Studs duds saints game

[RepStar15]

I apologize, I must have been watching a different football game. Or do people truly believe the Saints played well yesterday?

 

[I asked LT to delete my acct]

Reading comprehension skills need work here. Often times, a post means exactly what it said. Mondio got it.

My point was exactly what I wrote. The Saints are good and with Rodgers it wasn't a guaranteed a win.

Not saying it was good they lost and they deserve a "participation trophy" or Rodgers isn't 10 points better than Hundley.

The forum overreacts after every loss like we had just been blown out by a terrible team, but that is not the reality.

And that told you lot . There is a tendency to overeaction at times.

 

[Dantés]

Why did Trevor Davis keep taking it out? That last time he did put us in a hole at the 10.

I'm wondering if that was a coaching decision hoping for a big play in the kicking game.

 

[HardRightEdge]

Stud:

Capers for playing Randall at single high safety on two snaps with Dix in the box. Randall made the tackle on both plays, by the way.

Randall could be a 1st. round cornerback if the NFL banned the double move.

This would be a better defense with Randall at FS and Dix at slot corner.

Dud:

Capers for being out-adjusted at half time, again.

 

[HardRightEdge]

I'm wondering if that was a coaching decision hoping for a big play in the kicking game.

That was a nice return by Davis were it not for Jones' block in the back.

The kickoff return was one of the most exciting plays in football not so long ago. Between the touchbacks and the penalties it's turned into a waste of time. Since you can't get rid of it entirely because the on-side kick needs to be retained I would suggest the kicking team gets the option of either kicking or putting the ball at the 25 and be done with this obsolete football play.

Otherwise, go back to what it was: move the kick back and put the touchback at the 20. But the league will never do that because of the injury incidence. These half measures that have been taken make for bad football.

The only other option would be to give the kicking team a point if they put it through the uprights to make this play worth playing.

 

[Sunshinepacker]

Stud:

Capers for playing Randall at single high safety on two snaps with Dix in the box. Randall made the tackle on both plays, by the way.

Randall could be a 1st. round cornerback if the NFL banned the double move.

This would be a better defense with Randall at FS and Dix at slot corner.

Dud:

Capers for being out-adjusted at half time, again.

Kind of weird Capers obsession...I mean, many things didn't go well and I certainly understand Capers being on the list but the ONLY dud? Hundley not on the list? McCarthy not on the list? Front seven should be on the list, unless you think Capers schemed so that the team intentionally only got one sack when the QB threw the ball 38 times.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

I do prefer seeing Davis back there returning kicks over Janis, who once again for the 3rd time this year couldn't fall on a fumble and maintain possession, it's like his hands are greased up. Granted, it wouldn't have counted due to fair catch interference on the play, but come on Jeff....show me something special on special teams.

 

[HardRightEdge]

Kind of weird Capers obsession...I mean, many things didn't go well and I certainly understand Capers being on the list but the ONLY dud?

I'm not going waste my time in stating the obvious mentioned 50 times already. Jones! Woo woo! Happy?

By the way, Matthews had a nice game in case anybody didn't notice which is probably the case because he did not get a sack.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

Kind of weird Capers obsession...I mean, many things didn't go well and I certainly understand Capers being on the list but the ONLY dud? Hundley not on the list? McCarthy not on the list? Front seven should be on the list, unless you think Capers schemed so that the team intentionally only got one sack when the QB threw the ball 38 times.

Pretty simple reason, Capers is the old constant that doesn't seem to change. Now that the offense has been weakened, the need for the defense to step up is even greater. People can keep saying that the defense can't be expected to play well, when the offense goes 3 and out a lot, but was that really the problem prior to this? Morgan Burnett was the only starter missing yesterday, so it isn't injuries. It's either lack of talent or bad coaching, but until the Packers bring in a new DC, they will never know. I had been on the fence for awhile with Capers, but its time.

 

[Sunshinepacker]

Pretty simple reason, Capers is the old constant that doesn't seem to change. Now that the offense has been weakened, the need for the defense to step up is even greater. People can keep saying that the defense can't be expected to play well, when the offense goes 3 and out a lot, but was that really the problem prior to this? Morgan Burnett was the only starter missing yesterday.

Ok, the options are that defensive personnel is a problem or the coach is a problem. The Packers don't have a good defense, so no, it's not going to change from game to game. One could argue that the defense did an excellent job until they got tired. One could also argue that the defense was only misssing one starter but then it could be pointed out that the defense also had to play Quinton Dial, Marwin Evans, Damarious Randall and Chris Odom so obviously the team was a little more beat up than "just one starter". However, I've long just said that the entire organization is kind of letting Rodgers down; Thompson has lost too much front office talent for his "draft-centric" style, McCarthy is great at teaching young players but he's not very innovative on offense and he's kind of a bad game-day coach, and Capers might be the reason the defense is terrible and, if he is, then that's another reason to get rid of McCarthy because he's the guy that's kept him around.

 

[Mondio]

I'm wondering if that was a coaching decision hoping for a big play in the kicking game.

Was one of the first things I said to my brother sitting at USBank stadium after Rodgers went down. Our special teams philosophy had to change. Looks like it did. I know they were content to just take the ball at the 25 every time. Which was fine. Especially when it seems every team has a penalty of some sort on special teams, wth Rodgers I'll take it at the 25 every time rather than risk putting him inside the 10 because of dumb penalties.

But now special teams is going to have to provide a spark if they can. Can't play it safe anymore

 

[Dantés]

Pretty simple reason, Capers is the old constant that doesn't seem to change. Now that the offense has been weakened, the need for the defense to step up is even greater. People can keep saying that the defense can't be expected to play well, when the offense goes 3 and out a lot, but was that really the problem prior to this? Morgan Burnett was the only starter missing yesterday, so it isn't injuries. It's either lack of talent or bad coaching, but until the Packers bring in a new DC, they will never know. I had been on the fence for awhile with Capers, but its time.

I understand what you're saying, and I support the idea of moving on from Capers, but I do think that the defense played pretty well yesterday. They ended four different drives with a TO or a punt and the offense scored 0 points off of those opportunities. I realize that they got exposed late, but in my opinion that's going to happen to all but the best defenses if their offense keeps putting them out there. There just aren't many defenses who can get 87 yards and a pick out of their own team's passing attack and still carry the day.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

Was one of the first things I said to my brother sitting at USBank stadium after Rodgers went down. Our special teams philosophy had to change. Looks like it did. I know they were content to just take the ball at the 25 every time. Which was fine. Especially when it seems every team has a penalty of some sort on special teams, wth Rodgers I'll take it at the 25 every time rather than risk putting him inside the 10 because of dumb penalties.

But now special teams is going to have to provide a spark if they can. Can't play it safe anymore

Nor can the defense. The defense is going to have to win games for the team. I just don't see that happening.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

I understand what you're saying, and I support the idea of moving on from Capers, but I do think that the defense played pretty well yesterday. They ended four different drives with a TO or a punt and the offense scored 0 points off of those opportunities. I realize that they got exposed late, but in my opinion that's going to happen to all but the best defenses if their offense keeps putting them out there. There just aren't many defenses who can get 87 yards and a pick out of their own team's passing attack and still carry the day.

I know what you are saying and others are saying it as well......but how many times do we see the defense let this team down before a change is made? I am running out of excuses for the defense, not that I readily throw them out there anymore.

 

[Dantés]

I know what you are saying and others are saying it as well......but how many times do we see the defense let this team down before a change is made? I am running out of excuses for the defense, not that I readily throw them out there anymore.

Well as far as I'm concerned-- zero more times. I am over Capers. However, I can't look at that first half and at Hundley's performance and think that it was primarily the defense that let the team down in this particular case.

 

[swhitset]

I know what you are saying and others are saying it as well......but how many times do we see the defense let this team down before a change is made? I am running out of excuses for the defense, not that I readily throw them out there anymore.

I agree in general. I am definitely ready for a change at Defensive coordinator, but I just don't think yesterday's game is a great example of why. I really think the defense started out well with the two picks etc... but when your QB literally cannot complete a pass and constantly gives the ball right back to Drew Brees.... you are definitely going to get beat eventually. We need to remember that Brees will most likely be in the HOF. He is not an average QB. Overall, I think we need a change in defensive scheme, but I think they probably did enough to win yesterday if the Offense could have done its part.

 

[Mondio]

Nor can the defense. The defense is going to have to win games for the team. I just don't see that happening.

The defense isn't going to score 14 points and shut people out. They aren't going to keep the Saints to 200 yards of offense and 3 points, but they aren't as bad as everyone keeps going on about. against lesser offenses, it won't surprise me if they win a game or 2 for us. But the Saints offense is potent. You can't just go 3 plays and give the ball back when it matters very often and with the field position in their favor and expect the defense to hold up forever.

I'm ready to move on from Capers, I'm not trying to say this guy gives us our best chance to win, because I think we have some pretty good individual talent on the defensive side of the ball, but i don't think this defense is garbage either. Mediocre passing yesterday from our QB and we win that game against a team that is going to be in the playoffs barring what has stuck us.

 

[Half Empty]

I agree in general. I am definitely ready for a change at Defensive coordinator, but I just don't think yesterday's game is a great example of why. I really think the defense started out well with the two picks etc... but when your QB literally cannot complete a pass and constantly gives the ball right back to Drew Brees.... you are definitely going to get beat eventually. We need to remember that Brees will most likely be in the HOF. He is not an average QB. Overall, I think we need a change in defensive scheme, but I think they probably did enough to win yesterday if the Offense could have done its part.

I'm pretty sure Hundley literally completed 12.

 

[swhitset]

I'm pretty sure Hundley literally completed 12.

wow 12 whole passes ... Let me see if that changes my point.... umm.. no ...no it doesn't.

 

[easyk83]

Ok, the options are that defensive personnel is a problem or the coach is a problem. The Packers don't have a good defense, so no, it's not going to change from game to game. One could argue that the defense did an excellent job until they got tired. One could also argue that the defense was only misssing one starter but then it could be pointed out that the defense also had to play Quinton Dial, Marwin Evans, Damarious Randall and Chris Odom so obviously the team was a little more beat up than "just one starter". However, I've long just said that the entire organization is kind of letting Rodgers down; Thompson has lost too much front office talent for his "draft-centric" style, McCarthy is great at teaching young players but he's not very innovative on offense and he's kind of a bad game-day coach, and Capers might be the reason the defense is terrible and, if he is, then that's another reason to get rid of McCarthy because he's the guy that's kept him around.

I dont know how much is Thompson not having the talent and how much is just a stale coaching staff full of guys who aren't even trying to climb the ladder and struggle to develop talent? Holmgren created a damned good coaching tree in Green Bay with multiple winning coaches who came out from under him. How many of MMs coaches are winning in the league right now?

Why do guys like Hayward and Hyde go elsewhere and take their games to a whole new level?

 

[HardRightEdge]

Well as far as I'm concerned-- zero more times. I am over Capers. However, I can't look at that first half and at Hundley's performance and think that it was primarily the defense that let the team down in this particular case.

When you play an inexperienced QB the defense needs to step up if you want to win. Why anybody would expect a good game out of Hundley is beyond me.

By the way, one thing I've noticed about Hundley in his preseason efforts and again now is that he floats his sideline throws. He's got good zip going downfield, so this is either a mechanics issue or lack of confidence in his accuracy on those throws, taking something off so the receiver can adjust. You're not going to fix that overnight.

 

[Mondio]

I didn't expect 330 yards of passing, but I did figure on 170 or more. WIth the way we ran the ball, 200+ should have been pretty attainable.

 

[Dantés]

When you play an inexperienced QB the defense needs to step up if you want to win. Why anybody would expect a good game out of Hundley is beyond me.

By the way, one thing I've noticed about Hundley in his preseason efforts and again now is that he floats his sideline throws. He's got good zip going downfield, so this is either a mechanics issue or lack of confidence in his accuracy on those throws, taking something off so the receiver can adjust. You're not going to fix that overnight.

I agree and I think the defense delivered until they finally wore down late. I did not expect a *good* game out of Hundley, but 87 yards and 3.5 YPA with a pick was below even the most humble expectations, I would imagine.

But I do agree that some of his issues may improve over time.

 

[swhitset]

I agree and I think the defense delivered until they finally wore down late. I did not expect a *good* game out of Hundley, but 87 yards and 3.5 YPA with a pick was below even the most humble expectations, I would imagine.

But I do agree that some of his issues may improve over time.

I certainly hope so. What I found the most frustrating was the fact that the Packers forced the Saints to adjust to stop a very successful running attack, and yet they could not capitalize on that in the passing game.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

The defense isn't going to score 14 points and shut people out. They aren't going to keep the Saints to 200 yards of offense and 3 points, but they aren't as bad as everyone keeps going on about. against lesser offenses, it won't surprise me if they win a game or 2 for us. But the Saints offense is potent. You can't just go 3 plays and give the ball back when it matters very often and with the field position in their favor and expect the defense to hold up forever.

I'm ready to move on from Capers, I'm not trying to say this guy gives us our best chance to win, because I think we have some pretty good individual talent on the defensive side of the ball, but i don't think this defense is garbage either. Mediocre passing yesterday from our QB and we win that game against a team that is going to be in the playoffs barring what has stuck us.

This is something I think you and I both agree on

When I say "this defense isn't going to win games for us" I am talking as a collective and under the current DC. I am in agreement with you, I think there are some talented players on the Packer defense and that is just another reason why it's frustrating as a fan to see this year in and year out. Dom Capers isn't being given 2nd and 3rd stringers to work with here, he has some talent at his disposal. However, for whatever reason, he can't seem to get all the moving pieces aligned and working together and consistently. When another team starts beating you consistently with something, yesterday it was short passes, you make adjustments, something Capers seems like a deer in the headlights with.