Josh Jones wants out of Green Bay.....

[Heyjoe4]

IMO, Jones is what is fundamentally wrong with too many people in our Society. He is lucky enough to have an opportunity at a career that pays more than most, yet he think he deserves more. Yes, he probably earned his way to the NFL by being an outstanding athlete and putting in the hard work. However, that hard work doesn't just stop, you keep working hard and hope you move to the next level. Starting jobs in the NFL aren't just handed to people, they are earned and kept. I get his dilemma, he found himself in a situation where he feels he doesn't have a shot at being a starter, but there are approximately 65 other guys on each football roster right now that are in the same boat and 1000's of others not even on a team. Those lucky enough to be on a 90 man roster are showing up and competing to earn that job with a team they signed a contract with. Time for Jones to put his big boy pants on, put in the work, show how much he is willing to fight for a roster spot and see what happens. He may not like the fact that the decision is out of his control in regards to what team he is on, but welcome to how things are done in the NFL.

Well said and at this point, after his antics, what kind of team would want him? There’s a disconnect between how Jones evaluates himself and how others evaluate him. All he can do to correct that is to show up and compete. Maybe the acquisition of Amos and Savage gives him more opportunities at ILB (where I think he’d be better utilized). Every player, regardless of where they are drafted, have to prove their value at the next level. His agent, or someone close to him, should convince him of the need to show up and compete, and that he may have new opportunities under what is essentially a new defense.

 

[OldSchool101]

I don’t understand why he wouldn’t be a candidate at that other LB spot. I just feel like he’s a more natural fit there, especially having Safety experience that kinda overlaps those duties. I could see him doing a Brian Burns and adding 15-20lb without losing a significant degree of his stellar athleticism. Maybe he just doesn’t see himself in that role for whatever reason IDK. Also as said above, he’s one injury away from competing as the next man up, so it’s not like he doesn’t see the field... unless we have a 100% injury free season and that ain’t happening.

There’s two sides to a story. I don’t even feel like we have 50% of the one side, so we are obviously not privy to what’s fully going on behind the scenes. We have a newer management team and lots of gyrations in personnel. We have a relatively high draft pick that’s in his third year, which is where many players excel and unless there’s extenuating circumstances (violence in any fashion, verbal abuse, intimidation, personal attacks, etc..) we should try to encourage players when possible.

In short what I’m saying. This is an emotional sport but we shouldn’t govern by emotion. If we give up on every player who becomes discouraged, we become less and less of great coaches and FO managers and lean more and more “order takers” We should always negotiate and always encourage and challenge these young guys until we can say we have exhausted all efforts. There’s a big difference in between that and babysitting.
We’re 2 weeks into OTA’s for heavens sakes and we have fans calling for the gauntlet. I think I met some of you posters trying to merge onto the local Freeway this morning..about ran me off the road. Just relax!

 

[Heyjoe4]

I don’t understand why he wouldn’t be a candidate at that other LB spot. I just feel like he’s a more natural fit there, especially having Safety experience that kinda overlaps those duties. I could see him doing a Brian Burns and adding 15-20lb without losing a significant degree of his stellar athleticism. Maybe he just doesn’t see himself in that role for whatever reason IDK. Also as said above, he’s one injury away from competing as the next man up, so it’s not like he doesn’t see the field... unless we have a 100% injury free season and that ain’t happening.

There’s two sides to a story. I don’t even feel like we have 50% of the one side, so we are obviously not privy to what’s fully going on behind the scenes. We have a newer management team and lots of gyrations in personnel. We have a relatively high draft pick that’s in his third year, which is where many players excel and unless there’s extenuating circumstances (violence in any fashion, verbal abuse, intimidation, personal attacks, etc..) we should try to encourage players when possible.

In short what I’m saying. This is an emotional sport but we shouldn’t govern by emotion. If we give up on every player who becomes discouraged, we become less and less of great coaches and FO managers and lean more and more “order takers” We should always negotiate and always encourage and challenge these young guys until we can say we have exhausted all efforts. There’s a big difference in between that and babysitting.
We’re 2 weeks into OTA’s for heavens sakes and we have fans calling for the gauntlet. I think I met some of you posters trying to merge onto the local Freeway this morning..about ran me off the road. Just relax!

Very well said. Jones should look at this remade defense as an opportunity. ILB is weak, and if he added some muscle to go with his athleticism he could get a LOT of snaps.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

Well said and at this point, after his antics, what kind of team would want him? All he can do to correct that is to show up and compete. His agent, or someone close to him, should convince him of the need to show up and compete, and that he may have new opportunities under what is essentially a new defense.

I highly doubt any team would be interested in trading for him and the Packers should be wary about letting him compete for a roster spot after he quit on the team.

Pettine is in his second season as the team's defensive coordinator with Jones already having played in his scheme.

In short what I’m saying. This is an emotional sport but we shouldn’t govern by emotion. If we give up on every player who becomes discouraged, we become less and less of great coaches and FO managers and lean more and more “order takers” We should always negotiate and always encourage and challenge these young guys until we can say we have exhausted all efforts. There’s a big difference in between that and babysitting.
We’re 2 weeks into OTA’s for heavens sakes and we have fans calling for the gauntlet. I think I met some of you posters trying to merge onto the local Freeway this morning..about ran me off the road. Just relax!

I haven't seen a single poster getting worked up about Jones demanding a trade. There's no reason to rely on him moving forward as it seems he doesn't want to put in the work necessary to earn playing time though.

Therefore the Packers should move on, especially as Jones wasn't that good in the first place.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

I don’t understand why he wouldn’t be a candidate at that other LB spot. I just feel like he’s a more natural fit there, especially having Safety experience that kinda overlaps those duties. I could see him doing a Brian Burns and adding 15-20lb without losing a significant degree of his stellar athleticism. Maybe he just doesn’t see himself in that role for whatever reason IDK. Also as said above, he’s one injury away from competing as the next man up, so it’s not like he doesn’t see the field... unless we have a 100% injury free season and that ain’t happening.

There’s two sides to a story. I don’t even feel like we have 50% of the one side, so we are obviously not privy to what’s fully going on behind the scenes. We have a newer management team and lots of gyrations in personnel. We have a relatively high draft pick that’s in his third year, which is where many players excel and unless there’s extenuating circumstances (violence in any fashion, verbal abuse, intimidation, personal attacks, etc..) we should try to encourage players when possible.

In short what I’m saying. This is an emotional sport but we shouldn’t govern by emotion. If we give up on every player who becomes discouraged, we become less and less of great coaches and FO managers and lean more and more “order takers” We should always negotiate and always encourage and challenge these young guys until we can say we have exhausted all efforts. There’s a big difference in between that and babysitting.
We’re 2 weeks into OTA’s for heavens sakes and we have fans calling for the gauntlet. I think I met some of you posters trying to merge onto the local Freeway this morning..about ran me off the road. Just relax!

All well said and I imagine that was how the Packers staff approached things, unless they wanted Jones out, but I think he would have simply been cut awhile ago if that was the case. The Packers and fans can tell Jones anything they want at this point, but ultimately its his decision (unless the Packers trade/cut him), if he wants to compete in Green and Gold for a job or not.

 

[Favre>Rodgers259]

I got a trade....hear me out:

San Francisco Trades:

Solomon Thomas

Green Bay Trades:

Josh Jones
2020 Conditional Day 3 Pick
2021 5th Round Pick
​

It's far fetched, but maybe with LeFleur's familiarity with Shanahan maybe there's some willingness to at least have a conversation....I'm expecting LeFleur's presence to open up avenues with L.A. and San Francisco.

Thomas hasn't lived up to his #3 Overall Pick status at all. They've rotated him all over the place and he hasn't made the desired impact. Thomas can be the eventual replacement to a declining Mike Daniels if he find success with the Green & Gold or a matchup conundrum as another chess piece for Pettine.

Jones has been the same for us as the 61st Overall three years ago. Meanwhile, San Francisco is reeling from the loss of Jimmie Ward with pricey veteran options in Free Agency who are most likely looking for multi-year deals. Jones however is a very attractive(and inexpensive) option given the 4-3 Hybrid scheme Robert Saleh runs at Levi's Stadium:

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Depending on Jones' success or failure in San Francisco, Green Bay will forfeit as high as a 4th, or as late as a 6th for the 2020 Draft, and a 2021 5th Round Pick.

​

 

[Pkrjones]

There are numerous things "wrong" with this trade which all negatively impact GB (IMHO).

A. Jones' dead money is $610k and GB saves $545k on the cap if they cut him (or trade him).
B. Solomon Thomas counts as over $16Mil dead money to San Fran, which they can absorb if they want to (currently have $35Mil cap space). His $3Mil salary & roster bonus would be applied to GB's books in '19, and another $4.3Mil in '20.
C. Thomas is 6'-3", 273 lbs. ~ he's smaller than our 3 new OLB's but faster 4.69 40) and with a 6.95 3-cone (in '17) probably quicker. He's considerably smaller than every DL on GB's roster right now. Where would he help, as 4th OLB?
D. I wouldn't want Gute to give away 2 later round draft picks to be rid of Jones.

 

[HardRightEdge]

There are numerous things "wrong" with this trade which all negatively impact GB (IMHO).

A. Jones' dead money is $610k and GB saves $545k on the cap if they cut him (or trade him).
B. Solomon Thomas counts as over $16Mil dead money to San Fran, which they can absorb if they want to (currently have $35Mil cap space). His $3Mil salary & roster bonus would be applied to GB's books in '19, and another $4.3Mil in '20.
C. Thomas is 6'-3", 273 lbs. ~ he's smaller than our 3 new OLB's but faster 4.69 40) and with a 6.95 3-cone (in '17) probably quicker. He's considerably smaller than every DL on GB's roster right now. Where would he help, as 4th OLB?
D. I wouldn't want Gute to give away 2 later round draft picks to be rid of Jones.

Not that I endorse such a trade but are you sure about that 2019 roster bonus? It that's been earned already SF is on the hook for it.

 

[Pkrjones]

Not that I endorse such a trade but are you sure about that 2019 roster bonus? It that's been earned already SF is on the hook for it.

I'm not sure about anything related to these contracts, just did some rapid addition from Overthecap. I'm assuming the roster bonus is IF on the 53 to open the season (or possibly payable per-game?) would be paid by GB.

 

[Favre>Rodgers259]

A. Jones' dead money is $610k and GB saves $545k on the cap if they cut him (or trade him).

So if we're going to get the money regardless, then why even bring it up?

B. Solomon Thomas counts as over $16Mil dead money to San Fran, which they can absorb if they want to (currently have $35Mil cap space). His $3Mil salary & roster bonus would be applied to GB's books in '19, and another $4.3Mil in '20.

Per my research, as long as Thomas is traded after Jun 1st, the 49ers absorb everything except his yearly salary. So Green Bay would just have to pay him $3,024,490 in '19, and $4,304,235 in '20 (plus Roster Bonus of $3,569,235). That's half of Daniels' 2019 salary though, so we come out better financially across the board.

C. Thomas is 6'-3", 273 lbs. ~ he's smaller than our 3 new OLB's but faster 4.69 40) and with a 6.95 3-cone (in '17) probably quicker. He's considerably smaller than every DL on GB's roster right now. Where would he help, as 4th OLB?

San Francisco blew Thomas up to 290 last year trying to find somewhere for him to fit in. But if you reference the picture I gave of Saleh's defensive scheme, he's been playing somewhere between DE and NT the last two years. Mike Pettine runs a somewhat similar 3-4 scheme to what he played at Stanford, so I like his chances of success here. Donte Whitner(along with other less outspoken players) has said that Thomas is a scheme casualty. I believe that as well, in the right system he's an annual Pro Bowler. I believe Pettine can do that. Besides, you can NEVER have too many pass rushers.

D. I wouldn't want Gute to give away 2 later round draft picks to be rid of Jones.

I don't view it as giving away 2 picks to get rid of Jones. Jones is just part of the package to make this work. We are giving up 2 Day 3 picks to get a former Top 5 selection who right now is being quietly labeled a bust due to being in a scheme that doesn't play to his skillset. 5 years from now if Thomas has 65 sacks in those same years for Green Bay pundits would be saying San Francisco got swindled.

 

[GreenBaySlacker]

IMO, Jones is what is fundamentally wrong with too many people in our Society. He is lucky enough to have an opportunity at a career that pays more than most, yet he think he deserves more. Yes, he probably earned his way to the NFL by being an outstanding athlete and putting in the hard work. However, that hard work doesn't just stop, you keep working hard and hope you move to the next level. Starting jobs in the NFL aren't just handed to people, they are earned and kept. I get his dilemma, he found himself in a situation where he feels he doesn't have a shot at being a starter, but there are approximately 65 other guys on each football roster right now that are in the same boat and 1000's of others not even on a team. Those lucky enough to be on a 90 man roster are showing up and competing to earn that job with a team they signed a contract with. Time for Jones to put his big boy pants on, put in the work, show how much he is willing to fight for a roster spot and see what happens. He may not like the fact that the decision is out of his control in regards to what team he is on, but welcome to how things are done in the NFL.

Thats how normal people view it. Money doesn't factor into everyone equation like that...
Especially guys running on instincts like this young dude. Thats why they send the young guys to the front lines.....its about glory. Havnt taken the time to think of consequences.

Honestly look at it with his perspective, valuing the currency of glory... Different story.

And Jones sucked because the defense sucked. And the defense sucked because we don't have a great and deep dline. Still don't. And will still suck with all those olbs and safetys.......

Imo of course.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

I got a trade....hear me out:

San Francisco Trades:

Solomon Thomas

Green Bay Trades:

Josh Jones
2020 Conditional Day 3 Pick
2021 5th Round Pick
​

It's far fetched, but maybe with LeFleur's familiarity with Shanahan maybe there's some willingness to at least have a conversation....I'm expecting LeFleur's presence to open up avenues with L.A. and San Francisco.

Thomas hasn't lived up to his #3 Overall Pick status at all. They've rotated him all over the place and he hasn't made the desired impact. Thomas can be the eventual replacement to a declining Mike Daniels if he find success with the Green & Gold or a matchup conundrum as another chess piece for Pettine.

Jones has been the same for us as the 61st Overall three years ago. Meanwhile, San Francisco is reeling from the loss of Jimmie Ward with pricey veteran options in Free Agency who are most likely looking for multi-year deals.

Depending on Jones' success or failure in San Francisco, Green Bay will forfeit as high as a 4th, or as late as a 6th for the 2020 Draft, and a 2021 5th Round Pick.

While the Niners might be think about trading Thomas I highly doubt they would be interested in Josh Jones and two day three picks in return.

Per my research, as long as Thomas is traded after Jun 1st, the 49ers absorb everything except his yearly salary. So Green Bay would just have to pay him $3,024,490 in '19, and $4,304,235 in '20 (plus Roster Bonus of $3,569,235). That's half of Daniels' 2019 salary though, so we come out better financially across the board.

Thomas' roster bonus is already included in the $4.3 million for the 2020 season.

 

[GreenBaySlacker]

I mean once either Daniels or Clark get banged up. It will be stagnant city.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

And the defense sucked because we don't have a great and deep dline. Still don't. And will still suck with all those olbs and safetys.......

The Packers are currently pretty talented on the defensive line.

 

[GreenBaySlacker]

The Packers are currently pretty talented on the defensive line.

We lost 31-0 to the lions without Daniels and Clark.

 

[GleefulGary]

Soloman, Gary, and Z Smith are pretty redundant.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

We lost 31-0 to the lions without Daniels and Clark.

I have no idea what that has to do with the talent level on the defensive line.

 

[HardRightEdge]

Honestly look at it with his perspective, valuing the currency of glory... Different story.

While glory may be part of it, I suspect it is mostly about the currency.

A bench and special team player doesn't get the starter second contact money. Jones wants to go somewhere to have a shot at a starting position. He's staring down the prospect of being a bench/special teams player the next two seasons and a second contract not even as good as the first.

 

[Mondio]

Micah Hyde

 

[HardRightEdge]

Micah Hyde

Cap casualty.

 

[Mondio]

interesting spin I guess

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

I'm not sure if other teams go through this, but the amount of uncertainty, drama and revolving doors that the Packer secondary has been through in the last 5 or so years is just crazy. Not to even mention the draft resources pumped into it during that time. I don't ever recall a position group having this amount of turmoil and not a whole lot of success to go with it. Is there something in the water these guys are drinking, the scouting, the coaching? This has been all over the board, from guys being played out of position, missing assignments, missing tackles, blowing up on the sidelines, wanting out of Green Bay and the worst IMO, guys not able to play up to their potential until they leave Green Bay. I was hoping Capers departure would change things. Maybe Whitt being shown the door will help? I was a bit surprised to see Jason Simmons not only retained, but promoted to head DB coach. The guy was an assistant special teams coach for the Packers up until 2018.

I'm hoping Gutes additions over the last 2 years improves things and Josh Jones is the only issue the secondary has to face this year, because it has been nothing but a clusterf*ck for too long.

Let's just hope Josh Jones isn't seeing what some might be perceiving, leave Green Bay and become a better DB.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

Micah Hyde

Hyde showed some promise early and worked hard for four years before signing a decent contract with another team though.

I don't consider Jones to be on a similar path at this point.

 

[Pkrjones]

Is it possible that TT-drafted CB's, bigger, more physical guys are a casualties of the rule changes regarding Pass Interference? The Caper's CB's were expected to be bump & run guys on islands. NOT making excuses, just throwing it out there that maybe slightly smaller, quicker, faster guys were able to adapt better to the more wide-open offenses?

 

[Mondio]

The fact that Jones can't beat out UDFA's for starting labels and hasn't performed well in ample opportunities on the back half isn't giving me the feeling he'll be great somewhere else. Coupled with the fact he'd rather be traded to get more playing time rather than work to get better at the 80% of the defensive snaps he gets here and prove he's a starter doesn't make me believe he's mentally willing to put in the work necessary to be good anywhere.

If he works, he could, he has the physical tools