Mike Pettine's Defence

[PackerDNA]

the Chargers have traded defensive back Desmond King to the Titans for a sixth round pick

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

I hope LaFleur has some constructive ideas about all of this.

How about......

You must be logged in to see this image or video!

and tomorrow would be a fitting day to do so.

 

[Jerellh528]

packers defense is the only team in the nfl this season giving up a 100% scoring rate to opposing teams in the red zone. Bend and break lol.

You must be logged in to see this image or video!

 

[PackerDNA]

How about......

You must be logged in to see this image or video!

and tomorrow would be a fitting day to do so.

I don't see Pettine getting fired this season. Possibly if they get gouged again by the 49ers, who will basically be playing with a preseason game lineup.
After the season I think it's better than 50/50 he's gone, as I don't see this defense improving much if at all the rest of the way.

 

[gonzozab]

the Chargers have traded defensive back Desmond King to the Titans for a sixth round pick

Yet another Super Bowl contender making a move to make a playoff push while Gute continues to twiddle his thumbs and "be in talks" with various players.

 

[pacmaniac]

packers defense is the only team in the nfl this season giving up a 100% scoring rate to opposing teams in the red zone. Bend and break lol.

You must be logged in to see this image or video!

When you include FGs, all defenses will be giving up a 100% or near 100% scoring rate. You'd have to hope the other team misses the FG, or that you stop them on a 4th down or get a turnover in order to not be at 100%.

 

[Jerellh528]

When you include FGs, all defenses will be giving up a 100% or near 100% scoring rate. You'd have to hope the other team misses the FG, or that you stop them on a 4th down or get a turnover in order to not be at 100%.

well going only by TDs we’re 28th in the league, giving up a TD 74% of the time. 1st place is the bears, they give up red zone TDs 40% of the time. No team in the nfl last year gave up red zone TDs more than 73% of the time, so here’s to hoping we start to improve on that number some. We’re also 29th in the league in opponent points per play, so not only are they scoring TDs in the red zone, it’s not taking many plays to get there.

 

[gatorpack]

When you include FGs, all defenses will be giving up a 100% or near 100% scoring rate. You'd have to hope the other team misses the FG, or that you stop them on a 4th down or get a turnover in order to not be at 100%.

Most teams are able to create a turnover every now and then at some point. That stat says we are the only team giving up 100%. That means we are dead last. There is no pretty way you can put that.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

Just one game, on one night, but Tampa Bay didn't look like world beaters by squeaking out a 2 point win over the 1-7 Giants. Giants had a chance to tie it up at the end with a 2 point conversion, flag for PI thrown against TB and picked up. MLF and Petting have to be scratching their collective heads as to how the Giants came close to beating the Bucs.

Had to laugh, think it was Booker Booger McFarland that kept calling Tampa Bay "The Patriots". Might have to change their names to "The Tampa Bay Brady's" when his career ends.

 

[Mondio]

Isn't his name Booger?

Had to laugh, think it was Booker McFarland that kept calling Tampa Bay "The Patriots". Might have to change their names to "The Tampa Bay Brady's" when his career ends.

 

[Mondio]

A nice way of saying "you are a smart guy, but aren't doing so well getting your coaches to coach". A DC's job is not necessarily to individually instruct players as much as it is to individually instruct his coaches. When DB's don't look good, you go to the DB coaches, when the DL is struggling, you look to those coaches. When the whole defense is struggling, you go to who?

isn't that what I said?

the players for not putting up any resistance when getting punched in the face and maybe some of the coordinators that Mike has assembled to implement his plans.

I think it was exactly that, his former boss telling him he's better than the product and needs to figure it out. It wasn't an indictment on Pettine necessarily.

 

[PikeBadger]

well going only by TDs we’re 28th in the league, giving up a TD 74% of the time. 1st place is the bears, they give up red zone TDs 40% of the time. No team in the nfl last year gave up red zone TDs more than 73% of the time, so here’s to hoping we start to improve on that number some. We’re also 29th in the league in opponent points per play, so not only are they scoring TDs in the red zone, it’s not taking many plays to get there.

Where does our defense rank in 3 and outs? In turnovers created? Those are the two more important stats to me.

 

[Mondio]

Where does our defense rank in 3 and outs? In turnovers created? Those are the two more important stats to me.

we were up in there 3 and outs, not sure after last game. It is an important stat, but it's like if they don't get that, it's a score, and lately it's TD's. At least before they'd give up yards and force FG's. you can't just give up TD's and expect your offense to create a lead and then force them into playing offense into the strength of your defense.

They have to get better in at least forcing FG's if they can't get off the field. Forcing a 3 and out is fine, it's preferred. But if a defense is forcing a lot of punts over 4 or 8 plays, i'm ok with that too. Just force the punt.

I wonder how many punts this defense has forced vs other defenses.

 

[Jerellh528]

Where does our defense rank in 3 and outs? In turnovers created? Those are the two more important stats to me.

Takeaways per game were tied for last with 0.6 per game. Can’t find 3 and outs, I’ll keep looking but opponent 3rd down percentage were ranked 18th at 43%.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

Sick of that ridiculous excuse. Thompson has been gone for 3 years now giving him plenty of time to fill every single damn one of the holes on this team. Aside from Lazard, he's given us complete sh-t at WR, nothing on the DL, and only about average at ILB, OL. And even at CB, yeah he made a terrific pick with Alexander, but seems to have grabbed another Ahmad Caroll with Josh Jackson.

Drafting mediocre talent in and of itself is a fireable offense, and his approach so far to early round picks is garbage. ENOUGH OF THIS!!!!

I agree that Gutekunst hasn't adequately addressed several positions on the roster. My point was that he's not the one to blame for having to spend another first and second rounder on cornerbacks though.

Not nit-picking, but in fairness you point out when others are wrong. Our first two picks were clear back ups, and not even the #1 back-up at their positions but the 2nd. Deguara was the "starter" at the H-Back out the gate, but I concede not a starter in the terms we all discuss.

Our 4th pick, Kamal, was by all accounts slated to be a starter until his injury, and now back is illustrating why. So really just our first 3 picks, one may argue 2.5 picks were for back ups.

*Edited, wait, I gotcha - you're including our 4th round draft selection we traded away in the four. If that is the case, I'm back on board and understand - apologies for the confusion.

Yeah, I included the fourth rounder traded away to move up for Love.

When you include FGs, all defenses will be giving up a 100% or near 100% scoring rate. You'd have to hope the other team misses the FG, or that you stop them on a 4th down or get a turnover in order to not be at 100%.

Well, the Packers ranked only 31st in the league in points allowed per red zone opportunity before this week as well if you put more stock into that stat.

Where does our defense rank in 3 and outs? In turnovers created? Those are the two more important stats to me.

The Packers defense ranked third in three-and-out percentage after week 7. The have only created four turnovers which is tied with the Raiders and Texans for worst in the league.

I wonder how many punts this defense has forced vs other defenses.

The Packers defense ranked 12th best in punts forced per drive before playing the Vikings.

 

[PikeBadger]

Team lacks a turnover creating defender. Need to find one in the next draft.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

so why tell him to go coach them himself if he doesn't think he can do it?

isn't that what I said?

I think it was exactly that, his former boss telling him he's better than the product and needs to figure it out. It wasn't an indictment on Pettine necessarily.

So by your thinking, as long as a boss is better than his product, his job is always safe?

If your job is to watch over, teach and guide a large group, but the group is so large that you have to hire assistants to help you to do that, your job performance isn't judged just on your knowledge. You are going to be graded on how well you transfer your knowledge to your assistants and how well they instill it on those that they train. "The buck stops here"

If your boss says "Hey Mondio, you are a bright fella, but WTF are all these guys you are in charge of doing out there? If I could, I would make you do every one of their jobs to show them how its done." You wouldn't take that as criticism of your ability to do your job, the job to teach and lead?

Isn't his name Booger?

Fixed it

 

[Mondio]

So by your thinking, as long as a boss is better than his product, his job is always safe?

If your job is to watch over, teach and guide a large group, but the group is so large that you have to hire assistants to help you to do that, your job performance isn't judged just on your knowledge. You are going to be graded on how well you transfer your knowledge to your assistants and how well they instill it on those that they train. "The buck stops here"

If your boss says "Hey Mondio, you are a bright fella, but WTF are all these guys you are in charge of doing out there? If I could, I would make you do every one of their jobs to show them how its done." You wouldn't take that as criticism of your ability to do your job, the job to teach and lead?



Fixed it

NO, that isn't at all what I said. sometimes I think you like argue just to argue too. I basically said the same thing you did. Where did I say his job should always be safe? Obviously he needs to find a way to get the knowledge from his head about how he wants this defense run to the players on the field and run it better than they are. I simply said I didn't take it as a rub on Pettine, but rather the staff he's assembled around him. ie, "go teach them yourself" because Ryan KNOWS that Pettine knows better and it's time he gets better out of his product. He also called out the players for getting punched in the face repeatedly and taking it.

why are you trying to make say something i'm not?

 

[El Guapo]

You can be a good coach but the message gets stale. It happens with CEOs as well. Sometimes you just need to change the message at the top, and all of the little things fall into line. If LeFluer changes the defensive coordinator, we hopefully won't have to hear coach talk about gap integrity, missed tackles, lack of energy, point of attack, blah blah blah. The team will just start playing better.

I rarely hop onto the "fire the coach" bad wagons, but assuming the 49ers run the ball effectively against us on Thursday night it will be THE right time for LeFluer to make a change. That would give the promoted DC a week-plus to usher in a new attitude. The real problem is whom to promote? Jerry Gray seems to be the only strong candidate in the room.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

Team lacks a turnover creating defender. Need to find one in the next draft.

Funny you said that, because I often watch how the Packers tackle and where the runner is holding the ball. Obviously, making the tackle is the #1 priority and the Packers seem to be struggling with that as of late. However, I can't tell you how many times it looks like an easy punch or pull out, especially for the second guy in, yet the Packers seem content just to "try" and make the tackle. Towards the end of the Vikings game, when the Packers really needed a turnover, I saw a few opportunities to do this wasted. One thing I always get nervous about with the Bears defenses, seems like that mentality of ripping the ball out, is instilled in them.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

NO, that isn't at all what I said. sometimes I think you like argue just to argue too. I basically said the same thing you did. Where did I say his job should always be safe?

I guess to me and the author of the article I sited:

"Rex Ryan Rips Green Bay Packers Defensive Coordinator Mike Pettine"

it was pretty apparent that Rex Ryan was being highly critical of Pettine. Your reply seemed to try and rebuke that.

I wouldn't necessarily say he was calling out Pettine as much as he was the players for not putting up any resistance when getting punched in the face and maybe some of the coordinators that Mike has assembled to implement his plans. When he says, "come on mike, go coach them yourself" I think it's saying he knows pettine is a better defensive coach than the product on the field.

I disagree with you, Rex Ryan, Pettine's former boss, was totally calling out Pettine. So no, you and I weren't saying the same thing.

As far as his job being safe, if you don't see him as the problem, isn't his job safe?

 

[Pugger]

Just one game, on one night, but Tampa Bay didn't look like world beaters by squeaking out a 2 point win over the 1-7 Giants. Giants had a chance to tie it up at the end with a 2 point conversion, flag for PI thrown against TB and picked up. MLF and Petting have to be scratching their collective heads as to how the Giants came close to beating the Bucs.

Had to laugh, think it was Booker Booger McFarland that kept calling Tampa Bay "The Patriots". Might have to change their names to "The Tampa Bay Brady's" when his career ends.

The Gmen ran the ball pretty well and their QB got it out of there quick. If NY had a decent QB they could have won that game. That QB should have eaten the ball at least 2 times and took the sack. He threw a pick every time and that saved Tampa.

 

[El Guapo]

Funny you said that, because I often watch how the Packers tackle and where the runner is holding the ball. Obviously, making the tackle is the #1 priority and the Packers seem to be struggling with that as of late. However, I can't tell you how many times it looks like an easy punch or pull out, especially for the second guy in, yet the Packers seem content just to "try" and make the tackle.

IMO - what I highlighted above is the key. The first guy in should be tackling at the thigh in today's game. It keeps you low to avoid penalties, yet high enough to avoid players running out of the feet tackles. If your team is taught and rewarded for team tackling, that is where the second third and fourth guys should be punching and ripping. I never want to see the first guy go for the ball. Team tackling is the key to turnovers.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

The Gmen ran the ball pretty well and their QB got it out of there quick. If NY had a decent QB they could have won that game. That QB should have eaten the ball at least 2 times and took the sack. He threw a pick every time and that saved Tampa.

It was a frustrating game to watch for me, since I was under the impression that Tampa Bay was the best team in the NFC by the way that they mauled the Packers. Granted, just one game, but seeing a 1-7 team play them that tight, set my expectations of the Packers back a notch or two.

 

[GleefulGary]

I’m not defending Pettine, but on a re-watch, the issues on the defense have a lot more to do with effort and tackling. Guys just flat out missed tackles, particularly Darnell Savage. He was bad.

There are some issues with the team makeup. You look at the edge, and Preston Smith and Z are minuses against the run. Preston has been bad this year, but Z is at least effective as a pass rusher. Rashan Gary has been bad against the run, when that was a strength of his coming out of college. Is it coaching? Is it effort? Is it scheme? I really don’t know. I have no idea what tackling drills they do, but they aren’t doing them well, that’s for damn sure.

I don’t think Pettine is here for the next season. I’m not sure firing him mid-season really does anything either, but I expect if SF with a limited roster runs and passes all over us, then he’s gone.

This game was kind of a perfect storm for Minnesota. It was very, very, windy, which limited the pass. Our defense is set up to defend the pass, not the run. I don’t really agree with their thinking there, but that’s what they’ve done with the roster composition. Our biggest mismatch on offense was the passing game vs their limited secondary. The wind more than nullified that. It was a fluke game, but also illuminated some major issues. Here’s to hoping they can find a way to fix it.