Brown traded to Raiders

[Pokerbrat2000]

You can still throw your team mates under the bus with facts.

Sorry, I don't buy that for a second. Maybe I missed something in the article but I'm a bit surprised it was you who came up with that Poker. I thought you were more realistic than that. If Bell hadn't held out there wouldn't have been any questions or uncertainty about him reporting so yeah, Bell was the source of the distraction. Of course the media is going to ask about it and people are going to wonder if he is going to report so yeah, Bell was the distraction.

Guilty as charged Officer sschind

The first post was in reference to someone saying Big Ben threw Bell under the Bus, I guess I haven't seen where he did, thus why I asked for his source.

The second part I didn't state well. If you go back to the Bell thread, I was throwing Bell under the Bus for the stance he took, didn't like it all. My latest comment was more comparing what Bell did to what Brown did.

 

[Do7]

Guilty as charged Officer sschind

The first post was in reference to someone saying Big Ben threw Bell under the Bus, I guess I haven't seen where he did, thus why I asked for his source.

The second part I didn't state well. If you go back to the Bell thread, I was throwing Bell under the Bus for the stance he took, didn't like it all. My latest comment was more comparing what Bell did to what Brown did.

To which you provided the link. I suppose him saying that his situation turned out being a distraction was him throwing him under the bus as to why the team did poorly, when he and everyone else said that they would manage without him, and the fact that it is now a distraction since they missed the post season, and yet we didn't hear them say this when they were WINNING. Context is everything. This was going into my original point about Big Ben throwing teammates under the bus at the podium, (in Bell's case it wasn't at the podium)and that the Steeler lockeroom was toxic as opposed to The Packers in regards to AB. I suppose some would say he didn't but it's about context.

“It hurts you when you don’t have one of the better players in the game, but I think the biggest thing that hurts us was that it was a distraction. At his position we got to see James Conner and Jaylen Samuels, and I thought we got to see guys come into their own and see a glimpse of the future. I was really encouraged about life without Le’Veon.”

Maybe I'm being unfair to Big Ben in this case, but can you imagine how some people here would react if our current QB said this? They'd certainly would say he's throwing a teammate under the bus. Lord knows we have some people here buying in that myth.

 

[Shaggy]

A 3rd rounder is all I would give up for Brown.

 

[swhitset]

I think most agree that the offense could improve. However, I think it is fair to assume that Brown could potentially have the opposite effect too. What happens if he, Rodgers and Adams don't get along? What happens when he pulls what he did in Pittsburgh and you have to bench him?

IMO, too big of an investment in a guy that the Steelers may be willing to eat a lot of talent and money on, just because they don't want him effecting their team with what he does off the field. Locker room cancer isn't always an obvious thing, but the me first guys usually don't fare well. Nor do I expect someone like that to change much, even on a new team.

The only way I would want to see the risky guys like that on the team are like when the Packers signed Andre Rison... if we are heading into the playoffs with a deficit at WR ... and need a short term rental. Eventually his baggage would be a problem.... but with a short term rental.... hopefully you could get what you need from him before the problems start to happen.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

Fair enough. But if we’re talking career int totals we can’t just base it off 1 season.

Agreed, Ramsey was also the ninth (2017) and third ('16) most targeted cornerback though.

 

[Snoops]

How are we going to get Brown? Unless the Steelers are willing to trade him for less than a first rounder he would be out of the question in the scenario WIMM was replying to.

Ian Rapoport said it would likely be a second rounder..

 

[Do7]

Ian Rapoport said it would likely be a second rounder..

If it's for a second rounder for the best WR in the game? I'd say go for it. But then again our 2nd rounders we typically strike gold there so....then again maybe not.

 

[Half Empty]

As before, is the NFL's best receiver even available? Now, Brown...

 

[Deleted member 6794]

If it's for a second rounder for the best WR in the game? I'd say go for it.

With Brown being a possible locker room cancer the Packers shouldn't even think about trading a second rounder for him.

 

[Do7]

With Brown being a possible locker room cancer the Packers shouldn't even think about trading a second rounder for him.

Again with the possible locker room cancer mess? There's ALSO a chance that he won't be. I've already went over how toxic The Steelers locker room has proven to be. As well as bring up the fact that a beloved player in Woodson had problems when he first arrived.

If this team is truly great, then we should be able to overcome such a matter if the situation comes up. I'm not gonna turn away someone that can help us WIN, just because of how they behaved previously.

I believe in second and even third chances. If his skill didn't demand him being worth a look, then I wouldn't have considered it. The concept of the game is winning, and from my understanding this dude is a hard worker in regards to his game. If you produce on the field then I'm willing to take a chance.

 

[Half Empty]

As always, a matter of degree - cost, talent, intangibles.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

As always, a matter of degree - cost, talent, intangibles.

within cost and intangibles, I would include:

• opportunity cost of the lost draft pick(s)
• loss of playing reps for EQ/MVS
• obvious cap costs
• prioritizing needs of the team
• influence on 3 young WR's as well as Adams and Rodgers

Sure, if the Packers were one star WR away from competing for the Lombardi, this might be worth the risk. However, they aren't that close IMO and this is an unneeded risk for a team that needs to fix so many other moving parts. If AB was a failure in GB, the trickle down effect could be a big set back.

Finally, the transition and transformation that a new coaching staff creates is going to be a big challenge for the team, they don't need this kind of potential negative distraction on top of it.

 

[brandon2348]

Kansas City is the blueprint for us. The Packers should make an aggressive attempt to get Brown. Were gonna have to take some risks to get back in this thing. Injuries are starting to pile up on Rodgers and if not now then never.

 

[Sunshinepacker]

I've seen people willing to sacrifice a third round pick for Brown!! That must mean the guy we're trading for is basically a HoF player! I mean, as we've established, no actual current player is ever worth a first round pick and only QBs are worth second-rounders. So to give a third-round pick PLUS the $11 million extra per season for his contract is a massive sacrifice for the Packers. I mean, that third rounder could be Oren Burks or Montravius Adams on rookie deals for four whole seasons! Wow, this Antonio Brown guy must be great!

For those who couldn't tell, there was a little bit of sarcasm in the above.

 

[Sunshinepacker]

within cost and intangibles, I would include:

• opportunity cost of the lost draft pick(s)
• loss of playing reps for EQ/MVS
• obvious cap costs
• prioritizing needs of the team
• influence on 3 young WR's as well as Adams and Rodgers

Sure, if the Packers were one star WR away from competing for the Lombardi, this might be worth the risk. However, they aren't that close IMO and this is an unneeded risk for a team that needs to fix so many other moving parts. If AB was a failure in GB, the trickle down effect could be a big set back.

Finally, the transition and transformation that a new coaching staff creates is going to be a big challenge for the team, they don't need this kind of potential negative distraction on top of it.

Opportunity cost of the draft pick in this situation is negligible as the chance of any player the Packer's draft being as good as Brown is basically zero.

The loss of playing reps for EQ/MVS is irrelevant. They're being replaced with Antonio Brown! First, there will still need to be a third receiver and second, that means the young guys will get to watch two great receivers practice and learn those habits accordingly...seriously, we're worried that having Antonio Brown will hurt the development of young receivers?

Cap costs are actually cap savings in this instance. Pittsburgh eats the entire signing bonus, leaving the Packers paying a top-3 WR in the NFL only $11.5 million a year; that kind of deal can't be found ANYWHERE else.

Needs of the team: GETTING GREAT PLAYERS. The Packers' offense was not elite last year, teams were able to scheme around Adams (who excelled anyway). I would imagine the Packers' offense with two top-10 WRs would be nigh on unstoppable; which would help the defense as they would be playing with a lead most of the time.

Again, I could care less about how Brown influences the young guys. The Packers will have Rodgers playing at an elite level for only so many more years, the Packers need to maximize their chances of winning NOW. Similar to Wolf not trading for Randy Moss, does the team really want to worry about character at the cost of not making a MASSIVE improvement to the offense?

 

[Sunshinepacker]

With Brown being a possible locker room cancer the Packers shouldn't even think about trading a second rounder for him.

I remember how cancerous Randy Moss was supposed to be also. Some players are worth trading for because of their talent. If you're worried about the locker room, then get other guys to guide the locker room. Let's not forget that Big Ben isn't exactly a beloved player in his locker room; it's not like this is ALL on Brown.

 

[Mondio]

I remember how cancerous Randy Moss was supposed to be also. Some players are worth trading for because of their talent. If you're worried about the locker room, then get other guys to guide the locker room. Let's not forget that Big Ben isn't exactly a beloved player in his locker room; it's not like this is ALL on Brown.

If Randy Moss would have cost a first or 2nd round draft pick and 15 million in salary, give or take, he may have never left Oakland either.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

Opportunity cost of the draft pick in this situation is negligible as the chance of any player the Packer's draft being as good as Brown is basically zero.

The loss of playing reps for EQ/MVS is irrelevant. They're being replaced with Antonio Brown! First, there will still need to be a third receiver and second, that means the young guys will get to watch two great receivers practice and learn those habits accordingly...seriously, we're worried that having Antonio Brown will hurt the development of young receivers?

Cap costs are actually cap savings in this instance. Pittsburgh eats the entire signing bonus, leaving the Packers paying a top-3 WR in the NFL only $11.5 million a year; that kind of deal can't be found ANYWHERE else.

Needs of the team: GETTING GREAT PLAYERS. The Packers' offense was not elite last year, teams were able to scheme around Adams (who excelled anyway). I would imagine the Packers' offense with two top-10 WRs would be nigh on unstoppable; which would help the defense as they would be playing with a lead most of the time.

Again, I could care less about how Brown influences the young guys. The Packers will have Rodgers playing at an elite level for only so many more years, the Packers need to maximize their chances of winning NOW. Similar to Wolf not trading for Randy Moss, does the team really want to worry about character at the cost of not making a MASSIVE improvement to the offense?

While my post was probably tilted towards looking at things with the possibility of AB not working out, your post doesn't seem to take that scenario into consideration at all.

If there was no doubt in the idea of AB definitely working out, I think this is a no brainer for all 32 teams, but then again, he wouldn't be on the market if that was the case. Go back and read your post, is it still correct and make sense, if AB doesn't work out?

 

[Do7]

I've seen people willing to sacrifice a third round pick for Brown!! That must mean the guy we're trading for is basically a HoF player! I mean, as we've established, no actual current player is ever worth a first round pick and only QBs are worth second-rounders. So to give a third-round pick PLUS the $11 million extra per season for his contract is a massive sacrifice for the Packers. I mean, that third rounder could be Oren Burks or Montravius Adams on rookie deals for four whole seasons! Wow, this Antonio Brown guy must be great!

For those who couldn't tell, there was a little bit of sarcasm in the above.

Alright I'll bite. Assuming that these draft players prove to be solid pick ups, tell me which player in the draft right now is better than Antonio Brown? Who is the best if not one of the best WR in the game right now? I'm curious, how people are willing to hold on to these draft picks.

The only part I can honestly understand is how this would affect the cap, but other than that, what player in the draft that The Packers realistically have a chance to pick up, is better than AB?

 

[brandon2348]

While my post was probably tilted towards looking at things with the possibility of AB not working out, your post doesn't seem to take that scenario into consideration at all.

If there was no doubt in the idea of AB definitely working out, I think this is a no brainer for all 32 teams, but then again, he wouldn't be on the market if that was the case. Go back and read your post, is it still correct and make sense, if AB doesn't work out?

If he doesn't work out were screwed like we already are. People need to wake up and smell the coffee that were losers at this point with a 35 year old franchise QB.

It's a high risk high reward move but unfortunately after several years of failure in the front office this is what is neccessary.

 

[Dantés]

From the guy who brought you "drafting Courtland Sutton 14th overall will reverse our fortunes" we have the "we can't draft defense no matter what because reasons" comeback tour. Buy your tickets today.

 

[swhitset]

Alright I'll bite. Assuming that these draft players prove to be solid pick ups, tell me which player in the draft right now is better than Antonio Brown? Who is the best if not one of the best WR in the game right now? I'm curious, how people are willing to hold on to these draft picks.

The only part I can honestly understand is how this would affect the cap, but other than that, what player in the draft that The Packers realistically have a chance to pick up, is better than AB?

I’m not completely disagreeing with you... but remember that Brown is 30 years old. Based on that, I would not trade a first round pick for him because the answer to that question may be half of the first round picks in this draft ... 2 years from now. As we move down the draft ... that premise changes somewhat. I am not addressing other factors such as potential locker room problems etc... in this post.

 

[brandon2348]

From the guy who brought you "drafting Courtland Sutton 14th overall will reverse our fortunes" we have the "we can't draft defense no matter what because reasons" comeback tour. Buy your tickets today.

If we had Joe Mixon and Courtland Sutton we'd be halfway out of the situation we are in now. Instead, now we are in complete catch up mode.

Shouldn't you be busy mocking our next failure at Edge or in the Secondary?

 

[OldSchool101]

I will say it would be tempting to have a veteran with his caliber. I just don’t want AB pulling a Martellus Bennett. Any contract we would entertain better be weighted in performance, meaning if he bails or gets cut for causing internal turmoil so does his paycheck.

If we continue to come “as advertised” we would be adverse to signing anyone who has been disruptive. Martellus came in an immediately provoked players into dissension near immediately.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

From the guy who brought you "drafting Courtland Sutton 14th overall will reverse our fortunes" we have the "we can't draft defense no matter what because reasons" comeback tour. Buy your tickets today.

Shouldn't you be busy mocking our next failure at Edge or in the Secondary?

You guys crack me up and I say that in a good way. Pulling up a chair and getting ready for another healthy round of draft debating between you two.