The 2019 Dantés Draft Thread

[Packer96]

I guess you haven't been paying attention to what went down in this thread.

https://www.packerforum.com/threads/packers-hire-titans-oc-matt-lafleur-as-their-hc.82457/

or this one

https://www.packerforum.com/threads/the-mike-pettine-era-may-soon-be-over.82404/

Thought all the smiles and such would indicate I was making a joke and referencing the other thread but I guess not. I'm sorry you didn't get it and took it personally.

OK, no problem, I'm getting old, desperate for another SB before AR is too old, and I know TJ and his family. We would be proud to have him on our team, he won't let us down. We do not want Fant, I know things but I'm not putting them on an internet forum. Also want high draft picks used for offense, not defense. The league has changed, its all about scoring now.

 

[Passepartout]

Yeah as built the team around an offense. It is about scoring. But still the defense does win you the game.

 

[brandon2348]

OK, no problem, I'm getting old, desperate for another SB before AR is too old, and I know TJ and his family. We would be proud to have him on our team, he won't let us down. We do not want Fant, I know things but I'm not putting them on an internet forum. Also want high draft picks used for offense, not defense. The league has changed, its all about scoring now.

A lot of us are hungry for another Super Bowl. I have been on here for the last two years pleading to get the offense what it needs and yes it's become a "30 point league". That's the magic number in most of these games. The Packers have been swimming upstream with a bunch of Thompson failed DB picks amongst other ones and bad personnel moves. Rodgers had a significant injury and finally got tired of bailing out a MM 1990's scheme offense that had become way too predictable and stale. I mean McCarthy couldn't even beat out Gase for the Jets job. What does that tell ya?

Enter Matt Lafleur and a second round of Gute turning over the roster and building HIS roster which could allow things to change in a positive direction quickly. Especially with the draft capital and cap space available.

Yes, we need a TE that can stretch the seam(such as Hockenson) but IMO there are about 3-4 other players on offense we need before TE is addressed due to cap allocation to Graham. Now, if Gute wants to trade back in the first and go "all out offense" like we have defense just about every damn year I'm totally down to pick a TE that can help us with a high pick. However, if the plan is to go Edge, D-tackle, Safety and then add a 3rd round token to the offense then we cant afford to use it on a TE.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

sign me up....will he make it to the 3rd? im thinking not.

I don't know a ton about Hockenson, but based on the game film I have seen, in addition to his receiving skills, he looks like he has some decent speed for his size. I think if he lights it up in the combine, he doesn't make it out of the first round.

 

[brandon2348]

I don't know a ton about Hockenson, but based on the game film I have seen, in addition to his receiving skills, he looks like he has some decent speed for his size. I think if he lights it up in the combine, he doesn't make it out of the first round.

Yep, he is one of those prospects that could come out of the combine anywhere between 1-3 round.

 

[OldSchool101]

I’m not trying to be a party pooper at TE. We should always be prepared at any position.
We just have to look at the facts. While Graham underperformed he also didn’t crash n burn. He ranked #9 in the league in yards and #12 in yards per catch (out of the top 32). Where he suffered was in the Redzone with just 2 TDs. IMO I believe Graham fell into the trap of playing with a partly hobbled QB half a year and double that, in a new playbook. I noticed Jimmy was consistently blanketed in the redzone on many occasions. Now granted, he was solely to blame for a few contested catches that went incomplete, but they weren’t perfectly thrown balls (had heat on them, not thrown in stride, slightly behind him or a little high) or easy catches either. He needs to play better also. But I didn’t see a guy that necessarily needs to be replaced.

We also have a developing young TE in Tonyan. While agreeably it’s a small sample size (4 catches) he was #2 in the league in yards per catch. He’s got significant unlocked potential and year 2-3 is where he will likely take a leap. He doesn’t need to be benched, he needs to be tested.

I think getting the best talent on the field in 2019 is priority. One of the things that hurt us in 2018 was the constant rookie experiment at WR while 2 veteran FA TEs never saw the field.
That said, picking a developmental TE with upside day 3 is totally acceptable but unless a TE slips rounds? (This goes the same for RB btw) 2020 will bring a new set of challenges. The only other exception for me is if We get a starting caliber Safety, Olineman and pass rusher in FA.
It is my opinion it’s critical we stay focused.. It’s no small feet to replace CM3 this year and a Bulaga next OLB/DE, OG, OT, Safety, WR, OLB/DE, OG, OT, Safety, WR, OLB/DE, OG, OT, Safety until we are blue in the face.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

Yep, he is one of those prospects that could come out of the combine anywhere between 1-3 round.

I'm not well versed on combine numbers like many of the guys here are but it has become pretty obvious over time that it can have quiet the influence on draft position. I just find it a bit....interesting, for lack of better words, how far the draft gurus shift guys up or down based on combine results. Another big "test" that we don't get to see and I think ends up having probably an even bigger impact on a player getting drafted, is his interviews and private workouts.

Someday, maybe technology will exist that they will just be able to hook up a few sensors to the players head/brain and look at what his future in the NFL will look like.

 

[brandon2348]

I’m not trying to be a party pooper at TE. We should always be prepared at any position.
We just have to look at the facts. While Graham underperformed he also didn’t crash n burn. He ranked #9 in the league in yards and #12 in yards per catch (out of the top 32). Where he suffered was in the Redzone with just 2 TDs. IMO I believe Graham fell into the trap of playing with a partly hobbled QB half a year and double that, in a new playbook. I noticed Jimmy was consistently blanketed in the redzone on many occasions. Now granted, he was solely to blame for a few contested catches that went incomplete, but they weren’t perfectly thrown balls (had heat on them, not thrown in stride, slightly behind him or a little high) or easy catches either. He needs to play better also. But I didn’t see a guy that necessarily needs to be replaced.

We also have a developing young TE in Tonyan. While agreeably it’s a small sample size (4 catches) he was #2 in the league in yards per catch. He’s got significant unlocked potential and year 2-3 is where he will likely take a leap. He doesn’t need to be benched, he needs to be tested.

I think getting the best talent on the field in 2019 is priority. One of the things that hurt us in 2018 was the constant rookie experiment at WR while 2 veteran FA TEs never saw the field.
That said, picking a developmental TE with upside day 3 is totally acceptable but unless a TE slips rounds? (This goes the same for RB) 2020 will bring a new set of challenges.
It is my opinion it’s critical we stay focused.. OLB/DE, OG, OT, Safety, WR, OLB/DE, OG, OT, Safety, WR, OLB/DE, OG, OT, Safety until we are blue in the face.

It depends if Gute wants to go full metal jacket at putting the best offense we can on the field which I believe is our best chance of winning now. The fact is teams are competing for a Super Bowl right now with worse statistical defenses then ours. The Rams, Cheifs and Pat's all gave up more yards per game then us this year so I'm really getting tired of this edge, safety, LB, DT blah blah blah. Kansas City is the "blueprint" for us like it or not.

Yes, Graham is serviceable and I do believe TE is down the list of offensive needs considering the other needs on offense. However, if we could get the right speed guy in the slot that can be schemed open along with a TE that could stretch the seam we would be on our way to seeing some real nice things happen.

 

[brandon2348]

I'm not well versed on combine numbers like many of the guys here are but it has become pretty obvious over time that it can have quiet the influence on draft position. I just find it a bit....interesting, for lack of better words, how far the draft gurus shift guys up or down based on combine results. Another big "test" that we don't get to see and I think ends up having probably an even bigger impact on a player getting drafted, is his interviews and private workouts.

Someday, maybe technology will exist that they will just be able to hook up a few sensors to the players head/brain and look at what his future in the NFL will look like.

Hockenson has the tape. Fair or unfair he is gonna need to run 4.6 or under to be considered a 1st round prospect while testing well in other areas. If he checks all those boxes then I could see the 1st round grade.

 

[OldSchool101]

It depends if Gute wants to go full metal jacket at putting the best offense we can on the field which I believe is our best chance of winning now.
Yes, Graham is serviceable and I do believe TE is down the list of offensive needs considering the other needs on offense. However, if we could get the right speed guy in the slot that can be schemed open along with a TE that could stretch the seam we would be on our way to seeing some real nice things happen.

While I agree with you on building the O. I think we’re 1 year away from TE unless Noah Fant slips outside #50 etc..
I don’t want to overlap talent by going after another TE that likely won’t surpass Graham unless we bench him like we did Mercedes and Kendricks. We paid 2 FA TEs to warm the bench. We committed to Graham when we signed him to a $30M contract, if we’re going to have second thoughts about him? then we just blew $8M+ I’m not opposed to a TE, just not now. If you want to give up on Graham let’s wait until we see another year with him being our #3 target instead of the obvious #2 in 2018. He’s too much dead $ to put to sleep right now. It’s 3 choices.. part ways, overlap or ride it out 1 year.
Let’s get a WR opposite Adams that can hold his own and knows how to separate and has instincts to come back to the QB and make a play (Jordys replacement) This draft is filled with guys that could develop into a true #2 without even using a 1st rounder. Examples: Parris Campbell, N’keal Harry or a slot guy like AJ Brown.

 

[brandon2348]

While I agree with you on building the O. I think we’re 1 year away from TE unless Noah Fant slips outside #50 etc..
I don’t want to overlap talent by going after another TE that likely won’t surpass Graham unless we bench him like we did Mercedes and Kendricks. We paid 2 FA TEs to warm the bench. We committed to Graham when we signed him to a $30M contract, if we’re going to have second thoughts about him? then we just blew $8M+ I’m not opposed to a TE, just not now. If you want to give up on Graham let’s wait until we see another year with him being our #3 target instead of the obvious #2 in 2018. He’s too much dead $ to put to sleep right now. It’s 3 choices.. part ways, overlap or ride it out 1 year.
Let’s get a WR opposite Adams that can hold his own and knows how to separate and has instincts to come back to the QB and make a play (Jordys replacement) This draft is filled with guys that could develop into a true #2 without even using a 1st rounder.

I'm with ya on Graham as I've posted which due to cap allocation TE is down the list and I don't see them moving on from Graham.

My deal is I want to see Gute give LaFleur, Rodgers and this offense a plethora of weapons. This offseason is a defining moment for this franchise on which direction to go and if they don't do it now on offense then they mine as well pull the plug on the whole damn thing.

 

[OldSchool101]

I'm with ya on Graham as I've posted which due to cap allocation TE is down the list and I don't see them moving on from Graham.

My deal is I want to see Gute give LaFleur, Rodgers and this offense a plethora of weapons. This offseason is a defining moment for this franchise on which direction to go and if they don't do it now on offense then they mine as well pull the plug on the whole damn thing.

No I agree. But it’s really easy for us to get distracted with all the attractive options. I’d take a shot at TE with a 4th rounder etc.. I think it’s very possible we see 1 picked actually. In an NFL satellite radio. interview a few days ago, LaFleur mentioned wanting to focus on the running game more. He believes that will open up the play action. If that’s the case we’re in desperate need of a formidable Guard who can blow someone off their feet, ability to pull and hold the point of attack inside. Cody Ford is an example of having those traits.
Having a RB tandem with marginal dropoff is key. Look at what the LA Rams just did to a very respected Dallas Defense. Look at what KC has done without Hunt. Both are successful passing but both are also 2 dimensional and that’s what keeps Defenses honest... they can flip a switch and eat you up running the ball if you play the pass.

While nobodies talking RB. Don’t be surprised if Gute gets a veteran FA or a late first or second day guy. You’d be amazed how much pressure that would take off Aaron to open up the playbook on 2nd and 3

 

[brandon2348]

While I agree with you on building the O. I think we’re 1 year away from TE unless Noah Fant slips outside #50 etc..
I don’t want to overlap talent by going after another TE that likely won’t surpass Graham unless we bench him like we did Mercedes and Kendricks. We paid 2 FA TEs to warm the bench. We committed to Graham when we signed him to a $30M contract, if we’re going to have second thoughts about him? then we just blew $8M+ I’m not opposed to a TE, just not now. If you want to give up on Graham let’s wait until we see another year with him being our #3 target instead of the obvious #2 in 2018. He’s too much dead $ to put to sleep right now. It’s 3 choices.. part ways, overlap or ride it out 1 year.
Let’s get a WR opposite Adams that can hold his own and knows how to separate and has instincts to come back to the QB and make a play (Jordys replacement) This draft is filled with guys that could develop into a true #2 without even using a 1st rounder. Examples: Parris Campbell, N’keal Harry or a slot guy like AJ Brown.

One other thing while I'm at it. This younger receiver thing and learning all the nuances of Aaron is out the window. 1st and 2nd year players are the lifeblood of this league and were not running the Mike McCarthy offense anymore where it became all about Aaron and his subtle nuances that it evolved too.

Rodgers says he wants to be coached hard and it better be the truth. Follow the new scheme and match it with your talent Aaron and everything will be just fine. Rodgers needs to get back to basics and clean up his mechanics and good things will come. Follow the scheme and hit the open guy.

 

[OldSchool101]

One other thing while I'm at it. This younger receiver thing and learning all the nuances of Aaron is out the window. 1st and 2nd year players are the lifeblood of this league and were not running the Mike McCarthy offense anymore where it became all about Aaron and his subtle nuances that it evolved too.

Rodgers says he wants to be coached hard and it better be the truth. Follow the new scheme and match it with your talent Aaron and everything will be just fine. Rodgers needs to get back to basics and clean up his mechanics and good things will come. Follow the scheme and hit the open guy.

Amen. LacFleur also said he wanted to build the team around his talent. If you think about it, isn’t that exactly the opposite of MM? Did he build the team around his talent? Did he priorituzd this team around the nucleus of talent in Aaron Rodgers? I’m being sarcastic here
Just remember this stat.
In the last 5 years of consecutive drafts.
12 of the 15 first and second day picks were Defense
Not 1 first rounder was an Offensive player.

That’s not adapting to your best talent. That’s ignoring your strength at best and alienating your QB at worst

 

[brandon2348]

No I agree. But it’s really easy for us to get distracted with all the attractive options. I’d take a shot at TE with a 4th rounder etc.. I think it’s very possible we see 1 picked actually. In an NFL satellite radio. interview a few days ago, LaFleur mentioned wanting to focus on the running game more. He believes that will open up the play action. If that’s the case we’re in desperate need of a formidable Guard who can blow someone off their feet, ability to pull and hold the point of attack inside. Cody Ford is an example of having those traits.
Having a RB tandem with marginal dropoff is key. Look at what the LA Rams just did to a very respected Dallas Defense. Look at what KC has done without Hunt. Both are successful passing but both are also 2 dimensional and that’s what keeps Defenses honest... they can flip a switch and eat you up running the ball if you play the pass.

While nobodies talking RB. Don’t be surprised if Gute gets a veteran FA or a late first or second day guy. You’d be amazed how much pressure that would take off Aaron to open up the playbook on 2nd and 3

I have RB right up there with Receiver and OL and agree. As I've posted I like Jones but he is more of a limited carry change of pace back.

I've seen both Bama RB's mocked to us with 32 pick. I personally think we could get LJ Scott later but wouldn't complain either way.

 

[OldSchool101]

I have RB right up there with Receiver and OL and agree. As I've posted I like Jones but he is more of a limited carry change of pace back.

I've seen both Bama RB's mocked to us with 32 pick. I personally think we could get LJ Scott later but wouldn't complain either way.

In a weird way. It would be exciting to get a top notch RB to line up (and rotate) with Aaron Jones Imagine Aaron playing second fiddle.
If someone got hurt our running game might get stronger! Makes ya think

 

[brandon2348]

Amen. LacFleur also said he wanted to build the team around his talent. If you think about it, isn’t that exactly the opposite of MM? Did he build the team around his talent? Did he priorituzd this team around the nucleus of talent in Aaron Rodgers? I’m being sarcastic here
Just remember this stat.
In the last 5 years of consecutive drafts.
12 of the 15 first and second day picks were Defense
Not 1 first rounder was an Offensive player.

That’s not adapting to your best talent. That’s ignoring your strength at best and alienating your QB at worst

I know that "stat" all too well and have painfully lived it. Just imagine if we would of spent 12 of the 15 on offense or even half of those. My $ says we would still be playing right now.

 

[GreenNGold_81]

No I agree. But it’s really easy for us to get distracted with all the attractive options. I’d take a shot at TE with a 4th rounder etc.. I think it’s very possible we see 1 picked actually. In an NFL satellite radio. interview a few days ago, LaFleur mentioned wanting to focus on the running game more. He believes that will open up the play action. If that’s the case we’re in desperate need of a formidable Guard who can blow someone off their feet, ability to pull and hold the point of attack inside. Cody Ford is an example of having those traits.
Having a RB tandem with marginal dropoff is key. Look at what the LA Rams just did to a very respected Dallas Defense. Look at what KC has done without Hunt. Both are successful passing but both are also 2 dimensional and that’s what keeps Defenses honest... they can flip a switch and eat you up running the ball if you play the pass.

While nobodies talking RB. Don’t be surprised if Gute gets a veteran FA or a late first or second day guy. You’d be amazed how much pressure that would take off Aaron to open up the playbook on 2nd and 3

A lot of people are talking RB following the coaching change. Veteran RB's are basically: Coleman, Yeldon, Ingram. Maybe there's a starter in there, but I won't hold my breath. Coleman wants to stay in Atlanta, Yeldon did well as a receiver and hasn't looked well rushing the ball, Ingram is 29 and wants to stay in New Orleans. The value is just so high in rookie first round rb's who can usually come in and produce right away - and play for relatively cheap.

 

[brandon2348]

A lot of people are talking RB following the coaching change. Veteran RB's are basically: Coleman, Yeldon, Ingram. Maybe there's a starter in there, but I won't hold my breath. Coleman wants to stay in Atlanta, Yeldon did well as a receiver and hasn't looked well rushing the ball, Ingram is 29 and wants to stay in New Orleans. The value is just so high in rookie first round rb's who can usually come in and produce right away - and play for relatively cheap.

It worked well with Lacy in 2nd round. Packers got good rookie contract production out of him.

 

[elcid]

Not likely, but not impossible. You never know how their draft board lies. If their #5 overall player, a QB, is sitting there at #12 and we get an offer like last season, to trade back 14 picks for an extra #1 next year from another team that needs a QB, what is Washington going to do? They ask what is it going to take, and we tell them. Do they take their #5 overall player or do they look at a trade value chart that says they are getting screwed? The answer is, they would have traded up to #5 for a 2nd and not batted an eye. There is no difference to do it at #12.

This, thank you. I haven’t been watching the NFL and its draft for too long, but long enough to see teams throw the trade value chart out of the window and start overpaying if they feel like they will miss out on their QB of the future. It obviously all depends on how the draft pans out and the severity of Smith’s injury, but I am sure the Skins wouldnt mind giving up their second if it would mean securing their top QB prospect

 

[elcid]

The problem for the Packers and a potential QB related trade down is that there are 4-5 teams ahead of them that could taking a QB. So if there are 2-3 guys that people like enough to take that high, teams could be looking to trade up much higher than pick #12.

Which did you have in mind? Jaguars and Giants are pretty much locks, but after that its pretty much up for debate. I am guessing you are talking about the Bucs, Broncos and Bengals.

 

[Packer96]

Yeah as built the team around an offense. It is about scoring. But still the defense does win you the game.

If that was the case the Bears and Ravens would be playing this weekend. It's a score league now, not saying I like it, but that's what it is.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

As much as I would like an O lineman that can also run block, a really good inside linebacker has me drooling a bit.

I wouldn't mind the Packers adding an elite inside linebacker but the team has more pressing needs.

they can't go that nuts because Bahk needs re-signed before the end of 2019, if they want to avoid him going to FA, and several key guys come up in 2020 when rodgers' contract takes a really huge bite.

Bakhtiari is under contract through 2020, there's plenty of time to get a deal done with him.

that's next year but after that he's #1 and it isn't even close.

While Rodgers currently holds the highest cap hit in 2020 it's only $800K more than Matt Ryan.

Brate's annual value is 6.8million a season. he's signed until 2024. What do you think a free agent would sign in Green Bay for? My guess is at least that if not higher. Eifert, I agree with, but I doubt they won't express any interest. His injury history will make him cheap. In a team with win now intentions these cheap guys with high upside should be pursued.

Brate doesn't present an upgrade over Graham though. There's no reason to sign Eifert even for a reasonable deal as he can't stay healthy.

It depends if Gute wants to go full metal jacket at putting the best offense we can on the field which I believe is our best chance of winning now. The fact is teams are competing for a Super Bowl right now with worse statistical defenses then ours. The Rams, Cheifs and Pat's all gave up more yards per game then us this year so I'm really getting tired of this edge, safety, LB, DT blah blah blah. Kansas City is the "blueprint" for us like it or not.

Yards per game is a terrible metric to measure the success of a defense. The Patriots and Rams gave up less points than the Packers this season.

It worked well with Lacy in 2nd round. Packers got good rookie contract production out of him.

Lacy was effective for only two seasons though.

 

[Dantés]

Which did you have in mind? Jaguars and Giants are pretty much locks, but after that its pretty much up for debate. I am guessing you are talking about the Bucs, Broncos and Bengals.

I think NYG, JAX, and DEN are strong candidates.

OAK and CIN are, of course, debatable but also possible.

 

[GreenNGold_81]

I wouldn't mind the Packers adding an elite inside linebacker but the team has more pressing needs.

Brate doesn't present an upgrade over Graham though. There's no reason to sign Eifert even for a reasonable deal as he can't stay healthy.

Lacy was effective for only two seasons though.

Brate is 5 years younger, cheaper and a better blocker. His playerprofiler ranks his athleticism close to Ertz so it's not like he has bricks in his shoes. He's 6 million dollars cheaper in 2019. He has scored 6 TD's or more in each of the last three seasons (out scoring Jimmy's paltry 2 this year).

In summary, there are several reasons he is an upgrade over Jimmy.