Where will we draft?

[TouchdownPackers]

[QUOTE="Pokerbrat2000, post: 749656, member: 7261"Might also want to explain this condescending attitude to some of the younger fans, who perhaps actually know more about football than you do. [/QUOTE]

Have I said anything that implies I know less about football than people half my age? I get it. People think if we suck bad enough, Mark Murphy will clean house and hit seven home runs in the draft. Neither assumption is logical or realistic .I don't want GB fans to think that way because every year there are misfires - bad coaches, bad executives, bad players, you name it - by teams that were much worse than the Packers. The reality is our chances of going to the playoffs next year do not depend on picking higher in the draft than most other teams and firing the entire coaching staff instead of just the defensive coordinator like some Packers fans are suggesting.

Do I want a new DC? Of course. Do I wish we had a GM who loves free agency? Of course. Do I think Mike McCarthy should be fired for refusing to fire Dom Capers and losing out will help accomplish that? Absolutely not.

 

[thisisnate]

most mock drafts currently have the packers picking between 15 and 20
if that's as high as we pick after this crap season
that will be a little disappointing

 

[VegasPacker]

I'll say between #8 and #12.

My choices...

1st round:
Minkah Fitzpatrick - (DB)
Mike McGlinchey - (OT)
Harold Landry - (OLB)

2nd round:
Royce Freeman (RB)

 

[gbgary]

we'll never have another opportunity like this with Rodgers as our QB (unless the unthinkable reoccurs). they can't be so short-sighted as to now realize this...but hell, they've proven to be short-sighted about other things so who tf knows.

 

[Favre>Rodgers259]

That is not how is works. The HTH tiebreaker is only for the playoffs. Strength of schedule puts us in the driver's seat.

Thanks for the correction...learn something new everyday.

With the Steelers loss, I think we are firmly entrenched with a sub 20th pick. But beating Tampa might inch us to like 19th Overall. Couple latest mocks are liking Marinas Rankin/ OT -Miss St. Honestly, with a better OL we might not be in the predicament we're in right now, so I'm open to that pick.

 

[LambeauLombardi]

most mock drafts currently have the packers picking between 15 and 20
if that's as high as we pick after this crap season
that will be a little disappointing

*devastating

We miss the playoffs and still get a crappy draft turn

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

*devastating

We miss the playoffs and still get a crappy draft turn

I wouldn't worry too much about that now. Still plenty of football games to lose to improve our position in the draft!

We may end up at 5-11 or 6-10 and be sitting at #5-#10. The Browns, 49'ers and Giants seem to be the teams that for sure will be picking higher than the Packers.

 

[HardRightEdge]

#6 I don't think we win more than maybe 1 unless Rodgers comes back. I don't think he comes back to a 5-8,6-7 team.

It takes about 6 months for a broken collarbone to completely heal. He should be shut down for the season if the record is in that range. However, if salvaging something of the season means keeping one's job and if Rodgers wants to play, then he may take the field regardless, assuming he's cleared which is still an unknown.

 

[Arthur Squires]

The real question is will we resign the Vince Papale of Greenbay Jeff Janis. Say what you want but he will always be remembered that way with me.

 

[Carl 2]

It takes about 6 months for a broken collarbone to completely heal. He should be shut down for the season if the record is in that range. However, if salvaging something of the season means keeping one's job and if Rodgers wants to play, then he may take the field regardless, assuming he's cleared which is still an unknown.

Source on the 6 months?

Sometimes it can take a few months to heal, but 6 months is pushing it and not a normal case.

Last time Rodgers broke it, he was back in 8 weeks.

 

[McKnowledge]

Let's say GB wins the next two games against the Bucs and the Browns, there's still a lot of games that have to work in the Packers' advantage. Seahawks would have to lose three straight. Lions would have to lose two straight. Cowboys and Redskins cannibalize each other this week, and Redskins lose the next game on 12/10. We own tiebreaker against Cowboys. If Rogers is ready to go against Carolina, huge if, maybe, just maybe, but probably not, GB could secure a wild card. If GB loses to TB (Winston might play), then GB should shut Rodgers down.

They should evaluate Hundley. If he finishes strong, re-sign Hundley to a serviceable contract for a back-up. If the Packers pick is not the top 12th, trade that pick, and pick up more options. Also, trade Cobb, for a 4th rounder. Upgrade Geronimo Allison to No. 2 and move Jordy Nelson (if he does not retire) to the slot. Re-sign Davante Adams immediately!!! Turn Montgomery into a poor man's Le'Veon Bell. And...(baiting, I'm baiting...) consider making a run @ Le'Veon Bell.

Absolutely do not trade for Bell if he is franchised again, but I think Bell may wanna play elsewhere, and playing alongside AR12 has to be enticing. Use those draft picks on O-Line (a real RT!!!), Pass crushers, and sideline ping pong LBs. Of course this happens after Thompson is gone and the organization completely overhauls its strength and conditioning staff. Packers need some sports science nerds that were baptized in gatorade!!! Anyways, Packers more than likely get the 15th-17th pick.

 

[Mike McCarthy]

we'll never have another opportunity like this with Rodgers as our QB (unless the unthinkable reoccurs). they can't be so short-sighted as to now realize this...but hell, they've proven to be short-sighted about other things so who tf knows.

You forgot to mention nearsighted, farsighted, and astigmatic. Time has come to scuttle the ship mates.

 

[HardRightEdge]

Source on the 6 months?

Sometimes it can take a few months to heal, but 6 months is pushing it and not a normal case.

Last time Rodgers broke it, he was back in 8 weeks.

Here's one source:

http://rebalancemd.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/08/Clavicle_Fractures_Recovery_Guide.pdf

"While the bone heals usually within 2-3 months, recovery takes much longer. Typically most of the recovery is completed by 3-5 months. Some stiffness in the shoulder can happen after these injuries, but usually resolves by 6 months after the injury."

"The plate and screws do not need to be removed, but occasionally, patients find the plate bothersome under the skin. If this is the case, the plate and screws can be removed after the fracture has healed, usually at least 6 months after the break."

I've seen other sources stating 6 months for complete healing.

8 weeks is pretty typical for somebody not engaged in tackle football. Most symptoms are relieved and there is negligible risk of reinjury before complete healing for a typical civilian who's typical activity is just walking around.

A tackle football player has special risks, in particular a franchise QB injuring the throwing side. Last time Rodger injured his non-throwing collarbone; re-injury was a risk in that case but while it might end a season it would not be career-threatening. When considering the throwing arm, special caution should be taken. His surgery involved a plate and 13 screws indicating a injury on the severe end of the scale. 3 screws is pretty typical.

All in all, if the Packers are out of playoff contention, which is a high probability, he should be shut down categorically. If he has any discomfort at all, I'd shut him down regardless. What you absolutely don't want to happen is Rodgers compensating for discomfort with mechanical changes risking injury to the elbow or shoulder. Given the amount of hardware involved, and given what he does for a living with that arm, the odds are good the next step will be to remove the hardware and let complete healing proceed.

The Packers always quote the absolute best case recovery time which is why fans are constantly disappointed and angry. They never seem to learn.

By the way, I googled for other players suffering a broken collarbone this season and the elapsed time before return to play. The first one I ran across was Kevin White of the Bears. He broke his on Sept. 10, opening day. He's still on the IR. So there's that.

Now, show me a QB who had a collarbone break on the throwing side with a plate and screws inserted who came back in 8 weeks. Source?

 

[HardRightEdge]

By the way, if Hundley happens to win the next 2 games and Rodgers is not ready to return or management decides not to take the risk, with either case being a strong possibility, I think I can accurately predict the reaction in these pages.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

I wouldn't worry too much about that now. Still plenty of football games to lose to improve our position in the draft!

We may end up at 5-11 or 6-10 and be sitting at #5-#10. The Browns, 49'ers and Giants seem to be the teams that for sure will be picking higher than the Packers.

True, the Packers are currently only two games in front of the fourth pick.

They should evaluate Hundley. If he finishes strong, re-sign Hundley to a serviceable contract for a back-up.

Hundley is under contract for next season.

A tackle football player has special risks, in particular a franchise QB injuring the throwing side. Last time Rodger injured his non-throwing collarbone; re-injury was a risk in that case but while it might end a season it would not be career-threatening. When considering the throwing arm, special caution should be taken. His surgery involved a plate and 13 screws indicating a injury on the severe end of the scale. 3 screws is pretty typical.

All in all, if the Packers are out of playoff contention, which is a high probability, he should be shut down categorically. If he has any discomfort at all, I'd shut him down regardless. What you absolutely don't want to happen is Rodgers compensating for discomfort with mechanical changes risking injury to the elbow or shoulder. Given the amount of hardware involved, and given what he does for a living with that arm, the odds are good the next step will be to remove the hardware and let complete healing proceed.

I read an article after Rodgers had surgery mentioning that the plate and screws won't be removed until after his retirement. Unfortunately I can't find it anymore.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

The real question is will we resign the Vince Papale of Greenbay Jeff Janis. Say what you want but he will always be remembered that way with me.

LOL....didn't have a clue who Vince Papale was. Even wore the same number as Janis. While I see no reason for the Packers to resign Janis, I'm sure if they do, we are going to hear a lot of talk about how he is really coming along and starting to show things.

You must be logged in to see this image or video!

 

[Favre>Rodgers259]

I see no reason for AR to come back at all. Lets continue the tank and hope for a 15th Overall Pick at best. No need to risk the Franchise when the Defense will probably still get us bounced out in the Divisional Round.

Hundley right now is auditioning for his future as a starting QB elsewhere. Eli Manning just got benched, the Jags will look to move on from Blake Bortles, Denver is just looking for anyone who can at least manage a game, and the Cardinals are bracing for Carson Palmer's retirement. Hundley is showing some ability right now. Lets see if Thompson can fleece someone for hopefully at least a 4th or 5th Round Pick to invest in the Offensive Line.

 

[Mondio]

All in all, if the Packers are out of playoff contention, which is a high probability, he should be shut down categorically. If he has any discomfort at all, I'd shut him down regardless. What you absolutely don't want to happen is Rodgers compensating for discomfort with mechanical changes risking injury to the elbow or shoulder. Given the amount of hardware involved, and given what he does for a living with that arm, the odds are good the next step will be to remove the hardware and let complete healing proceed.

If there is any discomfort his biomechanics in the short term will be changed and he'll probably be "off" because of it. Compound that with being off for weeks and weeks with no real practice time or live action and he'll be "off". that's just the short term. You absolutely don't want to alter his mechanics for a chance this year, because a year of altered mechanics and now he has real shoulder/elbow problems. But I don't think this staff is going to risk their QB without him being ready. IF he ends up playing, I'll be ok with it, because I have confidence they're only letting him because he's ready.

 

[TouchdownPackers]

Thanks for the correction...learn something new every day.

With the Steelers loss, I think we are firmly entrenched with a sub 20th pick. But beating Tampa might inch us to like 19th Overall. Couple latest mocks are liking Marinas Rankin/ OT -Miss St. Honestly, with a better OL we might not be in the predicament we're in right now, so I'm open to that pick.

FYI "Steelers loss" means the opposite of "loss to the Steelers."

By sub-20 do you mean <=19?

Beating Tampa Bay and Cleveland will inch us closer to 21. After nearly beating Pittsburgh on the road, it would be a crime to say we have little chance of winning either of those two games. Carolina and Minnesota obviously will not be easiy games but if AR returns they are winnable and either way we can beat the Lions because Brett Hundley played very well against the Steelers. I will not expect a 3-2 finish (2-3 is more likely), but can see it happening. If Aaron Rodgers plays against Carolina and Minnesota, we should not chalk them up as automatic losses. I will root for Green Bay every week no matter what anyone says about where we will pick in the draft.

 

[TouchdownPackers]

I read an article after Rodgers had surgery mentioning that the plate and screws won't be removed until after his retirement. Unfortunately I can't find it anymore.

Smart decision .We saw what happened to Tony Romo when he decided not to have surgery and came back after the bone was fully healed, then broke it again two weeks later.

 

[HardRightEdge]

I read an article after Rodgers had surgery mentioning that the plate and screws won't be removed until after his retirement. Unfortunately I can't find it anymore.

That would be another one of those Green Bay Packer absolute best case recovery scenarios that never seem to materialize.

 

[HardRightEdge]

Smart decision .We saw what happened to Tony Romo when he decided not to have surgery and came back after the bone was fully healed, then broke it again two weeks later.

Tony Romo first broke his collarbone on 9/20/15. He returned to action on 11/22/15, about 9 weeks later. He re-broke it on 11/26/17, about 11 weeks after the initial injury.

It was his non-throwing side, no surgery as you stated, the same situation as Rodgers in 2013 who missed 8 weeks.

There are two takeaways.

1) Broken collarbones are not 100% healed after 8 or 9 weeks as I noted previously.
2) A re-injury risk risk can be taken with the non-throwing side.

 

[swhitset]

FYI "Steelers loss" means the opposite of "loss to the Steelers."
.

There is no apostrophe in the word Steelers denoting possession. Therefore no it doesn't. lol.

totally agree with the rest of your post.

 

[TouchdownPackers]

Tony Romo first broke his collarbone on 9/20/15. He returned to action on 11/22/15, about 9 weeks later. He re-broke it on 11/26/17, about 11 weeks after the initial injury.

It was his non-throwing side, no surgery as you stated, the same situation as Rodgers in 2013 who missed 8 weeks.

There are two takeaways.

1) Broken collarbones are not 100% healed after 8 or 9 weeks as I noted previously.
2) A re-injury risk risk can be taken with the non-throwing side.

Actually the reason given - at the time, anyway, not sure about now - for being pessimistic about his chances of returning this season was something about tissues in the shoulder used for throwing. Apparently there were concerns his throwing motion, speed or velocity would be negatively affected. Apparently those concerns were put to rest by Michele Tafoya, who reported he was throwing during pregame warmups despite being on injured reserve.

 

[TouchdownPackers]

There is no apostrophe in the word Steelers denoting possession. Therefore no it doesn't. lol.

Totally agree with the rest of your post.

I did not type one. Those were quotation marks.

On topic, I'm glad I'm not the only one who thinks we should not be discussing top 20 picks yet.