2022 Draft #34 Christian Watson

[Deleted member 6794]

The Chiefs have more of an elite D than you would like to think imho.

Well, the Chiefs featured an average defense during the regular season and really didn't perform at an elite level in the playoffs either.

 

[gopkrs]

Well, the Chiefs featured an average defense during the regular season and really didn't perform at an elite level in the playoffs either.

they sure did in the Super Bowl.

 

[Heyjoe4]

The Chiefs have more of an elite D than you would like to think imho.

The Chiefs allowed the Eagles 11 points in the second half, with the game on the line. That's a pretty good D and/or players who know how to bring it with the title on the line.

 

[Heyjoe4]

they sure did in the Super Bowl.

Agreed. It's naive to think they would have won the SB w/o that defense. Gotta give em credit.

 

[Schultz]

THAT Defense gave up 35 pts. Are you saying you expected KC to score more than 35 on the Philly defense?

 

[Heyjoe4]

THAT Defense gave up 35 pts. Are you saying you expected KC to score more than 35 on the Philly defense?

Actually, yes. Put another way, I believed the Chiefs would win. And yeah, in fairness, that D gave up 24 1H points and had about 10 mins. TOP. It was a game of two very different halves. When they needed to though, when the pressure was highest, the Chiefs were the better team.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

they sure did in the Super Bowl.

I'm sorry, but I definitely don't consider a defense that gave up 35 points in a game as having played at an elite level.

 

[Voyageur]

I'm sorry, but I definitely don't consider a defense that gave up 35 points in a game as having played at an elite level.

A single game can decide a championship, but the level of play in that one game does not determine the true ability of a team's capability. There's a reason there are so few perfect, and nearly perfect records, for a season. If you're intent on making it about one game, none of them really succeed unless they win every game during the entire season, and nobody crosses a threshold a person determines is acceptable for their defense.

 

[Schultz]

IMO. Here is the problem with a lot of comments on here. People do not have time to read everything. He was specifically responding to a post that stated the Chiefs defense played elite in the SB. Therefore it is an appropriate response to single out that 1 game. IMO.

 

[OldSchool101]

The Chiefs have more of an elite D than you would like to think imho.

The KC Defense allowed 22.2 points per game across 20 contests. That’s definitely not elite. If anyone was elite it was their Offense, with over 7,000 yards and 29.34 pts per game across those 20 contests.

 

[tynimiller]

IMO. Here is the problem with a lot of comments on here. People do not have time to read everything. He was specifically responding to a post that stated the Chiefs defense played elite in the SB. Therefore it is an appropriate response to single out that 1 game. IMO.

To be fair I would say when speaking critically of another in forum one should assume that person took time to actually read everything.

You’re not wrong and my comment isn’t towards you but those that do not read everything: YOU are the worst of the forums in moments you don’t read everything before commenting.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

A single game can decide a championship, but the level of play in that one game does not determine the true ability of a team's capability. There's a reason there are so few perfect, and nearly perfect records, for a season. If you're intent on making it about one game, none of them really succeed unless they win every game during the entire season, and nobody crosses a threshold a person determines is acceptable for their defense.

As others have pointed out I was replying to another poster claiming the Chiefs defense performed at an elite level in the Super Bowl.

In addition their defense wasn't elite over the course of the entire season either.

 

[Voyageur]

As others have pointed out I was replying to another poster claiming the Chiefs defense performed at an elite level in the Super Bowl.

In addition their defense wasn't elite over the course of the entire season either.

Agreed. I think some people misinterpreted what you said. The KC defense was only average over the course of the year, and that was only because their offense was so potent that they were able to force a lot of teams to take to the air. Even, when saying their offense was so good, that's another point. They were pretty good, but had some flaws as well. They could end up relying on Mahomes arm way too often.

 

[Heyjoe4]

Agreed. I think some people misinterpreted what you said. The KC defense was only average over the course of the year, and that was only because their offense was so potent that they were able to force a lot of teams to take to the air. Even, when saying their offense was so good, that's another point. They were pretty good, but had some flaws as well. They could end up relying on Mahomes arm way too often.

Yeah A 38-35 SB wasn't decided by the D, it was decided essentially by which team had the ball last (I know, technically that was Philly, but with 4 seconds). The KC D did step up in the second half, allowing only 11 points. A little surprising considering 1H TOP favored Philly 20/10.

I believe that most SBs are decided primarily by defense. Some people disagree and that's fine it's just an opinion. This SB was an exception and a lot more fun to watch.

And maybe with the rule changes being more kind to offense, especially on QB roughing, things are changing so the offense is the deciding factor. I don't know. Hey, as long as the games are interesting......

 

[OldSchool101]

Yeah A 38-35 SB wasn't decided by the D, it was decided essentially by which team had the ball last (I know, technically that was Philly, but with 4 seconds). The KC D did step up in the second half, allowing only 11 points. A little surprising considering 1H TOP favored Philly 20/10.

I believe that most SBs are decided primarily by defense. Some people disagree and that's fine it's just an opinion. This SB was an exception and a lot more fun to watch.

And maybe with the rule changes being more kind to offense, especially on QB roughing, things are changing so the offense is the deciding factor. I don't know. Hey, as long as the games are interesting......

I haven’t added in the last several seasons, but the SB teams up until about 5 years ago did favor the D very slightly. At that point the SB Defenses in Scoring and rounded to the nearest whole number were #7 (6.8 etc) whereas the Offenses averaged just over #8 ranking (8.1). I did not use the ST rankings but oddly, that might factor nicely as a tie breaker. We have all witnessed how a great Return specialist can turn the tide pretty quickly.

So while it is true that Defenses had factored the most going back over 57 Superbowls. At best, it’s likely only by a few nose hairs. The last several Superbowls have had some high octane scoring Offenses.
6 of the last 10 Super Bowl Winners have scored 31+points.

The average SB Winner over the last 10 Superbowls below

Offense 30.6 points scored
Defense 19.0 points allowed

Hopefully Christian Watson and another high draft pick WR sparks our Offense to 30.6 and we get Captain as DC to attain 19.0 allowed!

 

[Deleted member 6794]

I haven’t added in the last several seasons, but the SB teams up until about 5 years ago did favor the D very slightly. At that point the SB Defenses in Scoring and rounded to the nearest whole number were #7 (6.8 etc) whereas the Offenses averaged just over #8 ranking (8.1). I did not use the ST rankings but oddly, that might factor nicely as a tie breaker. We have all witnessed how a great Return specialist can turn the tide pretty quickly.

So while it is true that Defenses had factored the most going back over 57 Superbowls. At best, it’s likely only by a few nose hairs. The last several Superbowls have had some high octane scoring Offenses.
6 of the last 10 Super Bowl Winners have scored 31+points.

The average SB Winner over the last 10 Superbowls below

Offense 30.6 points scored
Defense 19.0 points allowed

Hopefully Christian Watson and another high draft pick WR sparks our Offense to 30.6 and we get Captain as DC to attain 19.0 allowed!

While over the past two seasons teams with only mediocre defenses during the regular season won the Super Bowl each of the previous eight teams that ended up winning the Lombardi Trophy featured a top 8 scoring defense.

 

[Voyageur]

While over the past two seasons teams with only mediocre defenses during the regular season won the Super Bowl each of the previous eight teams that ended up winning the Lombardi Trophy featured a top 8 scoring defense.

The reality is that how good your offense is, compared to your defense, it's mostly due to how much money you're willing to pay out to make it happen. A team with a great offense rarely has better than a mediocre defense, because they spend more on shoring up the offense.

As for the game itself, over the last 20 years, the league itself has constantly changed the rules to make it easier for teams to put points on the board. It's what everyone should suspect. When you compare it to the game I first followed, where a QB threw the ball less than 15 times a game, and in a lot of cases, around 10.

These changes have happened to get more people watching the game. The old one score wins games of the past no longer apply to today's game.

 

[Heyjoe4]

The reality is that how good your offense is, compared to your defense, it's mostly due to how much money you're willing to pay out to make it happen. A team with a great offense rarely has better than a mediocre defense, because they spend more on shoring up the offense.

As for the game itself, over the last 20 years, the league itself has constantly changed the rules to make it easier for teams to put points on the board. It's what everyone should suspect. When you compare it to the game I first followed, where a QB threw the ball less than 15 times a game, and in a lot of cases, around 10.

These changes have happened to get more people watching the game. The old one score wins games of the past no longer apply to today's game.

You're right. All the rule changes, or most of them, are designed to increase the output on offense, and rightfully so, to protect players. In the cap era, it's just not easy to win a SB, and a lot of luck is involved.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

The reality is that how good your offense is, compared to your defense, it's mostly due to how much money you're willing to pay out to make it happen. A team with a great offense rarely has better than a mediocre defense, because they spend more on shoring up the offense.

The Packers had one of the most expensive defenses in the league during several seasons of Rodgers' tenure as the starter. Unfortunately they overpaid for a lot of mediocre talent.

 

[GreenNGold_81]

The Chiefs have more of an elite D than you would like to think imho.

The Chiefs defense was brutal against the pass at times last year against slot receivers. You could practically throw against them at will. They cleaned it up a bit in the playoffs against the Jags, luckily. The problem is, you have to keep up with their offense and not take your foot off the gas.

 

[GreenNGold_81]

The Packers had one of the most expensive defenses in the league during several seasons of Rodgers' tenure as the starter. Unfortunately they overpaid for a lot of mediocre talent.

I think it's not necessarily the talent that's the issue. It's the coaching. Barry hasn't been the answer and Gray just left town. GB brass doesn't seem to cut ties quickly with poor coaches and can't attract the top coaches (ex. Fangio).

 

[Heyjoe4]

I think it's not necessarily the talent that's the issue. It's the coaching. Barry hasn't been the answer and Gray just left town. GB brass doesn't seem to cut ties quickly with poor coaches and can't attract the top coaches (ex. Fangio).

That sums it up well. How long did they keep Capers? Like six years, about 5 years too long. I’m kinda shocked MLF didn’t whack Barry. MLF doesn’t seem to have any cajones.

 

[OldSchool101]

As for the game itself, over the last 20 years, the league itself has constantly changed the rules to make it easier for teams to put points on the board.

This is true. Using the scoring ranking in points scored/allowed account for that, so it’s a level playing field there as far as the
argument of balanced teams win championships.
But you’re right the passing game has exploded. The other thing that’s changed is we don’t have nearly as high % of Tie games either

 

[Deleted member 6794]

I think it's not necessarily the talent that's the issue. It's the coaching. Barry hasn't been the answer and Gray just left town. GB brass doesn't seem to cut ties quickly with poor coaches and can't attract the top coaches (ex. Fangio).

I definitely agree that the coaching staff is responsible for the defense not performing up to potential. Unfortunately MLF doesn't seem to agree with us.

That sums it up well. How long did they keep Capers? Like six years, about 5 years too long.

Capers was the Packers' defensive coordinator for a total of nine seasons.

 

[Voyageur]

I'd like to blame the problems with the defense strictly on the coaches, but I can't. It's as much of a personnel and money problem, as it is coaching. We have way too much money tied up in a handful of players. There's not enough cap room to look at FAs out there that are one or two steps above what we have in some starting positions, and to improve depth.

You don't make Beef Wellington with ground beef.