Might as well trade Rodgers....

[GleefulGary]

You mentioned 1 year . In what year 13 for Rodgers ?

How long has Gute been the GM?

 

[Deleted member 6794]

Not making a deal does not mean they’re satisfied with the roster. If they were satisfied, they wouldn’t have been in the trade market.

Solely being in trade market without actually pulling off a move doesn't improve the roster though.

I don't care if we have a better receiver, scoring points isn't really our issue outside of 1 game.

It might be worth noting that happened against the only goid defense the Packers have faced all season.

6 Divisions won in those 10 years and 8 playoff appearances, easily can be said were Super Bowl contenders every year except the years' Aaron got hurt.....there are what "maybe" 3 other teams that have been better in that time as a whole?

It remains a fact that for whatever reason the Packers weren't goid enough to make it to the Super Bowl in any of those seasons though.

 

[Mondio]

Solely being in trade market without actually pulling off a move doesn't improve the roster though.



It might be worth noting that happened against the only goid defense the Packers have faced all season.



It remains a fact that for whatever reason the Packers weren't goid enough to make it to the Super Bowl in any of those seasons though.

it would also be worth noting our offensive line was destroyed that game.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

it would also be worth noting our offensive line was destroyed that game.

True, better talent at wide receiver would help Rodgers get rid of the ball faster though.

 

[Mondio]

True, better talent at wide receiver would help Rodgers get rid of the ball faster though.

maybe. but when the best WR in the league at getting open in his first 3 steps can't get open off the line because they know they don't have to respect any developing plays, good luck. They played the back half of the defense right on the LOS practically because they had complete faith their pass rush was going to squash any play other than the quick ones. when you can do that as a defense you get deflections like we saw. They could play exactly how they wanted on defense, I don't think another WR would have done a lot.

I think running at them and not turning to the long ball to take a quick lead again would have, but then we played right into their hands.

 

[XPack]

Ah, the obligatory thread is here.

 

[Pugger]

Not making a deal does not mean they’re satisfied with the roster. If they were satisfied, they wouldn’t have been in the trade market.

Exactly. None of us reading this forum know what Gute and company did or didn't do before the trade deadline. TT and MM had no problem moving on without Favre because they knew they what they had with Rodgers. Until Love shows MLF and that staff he is the real deal it would be a dereliction of duty to trade a QB of Rodgers' abilities without a viable option in his stead going forward.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

but when the best WR in the league at getting open in his first 3 steps can't get open off the line because they know they don't have to respect any developing plays, good luck.

The Packers not having another wide receiver aside of Adams the Bucs had to be worried about contributed to them being able to play defense like they did though.

Exactly. None of us reading this forum know what Gute and company did or didn't do before the trade deadline.

It doesn't matter as the only thing of importance is that they actually didn't do anything to improve the roster.

 

[Pugger]

The Packers not having another wide receiver aside of Adams the Bucs had to be worried about contributed to them being able to play defense like they did though.



It doesn't matter as the only thing of importance is that they actually didn't do anything to improve the roster.

Would you have given Houston a 2nd round pick and a player for Fuller for half a season? IMO that price was too steep. And just getting a WR wasn't going to get us to the SB.

Let's assume Gute made inquiries to other teams for defensive help but couldn't find a trading partner. Is that his fault too? I am just as frustrated that we couldn't improve the roster but it takes 2 to tango.

 

[Mondio]

They didn't play with 3 guys on Adams off the line. They just played everyone up close. if Adams couldn't get open in 3 steps, I doubt anyone else would with any consistency either. Things were working ok when we were running at them not laterally against the speed of those Lb'ers and we worked within the offense. It went to crap when we had to play catch up and try to go downfield. Then it was unfavorable down and distances, longer developing plays etc.

could another WR have helped? Maybe, but it would have been because Rodgers ran around enough and found someone, not because we were effective with any sort of offense. There wasn't time for anything downfield and if you don't have to respect downfield at all, it's a lot easier to play defense.

 

[Pugger]

True, better talent at wide receiver would help Rodgers get rid of the ball faster though.

I believe better play at the OL will help Rodgers more than anything else. If your QB is under siege and has no time to even set his feet to throw it won't matter who is at WR.

 

[swhitset]

They didn't play with 3 guys on Adams off the line. They just played everyone up close. if Adams couldn't get open in 3 steps, I doubt anyone else would with any consistency either. Things were working ok when we were running at them not laterally against the speed of those Lb'ers and we worked within the offense. It went to crap when we had to play catch up and try to go downfield. Then it was unfavorable down and distances, longer developing plays etc.

could another WR have helped? Maybe, but it would have been because Rodgers ran around enough and found someone, not because we were effective with any sort of offense. There wasn't time for anything downfield and if you don't have to respect downfield at all, it's a lot easier to play defense.

I can’t speak with authority... because I didn’t watch the games, but the Bears and Giants faired much better against Tampa than we did. They are not an unstoppable force, and their defense can be scored on.

 

[Mondio]

I can’t speak with authority... because I didn’t watch the games, but the Bears and Giants faired much better against Tampa than we did. They are not an unstoppable force, and their defense can be scored on.

i know, we played with very little effort all over that field after those turnovers. Our o line in particular was garbage. We have better RB's, QB and at least 1 pass catcher than either of those teams. We played like crap and then played right into their hands

 

[Deleted member 6794]

Would you have given Houston a 2nd round pick and a player for Fuller for half a season? IMO that price was too steep. And just getting a WR wasn't going to get us to the SB.

Let's assume Gute made inquiries to other teams for defensive help but couldn't find a trading partner. Is that his fault too? I am just as frustrated that we couldn't improve the roster but it takes 2 to tango.

I agree that giving up a second rounder to acquire Fuller for the rest of the season would have been too steep a price to pay.

Just for the record, I'm not criticizing Gutekunst that he wasn't able to acquire help at the trade deadline but advocate to judge him based on what he has actually done and not consider rumored inquires when evaluating his work.

They didn't play with 3 guys on Adams off the line. They just played everyone up close. if Adams couldn't get open in 3 steps, I doubt anyone else would with any consistency either. Things were working ok when we were running at them not laterally against the speed of those Lb'ers and we worked within the offense. It went to crap when we had to play catch up and try to go downfield. Then it was unfavorable down and distances, longer developing plays etc.

could another WR have helped? Maybe, but it would have been because Rodgers ran around enough and found someone, not because we were effective with any sort of offense. There wasn't time for anything downfield and if you don't have to respect downfield at all, it's a lot easier to play defense.

Actually the game against the Bucs turned on Rodgers' pick six with the Packers leading by 10. There was no need to play catch up at that point.

In my opinion the Bucs were able to play that aggressive as they didn't have to respect any other receiver than Adams. Another talented player at the position might have helped.

I believe better play at the OL will help Rodgers more than anything else. If your QB is under siege and has no time to even set his feet to throw it won't matter who is at WR.

It's true the offensive line needs to play better against good defenses as well. More talent among the pass catchers helps them with Rodgers being able to throw the ball faster as well though.

 

[thequick12]

maybe. but when the best WR in the league at getting open in his first 3 steps can't get open off the line because they know they don't have to respect any developing plays, good luck. They played the back half of the defense right on the LOS practically because they had complete faith their pass rush was going to squash any play other than the quick ones. when you can do that as a defense you get deflections like we saw. They could play exactly how they wanted on defense, I don't think another WR would have done a lot.

I think running at them and not turning to the long ball to take a quick lead again would have, but then we played right into their hands.

Guess you haven't seen Julio Jones take quick screen after quick screen to the house. Adams is really good at it too he almost always gets positive yards.

If you had both of those guys the bucs defense would not have been able to play such a high pressure style of defense. They would of had to play more coverage. They were able to do it because they had one of the best man corners in the league on adams. And he has the benefit of knowing yes that they were gonna make Rodgers get rid of it quick but also that he had safety help over the top. If you had another top 5 wr on the other side he would of had a field day...even a will fuller would of balled out

 

[Mondio]

Guess you haven't seen Julio Jones take quick screen after quick screen to the house. Adams is really good at it too he almost always gets positive yards.

If you had both of those guys the bucs defense would not have been able to play such a high pressure style of defense. They would of had to play more coverage. They were able to do it because they had one of the best man corners in the league on adams. And he has the benefit of knowing yes that they were gonna make Rodgers get rid of it quick but also that he had safety help over the top. If you had another top 5 wr on the other side he would of had a field day...even a will fuller would of balled out

I have
and if you think those passes were working against Tampa that day I would disagree. By a lot.

and why would they have had to play coverage? If they're confident the rush is getting there and they don't have to play the downfield game, why would they?

anyway, no kidding a WR like Julio would help. How can it not? Would it be enough? I don't think it mattered in that game and would it be worth the cost? Not at all. Atlanta couldn't get enough to make it worth the cost to them to trade him and we didn't have enough to even begin to entertain the idea.

 

[PikeBadger]

Have 2 top 5 wide receivers on the same team along with an elite QB and elite LT and top 5 or 6 RB? I think expectations perhaps have drifted out of the reality zone.

 

[Mondio]

I agree that giving up a second rounder to acquire Fuller for the rest of the season would have been too steep a price to pay.

Just for the record, I'm not criticizing Gutekunst that he wasn't able to acquire help at the trade deadline but advocate to judge him based on what he has actually done and not consider rumored inquires when evaluating his work.



Actually the game against the Bucs turned on Rodgers' pick six with the Packers leading by 10. There was no need to play catch up at that point.

In my opinion the Bucs were able to play that aggressive as they didn't have to respect any other receiver than Adams. Another talented player at the position might have helped.



It's true the offensive line needs to play better against good defenses as well. More talent among the pass catchers helps them with Rodgers being able to throw the ball faster as well though.

I know when the game turned. I know there was no need to play catch up at that point, yet they did. He tried to get the lead back "right now" and what did that do? Deep pass to Jones, Deep pass again to someone else, and then another pass. 3 incomplete passes, some out of shotgun 20 seconds off the clock and punt.

quick 3 and out and then what? Tampa TD.

Then what? 7 yard run and instead of just moving chains, get this offense going. DEEP ball to MVS miss. 3rd down shotgun, sack and punt. Another 3 and out. Every time we tried to go deep, we missed. first couple drives, we kept everything quick and short and moving chains and we scored points.

Then we gave up another TD before half and another TD coming out of the half. We played right into their hands. I know we didn't "have to" play catch up but you could clearly see they were trying to get right back in it with the next play instead of working withing the offense and moving chains, keeping the ball and taking shots when they opened up. They were trying to force it.

as to the Adams thing. Show me where there defense was all on him? They didn't put 2 guys on him at the LOS. They played him like they play any other WR except they didn't respect anything past 5 yards down the field because their rush was getting there pretty much every play.

 

[thequick12]

I have
and if you think those passes were working against Tampa that day I would disagree. By a lot.

and why would they have had to play coverage? If they're confident the rush is getting there and they don't have to play the downfield game, why would they?

anyway, no kidding a WR like Julio would help. How can it not? Would it be enough? I don't think it mattered in that game and would it be worth the cost? Not at all. Atlanta couldn't get enough to make it worth the cost to them to trade him and we didn't have enough to even begin to entertain the idea.

If during the draft this year we offer them our first round pick they'd probably do it. They may even do it for a 2nd round pick.

The Packers offered a 4th round pick for a rental of will fuller idk the point is if they had another guy that you had to double the bucs would not have been able to play as aggressive as they did. You keep saying they knew the pass rush was gonna get there so they played coverage the way they did. What if it's the other way around they played so aggressive with their front 7 because they knew all they had to do was cover davante adams... and they had once again 1 of the best corners in the nfl shadowing him with help. So carlton davis was on davante who was gonna cover julio? Some guy who was gonna get eaten up for 200 yards and 2 tds that's who...and I get that julio may not be realistic but they need to do something.

It just doesn't seem like a solid philosophy to say ok we have a future hall of fame qb so we don't have to invest in the skill positions, I don't get that...I guess maybe that's just 2 sides of a coin and I'm on the other side. I have a foh qb I'm getting him as many weapons as possible.

Then again I was in favor of trading a 3rd for marshawn lynch, a 3rd for randy moss, a 3rd for Tony gonzalez...

 

[Mondio]

I'm not saying NOT getting people is the right move. there are costs and we're in this situation right now. Nothing is coming to help, fuller was not worth a 2nd, Julio either because we're cutting people to take his remaining owed cap.

BUT where we are, we can win. I feel we could have won that tampa game had our Oline played better and we didn't panic and think we needed the lead with a pass. it went from bad to worse in the blink of an eye when it could have been played with balance and we're in it the entire time.

anyway, none of it works if you don't execute. whoever it is. I know this offense is good enough to win big games if the offensive line is offering adequate protection. They didn't hardly stand in the way of that pass rush once it went downhill that day.

 

[thequick12]

I'm not saying NOT getting people is the right move. there are costs and we're in this situation right now. Nothing is coming to help, fuller was not worth a 2nd, Julio either because we're cutting people to take his remaining owed cap.

BUT where we are, we can win. I feel we could have won that tampa game had our Oline played better and we didn't panic and think we needed the lead with a pass. it went from bad to worse in the blink of an eye when it could have been played with balance and we're in it the entire time.

anyway, none of it works if you don't execute. whoever it is. I know this offense is good enough to win big games if the offensive line is offering adequate protection. They didn't hardly stand in the way of that pass rush once it went downhill that day.

Honestly the biggest problem in that game was once Rodgers got hit he just went off the rails and couldn't get back on track. I suppose we can blame it on the offensive line but I mean it's football the qb gets hit and he has to be able to play well after he does. It's pretty clear that he's terrified of Suh, I'm not saying I wanna get hit by those guys either because that's a defense full of mean athletic dudes that are trying to hurt Rodgers and I don't mean intentionally injure tho a few of them are probably in that category. But they're all trying to inflict pain on the opponent every play...

Also like you said the game plan was poor and for all the good I see in mlf over mccarthy the one thing mccarthy had was the ability to make halftime adjustments to his game plan come out in the 2nd half and look like a different team. It seems with mlf if they get punched in the mouth in the first half it just gets worse in the 2nd

 

[Deleted member 6794]

I agree the offensive line played poorly vs. the Buccaneers but the Packers having another legit receiver most likely would have slowed down their pass rush as well.

As a side note, there's no way the Packers will be able to afford Julio Jones next offseason. It would be smart not to suggest otherwise.

 

[thequick12]

I agree the offensive line played poorly vs. the Buccaneers but the Packers having another legit receiver most likely would have slowed down their pass rush as well.

As a side note, there's no way the Packers will be able to afford Julio Jones next offseason. It would be smart to suggest otherwise.

Did you mean it wouldn't be smart to suggest otherwise or it would be smart to suggest otherwise like another player?

Either way I guess it means the same essentially.

They could afford julio for sure if they don't resign aaron jones. Which if it's jones or jones that's tough but I think I take jones

 

[Deleted member 6794]

Did you mean it wouldn't be smart to suggest otherwise or it would be smart to suggest otherwise like another player?

They could afford julio for sure if they don't resign aaron jones. Which if it's jones or jones that's tough but I think I take jones

I wanted to say that it would be smart not to suggest otherwise.

The Packers wouldn't be anywhere close to being able to fit Julio's contract under the cap solely by not re-signing Aaron Jones.

 

[thequick12]

Would you have given Houston a 2nd round pick and a player for Fuller for half a season? IMO that price was too steep. And just getting a WR wasn't going to get us to the SB.

Let's assume Gute made inquiries to other teams for defensive help but couldn't find a trading partner. Is that his fault too? I am just as frustrated that we couldn't improve the roster but it takes 2 to tango.

Yes that is his fault he's the gm. Is what I would say in a traditional power structure like they had under wolf and TT. It gets a bit more murky where blame lies under the current power structure.

But if what happened was gute wouldn't budge off of a 4th rounder I do blame him. He should of at least tried to offer 3rd as it would of been better than anything the Texans are gonna get for Fuller now by at least 1 pick and more likely a full round.

I never heard anything about and a player?

And the defensive thing was his fault for sure if he called around and found no deals because reasonable deals were made for good defensive players

Db Desmond King 6th round pick
Ilb Kwon alexander conditional 5th round pick & kiko alonso
Ilb avery williamson & 7th round pick for 5th round pick
Olb/de carlos dunlap for ol bj finney & 7th round pick
Olb marcus golden for 6th round pick