least 6 consecutive examples of first round picks to demonstrate that.

What a GM does in trying to get over the top is different from what he does once he's achieved that and wants to repeat it.

The Packers will not be drafting a QB, OT or safety in the first round, for example, no matter how good they think he might be because he won't be much better than a player at a position of need. Also, the Packers will not be spending a first round pick on a RB, C, OG or ILB, no matter how good the player might be because they do not value those positions as "bang for the buck" propositions.

It takes a radical mispricing of injury or dope risk in a superior talent available at #29 to make the best player available case interesting, and Thompson avoids those players like the plague in his risk/reward calculations.

One caveat: Thompson might draft a natural FS for conversion to CB.

Thompson's sub-par record with these last six 1st. round picks suggests he ought to trade down.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

This is Green Bay.. where talent evaluation is hit or miss, draft slots are fixed (no trade ups or trade backs) and there is never a splash and hardly a puddle in FA. TT and his staff are good at identifying pass rushers and safeties. Stick with that. Bolster the strengths. Supplement the weaknesses with FA. Let's get this damn ring!!!

Thompson has to change his approach this offseason and finally selectively use free agency to address obvious needs at cornerback and outside linebacker.

I don't agree the Packers are especially good at drafting any specific defensive positions although safety is most likely the only spot I'm absolutely fine with at the moment. Therefore I would prefer to address other ones in the draft.

FYI it seems you forgot about it but Thompson traded up nine spots during last year's draft to select Spriggs.

 

[McKnowledge]

Thompson has to change his approach this offseason and finally selectively use free agency to address obvious needs at cornerback and outside linebacker.

I don't agree the Packers are especially good at drafting any specific defensive positions although safety is most likely the only spot I'm absolutely fine with at the moment. Therefore I would prefer to address other ones in the draft.

FYI it seems you forgot about it but Thompson traded up nine spots during last year's draft to select Spriggs.

I did indeed forget about Jason Spriggs. However, I think Daniel, Perry, and Matthews have been good pass rushers picked by TT. At 64 y.o. TT is who he is. My biggest beef is that he has full autonomy with the roster. If the Packers are indeed beholden to the shareholders, which clearly they are not (according to personnel), I don't see any significant changes that would "push" the defense "over the top". I just don't think you should be complacent with the roster or coaching staff with a HOF QB at the peak of his powers.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

However, I think Daniel, Perry, and Matthews have been good pass rushers picked by TT.

While I agree about those players having drafted only three above average pass rushers in 12 years isn't something to get excited about.

 

[McKnowledge]

Defensive MVP/Superbowl Champ (Matthews) is something most other teams would like to have. Pro Bowler Daniels. Perry up and coming. We, Packer fans are so spoiled. And we have every reason to be. So, it boggles the mind that when draft picks don't pan out over the last three to four years, you might want to actively explore the FA market more than usual. C'mon man!!!

 

[PackerDNA]

Defensive MVP/Superbowl Champ (Matthews) is something most other teams would like to have. Pro Bowler Daniels. Perry up and coming. We, Packer fans are so spoiled. And we have every reason to be. So, it boggles the mind that when draft picks don't pan out over the last three to four years, you might want to actively explore the FA market more than usual. C'mon man!!!

Including the Packers.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

Defensive MVP/Superbowl Champ (Matthews) is something most other teams would like to have. Pro Bowler Daniels.

Neither has Matthews been named defensive player of the year nor has Daniels made the Pro Bowl so far in their careers.

 

[Half Empty]

And Perry is an up-and-comer after only five years? Kid has really showed something. Career year last year, almost literally, as his games started and sacks equaled the stats from the first four years, combined.