Time to sign a free agent on defense

[longtimefan]

No it's not..at the same time he's not the type of guy that will call out Capers scheme either so...

Ok what does this mean then

they don't understand the scheme fully, they don't understand what the scheme can do for them, if they understand it

 

[Rodgers in the House]

TT and MM are a draft and develop mentality. So we will always be the youngest team in the NFL and never have any significant playmakers that have made strides elsewhere. What happens is that we develop them then they go and kick *** somewhere else. Not all of them but most of them. So we will always be in mediocrity until that mindset changes. You have to admit that every time we go deep in the playoffs it's always because we 'overcome the odd's' when other teams do it by actual talented personel. Look at Denver, SF, Seattle, and NE. Those names constantly come up in terms of teams having what it takes to go far.

Our conditioning staff should be burned at the stake. Something is seriously wrong when this team has injury after injury. We lost 2 guys on one play alone against SF. WTF is wrong here? I can see 2-3 guys, even 5 but more than 15? Really?

We need to seriously sign a stud safety in FA, like Woodson back in the day. But it will never happen until we get a change in the front office.

I think TT will just leave if we have another season like this. The good news is we won't have to face SF until the post season if it happens. We just have to go to Seattle again and we all know how that ended.

 

[Royal Pain]

Woodson will be available

Lol. I'm a big fan of Charles Woodson and always will be, but that ship has sailed.

 

[rodell330]

Say Clay was a free agent last year, the contract he got with the Pack, is that what he would have got from a Dallas, Redskins or who ever?

ok so Dallas, Redskins or "whoever" still overpaid..just like Buffalo with Mario Williams, just like Colts with Walden. Your point is???

 

[Royal Pain]

Ok what does this mean then

I think he's saying that Capers scheme is fairly complicated and young players have enough on their plate dealing with the speed and talent level of playing in the NFL.

 

[rodell330]

Lol. I'm a big fan of Charles Woodson and always will be, but that ship has sailed.

or has it?

 

[longtimefan]

I think he's saying that Capers scheme is fairly complicated and young players have enough on their plate dealing with the speed and talent level of playing in the NFL.

Ok but if the young ones understand it, is it a good scheme?

 

[longtimefan]

ok so Dallas, Redskins or "whoever" still overpaid..just like Buffalo with Mario Williams, just like Colts with Walden. Your point is???

you said Packers over paid..

I am wondering what you believe he would have got as a FA last year

 

[rodell330]

Same dang story for the past three years. Tramon was right, you have all these young guy's getting significant playing time and sometimes they just aint ready. Combine that with a real lack of talent with guy's who know the scheme this is what you get.

Brad Jones is not a starting material, yet he was paid big money to assume that role? why not pay sombody else better and LESS injury prone to assume that role? MD Jennings is garbage..flat out sorry. Yet the guy was still lining up as a starter every week? this was who they let Woodson go for? stupid move. Nick Perry and Mike Neal are the exact same type of player. Neither one can play pass coverage, both are out of position and havn't made significant strides at being solid compliments to Clay Matthews as outside linebackers and both are two of the most injury prone guy's on the entire roster. For Petes sakes has Nick Perry ever made an open field tackle?

Capers needs to go yes, but if he does look at what the next guy has to work with? this roster needs a complete makeover on defense period and it starts with TALENT and guy's who are proven to stay HEALTHY..some speed wouldn't hurt either good Lord.

 

[Royal Pain]

Ok but if the young ones understand it, is it a good scheme?

I'm not qualified to answer that question, but from everything I've read, he had a good scheme drawn up for Sunday's game. IMO, too many injuries and untimely breakdowns led to the loss. I like Jarrett Bush. He plays with a lot of enthusiasm, but as a veteran he has to know he cannot allow Kaepernick to break contain on that key third down.

 

[HardRightEdge]

Nick Perry and Mike Neal are the exact same type of player.

That's about as true as you can get in comparing two players. Besides what you said, they're both bull rushers who made some hay against lesser OTs but then disappeared for games at a time. Neal had some nice pressure stats at times but not a lot of hits/sacks...being a 1/2 step slow in the NFL is the difference between "good" and "marginal/expendable". Neal says he'll be happy to drop more weight if that's what the coaches want. That suggests he sees the issue, and that he's not been made any contract gestures to date (no surprise there).

I think we can expect Neal going elsewhere in FA unless he agrees to something very cheap. I say this knowing Neal was our second best OLB this past season. His situation is comparable to EDS. Perry is under contract along with a rationalized "upside" that comes with inexperience...so he must get the nod.

 

[Royal Pain]

Same dang story for the past three years. Tramon was right, you have all these young guy's getting significant playing time and sometimes they just aint ready. Combine that with a real lack of talent with guy's who know the scheme this is what you get.

Brad Jones is not a starting material, yet he was paid big money to assume that role? why not pay sombody else better and LESS injury prone to assume that role? MD Jennings is garbage..flat out sorry. Yet the guy was still lining up as a starter every week? this was who they let Woodson go for? stupid move. Nick Perry and Mike Neal are the exact same type of player. Neither one can play pass coverage, both are out of position and havn't made significant strides at being solid compliments to Clay Matthews as outside linebackers and both are two of the most injury prone guy's on the entire roster. For Petes sakes has Nick Perry ever made an open field tackle?

Capers needs to go yes, but if he does look at what the next guy has to work with? this roster needs a complete makeover on defense period and it starts with TALENT and guy's who are proven to stay HEALTHY..some speed wouldn't hurt either good Lord.

All good points, although I do not agree Capers needs to go and I think we need to cut Perry some slack because of his foot injury. The thing is, with the emergence of Lacy, our offense should be bordering on unstoppable the next few years. We don't need a GREAT defense, just a good one. I think if we an get a healthy year out of most everyone and plug the holes at ILB and safety, we would have a pretty good defense.

 

[rodell330]

you said Packers over paid..

I am wondering what you believe he would have got as a FA last year

This wasn't about Matthews...In Matthews you can afford to "overpay" because the risk/reward factor is way higher towards the reward side. So i don't mind that signing. My point was that you can't afford to overpay for guy's like Brad Jones because what you see is what you get. An injury prone backup on 31 other teams. That money could have been better used..heck Oakland gave Woodson 2 mil. Woodson could have taken a pay cut and stayed here and helped this defense way better then what Brad Jones did.

 

[7thFloorRA]

Ok but if the young ones understand it, is it a good scheme?

I want to know which "young ones' he is referring to. Hyde seemed to be in position most of the time and he is as young as it gets. House, Burnett,Jennings and even shields sometimes seem to be the ones that have the miscommunication issues. Those guys have been around enough...some of them like Burnett more than enough to know the scheme inside and out by now. They may not be the smartest guys in the room but if they are still all struggling with the schemes then it might be too elaborate of a scheme. When he dumbs it down by letting them play man they play a whole lot better IMO.

 

[rodell330]

All good points, although I do not agree Capers needs to go and I think we need to cut Perry some slack because of his foot injury. The thing is, with the emergence of Lacy, our offense should be bordering on unstoppable the next few years. We don't need a GREAT defense, just a good one. I think if we an get a healthy year out of most everyone and plug the holes at ILB and safety, we would have a pretty good defense.

Exactly! we don't need a great defense just a good one. But we don't even have that. I know Perry is playing hurt but i'm not sold on him as an olb. He just does not have the ability to cover a guy in space and he whiffs on to many tackles. They need to line him up at Defensive end im so serious. It's now the time to groom another olb like Mulumba and see if he's the answer. Nick has had two yrs now in the system to take the spot and hasn't been able to take the job or stay healthy.

 

[rodell330]

I want to know which "young ones' he is referring to. Hyde seemed to be in position most of the time and he is as young as it gets. House, Burnett,Jennings and even shields sometimes seem to be the ones that have the miscommunication issues. Those guys have been around enough...some of them like Burnett more than enough to know the scheme inside and out by now. They may not be the smartest guys in the room but if they are still all struggling with the schemes then it might be too elaborate of a scheme. When he dumbs it down by letting them play man they play a whole lot better IMO.

Burnett is terrible in zone, House is terrible in zone, Jennings is just terrible, Williams is ok in zone better at man, and shileds is the only one out of the bunch who can thrive in either or because he thinks like a wr and recognizes routes very well.

 

[Royal Pain]

Saw Jon Beason's name mentioned and I think he could be a terrific addition. He was a stud on the Panther's defense until suffering a torn achilles in the first game of the 2011 season. He seemed to be working his way back to form, but was expendable because of the emergence of Luke Kuechly and was traded to the Giants. I'm not sure if the Giants intend to resign him, but he's the kind of player that brings an 'attitude' to a defense and is only 28 years old.

 

[Shawnsta3]

TT and MM are a draft and develop mentality. So we will always be the young team in the NFL and never have any significant playmakers that have made strides elsewhere. What happens is that we develop them then they go and kick *** somewhere else. Not all of them but most of them. So we will always be in mediocrity until that mindset changes. You have to admit that every time we go deep in the playoffs it's always because we 'overcome the odd's' when other teams do it by actual talented personel. Look at Denver, SF, Seattle, and NE. Those names constantly come up in terms of teams having what it takes to go far.

Our conditioning staff should be burned at the stake. Something is seriously wrong when this team has injury after injury. We lost 2 guys on one play alone against SF. WTF is wrong here? I can see 2-3 guys, even 5 but more than 15? Really?

We need to seriously sign a stud safety in FA, like Woodson back in the day. But it will never happen until we get a change in the front office.

I think TT will just leave if we have another season like this. The good news is we won't have to face SF until the post season if it happens. We just have to go to Seattle again and we all know how that ended.

Winning a championship and being one of the two teams to make the playoffs the past four years is not mediocrity. That's at the very least a top three franchise with New England and Baltimore.

You say we let too much talent walk to other good teams, yet we should sign more of other teams FA's? You can't have it both ways, and besides, resigning our own players has always been a huge priority of Thompson's. Look at Rodgers, Matthews, Nelson, Jones, Lang, Burnett, Tramon Williams, Hawk. I could go on and on.

Woodson was not a "stud" free agent by any means. He turned to free agency, the market soured on him with no one else even offering him a contract when Green Bay picked him up.

 

[ivo610]

Saw Jon Beason's name mentioned and I think he could be a terrific addition. He was a stud on the Panther's defense until suffering a torn achilles in the first game of the 2011 season. He seemed to be working his way back to form, but was expendable because of the emergence of Luke Kuechly and was traded to the Giants. I'm not sure if the Giants intend to resign him, but he's the kind of player that brings an 'attitude' to a defense and is only 28 years old.

That seems like a name signing. I would want a through medical eval before making any contract discussions

 

[ivo610]

I don't think the fan base realizes how good they have it with this org. Most will admit that no team would have fared well with the equal amount of injuries but they want things to be better than that even. Unrealistic expectations.

 

[brandon2348]

I know TT loves to develop through the draft and for the most part i applaud that strategy, but at times a free agent signing is in order. Unfortunately, our greatest needs on defense are also the shallowest positions in this draft. Clearly, if by chance Clinton-Dix or Mosley are available when we pick at #21, we are going to draft one. Other than that, there really aren't too many prospects for immediate impact.

Rodgers is in his prime and will be for the next 5-7 years. We don't have time to develop players at both of those positions. I think it's time to open the check book and make a serious play at Jairus Byrd. Bills franchised him last year, so he's got a green light. Would he be expensive? Yes. Would he be worth the investment? Hell yes!

If we sign one guy, that's the one I want. His impact would be immediate and substantial. A guy like him makes the entire defense better. He's my signee. Who would you sign?

 

[brandon2348]

That seems like a name signing. I would want a through medical eval before making any contract discussions

Tired of this seemingly never-ending process of re-building the D with no results. I think they should trade up to get C.J Mosley in first round if they need too and get Deone Bucannon, Washington State(SS) in second round. Those two guys are "fast and nasty." Make a move on Jimmie Graham if he makes free agency. Let Pickett, Jones & Jones, Raji, Starks, Finley go. Try to keep Neal, Lattimore, Kuhn, EDS, and Jolly on the cheap. Restructure Traymon Williams contract to keep Shields if possible or let one of them go. Hope Hayward can become starting corner. Dump the rest and draft. The defense with those new additions couldn't be a any worse then last year and offense would be "smokin" with Graham.

 

[ivo610]

Tired of this seemingly never-ending process of re-building the D with no results. I think they should trade up to get C.J Mosley in first round if they need too and get Deone Bucannon, Washington State(SS) in second round. Those two guys are "fast and nasty." Make a move on Jimmie Graham if he makes free agency. Let Pickett, Jones & Jones, Raji, Starks, Finley go. Try to keep Neal, Lattimore, Kuhn, EDS, and Jolly on the cheap. Restructure Traymon Williams contract to keep Shields if possible or let one of them go. Hope Hayward can become starting corner. Dump the rest and draft. The defense with those new additions couldn't be a any worse then last year and offense would be "smokin" with Graham.

Zero chance NO let's graham hit FA. Even if he did, we can't make 3 players the highest paid players at their position. It's not realistic fiscally.

They need to take the best player available outside of QB and O line in the first round.

 

[brandon2348]

New Orleans is buried like 15 million over the cap. The Sainsts would have to drop 5 players just to franchise him and hopefully under a TE franchise tag which might not happen. I know it's wishful thinking but he could very easily be available. The move would put lot's of pressure down the road on cap but who knows whats gonna happen. The window is closing and I want to beat the 49'ers. Packer are way way under the cap and even more so if they let Traymon Williams go.

 

[Carl]

Clay and Rodgers are not overpaid. If the Packers didn't pay them like they had, someone else would have. Lots of teams overpay and would have paid more. Jay Cutler just got a huge contract!

Also, the Packers have about 20 free agents. Even with the cap room, anyone who expects the Packers to retain all the guys they want and be major players in free agency is clearly mistaken.