Fire Capers

[Sky King]

I wouldn't say "almost certainly". You have to factor in the missed tackles, and the fact that we gave up 88 big plays during the regular season (runs over 10 yds and passes over 25 yds). Only 6 teams gave up more.

Point of clarification: The columnist's conclusion.

 

[gbpack]

Fire the whole bunch of them! From the top down on down unless you are happy to live in mediocrity.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

Fire the whole bunch of them! From the top down on down unless you are happy to live in mediocrity.

I thought this was sarcasm, until the last part. I don't know still, was it?

If it wasn't. Let's live by your philosophy and at the end of each season fire all the coaches, if they didn't win a SuperBowl. Then what? Hire all new coaches that will guarantee us a Super Bowl win. *Googles "flavors of kool aid"*

Mediocrity: "the quality of something that is not very good"

 

[C-Lee]

The defense bailed out this team the entire season. Peppers blew his assignment on the last play.

While I didn't like the decision to switch to zone, I'm tired of this fire Capers crap. Best defense we've had since 2010.

 

[Half Empty]

The defense bailed out this team the entire season. Peppers blew his assignment on the last play.

While I didn't like the decision to switch to zone, I'm tired of this fire Capers crap. Best defense we've had since 2010.

So, good D in 2010, good D this year, so we ignore the intervening four years?

 

[C-Lee]

So, good D in 2010, good D this year, so we ignore the intervening four years?

Fair point, but why now?

 

[Un4GivN]

So, good D in 2010, good D this year, so we ignore the intervening four years?

People need to do their jobs as easy as that... Peppers doesn't mess up and the game is different. Capers shouldn't have to babysit a professional athlete so that he knows his assignment.

It is not the scheme that is flawed... It is the personnel.

No scheme in the history of defense in the NFL leaves a receiver without someone within 20 yards. Peppers wanted to be a hero and do more than his job. Why do you think belichick coaches "Do your Job". Because the scheme is set up to succeed as long as people just do what they are suppose to do.

I don't believe this personally, but if you are going to fire anyone. Fire TT for bringing guys in that freelance, or don't have talent to run the scheme. But trust me it is not Capers fault they lost Saturday. He would be near the bottom of my list of people to blame.

 

[Half Empty]

I pretty much admire the way you address topics here, so don't take the points below personally. The major point, in fact, is that you refer to things that happened this year, and I conceded the D was good. What I was driving at is the 'blind pig' concept - Capers stumbled on a good D in 2010 and 2015, but in 2011-2014, the D was the Achilles' heel of the Pack.

People need to do their jobs as easy as that... Peppers doesn't mess up and the game is different. Capers shouldn't have to babysit a professional athlete so that he knows his assignment. Then who should? If it was anyone but Peppers, fine. But if you run a D where somebody like that is confused, maybe it's the scheme.

It is not the scheme that is flawed... It is the personnel. As above, maybe, maybe not. However, I expect a coach to get the most out of what he has to work with. Adapt the scheme to the personnel. Round pegs, square holes, that sort of thing.

No scheme in the history of defense in the NFL leaves a receiver without someone within 20 yards. Peppers wanted to be a hero and do more than his job. I'm not enough of an Xs and Os guy, nor am I a psychologist. I don't know why people did what they did. Why do you think belichick coaches "Do your Job". Because the scheme is set up to succeed as long as people just do what they are suppose to do. If it's the right scheme and if people are capable of doing what they're supposed to do.

I don't believe this personally, but if you are going to fire anyone. Fire TT for bringing guys in that freelance, or don't have talent to run the scheme. But trust me if this was written by a lot of posters, I'd be all over it, but I think I understand what you're saying it is not Capers fault they lost Saturday. Again, my point has never been that he was. I'm pointing to the other Capers years and wondering how he's lasted this long. He would be near the bottom of my list of people to blame.

 

[Mondio]

There's is so much different between every year, including those. A few years ago when we were a Micah Hyde INT away from a likely victory against the 49er's and our defense was decimated. Trot those guys we had available for much of that game and nobody else is winning any game let alone a playoff game and we were a rookie dropped INT away practically. We had some draft picks not work out, we lost an all pro safety in the prime of his career to injury. How many defenses are playing with Jennings and McMillan at safety? 2 guys that showed a bit of promise and then fell of the face of the earth. I'd say Capers probably got more out of them than anybody could have hoped for. We got old in some spots, all sorts happened.

 

[Un4GivN]

Then who should? If it was anyone but Peppers, fine. But if you run a D where somebody like that is confused, maybe it's the scheme.

I would think overall accountability would come from the head coach... Benching player who don't adhere or follow a concept. Like my last post, Belichick beats it in his players minds... DO YOUR JOB. To me it's up to the defensive coordinator to put players in the best position with the best plays. The head coaches job to have one mindset throughout a team.

Again, my point has never been that he was. I'm pointing to the other Capers years and wondering how he's lasted this long.

This one I'm right there with you, he has had a rocky up and down tenure in Green Bay. I can't say I haven't thrown my share of criticism his way as well... I guess it comes down to the same thing I think of MM. If I knew there was a better option out there. I would take it in a heart beat.

But do you see who these other teams are hiring... Unproven coaches, coaches that are making their first attempt at a position. Or coaches hated by their former organization (aka Chip Kelly).

Do I agree with everything capers and MM and even TT do? No. But I don't know anyone better than them at this moment that is available either. So ya...

 

[Ogsponge]

What in the name of all that is holy will it take for some of you to stop giving Capers a free pass?

2015 - The Packers are knocked out of the playoffs in overtime while the defense is on the field because of possibly the most ridiculous blown coverage and poorest tackling on one play in the history of the NFL.

2014 - The Packers knocked out of the playoffs in overtime on two plays while the defense is on the field.

2013 - The Packers are knocked out of the playoffs while the defense is on the field with no time remaining on the clock

2012 - The Packers are knocked out of the playoffs when the offense puts up 31 points but the defense can't stop one of the worst QB's in the NFL from running for 181 yards and 2 TD's

2011 - The Packers are knocked out of the playoffs because the offense sucked in one game and one of the worst defenses in the history of the NFL gave up 37 points to a team that only averaged 22 pts a game all year.

2010 - The only thing that any of you have to hang your hats on, by some miracle the Packers defense was awesome and we won a Super Bowl

2009 - The Packers lose while scoring 45 points, wait a second, read that again, the Packers lose while scoring 45 points because the defense gave up 51 points.

Seriously, how can any of you think Dom Capers should be the coach of the defense? In the last 7 years of the playoffs, 6 of those years the Packers were bounced out of the playoffs because the defense was either horrible all game long or in the case of the past 3 years, horrible when the game was on the line.

You can blame players being out of position, poor tackling, missed assignments all you want (by the way whose job is it to make sure the defense does not tackle poorly, blow coverage or miss an assignment?) but the bottom line is other than one shining glorious year the defense has failed, over and over again, sometimes in historic fashion.

All of the crap of it being blamed on player execution falls on the shoulders of one person, the coach who is supposed to coach the players so that stuff does not happen. The defense has and apparently always will be the Achilles heel of this team because they absolutely NEVER come through in crunch time. And before anyone says that both this year and last year the defense played great for most of the game, it does not matter when you play some of the worst defense known to man in the final losing minutes of the game. It literally means nothing.

 

[pacmaniac]

Also for 2014: The Packers defense allows 2 TDs in the final 2 minutes along with the first ever hail mary 2-point conversion.

 

[OldSchool101]

I pretty much admire the way you address topics here, so don't take the points below personally. The major point, in fact, is that you refer to things that happened this year, and I conceded the D was good. What I was driving at is the 'blind pig' concept - Capers stumbled on a good D in 2010 and 2015, but in 2011-2014, the D was the Achilles' heel of the Pack.

My memory is pretty bad, not so bad that I can't remember last year. Our Defense in the second half of 2014 dropped 10 spots to a top 12 scoring unit (over the whole year) because after moving Clay inside we became a force to reckon with all the way into a Conference Championship game. Nothing shy of several ST debacles cost us a good chance at the Lombardi.
It's a matter of opinion but long gone are the days were we finished 31st in the secondary. Then this year frankly, our D saved our butt. Capers stays IMO

 

[Sunshinepacker]

So, good D in 2010, good D this year, so we ignore the intervening four years?

Defense was really bad in one of those years. So easy to forget that it was the offense that cost the Packers a shot at the super bowl last year too.

 

[Sunshinepacker]

What in the name of all that is holy will it take for some of you to stop giving Capers a free pass?

2015 - The Packers are knocked out of the playoffs in overtime while the defense is on the field because of possibly the most ridiculous blown coverage and poorest tackling on one play in the history of the NFL.

2014 - The Packers knocked out of the playoffs in overtime on two plays while the defense is on the field.

2013 - The Packers are knocked out of the playoffs while the defense is on the field with no time remaining on the clock

2012 - The Packers are knocked out of the playoffs when the offense puts up 31 points but the defense can't stop one of the worst QB's in the NFL from running for 181 yards and 2 TD's

2011 - The Packers are knocked out of the playoffs because the offense sucked in one game and one of the worst defenses in the history of the NFL gave up 37 points to a team that only averaged 22 pts a game all year.

2010 - The only thing that any of you have to hang your hats on, by some miracle the Packers defense was awesome and we won a Super Bowl

2009 - The Packers lose while scoring 45 points, wait a second, read that again, the Packers lose while scoring 45 points because the defense gave up 51 points.

Seriously, how can any of you think Dom Capers should be the coach of the defense? In the last 7 years of the playoffs, 6 of those years the Packers were bounced out of the playoffs because the defense was either horrible all game long or in the case of the past 3 years, horrible when the game was on the line.

You can blame players being out of position, poor tackling, missed assignments all you want (by the way whose job is it to make sure the defense does not tackle poorly, blow coverage or miss an assignment?) but the bottom line is other than one shining glorious year the defense has failed, over and over again, sometimes in historic fashion.

All of the crap of it being blamed on player execution falls on the shoulders of one person, the coach who is supposed to coach the players so that stuff does not happen. The defense has and apparently always will be the Achilles heel of this team because they absolutely NEVER come through in crunch time. And before anyone says that both this year and last year the defense played great for most of the game, it does not matter when you play some of the worst defense known to man in the final losing minutes of the game. It literally means nothing.

That's a lot of writing but as soon as I saw the comment about 2014 I could see the agenda loud and clear...yup, 2014 loss was all about that awful defense that forced Russell Wilson into his worst game as a pro (and it's not even close).

I still remember that 2012 game. Never did find it why capers gameplan included Matthews spinning around in circles in the middle of the field for no apparent reason...and capers decision to have BJ Raji get continually blasted 7 yards downfield by a single guard will forever remain a mystery....OR it's possible that capers gameplan was the one most often used against an option system but the players were AWFUL in the game. Losing argument I know, so much easier to think that Raji, Perry, random-ILB would be awesome if only the coordinator was changed.

 

[Carl]

What in the name of all that is holy will it take for some of you to stop giving Capers a free pass?

2015 - The Packers are knocked out of the playoffs in overtime while the defense is on the field because of possibly the most ridiculous blown coverage and poorest tackling on one play in the history of the NFL.

2014 - The Packers knocked out of the playoffs in overtime on two plays while the defense is on the field.

2013 - The Packers are knocked out of the playoffs while the defense is on the field with no time remaining on the clock

2012 - The Packers are knocked out of the playoffs when the offense puts up 31 points but the defense can't stop one of the worst QB's in the NFL from running for 181 yards and 2 TD's

2011 - The Packers are knocked out of the playoffs because the offense sucked in one game and one of the worst defenses in the history of the NFL gave up 37 points to a team that only averaged 22 pts a game all year.

2010 - The only thing that any of you have to hang your hats on, by some miracle the Packers defense was awesome and we won a Super Bowl

2009 - The Packers lose while scoring 45 points, wait a second, read that again, the Packers lose while scoring 45 points because the defense gave up 51 points.

Seriously, how can any of you think Dom Capers should be the coach of the defense? In the last 7 years of the playoffs, 6 of those years the Packers were bounced out of the playoffs because the defense was either horrible all game long or in the case of the past 3 years, horrible when the game was on the line.

You can blame players being out of position, poor tackling, missed assignments all you want (by the way whose job is it to make sure the defense does not tackle poorly, blow coverage or miss an assignment?) but the bottom line is other than one shining glorious year the defense has failed, over and over again, sometimes in historic fashion.

All of the crap of it being blamed on player execution falls on the shoulders of one person, the coach who is supposed to coach the players so that stuff does not happen. The defense has and apparently always will be the Achilles heel of this team because they absolutely NEVER come through in crunch time. And before anyone says that both this year and last year the defense played great for most of the game, it does not matter when you play some of the worst defense known to man in the final losing minutes of the game. It literally means nothing.

You act like the defense was the only issue in all of those games. For example, the 37 points vs the Giants was also highly due to 4 turnovers. In 2012, the offense only put up 20 points and in 2014 the offense and special teams were equally as awful late.

The defense was not the sole reason many of those games were lost. If the offense had come through in crunch time in many of those games, the defense wouldn't even had to make a stop.

I'll agree the defense has not come through in the playoffs, but to blame the losses solely on the defense is huge stretch that fans continue to make even when it's clear other areas have not performed too.

 

[OldSchool101]

You act like the defense was the only issue in all of those games. For example, the 37 points vs the Giants was also highly due to 4 turnovers. In 2012, the offense only put up 20 points and in 2014 the offense and special teams were equally as awful late.

The defense was not the sole reason many of those games were lost. If the offense had come through in crunch time in many of those games, the defense wouldn't even had to make a stop.

I'll agree the defense has not come through in the playoffs, but to blame the losses solely on the defense is huge stretch that fans continue even when it's clear other areas have not performed too.

I completely agree Carl. Trust me When I say we've all been there completely PO'd when we got shredded week in week out. We had a D pass ranking at the bottom feeding range a few years Ago.
But the last 2 years in particular our D has improved markedly. So much so that if our Offense was its usual self and stopped playing like a 15-25 ranked Offense, we'd be talking about us vs Carolina for another NFC crown.
IMO the D should've never have had play in OT. Our D held arguably The best Offense on the the league on the road twice to 24pts and 20pts respectively in regulation. That is a phenomenal feat and gave our Offense every chance to redeem themselves for inconsistent at best play since the bye.

 

[longtimefan]

What in the name of all that is holy will it take for some of you to stop giving Capers a free pass

2014 - The Packers knocked out of the playoffs in overtime on two plays while the defense is on the field.


2012 - The Packers are knocked out of the playoffs when the offense puts up 31 points but the defense can't stop one of the worst QB's in the NFL from running for 181 yards and 2 TD's

I am not happy about the def and how they seem to have issues at end of games...But at same point, please stop over looking how the offense has had issues..


2012--7 points of the 31 was from a Shields pick 6---so 24 offense points....with 40 seconds left they got a TD....So with 40 secs left the offense scored only 17 points...

Not saying def played good, they actually sucked..But dont say the offense got 31 points when they truly didnt..


I hate bringing this up again, but maybe looking at it in print might make it easy to truly understand how great the def was for the 55 mins and how bad the offense was

2014--1st series on Seattles 29, Rodgers throws int

2nd Seattle series ---int by Ha-Ha returns to Seattles 19....Offense only gets FG.

Ensuing KO, Greenbay gets a fumble recovery at Seattles 23--again only a FG

(2 turnovers with in 5 mins and only got 6 points)

Middle of 2nd q, Haha gets another int...3rd Packer play after that t/o--- Rodgers throws int...

Seattle drives to GB 18, and Sam Shields gets another int...Packers go 7 plays, 12 yards and punts---

3 ints in 1st half is converted to 6 points..

Then another int with 4 mins to go. in the games (I dont care if he went down..it was an int and the chance for the offense to put game away....thats 4 interceptions and fumble recovery in the NFCCG....When does that happen????

And people only want to recall last mins and blame defense?

Offense had 5 EXTRA chances to put game away, and couldnt do it

 

[Ogsponge]

I am not happy about the def and how they seem to have issues at end of games...But at same point, please stop over looking how the offense has had issues..


2012--7 points of the 31 was from a Shields pick 6---so 24 offense points....with 40 seconds left they got a TD....So with 40 secs left the offense scored only 17 points...

Not saying def played good, they actually sucked..But dont say the offense got 31 points when they truly didnt..


I hate bringing this up again, but maybe looking at it in print might make it easy to truly understand how great the def was for the 55 mins and how bad the offense was

2014--1st series on Seattles 29, Rodgers throws int

2nd Seattle series ---int by Ha-Ha returns to Seattles 19....Offense only gets FG.

Ensuing KO, Greenbay gets a fumble recovery at Seattles 23--again only a FG

(2 turnovers with in 5 mins and only got 6 points)

Middle of 2nd q, Haha gets another int...3rd Packer play after that t/o--- Rodgers throws int...

Seattle drives to GB 18, and Sam Shields gets another int...Packers go 7 plays, 12 yards and punts---

3 ints in 1st half is converted to 6 points..

Then another int with 4 mins to go. in the games (I dont care if he went down..it was an int and the chance for the offense to put game away....thats 4 interceptions and fumble recovery in the NFCCG....When does that happen????

And people only want to recall last mins and blame defense?

Offense had 5 EXTRA chances to put game away, and couldnt do it

I never said the offense has not played its role in losses but at some point you should stop overlooking the fact that the defense has had an epic meltdown 2 years in a row and that the game has ended 3 years in a row with the defense on the field. 55 minutes of great defense means absolutely nothing when it is followed by some of the most pathetic defense ever seen.

Let me ask you this. If a heart surgeon performs a flawless open heart surgery but as he is getting ready to cut the last bit of thread from his last stitch, he unbelievably, inexplicably jams the scissors into the patient's heart instantly killing said patient, do you go back and say the patient died because 4 hours ago the scrub nurse dropped a sponge into the open chest cavity? No, you don't, you blame the guy that was nearly flawless for 95% of the surgery but was completely inept for 5% of the surgery.

In case you are not sure, the defense is the heart surgeon in this story.

 

[RRyder]

Fire the whole bunch of them! From the top down on down unless you are happy to live in mediocrity.

Ahhh I want to live in the place where you live. Apparently average teams are winning SBs there every few years. Shoot guess the Pats have won 8 in the past 3 years

 

[longtimefan]

You can blame players being out of position, poor tackling, missed assignments all you want (by the way whose job is it to make sure the defense does not tackle poorly, blow coverage or miss an assignment?) but the bottom line is other than one shining glorious year the defense has failed, over and over again, sometimes in historic fashion.

All of the crap of it being blamed on player execution falls on the shoulders of one person, the coach who is supposed to coach the players so that stuff does not happen. The defense has and apparently always will be the Achilles heel of this team because they absolutely NEVER come through in crunch time. And before anyone says that both this year and last year the defense played great for most of the game, it does not matter when you play some of the worst defense known to man in the final losing minutes of the game. It literally means nothing.

I never said the offense has not played its role in losses but at some point you should stop overlooking the fact that the defense has had an epic meltdown 2 years in a row and that the game has ended 3 years in a row with the defense on the field. 55 minutes of great defense means absolutely nothing when it is followed by some of the most pathetic defense ever seen.

Let me ask you this. If a heart surgeon performs a flawless open heart surgery but as he is getting ready to cut the last bit of thread from his last stitch, he unbelievably, inexplicably jams the scissors into the patient's heart instantly killing said patient, do you go back and say the patient died because 4 hours ago the scrub nurse dropped a sponge into the open chest cavity? No, you don't, you blame the guy that was nearly flawless for 95% of the surgery but was completely inept for 5% of the surgery.

In case you are not sure, the defense is the heart surgeon in this story.

Sigh, not over looking it, even brought up how the defense sucked.

I dont want to turn this isnt another pissing match..

I know we went over this before...and I said this before...The def and ST played horrible at the end.. I am fully on board that they screwed up....please go back and look how I never over looked the DEF screwed up..

You dont want to blame Rodgers and MM.as much as the def....Seems your 20% off, and 80 def and st..

I am only saying both sides of the ball share equally..Offense should have put the game away but didnt..

If Rodgers a td at end and throws a real bone headed int (he did it that year) can't pin that on def..Rodgers had the chance and blew it

 

[Grave]

Caper's zany zones killed us in the 2nd half. And Palmer was hardly touched.

How can any coach play D schemes that his players don't understand? They's saying now that Fitz was Randall's guy. Funny how Randall didn't know that. Had Capers stuck with man Randall would have know his assignment. But tta'ts just too ****** basic for the genius innovator Capers.

And MM blows it off again as just another botched assignment.

 

[Grave]

What else would you like me to point to? A ton of teams would kill to have Raji, Daniels, Pennel, and Guion at DL in a 3-4. They've played pretty well all season. Shields isn't a shut down corner, but he's definitely very talented as is Ha Ha. Our two rookies from this year played phenomenal and will only get better. We had a lot of sacks this year thanks to Peppers, Neal, Perry, and Clay. Our linebacking crew could be improved, but there is definitely talent on this defense.

The Viqueens picked up a run stopper in FA who's better than any of our guys.

 

[Grave]

I think Dom deserves to stay after our defensive display this season. But part of me thinks that McCarthy dropping play calling to focus on all aspects of the squad helped the d and special teams

Dom has spent his Packers career working himself out of a job. His 2nd half performance just cost us the playoffs. But you'll get your wish, because there's no coach accountability in Packers management.

 

[Grave]

Capers most likely did NOT tell defenders to stand around with thumbs in their ***** watching Fitzgerald run at will.

No. But it is Caper's job to insure that the players are assignment-sure.