Packers 1st round selection, #12 overall: Rashan Gary, DE

[easyk83]

I hope I am wrong, but I think our defense will continue to struggle against average and above offenses. When the Packers get in trouble is when the offense runs up against a really good defense and can't put as many points on the board and the defense can't give them the support by keeping the score close.

While I understand what you are saying, "IF, the defense improves in the next 6-7 games, Pettine might have another season in Green Bay". I just don't expect to see a big enough improvement to warrant giving Pettine a 4th season.

And by IF I mean that the unit turns into a very good defense not merely solid, which of course is unlikely.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

At that position, and with what Gary is illustrating, there is zero reason to imagine another player picked instead. Dude is straight making us better.

I think he was talking about the 2 picks used on Love and Dillon and how they might have improved the defense this season. It is easy to say that, but you just never know. If Love and Dillon prove to be great picks in the coming years, then they were the right picks.

 

[tynimiller]

Sorry thread is on Gary, didn't make that connection.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

Sorry thread is on Gary, didn't make that connection.

Who is this Gary guy I keep hearing about?

 

[Heyjoe4]

Even though everyone wanted a WR, just imagine a good DL or ILB with those first picks.

Agreed. An improved ILB group would do a lot to fix GB's ability to stop the run. A guy like Patrick Queen would have been a good start.

 

[El Guapo]

Gary was drafted after the Smith’s had signed.

That is my point. The Packers ended 2018 with an aging Clay Matthews, a disappointing Nick Perry, nobodies in Reggie Gilbert and Kyler Fackrell at OLB. Their plan for the position had imploded. They had to bring in the Smiths on massive FA contracts, and then they drafted one guy (Gary) to eventually take over.

 

[Heyjoe4]

Check this site out,

https://nflcombineresults.com/playerpage.php?i=27414

Gary ranked above average for the position in arm length and broad jump and was in elite company in his 10, 20 40 yard and vertical. The results were even more impressive once you factor in his size. Not many 6'4 275 pound players run a 4.58 40 ,put up a 120 inch broad jump and throw up 26 reps on the bench despite those 34 inch arms. Size speed length and strength there aren't that many players with his natural talent. Now it looked like a workout warrior, but he's looking not only like he could be a really good player for us but a dominant one too.

Agreed. Michigan used him in a different role. It takes time to adapt from college anyway. But he looks like a different player this year. He's stronger, leaner, and faster than last year. As a result, this might be Preston Smith's last year.

 

[gopkrs]

For fans, is there anything wrong with the "what have you done for me lately?" position?

I hate the what have you done for me lately mentality. I mean, if it has been a really long time...OK. But so many people are so fickle and start hating way too soon imho. I mean, for example. If someone actually wins you a Super Bowl. Like Pederson. And all of a sudden you don't have an O line and your QB just stinks. Why call for the guy's head? Just don't agree with it. Now McCarthy, that was different. But it (to me), was not, what have you done for me lately as much as you don't do much right and you keep all of your terrible coaches. Just don't like it at all when it comes too fast.

 

[sschind]

I blame Crosby, overpaid jerk!

At least Crosby shows up and tackles. Maybe we should make meniscus or meningitis or whatever his name is our DC. Might light a fire under our defensive guys and it would probably help our special teams as well.


To be fair I don't think anyone ever called Crosby a jerk. Just overpaid and over rated. Although I'm betting he was called far worse in the chat when he missed those extra points.

 

[Heyjoe4]

That is my point. The Packers ended 2018 with an aging Clay Matthews, a disappointing Nick Perry, nobodies in Reggie Gilbert and Kyler Fackrell at OLB. Their plan for the position had imploded. They had to bring in the Smiths on massive FA contracts, and then they drafted one guy (Gary) to eventually take over.

And they have guys like Alexander, King, Amos, Savage, and a resurgent Tonyan and Gary. There is not a lack of talent on this team. SB talent? We're about to find out.

 

[Heyjoe4]

I think he was talking about the 2 picks used on Love and Dillon and how they might have improved the defense this season. It is easy to say that, but you just never know. If Love and Dillon prove to be great picks in the coming years, then they were the right picks.

Correct. I didn't like the draft this year, but I'm not Gluten. And any draft really needs 3 years before it can be graded. I'm willing to change my initial opinion.

 

[Heyjoe4]

At least Crosby shows up and tackles. Maybe we should make meniscus or meningitis or whatever his name is our DC. Might light a fire under our defensive guys and it would probably help our special teams as well.


To be fair I don't think anyone ever called Crosby a jerk. Just overpaid and over rated. Although I'm betting he was called far worse in the chat when he missed those extra points.

After all these years, I still don't understand the criticism of Crosby. He delivers when it's money time, mostly. Not every kicker is gonna be Justin Tucker.

 

[Heyjoe4]

I hate the what have you done for me lately mentality. I mean, if it has been a really long time...OK. But so many people are so fickle and start hating way too soon imho. I mean, for example. If someone actually wins you a Super Bowl. Like Pederson. And all of a sudden you don't have an O line and your QB just stinks. Why call for the guy's head? Just don't agree with it. Now McCarthy, that was different. But it (to me), was not, what have you done for me lately as much as you don't do much right and you keep all of your terrible coaches. Just don't like it at all when it comes too fast.

I think MM was given plenty of time. He just couldn't adjust. And as far as the "what have you done for me lately", well that describes almost every job I've ever had. People forget that the players wanna win a SB just as much as we want them to win a SB. We're all figuratively on the same team.

 

[gopkrs]

And as far as the "what have you done for me lately", well that describes almost every job I've ever had. People forget that the players wanna win a SB

Yeah, it is definitely a sign of the times imho. There is a difference between all of a sudden just not doing your job as in your work job and just going through a rough patch. People today are not too interesting in discerning which is which. imo. I guess the danger is keeping someone around too long. I just don't like screamin for heads too soon. And I think it happens all too soon these days. Instant gratification .

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

To be fair I don't think anyone ever called Crosby a jerk.

I was giving Captain the Business as well as being quite factious in calling Crosby a jerk. Crosby is getting paid what the market for kickers is, like it or not. Some teams wish they had a Mason Crosby on their team.

 

[swhitset]

I was giving Captain the Business as well as being quite factious in calling Crosby a jerk. Crosby is getting paid what the market for kickers is, like it or not. Some teams wish they had a Mason Crosby on their team.

Minnesota comes to mind lol.

 

[sschind]

Minnesota comes to mind lol.

The vikings probably wish they still
had Ryan longwell .

After all these years, I still don't understand the criticism of Crosby. He delivers when it's money time, mostly. Not every kicker is gonna be Justin Tucker.

I completely understand Captains criticism of Crosby. He (Captain) is a PFF numbers kind of guy and from a strict statistical point of view the numbers do show that Crosby is not an elite kicker from a career percentage wise (although his career percentage is creeping up) even though he is paid like one. The problem with PFF and strict stats guys is that they do not take in certain intangibles. So yeah, I do understand some people's criticism of Crosby. I just don't agree with it.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

The vikings probably wish they still
had Ryan longwell .



I completely understand Captains criticism of Crosby. He (Captain) is a PFF numbers kind of guy and from a strict statistical point of view the numbers do show that Crosby is not an elite kicker from a career percentage wise (although his career percentage is creeping up) even though he is paid like one. The problem with PFF and strict stats guys is that they do not take in certain intangibles. So yeah, I do understand some people's criticism of Crosby. I just don't agree with it.

Stop being logical, we just have fun giving Captain the business about Mason.

Wait til Captain hears that JK Scott just got a new contract that makes him the highest paid punter in the league!

 

[easyk83]

The vikings probably wish they still
had Ryan longwell .



I completely understand Captains criticism of Crosby. He (Captain) is a PFF numbers kind of guy and from a strict statistical point of view the numbers do show that Crosby is not an elite kicker from a career percentage wise (although his career percentage is creeping up) even though he is paid like one. The problem with PFF and strict stats guys is that they do not take in certain intangibles. So yeah, I do understand some people's criticism of Crosby. I just don't agree with it.

Whoa whoa whoa PFFs numbers are not stats. It's a helpful guide for fantasy purposes but people actually in the business tend to treat that site like a punch line, or more accurately call it trash. Specifically how can you assign a numerical grade without knowing the playbook or the assignments. For that matter how many of their graders have even played the game or spent professional time in it. If a blitzer comes off the edge for a sack hurry or pressure without being blocked, was it the OTs assignment to block that rusher or was it supposed to be a free runner?

To me, lawyer speaking, PFF might be regarded as persuasive authority(AT BEST) or a thing to be considered but not a final conclusive source.

According to TJ Lang, in an appearance on a Detroit radio show, he once challenged PFF to provide a sit down film session with the gentleman who ranks offensive linemen. Apparently PFF declined because that person resides in Bangladesh and it would be inconvenient.

https://detroit.cbslocal.com/2017/09/13/tj-lang-pro-football-focus-is-absolute-garbage/

 

[gopkrs]

Didn't know whether to mark it informative or funny because of the last line.

 

[PikeBadger]

And they have guys like Alexander, King, Amos, Savage, and a resurgent Tonyan and Gary. There is not a lack of talent on this team. SB talent? We're about to find out.

If you look at the 67, 95, 96 and 2010 teams, there were talent question marks at some of the position groups on those teams as well. I think we still may be missing one game changer on defense.

 

[easyk83]

If you look at the 67, 95, 96 and 2010 teams, there were talent question marks at some of the position groups on those teams as well. I think we still may be missing one game changer on defense.

You dont have to be good everywhere, its whether or not the things you do well can make up for the things you don't. Obviously we need better and more consistent play from our defense if we're going the distance.

How explosive is your pass rush, does it make up for weak coverage? Is your coverage good enough to make your pass rush better? Are your corners good enough to play safeties up in the box ETC. If a defense has glaring weaknesses is it part that it lacks those types of strengths to cover them up?

 

[El Guapo]

If you look at the 67, 95, 96 and 2010 teams, there were talent question marks at some of the position groups on those teams as well. I think we still may be missing one game changer on defense.

Didn't the '95 team lose to the Cowboys just like the 1994 and 1993 teams? Your point is spot on though. That 2010 team especially had a lot of players missing on IR but had a lot of heart, and the backups and UDFAs really stepped up. On today's roster, our OL is mirroring that type of championship season. However, we need more out of MVS & Lazard, more out of the ILBs, and more out of every DB not named Jaire....but probably need him to take it to a championship level and stop being a punk (standing over receivers, chest bumping them, etc.).

 

[Half Empty]

I hate the what have you done for me lately mentality. I mean, if it has been a really long time...OK. But so many people are so fickle and start hating way too soon imho. I mean, for example. If someone actually wins you a Super Bowl. Like Pederson. And all of a sudden you don't have an O line and your QB just stinks. Why call for the guy's head? Just don't agree with it. Now McCarthy, that was different. But it (to me), was not, what have you done for me lately as much as you don't do much right and you keep all of your terrible coaches. Just don't like it at all when it comes too fast.

Everything is relative, so what's a reasonable period of time before we can judge someone's performance (and, does it vary between players, positions, coaches?).

 

[Heyjoe4]

Yeah, it is definitely a sign of the times imho. There is a difference between all of a sudden just not doing your job as in your work job and just going through a rough patch. People today are not too interesting in discerning which is which. imo. I guess the danger is keeping someone around too long. I just don't like screamin for heads too soon. And I think it happens all too soon these days. Instant gratification .

Yep, calling for someone's head is easy in pro sports. GB just has a history of holding onto guys too long (MM, Capers) or hiring the wrong people AND holding onto them too long (Bart Starr, as coach). Ten years is about it for a HC these days, and I think only Mike Tomlin has defied that.