Packers' defensive line looks to rise to another level

[HardRightEdge]

I think being forced to play Walden at OLB for so many year mentally scarred Capers and it affected the level of freedom he was willing to give future OLBs.

Yeah, I'm sure that's exactly right.

 

[mradtke66]

That's a horrible theory. Walden was a preferred for only 1 year (2011). 2010 he was an injury replacement and 2012 Perry was drafted.

 

[Heyjoe4]

Daniels/Clark/Wilkerson are top tier guys imo. The depth has potential too imo. Montravius Adams was one I was very optimistic about. The foot stress fracture derailed his rookie year. But before the foot he was getting good reports. After he healed he seemed to be producing good for a rookie on a rebound.
Then the taller leaner lowry should be making more plays now that he has some bruisers to soften up and tire out the oline.

And the best news about these five guys, assuming they stay healthy (I know, that’s a BIG assumption) is the depth. If Adams and Lowry can spot for Daniels, Clark, and Wilkerson, that will keep the D line from tiring too quickly during the game. And there’s another assumption that Wilkerson can return to form under former coach Pettine. I like Wilkerson’s chances as he should be motivated to prepare and produce. As for injury, that’s just a wild card - but it seems the guys on the DL have had better luck with avoiding injury than Matthews and Perry on the outside. Here’s hoping Martinez can continue to build and Burks lives up to his 3rd round expectations. And best of all, a productive DL and edge rush makes life easier on a very talented, but young, secondary.

 

[HardRightEdge]

That's a horrible theory. Walden was a preferred for only 1 year (2011). 2010 he was an injury replacement and 2012 Perry was drafted.

It wasn't even Walden anyway. It was the "Combo"...Walden and Zombo. They combined for 7 sacks if memory serves.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

And there’s another assumption that Wilkerson can return to form under former coach Pettine.

I believe a lot of fans put too much stock into Pettine have coached Wilkerson with the Jets as it was only for two seasons and he only had eight sacks in those 32 games.

It wasn't even Walden anyway. It was the "Combo"...Walden and Zombo. They combined for 7 sacks if memory serves.

Walden played in a total of 40 games (starting 26) for the Packers from 2010-12 recording eight sacks. Zombo appeared in 25 games (nine starts) in Green Bay totaling five sacks.

 

[HardRightEdge]

Walden played in a total of 40 games (starting 26) for the Packers from 2010-12 recording eight sacks. Zombo appeared in 25 games (nine starts) in Green Bay totaling five sacks.

I was referring to 2010 where Walden and Zombo did in fact combine for 7 sacks.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

I was referring to 2010 where Walden and Zombo did in fact combine for 7 sacks.

Actually Walden and Zombo combined for six sacks during the regular season for the Packers in 2010 and added another two in the playoffs.

 

[HardRightEdge]

I believe a lot of fans put too much stock into Pettine have coached Wilkerson with the Jets as it was only for two seasons and he only had eight sacks in those 32 games.

A while back I posted Wilkerson's snap counts for each year except his rookie year where I did have the data. I'll reproduce that data here, courtesy of footballoutsiders.com:

2011: ?
2012: 85.3% - 16 games
2013: 94.5% - 16 games
2014: 79.5% - 13 games
2015: 89.3% - 16 games
2016: 81.5% - 15 games
2017: 62.4% - 13 games

I believe a lot of fans do not appreciate the significance of those numbers.

Actually Walden and Zombo combined for six sacks during the regular season for the Packers in 2010 and added another two in the playoffs.

I referenced ESPN stats which credits Walden with 3 sacks during that regular season; pro-football-reference.com credits him with 2 sacks. I'd say it's 6 or 7.

If you followed the sequence of posts, I was referring to a (sarcastic?) contention that Capers was scarred by the Walden experience leading him to dictate the conservative edge rush emphasizing pocket contain that I described.

The fact he got 6 or 7 sacks out of those guys in 2010 running bull rush contains may have led him to think, "hey, if I can get that out of those guys just think what I could get out of Perry doing the same thing."

 

[Deleted member 6794]

I referenced ESPN stats which credits Walden with 3 sacks during that regular season; pro-football-reference.com credits him with 2 sacks. I'd say it's 6 or 7.

It seems Pro Football Reference has Walden's numbers incorrect for the 2010 season as NFL.com lists him with three sacks for that season as well with all of them coming in the Packers must win 10-3 victory over the Bears in week 16.

 

[HardRightEdge]

It seems Pro Football Reference has Walden's numbers incorrect for the 2010 season as NFL.com lists him with three sacks for that season as well with all of them coming in the Packers must win 10-3 victory over the Bears in week 16.

OK. Then it was 7 for the "Combo" in 2010, like I said. I remember that Walden performance. He had 10 solo tackles per ESPN to go with the 3 sacks. He was everywhere that day earning NFC Defensive Player of the Week. He only played 9 games for the Packers that season coming in mid-season, with that Bears game only his second start as a Packer. He had not yet learned the Capers Way.

 

[Heyjoe4]

I believe a lot of fans put too much stock into Pettine have coached Wilkerson with the Jets as it was only for two seasons and he only had eight sacks in those 32 games.



Walden played in a total of 40 games (starting 26) for the Packers from 2010-12 recording eight sacks. Zombo appeared in 25 games (nine starts) in Green Bay totaling five sacks.

If Pettine does his job the entire D will benefit. The fact that he coached Wilkerson earlier in his career doesn’t mean that much to me. And I think Wilkerson will be more motivated to produce in advance of his next contract, and not due to any one, or multiple, coaches. If the entire D is contributing, 4 or 5 sacks from Wilkerson may be plenty.

 

[XPack]

Do we see this as improved defence based on 2 pre-season game?

 

[Heyjoe4]

Do we see this as improved defence based on 2 pre-season game?

Maybe. The proof will have to wait until the games count. On paper, and based on preseason play, yeah they look better. But it’s the preseason and that doesn’t present enough of a gauge. Not for me anyway.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

Maybe. The proof will have to wait until the games count. On paper, and based on preseason play, yeah they look better. But it’s the preseason and that doesn’t present enough of a gauge. Not for me anyway.

The defensive line hasn't been impressive during the first two preseason games by any means. There's no reason for concern as Daniels, Clark and Wilkerson have combined to play only 46 snaps with Daniels not having played at all so far.

 

[Heyjoe4]

The defensive line hasn't been impressive during the first two preseason games by any means. There's no reason for concern as Daniels, Clark and Wilkerson have combined to play only 46 snaps with Daniels not having played at all so far.

Yeah it seems like management is pretty happy with the D line depth. Interesting stat on how little the starters have played. Probably a smart move to avoid injury in otherwise meaningless games for those players. It also gives snaps to other, as yet unproven talent. So just as they keep Rodgers out, it makes sense to protect a proven D line and see what other talent they may have.

 

[XPack]

What's the verdice on secondary? I think it has improved and I'm feeling more confident than last year.

Let's see how they do against Jordy and Amari C today.

 

[Heyjoe4]

What's the verdice on secondary? I think it has improved and I'm feeling more confident than last year.

Let's see how they do against Jordy and Amari C today.

I agree with you X, they do look better. One reason is that they have natural corners playing corners. Randall was a safety in college and they played him as a CB, and Hyde was a DB in college and they played him as a safety. In King, Alexander, and Jackson, they have true corners.

I’ve been very impressed with Jackson, and I’ll admit I wasn’t crazy about the pick. Now, it looks like they got a bargain getting him in the 2nd round. And we really haven’t seen what Alexander and King can do - but King reminds me of Richard Sherman, long, rangy, great body control, and fast.

The real test will of course come in the regular season. But I like what I see so far.

As for the rest of the secondary, well here’s hoping HaHa returns to his Pro Bowl form (he will) and Josh Jackson makes the 2nd year “jump”.

And with that D-line, hopefully the job of the secondary will be easier.

 

[XPack]

I just learnt that the defence plays without plans in preseason. They just have basic coverage and let the backs play to their instinct.

Coach can learn about the players and does not tip our strategy for regular season.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

What's the verdice on secondary? I think it has improved and I'm feeling more confident than last year.

The secondary looks improved but there's no reason to put too much stock into their performance during the preseason as they haven't faced an elite offense so far.

 

[Conso]

I mean at some point shouldn't the Training staff be...fired? Like, they have one job. It's obvious they can't do it...

Btw, I am not a MM hater like some have claimed. I just call what I see.personally, I think it's time for new blood ( Pending they don't reach the SB this season).

Yea but it also the players responsibility to take care of themselves too, staff can only do so much and at the field, players need to take care of themselves off the field AND in the offseason. Not to mention doing what the staff suggests, eat better, exercise at home more etc. It’s like if the doc tells you to stop eating greasy food, most people don’t listen until it’s too late or something serious happens.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

The secondary looks improved but there's no reason to put too much stock into their performance during the preseason as they haven't faced an elite offense so far.

I really don't put much stock into the preseason at all. Maybe stock in the parts of a team, but not in the whole. Gone are the days of seeing the starting offenses and defenses play for a good portion of the first half of the first 3 games. Gone is really seeing all the starters as a collective group for more than a series or two on offense in one game and perhaps longer on defense. Gone is seeing this happen at the same time for both teams, due to different philosophies of when to put the starters out there. The Preseason has become nothing but 2 teams practicing full on against each other, mainly with as few of their important pieces as possible. I understand why this approach is used, fear of injuries and the need to give the young players a chance to show what they have and gain experience. However, I have to wonder if in the long run you end up with a team that takes longer to jell and come together in the early stages of the season. But I guess as long as all the teams are doing it that way, you are on equal grounds and a player like Rodgers, just how much preseason does he need to be ready?

 

[JK64]

The secondary looks improved but there's no reason to put too much stock into their performance during the preseason as they haven't faced an elite offense so far.

I don't trust the defense either. They will have to show me. I do like Jackson. I think he improves the secondary.

 

[HardRightEdge]

I just learnt that the defence plays without plans in preseason. They just have basic coverage and let the backs play to their instinct.

Whoever told you that is lying. Or shall we say oversimplifying?

There's a game plan. It just may not be targetted to matchups as in the regular season since you are playing against a lot of unknown quantities and you're prepping 90 players to be tested in certain situations against who knows who.

They practice what they plan to play against a scout team in preseason. The scout team will do something resembling what the opponent likes to do. Plays are called and the players will be graded on how they execute to the call. The DBs are not just playing man; I see a fair amount of zone coverage, some of it quite good in the red zone. That doesn't happen without playing to a plan formed in practice and then evaluated on execution to the plan.

Do teams save some wrinkles for the regular season? Sure. Is the defense pure "vanilla"? I see a fair amount of variation.

Do you think CBs won't bother to look at film of the QBs they intend to face? I think their coaches would be disappointed in that.

In short, there is a lot of preparation that goes into these games if for no other reason than guys are being evaluated on how they prepare. It's just not hyperfocused on and tweeked for a specific opponent and specific matchups.

 

[HardRightEdge]

The secondary looks improved but there's no reason to put too much stock into their performance during the preseason as they haven't faced an elite offense so far.

It is hard to imagine the secondary being other than significantly improved given the attrocious play last season and what we've seen so far in preseason, level of competition notwithstanding. The talent upgrade is visible and meaningful.

Besides, the 31st. ranked passing defense last year based on the passer rating against of 102.0, with a 67.8% completion percentage surrendering 7.9 yards per attempt and 37 TD passes on only 513 throws while snagging only 11 interceptions, amounts to making their QB opponents Hall of Famers in the aggregate. Those are Tom Brady numbers.

There is nowhere to go but up.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

However, I have to wonder if in the long run you end up with a team that takes longer to jell and come together in the early stages of the season. But I guess as long as all the teams are doing it that way, you are on equal grounds and a player like Rodgers, just how much preseason does he need to be ready?

It seems the Packers are taking an even more cautious approach with their starters during the preseason than most other teams though. Nevertheless they have been able to start strong out of the gate several times.