How should Packers address CB

[Pokerbrat2000]

I am still not convinced, or maybe it is just hope, that TT isn't done with FA signings or other ways besides the draft to improve the defense. He hinted to such during an interview at the owner's meeting, although that was in regards to Running backs. There aren't a lot of FA options at CB at this point, but that doesn't mean he can't trade or keep his eyes open for other options besides the draft. Same goes with trying to bring in depth or upgrades at both OLB and ILB.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

BTW none of them has performed even at a decent level without being aided by a veteran #1 cornerback on the field.

Very true and key statement right there. Which is why I think we and others have been shaking our heads at why a #1 wasn't signed.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

I am still not convinced, or maybe it is just hope, that TT isn't done with FA signings or other ways besides the draft to improve the defense. He hinted to such during an interview at the owner's meeting, although that was in regards to Running backs. There aren't a lot of FA options at CB at this point, but that doesn't mean he can't trade or keep his eyes open for other options besides the draft.

Well, the Saints won't sign Malcolm Butler to an offer sheet nor trade the 11th pick in this year's draft for him, so there's still a possibility to acquire him.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

still no answer? you made a specific statement to which I asked a specific question, twice, now 3 times. i know the definition of insanity, but here it goes, who?

I respect your opinion and your posts have made it very clear that in your opinion that once Perry was resigned, there were no other options for TT to improve the pass rush. I respectfully disagree and contend that not only could the pass rush have been improved through FA's or a trade for OLB's, the secondary could have been improved, which would have also improved the pass rush in a few ways; not allowing a QB to complete a quick pass and allowing Capers the ability to blitz more, instead of having to drop more guys into coverage. The same can be said about improving the Defensive line, which in turns improves the pass rush. Instead, TT so far has only added two players to an already weak defense, Devon House and Francois and lost three, Peppers, Jones and Hyde.

So if you need a list of defensive players that could have helped our defense as well as its pass rush, I would invite you to look at all of the posts discussing that very subject and the players talked about. I'm not going to compile that list of players that has already been debated ever since the regular season ended and just reopen the discussion of each, because you find none of them worthy of anything but a minimum contract.

 

[Mondio]

You'd make a very good force field for the death star with deflections like that. Wth a few twists and spins too. Pass rushers, you said none. I said after Perry FA was pretty slim in that regard. But hey, let's open this up to include that if any better player exists in a roster other than GBs, Ted isn't doing his job to get them here.LOL


Still, not one pass rusher named. I guess this will help steer clear of having anything associated with your name when the season ends and we can't bust your chops for not attaching your name to guys like a Rolando McClain or something

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

You'd make a very good force field for the death star with deflections like that. I guess this will help steer clear of having anything associated with your name when the season ends and we can't bust your chops for not attaching your name to guys like a Rolando McClain or something

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I will make it easy for you, if you search threads you will find my name associated with:

1. Resigning Peppers
2. Connor Barwin
3. John Simon
4. Calais Campbell
5. Elvis Dumervil
6. Trades to upgrade
7. 2-3 CB's that would have improved the secondary

Tuck this list away in your "I told you so" files, so that you have ammo for the end of the season, so you can post "See I told you Connor Barwin would have been a flop in Green Bay". It is really hard for me to understand how the Packers doing very little thus far in the offseason to improve a below average defense can excite you and that you truly think that it was because they didn't have any options. I would have much more respect for your position if you just said "The Packers have a great defense and all it needed was to get healthy and sign a guy like House, Francois and a couple of rookies."

 

[PikeBadger]

I am still not convinced, or maybe it is just hope, that TT isn't done with FA signings or other ways besides the draft to improve the defense. He hinted to such during an interview at the owner's meeting, although that was in regards to Running backs. There aren't a lot of FA options at CB at this point, but that doesn't mean he can't trade or keep his eyes open for other options besides the draft. Same goes with trying to bring in depth or upgrades at both OLB and ILB.

Agree, there are at least a half dozen teams that are probably going to jettison players for salary cap reasons.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

Agree, there are at least a half dozen teams that are probably going to jettison players for salary cap reasons.

While you bring that up on several occasions I'm still waiting for an answer about how many players that were cut shortly before the season by other teams Thompson has signed that made an impact with the Packers. I can't think of any.

 

[Mondio]

Man you draw some interesting conclusions from my posts. Somehow you believe that I believe we have a juggernaut defense?

I recognize we have holes. I also recognize that barwin was probably the best name on that list that could have been had to help with the very specific question to your very specific statement about Ted doing nothing to upgrade it, and he's in a 2 year nosedive in production and not getting younger.

So while I recognize the need I can also recognize what was available and the likelihood of them being the answer. In FA, we did sign the best pass rushing OLB available.

Trades are still an option and not likely to happen until draft time or end of TC time if at all. There are still lots of options of those FA still available at that tier of production and likely will have plenty available again after cuts and we have the draft.

 

[XPack]

Trade #1 pick?

Maybe package it along with Randall/Rollins and solve 2 problems at once?

 

[Deleted member 6794]

Trade #1 pick?

Maybe package it along with Randall/Rollins and solve 2 problems at once?

There's no reason to trade two players at the weakest position on the roster at all.

 

[Favre>Rodgers259]

With less than 30 days left in the Draft, FA is pretty much dead. However, there is one veteran CB that I've been interested in us signing all along; Leon Hall. Granted he recently turned 32, he still has something left in the tank and would make a great veteran/leadership addition and would be a good option to line up in the slot. If we went CB in the 1st Round I could see the depth chart as: 1. House 2. 29th Overall, 3. Hall, 4. Gunter, 5. Rollins, 6. Randall. That's my evaluation of the secondary at this time, I'd be more than happy to watch everyone from 3-6 compete to move up the depth chart.

If for some reason a "Day 1" CB isn't available. - Meaning they are an NFL Starting CB from the moment they shake Goodell's hand and hold up the jersey. I would go Edge. I'd still sign Hall because we'd need some additional help in the scenario that we sign a CB in Round 2 or 3 that's not ready Day 1 and allow them to develop without the additional pressure of trying to handle elite NFL WRs from the start. That Round 2 or Round 3 selection would depend on if there was an OL, RB, or another LB/DL who was just too good to pass up in that corresponding round. After Round 3, draft BPA based on need.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

With less than 30 days left in the Draft, FA is pretty much dead. However, there is one veteran CB that I've been interested in us signing all along; Leon Hall. Granted he recently turned 32, he still has something left in the tank and would make a great veteran/leadership addition and would be a good option to line up in the slot. If we went CB in the 1st Round I could see the depth chart as: 1. House 2. 29th Overall, 3. Hall, 4. Gunter, 5. Rollins, 6. Randall. That's my evaluation of the secondary at this time, I'd be more than happy to watch everyone from 3-6 compete to move up the depth chart.

The Packers don't need a slot cornerback like Hall but one capable of playing on the perimeter. I truly hope House doesn't end up #1 on the depth chart this season.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

With less than 30 days left in the Draft, FA is pretty much dead. However, there is one veteran CB that I've been interested in us signing all along; Leon Hall. Granted he recently turned 32, he still has something left in the tank and would make a great veteran/leadership addition and would be a good option to line up in the slot. If we went CB in the 1st Round I could see the depth chart as: 1. House 2. 29th Overall, 3. Hall, 4. Gunter, 5. Rollins, 6. Randall. That's my evaluation of the secondary at this time, I'd be more than happy to watch everyone from 3-6 compete to move up the depth chart.

If for some reason a "Day 1" CB isn't available. - Meaning they are an NFL Starting CB from the moment they shake Goodell's hand and hold up the jersey. I would go Edge. I'd still sign Hall because we'd need some additional help in the scenario that we sign a CB in Round 2 or 3 that's not ready Day 1 and allow them to develop without the additional pressure of trying to handle elite NFL WRs from the start. That Round 2 or Round 3 selection would depend on if there was an OL, RB, or another LB/DL who was just too good to pass up in that corresponding round. After Round 3, draft BPA based on need.

I don't think Free Agency is "pretty much dead", there are still quite a few FA and RFA's out there to be had. They are still available because they are either asking too much or the right team hasn't approached them. I don't know enough about Hall, but nothing I have read excites me as far as him being a #3 and I don't think it will just because of the hit he broke Jordy's ribs with, that the Packers wouldn't be interested. Seems like just another body, which we have plenty of.

If nothing else is done in the Free Agent Market, I see the #1-3 spots being wide open for House, Randall, Rollins, Gunter and a rookie to earn. It will be competitive, I just don't think as high of quality as it should or could have been. Fingers are starting to cross that Randall, Rollins or both prove a lot of us wrong and play much better.

 

[sschind]

I think the packers should wait on a CB in the draft get bigger need like an OL,RB or pass rusher before they go get CB. I think Randall and Rollins will bounce back after their sophomore slump. They also were bang up lots last year. And the addition of House might boost the position too

I'm replying to this before reading any of the other comments because I can't really think of a post that has made me instantly think of a reply. My reply would be You might be the only one who thinks this way. Now I'll go back and see how many people have already said it or something similar.

To answer your question though I don't know that there is a bigger need for the Packers than CB. I'm not ready to call R&R busts like so many people are but they do have questions surrounding them. How they should address the position depends on where the players fall in the draft. I wouldn't be a fan of trading up to get the best CB in the draft as some have suggested. It would simply cost too much. On the other hand if that player or another top prospect falls to within reach I would not be opposed to trading up to get him. If we stand pat at 29 I wouldn't make a blanket statement like "We should draft the best CB available" either which has also been proposed. Such a situation could easily mean a reach to fill a position while another better player at a position of lesser need might be passed over.

As I have said before, if the best player, or even top 2 or 3 at some positions, at any position other than QB, K, P, long snapper or center, drops to #29 I'm going to be happy as heck if the Packers draft him regardless of the position he plays. If all players are pretty much equal at that point and its not a reach then I think they should draft a CB.

 

[sschind]

I am still not convinced, or maybe it is just hope, that TT isn't done with FA signings or other ways besides the draft to improve the defense. He hinted to such during an interview at the owner's meeting, although that was in regards to Running backs. There aren't a lot of FA options at CB at this point, but that doesn't mean he can't trade or keep his eyes open for other options besides the draft. Same goes with trying to bring in depth or upgrades at both OLB and ILB.

I don't believe for a minute that Ted isn't constantly looking at ways to improve the team and that includes FAs and trades. Its just that what he sees as ways to improve it and what he is willing to give up to do it are much different than most fans.

 

[Favre>Rodgers259]

The Packers don't need a slot cornerback like Hall but one capable of playing on the perimeter. I truly hope House doesn't end up #1 on the depth chart this season.

GB needs all the help it can get at CB; Randall couldn't cover anyone last year, and Rollins wasn't as bad but he had his moments which cost us big, plus he was out several games due to injury. But I most definitely see House on the outside. In my preferred scenario, our 1st Round Pick is starting opposite House with Hall at the slot. Let Randall, Gunter, and Rollins sit on the bench until they can prove they belong out there or they fill in due to injury.

I don't think Free Agency is "pretty much dead", there are still quite a few FA and RFA's out there to be had. They are still available because they are either asking too much or the right team hasn't approached them. I don't know enough about Hall, but nothing I have read excites me as far as him being a #3 and I don't think it will just because of the hit he broke Jordy's ribs with, that the Packers wouldn't be interested. Seems like just another body, which we have plenty of.

If nothing else is done in the Free Agent Market, I see the #1-3 spots being wide open for House, Randall, Rollins, Gunter and a rookie to earn. It will be competitive, I just don't think as high of quality as it should or could have been. Fingers are starting to cross that Randall, Rollins or both prove a lot of us wrong and play much better.

There are dozens of no-names that you could sign to the roster to fill out training camp and the practice squad I suppose but other than some aging stars (which I will admit Leon Hall is) as a stopgap option who would you add that honestly says, "On Paper, the Packers just got Better"?


Sidenote: I know everyone is praying that Randall and Rollins both had "Sophomore Slumps", but I find that extremely wishful thinking. What if they are just Ahmad Carroll and Joey Thomas reincarnate? I find that scenario equally farfetched, but one or the other being a bust I find highly likely. My money's on Randall. So the next question is, how long does TT hold on to either, and how many games do we lose until he realizes he has to do what he must?

 

[kevans74]

Gilmore was honestly the only one really worth the money he got for CBs in my honest opinion... and that's even pushing it

We have a lot of FAs coming up too

 

[Deleted member 6794]

GB needs all the help it can get at CB; Randall couldn't cover anyone last year, and Rollins wasn't as bad but he had his moments which cost us big, plus he was out several games due to injury. But I most definitely see House on the outside. In my preferred scenario, our 1st Round Pick is starting opposite House with Hall at the slot. Let Randall, Gunter, and Rollins sit on the bench until they can prove they belong out there or they fill in due to injury.

I agree the Packers desperately need improvement at cornerback but mostly on the perimeter. While House will probably start on the outside I don't want him to cover opposing top receivers.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

We have a lot of FAs coming up too

Only a few starters are headed towards free agency in 2018. There's no need to roll over a ton of cap space from next season.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

I don't believe for a minute that Ted isn't constantly looking at ways to improve the team and that includes FAs and trades. Its just that what he sees as ways to improve it and what he is willing to give up to do it are much different than most fans.

I agree, that Ted is looking at ways to improve the team, but I think the biggest knock on him (for me) is that he has a bit too much confidence in "his own guys" and not enough confidence in "someone else's guys". What seems to happen with that strategy is waiting too long to prove a player worthy and in the process losing out on an opportunity of another player actually being worthy. Hate to use poker analogies too much, but its like a game I play. A player can play the whole hand that he is dealt or at certain times, buy cards to try and improve his hand. I see Ted as that guy sitting at the table always playing his same 5 cards, not wanting to gamble that he might spend money on a crappy card that could ultimately have improved his hand.

 

[Favre>Rodgers259]

I agree the Packers desperately need improvement at cornerback but mostly on the perimeter. While House will probably start on the outside I don't want him to cover opposing top receivers.

And who's your alternative? Gunter? He has great instincts don't get me wrong but he got torched by far less than top WRs. I'll take House and our 1st Rounder over anything currently on the roster. If anything, let Gunter line up in the slot and let R&R fight over the leftovers in the Dime or Prevent Defense (Whoops, that belongs to Burnett.....back to the bench you go.)

 

[Deleted member 6794]

And who's your alternative? Gunter? He has great instincts don't get me wrong but he got torched by far less than top WRs. I'll take House and our 1st Rounder over anything currently on the roster. If anything, let Gunter line up in the slot and let R&R fight over the leftovers in the Dime or Prevent Defense (Whoops, that belongs to Burnett.....back to the bench you go.)

I'm still holding out hope that Thompson somehow acquires a #1 cornerback before the start of the season. If it's House covering opposing top receivers I don't expect the pass defense to significantly improve in 2017.

 

[PFanCan]

I challenge the common assumption that Ted picks a CB in the first round. Watch him pick a TE.

 

[Favre>Rodgers259]

I challenge the common assumption that Ted picks a CB in the first round. Watch him pick a TE.

And I would personally fly a drone to firebomb his house.