Biggest mistake of the offseason

[brandon2348]

yes, it's my contention and always has been that once the draft happens, there is never another single player available at any time from then forward until the season concludes. Or it has always been that trades are uncommon, especially for a player that would have replaced Sam Shields, and let's face it, with all the injuries that happened behind him, it was going to take a big big player to fill those shoes. Joe Hayden was the answer. Turns out he played about as well as Randall, probably even a tad worse.

Could another player been traded for a week before the deadline. I'm sure there was considering the number of players in the NFL, there had to be a least one. Then it comes down to cost. Until you can give me the cost about all you can say is, "I wish there would have been someone available" It's a little disingenuous to say Ted wasn't doing his job when trades of that magnitude are rare and even more rare mid season.

as for the street FA's, I don't have that list in front of me, but I don't remember any names jumping out. In fact almost all of them remained available all year long, in a league that is now built on passing and defending against it, if a team could have used them, they probably would have been picked up by someone. They weren't.

Just think, we could have traded for Hayden and his contract and got sub Randall performance with a few million in cap eaten. We could have picked up Trevathan and got 4th round 2nd year player on a rookie contract production for 6-7 million. There's more I'm sure i'm missing from just last year alone. and I thought our secondary would be a strength. The analysis in this room isn't very good by anyone. I certainly don't think I have all the answers, but I do take issue with some that think they do.

Well you won't find one post on here from me wanting to get Hayden last year or Trevathan for that matter. I would of been open to signing Trevathan but it was far from a battle cry. I did push for them to sign Ladarius Green or Cook. I have been very patient with this Thompson and probably too patient. I am tired of getting excited about UDFA's and rookies getting us over the hump and taking us to the promise land. I feel like I have been one of the biggest cheerleaders in regards to those guys and it's gotten old.

TT didn't do anything "in season" last year to address secondary and I can handle that. What I cant handle is not doing anything in the offseason to address it other then maybe the draft. This is enough to put any real Packer fan in a "Funk" as you put it and to question Thompson about it I believe is justified.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

Is it because he doesn't see a need to improve a team, or he doesn't think the names you recognize are going to be an improvement? again, Gilmore I give the benefit of the doubt to, because he was signed by the Pats. A pretty good team and managing rosters and they play him 2x's a year. other than that, who? Personally I don't think bouye is worth that contract. I think he was decent with a great pass rush in front of him. The rest? most of them are still available if that means anything.

So doesn't see a need to improve a roster, or doesn't see the guys available to do it with that enters into a whole bunch of other variables about where they wanted to be in the first place. Considering nobody saw 2 TE's getting signed this year, or Peppers when he was and how much people really know about his organization until it actually happens tells me, Ted is always working. If something isn't done, it's for other reasons we will never know except for taking wild guesses. Like I am now, maybe Ted is at home taking a nap instead of watching film.

Three simple questions I have of you, because you seem more about defending the actions or lack of by TT then you are at commenting on what you think should have or shouldn't have been done in regards to the CB position.

Did you think the Packers had a need at CB at any point during the 2016 season?

Did you think the Packers had a need at CB when the season concluded?

Do you think the Packers have a need at CB now?

 

[Mondio]

of course, exactly when did I give someone the impression I thought we were in great shape last year? There's a difference between seeing a need, and then seeing a real life viable option, or just needing a reason to complain about someone that is very good at their job. Especially when year after year I"m wrong about a lot and the rest of you? Hayden, Ladarius, Trevathan, and that was just last year. But these guys all just know LOL

 

[Mondio]

You do realize that you are one of the biggest loudest old hats on the forum right? I mean you ***** and moan about the *****ers and moaners louder than the original *****ers and moaners. This is of course fully within your right to do so But don't sit there and pretend for even one second that you are not right there with all the rest of the whiners and cryers.

of course I do, why do you tihnk i'm here every day?

 

[PackerDNA]

What's the problem with Trevathon? I'd still much prefer him to what we have.

 

[Mondio]

nothing wrong with him, but would you rather pay 4th round rookie money for that production or the 6-7 or so million per year money he got for the same production?

 

[brandon2348]

nothing wrong with him, but would you rather pay 4th round rookie money for that production or the 6-7 or so million per year money he got for the same production?

If your worried about the $ then worry about the 15 mill Matthews is set to get paid.

I'd take Trevathan right now headed into 2017.

 

[RRyder]

All good points and besides not being able to resign Lacy, I personally wasn't that upset about who we didn't resign. While that is all fair and good to say, the off season isn't just about who you don't resign but probably more importantly, about what moves you make to counter those losses and any carryover needs from the previous season. This IMO is where TT comes up short every year, expecting to cover his losses and needs with a few free agents, rookies and development of his own guys.

So we can talk about and applaud TT for who he didn't sign to big contracts this year, but what were his moves to counter his losses and needs?

Fine points. And I'm good with those being discussed. The offseason could've for sure been better so far. But refusing to acknowledge the good things TT has done doesn't help either. (Not that I believe that's what your doing)

We could have kept them for less. Both Lang and Lacy wanted to stay in GB and I'm sure we could have retained them for less than what the new team is paying out. Hyde was never hot target too. I'm sure we could have raised their contracts for less than what they earned in FA and still retained them. None of them had a breakout year to have any extra leverage.

The objective of a transfer season (FA+ Drafts) is for us to improve our team without getting economically busted. We are well and good to the last pat, but the team hasn't noticeably improved in past 2 or 3 years.

None of them had any extra leverage? How about the contracts they were offered and eventually signed?

This idea that all these players would resign here for less is just non sense. The closest you can say is that Lang said he'd give the Packers a chance to match. That's a far cry from saying any kind of hometown discount.

The idea that neither Hyde or Lacy were hot targets so we should've gotten them for less is non sensical also. Hot target or not they still managed to get more then they're worth

 

[Mondio]

I think Hyde would have made a lot of sense at 2-3 million per. 4 was a stretch. 6-7 he got was too much.

if lacy gets in shape he can be very good for them. In 2 seasons he couldn't for us, not sorry to see him go. Maybe this coaching staff just couldn't get thru to him, maybe Seattle will. But i wouldn't trade MM for carroll ever.

Lang is a guy I would have liked to have seen kept. Maybe not quite at the salary he was given, but if they'd have matched i would have considered it a slight over pay, but acceptable. But they have the inside track on his injuries and things that to his credit he has always battled thru and has been a warrior for this team. But eventually they take their toll, if it happens over the next season or 2, which I feel it most likely will. Not signing will make even more sense. If he continues to make probowls and we dont' have a replacement, it will look pretty bad

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

of course, exactly when did I give someone the impression I thought we were in great shape last year? There's a difference between seeing a need, and then seeing a real life viable option, or just needing a reason to complain about someone that is very good at their job. Especially when year after year I"m wrong about a lot and the rest of you? Hayden, Ladarius, Trevathan, and that was just last year. But these guys all just know LOL

I guess I would call what some posters do.....actually "putting their money where their mouths are", right or wrong. Of course none of us are right all the time or even very often, but I give someone credit for recognizing, reporting AND saying how they would try and fix it....right or wrong, more that I credit someone for only saying "leave it to the experts, nothing we do will change things". Sitting back and watching a house burn down and commenting on it after, is much different then offering up ideas on how that fire could have been prevented or at least, how that fire may have been contained. While none of us can physically go in and fight the fire at least some of us can smell smoke. Sure maybe that smoke we smell is nothing but you grilling out and drinking a beer, watching us all running around as you laugh or maybe it's someone falsely pulling an alarm. But I would rather be the guy who noticed and reported that the house is on fire, than just assume that it isn't, because the professionals haven't shown up.

 

[Mondio]

come on, you're trying to tell me you recognized issues more than I did last year? I can throw names around in hopes too, but i already get accused of hoping too much. I had a little interest in Hayden last year too, but not at any cost. I'm glad we didn't get him, at any cost. Even if they would have given him to us, his salary would have made it a bad move for his production.

like I said, it's one thing to recognize an issue and another to act like you know better. I can't wish or hope for someone else, there's too much of that around here already i'm told. I don't know enough to know better than the pro's so I can't be too certain of my statements. but i do know most people are mostly wrong, yet they still act like they know. they don't discuss or generalize or offer up suggestions, they KNOW and are very adamant about it. Not you, but you probably know exactly who i'm talking about.

so i'm left with *****ing about the *****ers, it's my niche. at least until there is something more interesting to talk about and then hopefully there will be enough Ted *****in' threads it keeps most of them away from the other stuff

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

come on, you're trying to tell me you recognized issues more than I did last year? I can throw names around in hopes too, but i already get accused of hoping too much. I had a little interest in Hayden last year too, but not at any cost. I'm glad we didn't get him, at any cost. Even if they would have given him to us, his salary would have made it a bad move for his production.

like I said, it's one thing to recognize an issue and another to act like you know better. I can't wish or hope for someone else, there's too much of that around here already i'm told. I don't know enough to know better than the pro's so I can't be too certain of my statements. but i do know most people are mostly wrong, yet they still act like they know. they don't discuss or generalize or offer up suggestions, they KNOW and are very adamant about it. Not you, but you probably know exactly who i'm talking about.

so i'm left with *****ing about the *****ers, it's my niche. at least until there is something more interesting to talk about and then hopefully there will be enough Ted *****in' threads it keeps most of them away from the other stuff

Your beer is waiting on the bar

 

[XPack]

None of them had any extra leverage? How about the contracts they were offered and eventually signed?

This idea that all these players would resign here for less is just non sense. The closest you can say is that Lang said he'd give the Packers a chance to match. That's a far cry from saying any kind of hometown discount.

The idea that neither Hyde or Lacy were hot targets so we should've gotten them for less is non sensical also. Hot target or not they still managed to get more then they're worth

They should not even be let to hit FA. Letting them hit FA and hoping for no takers so we can re-sign them on cheap is TTs philosophy and it cuts both ways.

 

[Dantés]

come on, you're trying to tell me you recognized issues more than I did last year? I can throw names around in hopes too, but i already get accused of hoping too much. I had a little interest in Hayden last year too, but not at any cost. I'm glad we didn't get him, at any cost. Even if they would have given him to us, his salary would have made it a bad move for his production.

like I said, it's one thing to recognize an issue and another to act like you know better. I can't wish or hope for someone else, there's too much of that around here already i'm told. I don't know enough to know better than the pro's so I can't be too certain of my statements. but i do know most people are mostly wrong, yet they still act like they know. they don't discuss or generalize or offer up suggestions, they KNOW and are very adamant about it. Not you, but you probably know exactly who i'm talking about.

so i'm left with *****ing about the *****ers, it's my niche. at least until there is something more interesting to talk about and then hopefully there will be enough Ted *****in' threads it keeps most of them away from the other stuff

I had to start using the "ignore" button as I found I could waste entire days going back and forth with the extreme Thompson haters.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

I think Hyde would have made a lot of sense at 2-3 million per. 4 was a stretch. 6-7 he got was too much.

if lacy gets in shape he can be very good for them. In 2 seasons he couldn't for us, not sorry to see him go. Maybe this coaching staff just couldn't get thru to him, maybe Seattle will. But i wouldn't trade MM for carroll ever.

Lang is a guy I would have liked to have seen kept. Maybe not quite at the salary he was given, but if they'd have matched i would have considered it a slight over pay, but acceptable. But they have the inside track on his injuries and things that to his credit he has always battled thru and has been a warrior for this team. But eventually they take their toll, if it happens over the next season or 2, which I feel it most likely will. Not signing will make even more sense. If he continues to make probowls and we dont' have a replacement, it will look pretty bad

I agree with most of that and all the no resigns are either going to look like brilliant moves or stupid moves....after a year +, but you have to do what you have to do in the moment. I remember people complaining about Crosby being resigned at the money he was resigned at. I don't think we win that Dallas game without Crosby.....paycheck earned. Anyway, for me it comes down to what the Packers do in response to their needs from 2016 as well as the needs created from the guys they lost. So far, I'm not overly confident that the guys we signed in Free Agency, add through the draft and toss in good health and development are collectively enough to make us any better than last year. Although, I never use injury as an excuse, really good health might be the difference needed.

 

[Dantés]

They should not even be let to hit FA. Letting them hit FA and hoping for no takers so we can re-sign them on cheap is TTs philosophy and it cuts both ways.

After allowing both Hayward and Hyde to walk, it would seem that Thompson doesn't value that 3rd corner spot enough to pay what the market dictates.

In Hayward's case, it looks really bad in retrospect because he was excellent on the outside last year. Why he was never able to demonstrate that type of play in GB is beyond me. I'm just not convinced of Capers' ability as a teacher or tactician.

But certainly the defensive backfield would look a lot different right now with Hayward and Hyde penciled in as a starter and nickel respectively.

 

[Half Empty]

I had to start using the "ignore" button as I found I could waste entire days going back and forth with the extreme Thompson haters.

Do you waste time following the "in TT I trust" crowd?

 

[Dantés]

Do you waste time following the "in TT I trust" crowd?

I ignore the people who seem to be completely blindly loyal to everything he does and the people who seem to be completely blindly critical of everything he does. Everyone else seems worth having a discussion with.

 

[XPack]

It eventually ends up as for vs against on TT and understandably so.

But the only questions we should ask ourselves is, are we stronger than last season? Do we have a better potential to win SB than last season?

Whether we win or not depends on lot of other factors, but the preparation or lack of is the primary focus of the threads...and it does reflect back to TT.

 

[PackerDNA]

it would seem that Thompson doesn't value that 3rd corner spot enough to pay what the market dictates.

Which, if true, should set off alarm bells, as #3 CB's are in reality very much starters in today's NFL.

 

[sschind]

IMO the biggest mistake so far was not replacing Sam Shields. Going into last season we had a pretty good idea that he was going to be one of our starting CBs this year as he was still under contract. His leaving was somewhat unexpected and while I can forgive, to an extent, not replacing him during the season I don't know why Ted didn't use the money gained from losing him for replacing him.

The prospect of Randal and/or Rollins patrolling one half the field while a player of Sams caliber handled the other side would be a lot less scary.

Now its possible that if they would have used that money to sign one of the top FA corners they would not have signed Martellus Bennett and he certainly was an upgrade at TE but I made the analogy before and I'll make it again.

If you total your truck and the insurance company writes you a check for $30,000 it might not be a bad idea to spend that $30,000 replacing the truck. You could spend half of it on a replacement truck and the other half on a better boat but if the new truck can't pull the new boat you've lost ground in both areas.

 

[Dantés]

Which, if true, should set off alarm bells, as #3 CB's are in reality very much starters in today's NFL.

I don't love it, no.

But all good organizations have places on the roster where they want to spend and places where they want to save.

It would seem that TT feels he can replace that position. So far he's right, as Hyde was a capable replacement for Hayward. We will see how he does this time around.

 

[PackerDNA]

I don't love it, no.

But all good organizations have places on the roster where they want to spend and places where they want to save.

It would seem that TT feels he can replace that position. So far he's right, as Hyde was a capable replacement for Hayward. We will see how he does this time around.

Or, if you will, a matter of priorities. In this case, possibly believing the answer is in a better pass rush, and feeling they can aquire better rushers than CB's at this time.

 

[Mondio]

Your beer is waiting on the bar

i'm not even going to ask what flavor, ,just what bar? there are a lot to choose from. Or did you mean The Bar, in which case I need to know which location

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

i'm not even going to ask what flavor, ,just what bar? there are a lot to choose from. Or did you mean The Bar, in which case I need to know which location

LOL.....the Bar.....that I set too damn high