Are you happy now that Javon is gone ??

[pyledriver80]

It was a total reach on a team who could use something more than a 3rd String QB.

Who would you have taken instead?

That would be a long list. Definitely not a QB and if it had to be a QB there were several who I would have rather had. Just to name a few players

Demario Winter
Chris Kuper
Mark Anderson
Jonathan Orr
Bernard Lay
Jason Pociask
Julian Jenkins
Jesse Mahelona

on and on and on

 

[Zero2Cool]

It was a total reach on a team who could use something more than a 3rd String QB.

Who would you have taken instead?

That would be a long list. Definitely not a QB and if it had to be a QB there were several who I would have rather had. Just to name a few players

Demario Winter
Chris Kuper
Mark Anderson
Jonathan Orr
Bernard Lay
Jason Pociask
Julian Jenkins
Jesse Mahelona

on and on and on

Everyone you mentnioned on that list, I've heard many negatives about.

GO INGLE!

 

[porky88]

The problem was at best heis a 3rd stringer this year and in the 5th round of a 4-12 teams draft we took a 3rd string "project".

Do you realize it was a 5th round pick and that's where you usually look to take players like that. Ron Wolf did the same thing with QB's and it worked out. You continue to call him a project when you fail to realize every QB taken in the Draft is a project.

[quote:1kn15pz8]I don't like Martin, sorry. You can talk about the guys arm strength but his accuracy is awful. There are lots of STRONG ARM QB's that have never amounted to anything. I hope he comes in when we get in a 3rd and 65. After that you better take him out because is accuracy is awful.

He completed 61 pct of his passes in 2 years at Furman. That's pretty solid actually. 147.65 was his passing efficiency. Again another solid number.

Love the guy all you want, it's a perfect feel good story for a QB from Furman to actually make it in the NFL, BUT, I am going to be realistic.

You fail to realize he was a top High School college recruit and played a 2 years at Florida a top level program that recruited him.

Porky, how do you know what mock drafts I am looking at? How do you know that one mock is better than another? On Scotts's Wright draft Martin was the 20th rated QB. Omar Jacobs was taken after Martin and he rated him 5th. He also suggests that Martin would be available in Free Agency as did every other draft site I saw. It was a total reach on a team who could use something more than a 3rd String QB.

[/quote:1kn15pz8]

He didn't update scouting reports for late graded players. Ask him if you like. Martin's combine was amazing.

Jacobs fell to the 6th round because of a reason. He has horrible mechanics. Martin has better mechanics. A lot of scouts told him before he declared he'd fall to day 2.

There's reason why ESPN is a pay site.

 

[pyledriver80]

I realize all those things Porky. Do you think I did not know he could not cut it at Florida?

I wish the guy the best, I really do, but am not expecting much. My problem is we do not have the luxury of reaching for a "Project QB" when we have other needs. Kuper would have been the perfect fit for this system. Why do you think Denver took him. I was high on Kuper long before the draft. Kuper was from North Dakota so it's not about school size it's about quality and need.


61% of his passes is nothing special. The 147 rating is also average. Omar Jacobs and Bruce Gradkowski both had higher averages and pass completion percentages and were both available when TT blew a 5th rounder on a unneeded QB.


I still don't know what Draft site had him rated as a possible 3rd rounder. You refer to Scott Wright's draft then you state he "just did not update it". What the hell kind of site is that then? It should probably tell you something. The truth is pay-site or free-site, none of these guys know anymore than anyone else. Again you have NO clue what sites I am using as a source. When I look at 25 sites and 24 of them say he will be at best a 7th round pick or most likely a free agent I tend to believe them over the 1 that does not. You should be a politician with all the spinning you are doing.


I wish him the best, I really do, but my problem is justified. TT REACHED for a position we did not need and as if that wasn't ridiculous enough he REACHED for a player at a position with better talent available.

 

[porky88]

60.7% That is Jacobs completion pct.

Grado would've been a good pick but hey why use a 5th round pick on a 3rd string QB especially when we don't have one? (sarcasm)

ESPN and NFL.com the fact is they have the inside sources. Both had him rated as "the" guy to watch. Todd McShay, Mel Kiper and even Mike Maylock (though I can't stand him) are better sources than any other draft site on the net. they have the inside sources. Your general scout does as well. The other ones don't. It's that simple. I said your probably looking at draft sites through Google. You haven't denied that.

Your problem isn't justified. Your complaining on a 5th round pick. Let's rip on TT for a 5th round pick. Why? It's a 5th round pick. Your not going to find someone in the 5th round that is going to make an impact. It's very rare that does happen. You have to get lucky with a hidden gem. You bash us for taking a QB from Furman then you want us to take a OL from N. Dakota. TT's draft isn't going to be make or break with a 5th round pick. Fact is Green Bay needed a 3rd string QB. Tom Arth isn't going to make the roster. TT said before the draft he was going to take a QB sometime. He did in the 5th round. Now when Favre is gone (probably next year) we don't have to waste money on 2 veteran’s coming in or another 1 or 2 Draft picks on a QB. It was a good pick. Was it the best pick in the draft. Not at all. Was it the Packers best pick in the draft? probably not. Was it the Packers worse pick in the Draft. No that goes to Tony Moll. A 4-12 or a 12-4 team doesn't look for 5th round pick to come in and make an impact. They look to use that pick for depth which TT did with it on a guy who most undoubtedly would’ve gone Drafted.

 

[Zero2Cool]

I realize all those things Porky. Do you think I did not know he could not cut it at Florida?

I realize I like pork and the second sentance, I realize confuses me. Anyone else confused by it?


GO INGLE! Imagine the chants of 70,000 plus fans screaming 'GO INGLE GO, GO INGLE GO, GO INGLE GO' serously you HAVE to love that.

 

[pyledriver80]

60.7% That is Jacobs completion pct.

Grado would've been a good pick but hey why use a 5th round pick on a 3rd string QB especially when we don't have one? (sarcasm)

ESPN and NFL.com the fact is they have the inside sources. Both had him rated as "the" guy to watch. Todd McShay, Mel Kiper and even Mike Maylock (though I can't stand him) are better sources than any other draft site on the net. they have the inside sources. Your general scout does as well. The other ones don't. It's that simple. I said your probably looking at draft sites through Google. You haven't denied that.

Your problem isn't justified. Your complaining on a 5th round pick. Let's rip on TT for a 5th round pick. Why? It's a 5th round pick. Your not going to find someone in the 5th round that is going to make an impact. It's very rare that does happen. You have to get lucky with a hidden gem. You bash us for taking a QB from Furman then you want us to take a OL from N. Dakota. TT's draft isn't going to be make or break with a 5th round pick. Fact is Green Bay needed a 3rd string QB. Tom Arth isn't going to make the roster. TT said before the draft he was going to take a QB sometime. He did in the 5th round. Now when Favre is gone (probably next year) we don't have to waste money on 2 veteran’s coming in or another 1 or 2 Draft picks on a QB. It was a good pick. Was it the best pick in the draft. Not at all. Was it the Packers best pick in the draft? probably not. Was it the Packers worse pick in the Draft. No that goes to Tony Moll. A 4-12 or a 12-4 team doesn't look for 5th round pick to come in and make an impact. They look to use that pick for depth which TT did with it on a guy who most undoubtedly would’ve gone Drafted.

Actually Jacobs career completion percentage is 65.1%.

I have stated several times that I don't mind small school guys and that Ingle was from Furman has nothing to do with it. Kuper is an OG, you know the weakest spot on the team, who was taken by a team who uses a Zone-Blocking scheme effectively and knows what kind of players are needed to properly execute it.

Denver not only ripped us off for Walker, but did what GB should have done in taking Kuper.


It's just spin Porky. It's funny that everyone says that he was replaced by Leak because Zook was a "Leak Guy" but again thats not true. He started 4 games and was yanked after his second loss to Tennessee.


I am still waiting to see where Martin was projected as a 3rd rounder. I am a college football freak and look at tons of Mock Drafts. I don't look at 1 or 2 sites but dozens. NONE of these sites had Ingle Martin going early. Every one says "Late Rounder/Free agent". 95% of the sites also have 3-4 QB's that were available going before Ingle.


I can see that you are just pulling for the guy and are not real familiar with him. You can say you have tape or whatever but I see his mediocre stats playing against teams like Elon and Jacksonville State, and they are less than impressive.

You can minimize the "5th round pick" thing if you want but there were definitely spots with higher importance than QB. I also disagree with your assessment of Moll. When Colledge does not pan out because he's getting steamrolled, Moll will take his spot. He was the best O-Lineman we drafted for this system IMO.

 

[SuperRat]

I was just wondering, what was your stance on Nick Collins last year? Everything I read had him going undrafted last year, and I didn't see him in any mock drafts.

 

[Zero2Cool]

Actually Jacobs career completion percentage is 65.1%.

Current Season Statistics: Completed 195 of 321 passes (60.7%) for 2,591 yards and 26 TDs with seven interceptions.

Carreer Stats : 811 Attempts 523 Completions 64.4%.

 

[arrowgargantuan]

I was just wondering, what was your stance on Nick Collins last year? Everything I read had him going undrafted last year, and I didn't see him in any mock drafts.

some had him going in the 4th i believe. someone told me the Ravens were going to take him with their next pick if we hadn't, but i have absolutely nothing to back that up with.

 

[Zero2Cool]

I was just wondering, what was your stance on Nick Collins last year? Everything I read had him going undrafted last year, and I didn't see him in any mock drafts.

some had him going in the 4th i believe. someone told me the Ravens were going to take him with their next pick if we hadn't, but i have absolutely nothing to back that up with.

Ravens contacted the Packers to congradulate them on picking Collins. That's when I got confidence in the pick right away lol

 

[SuperRat]

Yeah I had heard that the Ravens were going to take him also, and that at least one team congratulated Green Bay on the pick, but if I remember correctly most mocks I saw had him undrafted and Kiper called it a major reach.

 

[P@ck66]

One impact guy so far...

Looks like TT's on a roll...

 

[arrowgargantuan]

blah, blah, blah...

yeah, TT is like the worst GM ever.

 

[DePack]

I probably missed it, but where did you come up with this quote from P@ck66?

I'm assuming you didn't make this quote up. I'm sure there are rules regarding tampering with others quotes. If you're pulling it from a different thread well....that's just cheap.

 

[Zero2Cool]

I probably missed it, but where did you come up with this quote from P@ck66?

I'm assuming you didn't make this quote up. I'm sure there are rules regarding tampering with others quotes. If you're pulling it from a different thread well....that's just cheap.

Bad attempt... very bad.


Shall we visit the topic once more? We shall.

I dont know why everyone is so happy that Javon is gone. I havent been on here very long but im sure that everyone loved him 2 years ago when he was one of the best receivers in the league. I know that I considered him a top 5 receiver in the league back then. For soooooo long, Javon is exactly what we(Packers) and brett desperately needed.

Its funny, we have money for chronically injured overrated players like Charles Woodson. What a slap in the face to Javon it must have been to see Woodson given all that money and respect froma team he never even played for. We can give a boatload of money to a rookie who has never played an NFL down. But, we cant seem to "take care" of our own guys. Javon was our guy. He was proven. He was going to be a superstar and most likely still will be one. With a healthy Javon we could have had a shot at the playoffs last year. I know one player dosent make a team but.........you have 2 receivers on the field. If you only have to worry about one of them, the other receiver suffers as well as the running game.

We got a 2nd round draft pick for Javon. Would you trade Randy Moss, Chad Johnson or Harrison for a 2nd unproven draft pick who might not even make the team. Greg Jennings might be pretty good but he will never equal Javon in "play making" capabilities. Playmakers are what make an offense explosive, not a bunch of decent receivers can catch the ball.

If you want to say "honor your contract" than fine. How many other great pros have held out. Emmit Smith is just one example. Other players in similar situations to Javon dont have to deal with this. The team just recognizes that they need to keep their guys happy and they pay them before the contract even ends. How many guys can you name that have had their deals redone before the contract ended. Why couldnt the GBP have done that? We needed a big time playmaker for Favre for soooo long and we gave him away for a player who might not even start on our weak offensive line.

So, basically the best we can hope for this year is to be a pretty good team that might make the playoffs. With Javon, i think we would be one of the 3 best teams in the conference with a Superbowl shot. Thats all we will be this year unless Rod Gardner/Underacheiver can finally realize his potential.

Keep in mind, im not saying this to trash the packers or Brett Favre for saying what he said about Javon even though you dont put your teammates out there the way Brett did to Javon. Your still my fav player Brett but you should have said nothing. Ive been a Packer fan for much longer than alot of you im sure, since 1991. Nobody loves the Pack more than me.

Thats all i have to say, now you can start throwing rocks at me, go ahead.

 

[longtimefan]

Emmitt Smith?? Didnt he hold out when they just won a SB tho? or at least when he was an ESTABLISHED rb?

 

[DePack]

I probably missed it, but where did you come up with this quote from P@ck66?

I'm assuming you didn't make this quote up. I'm sure there are rules regarding tampering with others quotes. If you're pulling it from a different thread well....that's just cheap.

Bad attempt... very bad.


Shall we visit the topic once more? We shall.

I dont know why everyone is so happy that Javon is gone. I havent been on here very long but im sure that everyone loved him 2 years ago when he was one of the best receivers in the league. I know that I considered him a top 5 receiver in the league back then. For soooooo long, Javon is exactly what we(Packers) and brett desperately needed.

Its funny, we have money for chronically injured overrated players like Charles Woodson. What a slap in the face to Javon it must have been to see Woodson given all that money and respect froma team he never even played for. We can give a boatload of money to a rookie who has never played an NFL down. But, we cant seem to "take care" of our own guys. Javon was our guy. He was proven. He was going to be a superstar and most likely still will be one. With a healthy Javon we could have had a shot at the playoffs last year. I know one player dosent make a team but.........you have 2 receivers on the field. If you only have to worry about one of them, the other receiver suffers as well as the running game.

We got a 2nd round draft pick for Javon. Would you trade Randy Moss, Chad Johnson or Harrison for a 2nd unproven draft pick who might not even make the team. Greg Jennings might be pretty good but he will never equal Javon in "play making" capabilities. Playmakers are what make an offense explosive, not a bunch of decent receivers can catch the ball.

If you want to say "honor your contract" than fine. How many other great pros have held out. Emmit Smith is just one example. Other players in similar situations to Javon dont have to deal with this. The team just recognizes that they need to keep their guys happy and they pay them before the contract even ends. How many guys can you name that have had their deals redone before the contract ended. Why couldnt the GBP have done that? We needed a big time playmaker for Favre for soooo long and we gave him away for a player who might not even start on our weak offensive line.

So, basically the best we can hope for this year is to be a pretty good team that might make the playoffs. With Javon, i think we would be one of the 3 best teams in the conference with a Superbowl shot. Thats all we will be this year unless Rod Gardner/Underacheiver can finally realize his potential.

Keep in mind, im not saying this to trash the packers or Brett Favre for saying what he said about Javon even though you dont put your teammates out there the way Brett did to Javon. Your still my fav player Brett but you should have said nothing. Ive been a Packer fan for much longer than alot of you im sure, since 1991. Nobody loves the Pack more than me.

Thats all i have to say, now you can start throwing rocks at me, go ahead.

Bad attempt at what?


You know me. I don't like it when people start crap. I really couldn't find the quote. You got a problem with me saying that......then ban me.