This draft will make or break Gute and Lafleur

[longtimefan]

Being snarky isn't against the rules just like some people being a ******(ahem) isn't against the rules. I've broken no rules

Did you read the rules? Cuz way I see it, you did break one

 

[I asked LT to delete my acct]

Nope the other dozen threads are not enough for this crappy draft. But really dude you posted on this thread just to say that? I feel your time would have been better spent in a thread you care about.

He`s doing his job as a moderator, you ****** !

 

[TornSolace]

He`s doing his job as a moderator, you ****** !

And I'm.just stating my opinion you ******

 

[TornSolace]

We did not run the ball poorly last year. Should be as good or better.

I think Sternberger will be an upgrade. Lazard should be better. With a good run/pass mix, we should be able to score enough and hold on to the ball long enough.

Stopping the run is definitely the weak spot. Against a normal team, we will do OK. Against the better teams, not so much. I feel better about Martinez leaving. He really only stopped the run 5,6,or 7 yards down the field. I think Rashan should be better and that could help. We have two inside linebackers coming off a year of being hurt. They might be able to help out. The D line...we have to add somebody. Hopefully add two from last year. Very weak here but still have a chance to beat anyone. First things first...the division.

Last year we were an average running team if you look at the stats. Jones had a monster season but overall we were average

 

[TornSolace]

I think getting Jordan Love at #26 was a gamble.
I also believe it’s true that we didn’t get the 5th best WR (or was it 6th?).

Anyway, the reality is that in the long haul.. getting possibly the 3rd to 4th best QB by far trumps getting the 6th best WR as far as value if they both become successful. There’s not even a close comparison between a starting level #1 WR and a starting level #1 QB. If they both play out their contract +. The successful QB will command a massive amount more of value in that comparison.

If they play average range? then i see that as a long-term contract “wash” because the receiver likely gets to production quicker (although Gute seemed to think the WRs left would have minimal impact their rookie season, which I’ll add factors in to this “win now” argument we all have in somewhat negative fashion). However, in that case, the QB enables the team not to have to spend mid round picks or veteran $ executing their contingency plan at QB each year and eventually starts and evens the raw production by catching up rather quickly.

If they both underperform to their ability (or bust) then I see a “slight advantage” to the WR because of the QB long term negative impact is greater than that negative impact of a Wideout. One could say that the QB position is more dynamic overall than a WR.

Those not liking this QB are counting on the QB to bust or near bust for a late 1st rounder. Gute is counting on our QB to either be average or better for his draft stock. But the main point is the reward of our QB performing is far greater than the risk of him not performing. Also the % chance is greater that QB Love (or the lost WR asset) will be average or better (the first 2 scenarios) verses bust (the last 1 scenario), by default.

I understand there’s no way to know until a few years but that’s the whole point of this discussion. None of us including myself or the GB front office will make an accurate summary of the result until we are at least several years into their tenure. This is mainly a hypothetical argument from either standpoint. Getting all worked up about it out of fear (anger derived from fear) won’t help or hurt an argument that takes substantial time to resolve itself. .. it’ll only create a false sense of short term pleasure or displeasure that’s not realistic in the meantime, depending on which argument you support.

There’s a very good argument to support that the WR we chose wouldn’t have came into their Rookie season in the NFL “full throttle”. So we’d be looking at 2-3,seasons before we saw increased production in that #1 or #2 realm at best.
I saw what Gute saw, that those first #3 to #4 consensus Wideouts had a better shot at that early success, but likely not draft #6 or #7 WR or wherever our staff had those remaining guys rated.

Well thought out but I have to disagree because I think we should maximize the present with a known talent in Rodgers but also prepare for the future and they only did one of those things in the draft. They sacrificed the now for the future and Lafleur and Gute's job is tied to Love

 

[TornSolace]

Both Rodgers and Jones were on the 6-9-1 team too.

As to the receivers, I have not heard from Larry yet, but Joe said he has been working out all quarantine with Moss, Rice and Janis and will give it a heck of a try!

Rodgers was done with McCarthy the 6-9 year and so was I Rodgers had no help and our defense sucked I don't put that on Rodgers

 

[Patriotplayer90]

Gute and LaFluer have hardly been here. They may not even be here when Love is ready to play. If they fall short of the AFCC game or worse, then they'll both be on the hot seat for blowing the draft. They already have a huge spotlight for them, not years from now or whenever they expect Love to be ready, but next season. That's why they should have put all effort into winning now, build up the team so that they could sign a bridge QB after Rodgers retires when they draft the next guy. For all we know, they'll be fired and the next regime decides they don't like Love and goes a different direction

 

[CanadaCheese]

He`s doing his job as a moderator, you ****** !

******!!!! I love my British cousins!!!!

 

[TornSolace]

Gute and LaFluer have hardly been here. They may not even be here when Love is ready to play. If they fall short of the AFCC game or worse, then they'll both be on the hot seat for blowing the draft. They already have a huge spotlight for them, not years from now or whenever they expect Love to be ready, but next season. That's why they should have put all effort into winning now, build up the team so that they could sign a bridge QB after Rodgers retires when they draft the next guy. For all we know, they'll be fired and the next regime decides they don't like Love and goes a different direction

I couldn't have said it better myself! And if this does indeed blow up in their face then it's the fans left to endure the mess they created for years to come while we have to build the entire roster up from scratch!

 

[Snoops]

Man I been away for a while! I gotta hop in this conversation.
Green Bay did absolutely nothing to get better... nothing... they are turning into the titans.. saweeeeettt I do agree with gute saying they felt no receiver that came in would help them right away.. I have high hopes for Lazard and Mvs rmbr when Adams SUCKED his second year I rmbr people saying cut him.. let’s stand pat for now I think Dillon will be good but they should put jones at receiver in the slot. He is better than anyone else.. and honestly I think they gonna be boring to watch if they wanna run it 80 times a game.. they need a good defense to do that and they got abused look at how good the nfc is this year.. redskins giants lions panthers in a tier by themselves? The nfc is stacked... good luck.. it’s a damn shame have two HOF qbs for over 30 years and nothing to show for it...

 

[TornSolace]

Man I been away for a while! I gotta hop in this conversation.
Green Bay did absolutely nothing to get better... nothing... they are turning into the titans.. saweeeeettt I do agree with gute saying they felt no receiver that came in would help them right away.. I have high hopes for Lazard and Mvs rmbr when Adams SUCKED his second year I rmbr people saying cut him.. let’s stand pat for now I think Dillon will be good but they should put jones at receiver in the slot. He is better than anyone else.. and honestly I think they gonna be boring to watch if they wanna run it 80 times a game.. they need a good defense to do that and they got abused look at how good the nfc is this year.. redskins giants lions panthers in a tier by themselves? The nfc is stacked... good luck.. it’s a damn shame have two HOF qbs for over 30 years and nothing to show for it...

Lafleur wants to commit to the run but didn't pick up and OL until the 6th round lol
This is a case of saying one thing but in reality meaning a completely other thing. A person can say I do care about winning right now until they are blue in the face but their actions speak louder than words and their actions prove they don't care about the next three seasons! And how many chances are we going to give to MVS and ESB? I mean come on now we have been hoping for a few years now that realize their potential Rodgers needs help

 

[CanadaCheese]

Man I been away for a while! I gotta hop in this conversation.
Green Bay did absolutely nothing to get better... nothing... they are turning into the titans.. saweeeeettt I do agree with gute saying they felt no receiver that came in would help them right away.. I have high hopes for Lazard and Mvs rmbr when Adams SUCKED his second year I rmbr people saying cut him.. let’s stand pat for now I think Dillon will be good but they should put jones at receiver in the slot. He is better than anyone else.. and honestly I think they gonna be boring to watch if they wanna run it 80 times a game.. they need a good defense to do that and they got abused look at how good the nfc is this year.. redskins giants lions panthers in a tier by themselves? The nfc is stacked... good luck.. it’s a damn shame have two HOF qbs for over 30 years and nothing to show for it...

Yup...two Super Bowls, 5 MVP’s, and winning records and playoff appearances > 75% of the time is a bloody tragedy....

 

[TornSolace]

Yup...two Super Bowls, 5 MVP’s, and winning records and playoff appearances > 75% of the time is a bloody tragedy....

No the real tragedy is not capitalizing on those 5 MVPs and winning records think about it this way the cowboys have more rings than us in the past 30 years and havent won a Superbowl since VCRs were the biggest form of home entertainment!

The real tragedy is Aaron Rodgers dropping 45 pts on the Cardinals just for our defense to give up 51 pts the real tragedy is with two HOF QB's we only managed two Superbowls in 30 years and haven't drafted a WR or RB In the first round in the last 15 years. And remember with are last Superbowl with farve are defense let us down In that game also(I cried for two hours)

I agree with you we have a winning record but are playoff exits have been devistating and the fan base have known what we needed and Ted Thompson Mike McCarthy and now MAYBE Gute and Lafleur also(we will see)
I think even with the winning besides the Superbowl the Packers have wasted Rodgers and if he fails to win another ring his career will have been wasted I mean as good as Rodgers is don't you believe he should have at least three rings?

 

[Patriotplayer90]

Yup...two Super Bowls, 5 MVP’s, and winning records and playoff appearances > 75% of the time is a bloody tragedy....

And it's strange how you all can't go seem to acknowledge that these are things which come along with HOF QBs. How many winning records, SBs, and MVPs did they have the 25 years before Favre? How dense can you possibly be?

 

[Snoops]

Also Green Bay had 1 convincing win last year and that was against the raiders... a win is a win but I want to punish people

 

[gopkrs]

Last year we were an average running team if you look at the stats. Jones had a monster season but overall we were average

We should be better and that will open up play action a little more. I think we will be better offensively. I don't think we lose anything in the run game with Bulaga moving on. And I am not so down on Billy Turner. I think he will be better. I like his size and think he is athletic.

 

[TornSolace]

We should be better and that will open up play action a little more. I think we will be better offensively. I don't think we lose anything in the run game with Bulaga moving on. And I am not so down on Billy Turner. I think he will be better. I like his size and think he is athletic.

But how have we gotten better? That is the question. How do we beat great teams like the 49ners when our offense has less talent than last year and our defense is worse? Nobody can answer these questions

 

[CanadaCheese]

No the real tragedy is not capitalizing on those 5 MVPs and winning records think about it this way the cowboys have more rings than us in the past 30 years and havent won a Superbowl since VCRs were the biggest form of home entertainment!

The real tragedy is Aaron Rodgers dropping 45 pts on the Cardinals just for our defense to give up 51 pts the real tragedy is with two HOF QB's we only managed two Superbowls in 30 years and haven't drafted a WR or RB In the first round in the last 15 years. And remember with are last Superbowl with farve are defense let us down In that game also(I cried for two hours)

I agree with you we have a winning record but are playoff exits have been devistating and the fan base have known what we needed and Ted Thompson Mike McCarthy and now MAYBE Gute and Lafleur also(we will see)
I think even with the winning besides the Superbowl the Packers have wasted Rodgers and if he fails to win another ring his career will have been wasted I mean as good as Rodgers is don't you believe he should have at least three rings?

SuperBowls are very hard to win and unless you’ve been able to build and retain overwhelming talent for an extended period of time, multiple SBs are even harder to get (this makes the NE accomplishment even more astounding) It seems like that the Packers could never put strings of offense and defense together at one time and for whatever the reason the stars seemed to align injury problems seemed to come up more than usual. Salary cap, free agency, and a number of other parity actions have really made it hard to keep teams together. I believe TT unwillingness to get FAs when needed also really limited us to get over the hump a few years. In the later years defenses were usually substandard for SB hunting teams
Overall though bring a Packer fan over the past two decades has been pretty easy and enjoyable....a whole lot more enjoyable than living in Detroit or Cleveland for sure!!!!

 

[CanadaCheese]

And it's strange how you all can't go seem to acknowledge that these are things which come along with HOF QBs. How many winning records, SBs, and MVPs did they have the 25 years before Favre? How dense can you possibly be?

Did you refer to me as being dense?

 

[gopkrs]

But how have we gotten better? That is the question. How do we beat great teams like the 49ners when our offense has less talent than last year and our defense is worse? Nobody can answer these questions

How are we less talented on offense? Bulaga? Graham? And we have added a couple pieces. Well, maybe Geronimo.

 

[CanadaCheese]

How are we less talented on offense? Bulaga? Graham? And we have added a couple pieces. Well, maybe Geronimo.

I’m not speaking for anyone else but the offense lost overall capability at RT and another year older is always a negative. Adding Dillion is a plus plus not having to endure anther year of Jimmy G is too. Not sure of Deguria.. overall we probably stayed the same....
On defense while a Martinez wasn’t a great backer, he was game dependable and could tackle....we have no known replacement so that’s a negative plus Father Time again.
The defense last year was horrible against the run and really is a little worse this year on paper
The old adage of “ if you're not growing you’re dying” is appropriate in this situation

 

[Patriotplayer90]

Did you refer to me as being dense?

Yeah, I'd like to take it back though. Now that I thoroughly read his message, I was just moreso referring to people who don't understand what the frustration is.

 

[CanadaCheese]

No the real tragedy is not capitalizing on those 5 MVPs and winning records think about it this way the cowboys have more rings than us in the past 30 years and havent won a Superbowl since VCRs were the biggest form of home entertainment!

The real tragedy is Aaron Rodgers dropping 45 pts on the Cardinals just for our defense to give up 51 pts the real tragedy is with two HOF QB's we only managed two Superbowls in 30 years and haven't drafted a WR or RB In the first round in the last 15 years. And remember with are last Superbowl with farve are defense let us down In that game also(I cried for two hours)

I agree with you we have a winning record but are playoff exits have been devistating and the fan base have known what we needed and Ted Thompson Mike McCarthy and now MAYBE Gute and Lafleur also(we will see)
I think even with the winning besides the Superbowl the Packers have wasted Rodgers and if he fails to win another ring his career will have been wasted I mean as good as Rodgers is don't you believe he should have at least three rings?

Maybe two for Rodgers since that fiasco in Phoenix was real BS and I think they could have run that one to a championship that year realistically

 

[I asked LT to delete my acct]

And I'm.just stating my opinion you ******

And it`s a comma after I`m, you ****** , NOT a full stop. I don`t mind a battle of minds, but I refuse to attack an unarmed man.

 

[I asked LT to delete my acct]

******!!!! I love my British cousins!!!!

I wish I could say the same sir !!