Malik Turner connected to Packers

[tynimiller]

I believe it's extremely unrealistic to expect 4/5 guys to improve their "skills" between seasons.

Let's not forget some of our best WRs served time, some few years as 4/5 type guy.

Adams himself....Driver...

 

[tynimiller]

Nevermind on Adams he was basically our 3 entering his rookie year.

 

[McKnowledge]

I'm not crazy about this guy I don't think he'd be bad but I don't think he'd be a difference maker though I don't know that anyone available would be except Brown or Gordon who com with to many problems outside of their play.

Would you guy's be interested in trying to trade for Corey davis?
He's one guy that sort of catches my eye if the cost to acquire was low enough.

That could be interesting. I personally wish Gute would give Jon Gruden a call and see if a trade for Hunter Renfrow is available. A true slot guy with good hands is much needed.

 

[Sunshinepacker]

It’s not unrealistic in the least to expect 4 out of 5 WR’s to Improve their skills being that all 5 mentioned have 2 or less years of NFL and Aaron Rodgers experience.

my biggest question is who amongst those 5 have developed the professionalism and commitment to their craft to improve their skills and knowledge in off-season isolation.
That also requires a certain amount of maturity and self discipline. I have no idea how to assess those intangibles but I bet the coaching staff has a pretty good idea.

I think in most offseasons you could expect some improvement from 1, maybe 2. Unfortunately, this isn't a normal offseason and those players are getting much less practice time and no exhibition games to improve. Plus, based on what they showed last year, the Packers don't need a "little" improvement from ESB or MVS, they need a LOT of improvement and I just don't see any way to reasonably plan on that. It's obvious the Packers' front office was fine going into the season this year with one great WR, one potentially decent #3 in Lazard, and a bunch of questions.

 

[GreenNGold_81]

That could be interesting. I personally wish Gute would give Jon Gruden a call and see if a trade for Hunter Renfrow is available. A true slot guy with good hands is much needed.

Very doubtful, he's cheap and I think Renfrow graded out very well last year in the slot.

 

[PikeBadger]

I think in most offseasons you could expect some improvement from 1, maybe 2. Unfortunately, this isn't a normal offseason and those players are getting much less practice time and no exhibition games to improve. Plus, based on what they showed last year, the Packers don't need a "little" improvement from ESB or MVS, they need a LOT of improvement and I just don't see any way to reasonably plan on that. It's obvious the Packers' front office was fine going into the season this year with one great WR, one potentially decent #3 in Lazard, and a bunch of questions.

We’ll have to agree to disagree. I have always, and will always believe in young players improving and developing under the tutelage of good coaching. All of our good and great players over the last 30 years have gone through varying degrees of development. I don’t recall Green Bay ever in my lifetime drafting a sure-fire lock or generational talent. White and Woodson were brought in from elsewhere. They would be the closest things to that description imo.

 

[tynimiller]

Very doubtful, he's cheap and I think Renfrow graded out very well last year in the slot.

ZERO chance a team is going to let go of a guy that has early signs of gold in the slot for VERY cheap. I'm still shaking my head as I know many are as we passed over him in the draft, dude IMO had NO reason to still be there when he was...or quite a bit higher as well.

 

[GreenNGold_81]

ZERO chance a team is going to let go of a guy that has early signs of gold in the slot for VERY cheap. I'm still shaking my head as I know many are as we passed over him in the draft, dude IMO had NO reason to still be there when he was...or quite a bit higher as well.

He didn't grade well athletically wasn't it?

 

[tynimiller]

He didn't grade well athletically wasn't it?

Yeah rather low ratings...now I will say Gruden drafted what like 3 WRs in first 3 rounds this season....may not be room for Renfrow

 

[Sunshinepacker]

We’ll have to agree to disagree. I have always, and will always believe in young players improving and developing under the tutelage of good coaching. All of our good and great players over the last 30 years have gone through varying degrees of development. I don’t recall Green Bay ever in my lifetime drafting a sure-fire lock or generational talent. White and Woodson were brought in from elsewhere. They would be the closest things to that description imo.

I agree with what you've said. However, the players haven't had coaching this offseason.

 

[PackAttack12]

Let's not forget some of our best WRs served time, some few years as 4/5 type guy.

Adams himself....Driver...

Unfortunately there aren't a whole lot of Donald Driver types that turn into what he did being drafted late, or undrafted all together.

I'm hoping for a ton of progression from guys like MVS and EQSB (who I'm very high on). And then undrafted guys. But I remain hesitant.

 

[Mavster]

Let's not forget some of our best WRs served time, some few years as 4/5 type guy.

Adams himself....Driver...

I don't disagree with the general idea that a player can improve, even drastically. But to expect nearly the whole group to improve in one off season is a pipe dream

 

[tynimiller]

I don't disagree with the general idea that a player can improve, even drastically. But to expect nearly the whole group to improve in one off season is a pipe dream

I don't think anyone would argue everyone will improve dramatically...or even improve.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

I said reliable speed, neither of those two is reliable.

Their speed is reliable

It’s not unrealistic in the least to expect 4 out of 5 WR’s to Improve their skills being that all 5 mentioned have 2 or less years of NFL and Aaron Rodgers experience.

Once again, it's completely unrealistic to expect four out of five players to improve. Just take a look at last season, out of 21 draft picks that were second or third year players only one made a significant jump in production (Aaron Jones).

 

[tynimiller]

Unfortunately there aren't a whole lot of Donald Driver types that turn into what he did being drafted late, or undrafted all together.

I'm hoping for a ton of progression from guys like MVS and EQSB (who I'm very high on). And then undrafted guys. But I remain hesitant.

For sure, I don't need any of them to become a Drive type...but give me a Robert Ferguson level type guy, or a Bill Schroeder type guy and I'm golden. MVS, ESB, Kumerow, Begelton...just one to step up and be a TRUE #3 would go a long way. Shoot throw Lazard in there and say you'll give me two guys that are arguably capable of being a bonafide #3 or challenge for such on any roster (perhaps #2) I'm ECSTATIC.

ESB's chance to excel is falling together VERY nicely. Funchess opting out, us not drafting anyone AND the book/hardwork nerd that he is known to be all line up to him getting some serious nods. If he excels and Lazard missteps it is VERY possible ESB becomes our #2 by mid season or so.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

I don't think anyone would argue everyone will improve dramatically...or even improve.

Well, Pike expects four out of five wide receivers to improve. That's pretty close to everyone.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

For sure, I don't need any of them to become a Drive type...but give me a Robert Ferguson level type guy, or a Bill Schroeder type guy and I'm golden. MVS, ESB, Kumerow, Begelton...just one to step up and be a TRUE #3 would go a long way. Shoot throw Lazard in there and say you'll give me two guys that are arguably capable of being a bonafide #3 or challenge for such on any roster (perhaps #2) I'm ECSTATIC.

ESB's chance to excel is falling together VERY nicely. Funchess opting out, us not drafting anyone AND the book/hardwork nerd that he is known to be all line up to him getting some serious nods. If he excels and Lazard missteps it is VERY possible ESB becomes our #2 by mid season or so.

I'm quite sure that would be fear into opposing defensive coordinators, especially paired with our elite group of tight ends

 

[Sunshinepacker]

Once again, it's completely unrealistic to expect four out of five players to improve. Just take a look at last season, out of 21 draft picks that were second or third year players only one made a significant jump in production (Aaron Jones).

To be clear though, Jones didn't improve that much, the coach just realized how much better he was (and always has been) than Williams and gave him the chance to play more.

 

[Mondio]

Or Jones just went thru his first season not injured in camp coming off injury or suspension as well?

 

[GreenNGold_81]

Jones dedicated his offseason to improve his fitness last year. He changed his body and it showed on the field.

 

[Sunshinepacker]

Or Jones just went thru his first season not injured in camp coming off injury or suspension as well?

Jones dedicated his offseason to improve his fitness last year. He changed his body and it showed on the field.

Well, let's see. His yards per carry was lower in 2019 than 2018:
2018: 133 carries for 5.5 yards per attempt (avg of 11.1 carries per game)
2019: 236 carries for 4.6 yards per attempt (avg of 14.75 carries per game)

Looking at the numbers, it just seems like the primary difference in total rushing yards was that he was suspended for 2 games in 2018 and MLF gave him more carries in 2019 (MM was fired for a reason, one of them being that he only ran Jones an average of 8 times a game in weeks 3-6). Unless someone wants to argue that rushing TDs was a sudden rushing skill that Jones developed, it appears that the coach just wasn't as stupid as MM when it came to which RB was better (even MM eventually learned, it just took a long time).

It does appear that his receiving was slightly improved in 2019:
2018: 35 targets, 26 receptions, 206 yards, 5.9 yards per target, 1 TD
2019: 68 targets, 49 receptions, 474 yards, 7.0 yards per target, 3 TD

Look, I'm not trying to argue that Jones didn't improve from 2108 - 2019, he did, though it wasn't a HUGE jump. His primary improvement was in his catch rate (he only dropped two passes in 2019). I was simply stating that Jones was ALREADY an elite RB in 2018, it just took MLF and an injury to Adams to actually give him the chance to get the volume he got last year.

 

[Mondio]

TD's go up and down by a lot for all sorts of players every year, that's not my metric. Jones was good, Jones is good. Jones was in better shape. Jones wasn't injured, Jones wasn't suspended. Jones didn't carry the ball much more at all under MLF than MM, he was just more available. Could there be a reason he didn't run him much in weeks 3-6? Maybe missing the entire preseason and TC with an injury and then coming off a suspension? Remember what happened to Dorsey after missing a TC and being put to work out of the gates. That ended well. Passing to RB's did increase last year over the prior, that was noticeable.

 

[GreenNGold_81]

TD's go up and down by a lot for all sorts of players every year, that's not my metric. Jones was good, Jones is good. Jones was in better shape. Jones wasn't injured, Jones wasn't suspended. Jones didn't carry the ball much more at all under MLF than MM, he was just more available. Could there be a reason he didn't run him much in weeks 3-6? Maybe missing the entire preseason and TC with an injury and then coming off a suspension? Remember what happened to Dorsey after missing a TC and being put to work out of the gates. That ended well. Passing to RB's did increase last year over the prior, that was noticeable.

I think his week 3-6 misuse was also the team trying out Jamaal as the starter given the perception he was a better pass blocker. We saw how that worked out. Jones became the clear talent in the backfield.

 

[lambeaulambo]

I dont know why peeps crow over St Brown. He is average at best with a bad injury in his mirror. Love the loyalty, but truth be said we don't know if Turner will assist well or not. It is definitely worth a shot. The same thing happened with Favre comment earlier is spot on, and we have a coaching staff that wants the TN Titan offense in full bloom.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

To be clear though, Jones didn't improve that much, the coach just realized how much better he was (and always has been) than Williams and gave him the chance to play more.

Jones received the majority of snaps under McCarthy when he was healthy as well. He was in better shape last year though.