Reggie Begelton Thread

[Deleted member 6794]

Who said having the battle means its a strength? Strength, weakness the battle there is what intrigues me.

It might not matter who wins the battle for the second inside linebacker as none of them could be talented enough to receive significant playing time. It's quite realistic that one of the safeties lines up next to Kirksey on the majority of snaps.

I do believe Kirksey is much more gifted athletically than Blake was, and most definitely may be the case. He has already been showing his side line to side line coverage chops reports say....but like all practice reports shred em

It's fine if we disagree on Kirksey being a significant upgrade over Martinez. Getting excited about him showing his sideline to sideline coverage skills in practice??? Boy oh boy, you'll never learn.

 

[tynimiller]

It might not matter who wins the battle for the second inside linebacker as none of them could be talented enough to receive significant playing time. It's quite realistic that one of the safeties lines up next to Kirksey on the majority of snaps.



It's fine if we disagree on Kirksey being a significant upgrade over Martinez. Getting excited about him showing his sideline to sideline coverage skills in practice??? Boy oh boy, you'll never learn.

You just don't realize you read into folks comments more than the comments themselves state...nor do I think you ever will.

Kirksey if he stays healthy I am very confident will be a BIG upgrade over Martinez when it comes to coverage of backs and TEs when asked....however my biggest worry is not that skill but the ability to help in run defense. Something I'm fearful Martinez was clearly better built for.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

I heard Tim Boyle is looking great at practice. Tom Silverstein said that Boyle even looked sharper than Aaron Rodgers, calling him "The best QB in camp so far". I guess the Packers found their immediate replacement for Rodgers.

On a more serious note, AJ Dillion is turning a lot of heads, just on his size and speed alone. I know a lot of people wondered WTF the Packers were doing drafting him in the 2nd round, but he just might be the rookie that makes the biggest impact right away. Not sure if Williams will make the team, but that would't be a bad trio of running backs to have Jones-Dillion-Williams.

 

[Mondio]

I think the only way Williams is not on the team is if he's traded. I think Jones, williams, dillion are the big three we run with this year

 

[Deleted member 6794]

Kirksey if he stays healthy I am very confident will be a BIG upgrade over Martinez when it comes to coverage of backs and TEs when asked....however my biggest worry is not that skill but the ability to help in run defense. Something I'm fearful Martinez was clearly better built for.

The Packers mostly need an improvement in run defense out of the inside linebackers on the field. They could use a safety in that spot to cover running backs or tight ends.

 

[GreenNGold_81]

You just don't realize you read into folks comments more than the comments themselves state...nor do I think you ever will.

Kirksey if he stays healthy I am very confident will be a BIG upgrade over Martinez when it comes to coverage of backs and TEs when asked....however my biggest worry is not that skill but the ability to help in run defense. Something I'm fearful Martinez was clearly better built for.

"Kirksey has developed into a dominant force defending the run. In 2016 his run-defense grade of 84.9 ranked fourth among linebackers and his 46 run stops ranked first amongst inside linebackers(A stop is a tackle resulting in an offensive failure)."

If your comment is regarding durability, maybe you have a point. Overall, Kirksey I think is the better player for pass and run defense otherwise.

source: https://www.pff.com/news/pro-browns-extend-lb-christian-kirksey-with-a-4-year-deal

 

[tynimiller]

"Kirksey has developed into a dominant force defending the run. In 2016 his run-defense grade of 84.9 ranked fourth among linebackers and his 46 run stops ranked first amongst inside linebackers(A stop is a tackle resulting in an offensive failure)."

If your comment is regarding durability, maybe you have a point. Overall, Kirksey I think is the better player for pass and run defense otherwise.

source: https://www.pff.com/news/pro-browns-extend-lb-christian-kirksey-with-a-4-year-deal

Oh for sure, and I"m perhaps expecting a regression somewhat in that now post injury for a bit...but I am hoping he comes back to exactly what he was prior...but let's also acknowledge the figures you listed is from 2016..long time ago.

 

[GreenNGold_81]

Oh for sure, and I"m perhaps expecting a regression somewhat in that now post injury for a bit...but I am hoping he comes back to exactly what he was prior...but let's also acknowledge the figures you listed is from 2016..long time ago.

Ya, that's true. 2016 is in the rear view mirror and on a different team. That said, he's in the same system that produced that success. If the risk pans out he's most likely a significant upgrade. Hoping he stays healthy.

 

[Heyjoe4]

You just don't realize you read into folks comments more than the comments themselves state...nor do I think you ever will.

Kirksey if he stays healthy I am very confident will be a BIG upgrade over Martinez when it comes to coverage of backs and TEs when asked....however my biggest worry is not that skill but the ability to help in run defense. Something I'm fearful Martinez was clearly better built for.

Both good points. Kirksey's injury history isn't chronic. I'm very confident he'll be an upgrade to Martinez in the rush and in coverage. I agree that he may not be as good as Blake was in run D, which is obviously concerning. IMO, the problems with run D last year is that they weren't a priority for Pettine - so good run D wasn't coached or wasn't emphasized. So I'm hopeful that after getting pounded, especially in the NFCCG, there will be a renewed focus on run D. That means existing personnel are going to have to step up. We'll see.

 

[Heyjoe4]

Ya, that's true. 2016 is in the rear view mirror and on a different team. That said, he's in the same system that produced that success. If the risk pans out he's most likely a significant upgrade. Hoping he stays healthy.

Hey GnG, what are they paying Kirksey? I thought it was a two-year contract at $6 mil/year, but not really sure. (I know Blake got $10 mil/year from the Giants. That's too rich for his skill set IMO. I'm really not disappointed that he's gone.) Anyway, thanks.

 

[GreenNGold_81]

Hey GnG, what are they paying Kirksey? I thought it was a two-year contract at $6 mil/year, but not really sure. (I know Blake got $10 mil/year from the Giants. That's too rich for his skill set IMO. I'm really not disappointed that he's gone.) Anyway, thanks.

Average annual is 6.5 for Kirksey. Obviously we got him at a discount. 10 mil per for Blake was obviously good for him, but kind of one of these scenarios where he was really just priced out of Green Bay with no hopes he would come back. Similar to what happened with Micah Hyde. Only many of us wanted to keep Hyde for his multitool usefulness, whereas I don't think too many of us wanted to keep Blake.

 

[Heyjoe4]

Average annual is 6.5 for Kirksey. Obviously we got him at a discount. 10 mil per for Blake was obviously good for him, but kind of one of these scenarios where he was really just priced out of Green Bay with no hopes he would come back. Similar to what happened with Micah Hyde. Only many of us wanted to keep Hyde for his multitool usefulness, whereas I don't think too many of us wanted to keep Blake.

Thanks GnG. We did get him at a discount. I get that he hasn't played a down yet in green and gold, and I don't much care for other negative opinions. In my gut I just like the guy.

Hindsight is 20/20 but we should have kept Hyde. The problem is MM was playing him out of position. Oh well, the past is past.

Even if Kirksey plays well, there's a huge hole at 2nd ILB. Someone else mentioned it, I think it was Cap, but expect to see a safety lining up with Kirksey, especially on running downs. This is where wasting that 1st round pick hurts. I think we could have had Patrick Queen at #26. That would have been worth the trade up, IMO. Again, past is past.

 

[GreenNGold_81]

Thanks GnG. We did get him at a discount. I get that he hasn't played a down yet in green and gold, and I don't much care for other negative opinions. In my gut I just like the guy.

Hindsight is 20/20 but we should have kept Hyde. The problem is MM was playing him out of position. Oh well, the past is past.

Even if Kirksey plays well, there's a huge hole at 2nd ILB. Someone else mentioned it, I think it was Cap, but expect to see a safety lining up with Kirksey, especially on running downs. This is where wasting that 1st round pick hurts. I think we could have had Patrick Queen at #26. That would have been worth the trade up, IMO. Again, past is past.

I'm liking what I'm reading on Martin. Obviously we need to see what a healthy Burks can do, but I'm not holding my breath there. I wanted Queen, but also BPA I was cool with. Maybe one of the benefits of getting Love is that it's lit a fire under Rodgers. Sounds like he's been lighting it up at practice. If Lazard is the real deal, and MVS takes that third year jump then we wouldn't have needed a WR. Granted, those are big ifs.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

Sounds like Begelton is struggling.

https://www.packersnews.com/story/s...-reggie-begelton-struggles-adjust/5634200002/

 

[GleefulGary]

Sounds like Begelton is struggling.

https://www.packersnews.com/story/s...-reggie-begelton-struggles-adjust/5634200002/

Can we take this one seriously or not?

I'll defer to Wimm.

 

[GreenNGold_81]

I think the team has to slow play Begelton if they're serious about putting his YAC potential to use. He has so much ground to catch up on that it's not surprising that he's struggling.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

2016 is in the rear view mirror and on a different team. That said, he's in the same system that produced that success. If the risk pans out he's most likely a significant upgrade. Hoping he stays healthy.

On top of it the Packers better hope that injuries over the past two seasons haven't taken a toll on his performance in the first place.

IMO, the problems with run D last year is that they weren't a priority for Pettine - so good run D wasn't coached or wasn't emphasized.

You can be assured that Pettine and his coaching staff put an emphasis on run defense as well. They just happened to have a terrible game plan for the NFCCG and failed to make proper adjustments.

Even if Kirksey plays well, there's a huge hole at 2nd ILB. Someone else mentioned it, I think it was Cap, but expect to see a safety lining up with Kirksey, especially on running downs.

Actually I'm advocating for the Packers to use a safety next to Kirksey on passing downs.

Sounds like Begelton is struggling.

https://www.packersnews.com/story/s...-reggie-begelton-struggles-adjust/5634200002/

Fake news, Begelton is on his way to becoming an All-Pro, don't you know??? It seems you missed the reports about him making some catches during the first two days with the team practicing in shorts.

 

[HardRightEdge]

When you get down to the last roster spots, guys who wouldn't make the game day roster which is where Begelton would likely start out if he makes it, it isn't just how many WRs they'll keep and who are the best.

Does Ervin show enough to be a psudo #4 or #5, a guy who might get few or no snaps in one game and then several in another to exploit a perceived defensive weakness? Do the TEs have their collective sh*t together to the extent that one is perceived to be an effective in-line blocker and another effective out of the slot, and occasionally wide as we've seen with Tonyan in the past?

Deguara was obviously drafted to take over the H-back/FB role right away. If he's not up to the task by a week from now a guy like Begelton can lose his spot to a FB. Or in that case they may like Tonyan for that role which puts Begelton back in the conversation taking Tonyan out of slot/wide mix for x number of downs.

9 or 10 OL? Do they like the potential of a young 10th. guy enough to want to protect him instead of trying to move him to the PS? With the OT situation behind Bakhtiari up in the air they may want to keep an extra one for more options as they work through the early games.

The thing that a guy like Begelton has going against him is that while he might look like a mid-round pick equivalent based on his beating up on second and third tier college players in Canada, he really isn't given his age. He could end up on the PS for deep bench. They probably know if and how many other teams had an interest in him as they would with undrafted rookies.

I've got him penciled in for a spot on the roster at the moment, but until you study the whole roster and get down to brass tacks as cutdown draws near, it's just a pencil mark, not ink.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

I think at best, Begelton ends up on the PS. If he does actually make the 53 man roster, I don't think it will say as much about his talent as it does about the talent level of the Packer WR group. I spent most of last season, from start to finish complaining about the lack of talent at the position and I really don't see any improvement in it this year. They will be relying a lot on Adams and the growth of several other players. Let's hope the TE's have gotten better too.

This does bring up an interesting topic though, practice squads. Unlike previous years, all 32 teams will be operating mostly "blind" when it comes to evaluating players cut by other teams. No preseason game film to evaluate guys and very little information coming out of camps. It won't surprise me if a good majority of the Packers PS will be players that have been in their camp. Stashing virtually unknown players will be much easier this season.

 

[PikeBadger]

I think at best, Begelton ends up on the PS. If he does actually make the 53 man roster, I don't think it will say as much about his talent as it does about the talent level of the Packer WR group. I spent most of last season, from start to finish complaining about the lack of talent at the position and I really don't see any improvement in it this year. They will be relying a lot on Adams and the growth of several other players. Let's hope the TE's have gotten better too.

This does bring up an interesting topic though, practice squads. Unlike previous years, all 32 teams will be operating mostly "blind" when it comes to evaluating players cut by other teams. No preseason game film to evaluate guys and very little information coming out of camps. It won't surprise me if a good majority of the Packers PS will be players that have been in their camp. Stashing virtually unknown players will be much easier this season.

Agree with much of this but I think the young WR’s and TE’s will exceed most people’s expectations on this forum. I’m expecting improvement from them as a whole.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

Agree with much of this but I think the young WR’s and TE’s will exceed most people’s expectations on this forum. I’m expecting improvement from them as a whole.

As I've mentioned on several occasions that's wishful thinking with the numbers over the past few years suggesting it's completely unrealistic.

 

[HardRightEdge]

I think at best, Begelton ends up on the PS. If he does actually make the 53 man roster, I don't think it will say as much about his talent as it does about the talent level of the Packer WR group.

If there isn't great confidence in the group, and there isn't some developmental player at another position they'd like to keep for that last spot on the roster, that might be the difference in keeping an extra WR if he doesn't actually beat someboy out.

If Vrable's seeming investment in the player is reflective of LaFluer's and Gutekunst's, that weighs heavily in his favor. If Vrable was the guy pounding the table for him that's a different matter. I'll take Vrable's comments as something in Begelton's favor warranting a pencil mark.

 

[HardRightEdge]

Agree with much of this but I think the young WR’s and TE’s will exceed most people’s expectations on this forum. I’m expecting improvement from them as a whole.

I liked Tonyan's progress toward the end of last year particularly as a blocker. There isn't much evidence the other guys behind Adams haven't topped out right where they are. I don't have expectations and I find that to be a problem. Ask me again after Week 3.

 

[Sunshinepacker]

You can be assured that Pettine and his coaching staff put an emphasis on run defense as well. They just happened to have a terrible game plan for the NFCCG and failed to make proper adjustments.

I would love if this was true because it would mean the Packers are only "better coaching"away from being an elite defense. Unfortunately that's just not true. The issue in the NFCCG was certainly some coaching, but much of it was also just not enough good players. Packers didn't (and probably still don't) have enough good players to stop a dominant run team. Yes, Zadarius can rush the passer from the DT position really well, but he can't stop the run from there. Packers have only one quality defensive lineman and nothing close to the kind of elite ILB you'd need to compensate for that. Trying to pawn off one of the worst run stopping defensive games I've ever seen at the professional level on "gameplan" is just not accurate.

 

[gopkrs]

Holding my breath on linebackers. Really just need one to play alongside Kirksey. Maybe Martin will be that guy. Don't care if he is a rookie or not. If he is next best...play him. I'll live with a few mistakes. Maybe Burks will be better. Maybe Bolton will come on. I have some hope for the first time is awhile. Never liked Martinez to play the run.