H
HardRightEdge
Guest
4.6...4.9...tomato...tomahto.meh, potato potahtoe
4.6...4.9...tomato...tomahto.meh, potato potahtoe
If 4" mattered enough for you to make a factually inaccurate issue out of it; 2" inches should then matter to you somewhat.Height honestly means ****-all for ILB anyway.
If 4" mattered enough for you to make a factually inaccurate issue out of it; 2" inches should then matter to you somewhat.
I personally have no issue with 6' ILBs per se, as noted previously. But when you put it together with one of the most underperforming Combines in recent history, it should matter. 6' with a 28" vertical and a 4.93 40 spells the kind of "earthbound" NFL TEs will rip up.
I've looked at the clips and I don't even like the way he gets pushed around in the hole which has nothing to do with Combine numbers.
Dawson's Pro Day awaits for possible redemption. If the numbers come out close to the same, I'd conclude he's a system player. If they come out the way they were originally expected you have a work ethic issue raising the questions, "What's he been doing for the last 2 months? Playing Madden and eating pizza?"
The following was posted today on the Packer Report site http://gnb.scout.com/story/1526043-nfl-draft-report-ilb-rankings :
"These inside linebacker rankings are provided by the NFL's longtime head scout, Dave-Te' Thomas. They are based on last week's league meetings with scouts from around the league.
PLAYER...................SCHOOL.....CL..HT.......WT...40-YD..PRO..RND
KENDRICKS, Eric (WB).....UCLA.......rSr.06:00.2..232..4.61...6.7..1-2
ANTHONY, Stephone (WB)...Clemson....Sr..06:02.5..243..4.56...6.5..2
McKINNEY, Benardrick (SB)Miss St....rJr.06:04.1..245..4.66...6.3..2
DAWSON, Paul (WB)........TCU........Sr..06:00.1..235..4.93...6.2..2-3
PERRYMAN, Denzel.........Miami......Sr..05:10.6..236..4.78...6.1..3
ALEXANDER, Kwon (OB).....LSU........Jr..06:00.6..227..4.55...6.1..3
#HICKS, Jordan (OB)......Texas......Sr..06:01.3..236..4.68...5.9..3-4
HULL, Michael (OB).......Penn St....Sr..05:11.7..237..4.68...5.7..4
HEENEY, Benjamin.........Kansas.....Sr..06:00.3..228..4.59...5.7..4
WILSON, Ramik (WB).......Georgia....Sr..06:01.6..237..4.77...5.6..4-5
#HAGER, Bryce............Baylor.....rSr.06:00.6..234..4.60...5.5..5
RYAN, Jake (SB)..........Mich.......Sr..06:02.3..240..4.65...5.4..5
****SON, Xzavier (RE/SB).Alabama....Sr..06:03.4..260..4.74...5.3..5-6
JONES, Taiwan............Mich St....Sr..06:02.5..252..4.95...5.2..5-6
PULLARD, Hayes (SB)......S Cal......rSr.06:00.4..240..4.78...5.1..6
ROBINSON, Edmond (WB)....Newberry...Sr..06:02.5..245..4.61...5.1..6
%DEPRIEST, Trey (SB).....Alabama....Sr..06:00.3..254..4.82...5.0..6-7
VIGIL, Zachary...........Utah St....Sr..06:01.5..233..4.86...5.0..6-7
MALONE, Derrick (WB).....Oregon.....Sr..06:02.0..219..4.67...4.9..7
LUC, Jeff (WB)...........Cinc.......Sr..05:11.7..253..4.79...4.8..7-FA
HERRERA, Amarlo (SB).....Georgia....Sr..06:00.5..244..4.83...4.8..7-FA
TARPLEY, Aubrey (WB).....Stanford...rSr.06:00.4..238..4.84...4.8..7-FA
WILSON, Damien...........Minnesota..Sr..06:00.0..245..4.77...4.8..7-FA
PLUMMER, Terrance........Cent FLA...Sr..05:11.1..240..5.03...4.7..PFA
MAYO, David..............Texas St...Sr..06:02.0..228..4.79...4.7..PFA
GRANT, Curtis............Ohio St....Sr..06:02.3..243..4.59...4.7..PFA
NOTE-The positions in parentheses indicate the player’s best fit (but not only fit). WB indicates 3-4 weak-side ‘backer; SB indicates 3-4 strong-side ‘backer; OB indicates 4-3 outside linebacker (but can play inside in a 3-4); RE indicates rush end. Players with no position in parentheses fit best as a 4-3 middle linebacker. NOTE 2-rSr/rJr indicates player redshirted/graduating class…# indicates major injury that could impact draft grade…CL indicates college class… HT indicates height of the player…WT indicates weight…40 indicates 40-yard dash time…PRO-indicates The NFL Draft Report’s projected pro potential grade…RND indicates the round we project the player to be selected."
You're right...you're not the only one.Seems like I'm not the only one thinking Kendricks would be the best fit for the Packers defense.
Saints will grab Kendricks with that 31st pick if hes there. He wont last until round 2. So if we want him, we have to take him at #30 if hes available.
Seems like I'm not the only one thinking Kendricks would be the best fit for the Packers defense.
I like Kendricks too but he simply doesn't have the athleticism, size or strength to ultimately be effective at the next level.
The guy is a gamer and understands the game, but he doesn't make any impact plays, can't stack and shed and gets hung up on blockers. Most of his tackles are past the line of scrimmage and he's getting help on most of them. His frame is maxed out and he tends to carry extra body fat if he's trying to keep weight on.
He's become overhyped for the next level.
IMO he's no better than a special teams ace. I don't see him as an effective starter, especially in a 34.
What about Anthony? Bob Fox wrote an article about two weeks ago titled, “Why Stephone Anthony Should Be the Green Bay Packers' Ultimate NFL Draft Target”. In it he quotes NFL scout Chris Landry saying this about Kendricks: "Kendricks is another good player that I like a lot," Landry said. "I think he's a physical point-of-attack guy and a downhill run defender and I think he plays well in space." Fox agrees about Kendricks but says he likes Anthony better noting the 6’3”, 243 pound Anthony ran a 4.56 40 as opposed to the 6’, 232 pound Kendricks running a 4.61. Asked about Anthony, Landry said, "I love Anthony," Landry said. "I think he's really an instinctive player and I like him a lot."
Fox says Anthony was overshadowed at Clemson by Beasley and then makes this case for the Packers picking him at #30: “Anthony has the prototypical size at inside linebacker, plus has the speed to go from sideline to sideline and to drop into coverage. In 2014 for the Tigers, Anthony had 75 tackles, 10.5 tackles for a loss, 2.5 sacks, one interception and two forced fumbles. In his career at Clemson, Anthony had 255 tackles, 33.5 tackles for a loss, 9.5 sacks, three interceptions, nine passes defended and six forced fumbles.”
I didn’t watch any Clemson games last year and I’m far from a draftnik, but based on this limited information Landry seems more like a Thompson pick than Kendricks. What do you all see as Anthony's weaknesses as the ILB lining up next to Barrington?
http://bleacherreport.com/articles/...e-green-bay-packers-ultimate-nfl-draft-target
There is a sub-forum for draft talk, which I believe already has a thread on ILB prospects.
https://www.packerforum.com/forums/draft-talk.26/
Let's have a serious discussion or breakdown of potentials in the draft at ILB. We all know or would bet the house on a ILB taken 3rd round or earlier (1st round is HIGHLY likely if we don't trade back).
McKinney, Benardrick ILB 6'4" 246 Mississippi St.
-Many have him as the first true ILB coming off the board and believe it or not to us. However, while he holds more athletic ability in pass coverage than Hawk ever did, he still is repped with the clause that he "could potentially be a pass coverage liability". I truly feel his tangibles point towards a SOLID ILB and would be a true upgrade...however I honestly am split on whether he will grow entirely into an all around ILB...but the potential is truly there.
BOTTOM LINE (NFL.com)
Productive, steady performer in the middle with above-average size and length for the position but below-average agility. McKinney plays within the scheme and finds himself near the play frequently. He plays with strength and has an ability to take on offensive linemen and get downhill to finish his tackles. McKinney looks like an above-average NFL inside linebacker who could become part of a really good defense. He lacks star-making talent, though.
**My personal thought on if we draft him is I'd be extremely pleased but would have hesitation before christening him the next Ray Lewis .
Dawson, Paul ILB 6'0" 235 TCU
-Graded out by most to the same level as McKinney...but is smaller in stature however much quicker and considered by many the best athlete at ILB in the draft bunch. Quick hips and very agile he graded out exceptionally well in pass defense allowing under 40% of passes to be completed tossed his way.
BOTTOM LINE (from NFL.com)
Outrageously productive linebacker with a nose for the ball. Dawson averages a tackle every 5.3 snaps and either caused or recovered a total of 8 turnovers during the 2014 season. Evaluators understand that Dawson has been a handful while at TCU and that will turn some teams off to him completely. Dawson can play inside in a 2-gap scheme but is a natural fit at 4-3 WILL.
**My personal thought on if we draft him is I'd be PUMPED....however his off-field issues make me pause. However, that said if we draft him I have no doubt TT and staff liked not only the ability of the player but the man in the interviews. Come to GB and turn over a new leaf.
Kendricks, Eric ILB 6'0" 232 UCLA
-Not going to go deep on him as many scouts are saying he'll most likely shift to a OLB.
BOTTOM LINE (NFL.com)
Kendricks is an intelligent leader with high football character. Scouts don't see the same explosiveness in Eric as they see in his brother Mychal (Eagles LB), but they do see the same level of production and desire. Eric Kendricks plays with plus instincts against the run and pass. He has the athleticism and demeanor to be an impactful, productive outside linebacker in a 4-3 for years to come.
**My personal thought on if we draft him is it better be with NOT the 30th pick...as I don't like drafting an OLB forecast unless he falls to us.
Anthony, Stephone ILB 6'3" 243 Clemson
-If it isn't Benardrick people have us drafting it is this guy more often than not (in mocks that we take a ILB). I personally like him more then McKinney simply due to many praise his quickness and ability to cover Tight Ends or RBs out of the back field.
BOTTOM LINE(NFL.com)
Anthony has the athleticism to be an NFL linebacker, but he's not an explosive talent. He tries to get downhill and make plays, but more often it feels like he's guessing rather than instinctive. He'll take high-risk chances that will turn some coaches off. Anthony can make it in the league but he might be more of a depth-chart player than a long-time starter.
**My personal thought on if we draft him is he has a similar body type to McKinney yet I see more potential to be a complete ILB in his ability to defend the pass more confidently. I'd be happy with both but if I had them beside eachother on my draft board I'd put him above McKinney (assuming they both seem equivalent in character and such discovered in inteviews).
Perryman, Denzel ILB 5'11" 236 Miami
BOTTOM LINE (NFL.com)
Early down linebacker who can make plays against the run but will struggle if isolated in coverage. Perryman is a lunch-pail worker who enjoys the physical part of the game. Can be a highly productive NFL player but ceiling looks to be limited.
**My personal thought on if we draft him is he better learn to defend the pass. He has the gut wrenching desire to hit people which I'd love but unless something unforeseen occurs in the draft I don't think we target him...although early grading by some had him as the #1 ILB.
Wilson, Ramik ILB 6'2" 237 Georgia
BOTTOM LINE (NFL.com)
Wilson could use more thump in his game. He will occasionally flash explosiveness, but we don't see it enough. Productive over the last two years, with ability to come in and help on special teams. Attack- oriented defense could turn Wilson into a more urgent player, but he might have to prove he can be more than just a backup linebacker.
**My personal thought on if we draft him is that there had to be more to him than some scouts think, and I trust TT if he takes he has that. He intrigues me a lot for the right pick due to him being graded out as the best tackling LB in the SEC last year. 3 years of starting in the SEC is a great thing to have on a resume as well. Good size and I think his urgency could get helped along watching guys like Clay. (early predictions have him middle rounds...we'll see)
Jones, Taiwan ILB 6'3" 245 Michigan St.
BOTTOM LINE (NFL.com)
Physically imposing "Hulk smash" linebacker with outstanding power and toughness but a lack of instincts essential to the position. Jones' coverage limitations could be mitigated by his ability to thump and blitz as a 3-4 inside linebacker next to a more instinctive chaser. At worst, Jones is a backup linebacker and core special-teams player.
**My personal thought on if we draft him is I'm excited. Of the ILB not projected to be taken in the 1st he may have my eye the most. I see him as a hungry hungry ILB, and would love to see him develop into a Clay type mentality there. Athletic enough to overcome his pass coverage skills, until the game slows for him....this could be a guy depending on where TT thinks he falls could allow us to not go ILB with our 1st pick or even our 2nd pick.
***OVERALL***
These are just a portion of the my personal short list but there are more guys on the radar....add people, share thoughts....and GO!
I mergedDangit...you're right. I've never really paid attention to the sub-forums. Go ahead and lock this one admins.
Anthony is interesting, no doubt. The athletic measurements are impressive and show up on tape. Fast, instinctual, high motor. Runs to the ball, plays sideline to sideline. We could do a lot worse. He might have more upside potential than Kendricks in terms of splash plays, but poses some higher risks. He's not great at shedding blocks. The splash plays originated out of an fast, attacking, swarming defense at Clemson where he's unblocked. Can he play under more control? How will he do when NFL linemen come out him at the second level?
Kendricks is more likely to bring more glue to front 7, a needed and valuable trait. He's polished. He's smart. And the thing that jumps out at me on the tape is his efficiency; he gets to the ball without a lot of hoopla or wasted motion. He's more a flow player than a burst player like Anthony; the latter tends to show up better on highlight tapes but perhaps not as well in a down-after-down grading. He sheds blocks better than Anthony and is a fundamentally better tackler.
When Thompson spends meaningful capital on LBs, he has a history of liking LBs with top athletic measurables.
Start with Hawk (people forget he ran 4.47 at 248 lbs. at his Pro Day), through Matthews, Perry and Peppers.
Everybody likes to cite Anthony's 4.56 Combine time. Well, Kendricks ran a nearly indistinguishable 4.61. Their Combine numbers across the board are indistinguishable except for Anthony's 4 additional lifts, a difference which, frankly, does not show up on the tape.
I'd take Kendricks on the basis of efficiency, polish and fundamentals. The only question I have is about the hamstring he aggravated which prevented him running at his pro day. I'd be concerned if this has been a recurring problem.
Either would be an easy upgrade by the playoff run. One of the unappreciated advantages of playing in a weak division is you can start a couple of rookies out of the gate, maybe flub a game or two in the process, but by week 18 those guys are near-veterans.
Let's have a serious discussion or breakdown of potentials in the draft at ILB. We all know or would bet the house on a ILB taken 3rd round or earlier (1st round is HIGHLY likely if we don't trade back).
McKinney, Benardrick ILB 6'4" 246 Mississippi St.
-Many have him as the first true ILB coming off the board and believe it or not to us. However, while he holds more athletic ability in pass coverage than Hawk ever did, he still is repped with the clause that he "could potentially be a pass coverage liability". I truly feel his tangibles point towards a SOLID ILB and would be a true upgrade...however I honestly am split on whether he will grow entirely into an all around ILB...but the potential is truly there.
BOTTOM LINE (NFL.com)
Productive, steady performer in the middle with above-average size and length for the position but below-average agility. McKinney plays within the scheme and finds himself near the play frequently. He plays with strength and has an ability to take on offensive linemen and get downhill to finish his tackles. McKinney looks like an above-average NFL inside linebacker who could become part of a really good defense. He lacks star-making talent, though.
**My personal thought on if we draft him is I'd be extremely pleased but would have hesitation before christening him the next Ray Lewis .
Dawson, Paul ILB 6'0" 235 TCU
-Graded out by most to the same level as McKinney...but is smaller in stature however much quicker and considered by many the best athlete at ILB in the draft bunch. Quick hips and very agile he graded out exceptionally well in pass defense allowing under 40% of passes to be completed tossed his way.
BOTTOM LINE (from NFL.com)
Outrageously productive linebacker with a nose for the ball. Dawson averages a tackle every 5.3 snaps and either caused or recovered a total of 8 turnovers during the 2014 season. Evaluators understand that Dawson has been a handful while at TCU and that will turn some teams off to him completely. Dawson can play inside in a 2-gap scheme but is a natural fit at 4-3 WILL.
**My personal thought on if we draft him is I'd be PUMPED....however his off-field issues make me pause. However, that said if we draft him I have no doubt TT and staff liked not only the ability of the player but the man in the interviews. Come to GB and turn over a new leaf.
Kendricks, Eric ILB 6'0" 232 UCLA
-Not going to go deep on him as many scouts are saying he'll most likely shift to a OLB.
BOTTOM LINE (NFL.com)
Kendricks is an intelligent leader with high football character. Scouts don't see the same explosiveness in Eric as they see in his brother Mychal (Eagles LB), but they do see the same level of production and desire. Eric Kendricks plays with plus instincts against the run and pass. He has the athleticism and demeanor to be an impactful, productive outside linebacker in a 4-3 for years to come.
**My personal thought on if we draft him is it better be with NOT the 30th pick...as I don't like drafting an OLB forecast unless he falls to us.
Anthony, Stephone ILB 6'3" 243 Clemson
-If it isn't Benardrick people have us drafting it is this guy more often than not (in mocks that we take a ILB). I personally like him more then McKinney simply due to many praise his quickness and ability to cover Tight Ends or RBs out of the back field.
BOTTOM LINE(NFL.com)
Anthony has the athleticism to be an NFL linebacker, but he's not an explosive talent. He tries to get downhill and make plays, but more often it feels like he's guessing rather than instinctive. He'll take high-risk chances that will turn some coaches off. Anthony can make it in the league but he might be more of a depth-chart player than a long-time starter.
**My personal thought on if we draft him is he has a similar body type to McKinney yet I see more potential to be a complete ILB in his ability to defend the pass more confidently. I'd be happy with both but if I had them beside eachother on my draft board I'd put him above McKinney (assuming they both seem equivalent in character and such discovered in inteviews).
Perryman, Denzel ILB 5'11" 236 Miami
BOTTOM LINE (NFL.com)
Early down linebacker who can make plays against the run but will struggle if isolated in coverage. Perryman is a lunch-pail worker who enjoys the physical part of the game. Can be a highly productive NFL player but ceiling looks to be limited.
**My personal thought on if we draft him is he better learn to defend the pass. He has the gut wrenching desire to hit people which I'd love but unless something unforeseen occurs in the draft I don't think we target him...although early grading by some had him as the #1 ILB.
Wilson, Ramik ILB 6'2" 237 Georgia
BOTTOM LINE (NFL.com)
Wilson could use more thump in his game. He will occasionally flash explosiveness, but we don't see it enough. Productive over the last two years, with ability to come in and help on special teams. Attack- oriented defense could turn Wilson into a more urgent player, but he might have to prove he can be more than just a backup linebacker.
**My personal thought on if we draft him is that there had to be more to him than some scouts think, and I trust TT if he takes he has that. He intrigues me a lot for the right pick due to him being graded out as the best tackling LB in the SEC last year. 3 years of starting in the SEC is a great thing to have on a resume as well. Good size and I think his urgency could get helped along watching guys like Clay. (early predictions have him middle rounds...we'll see)
Jones, Taiwan ILB 6'3" 245 Michigan St.
BOTTOM LINE (NFL.com)
Physically imposing "Hulk smash" linebacker with outstanding power and toughness but a lack of instincts essential to the position. Jones' coverage limitations could be mitigated by his ability to thump and blitz as a 3-4 inside linebacker next to a more instinctive chaser. At worst, Jones is a backup linebacker and core special-teams player.
**My personal thought on if we draft him is I'm excited. Of the ILB not projected to be taken in the 1st he may have my eye the most. I see him as a hungry hungry ILB, and would love to see him develop into a Clay type mentality there. Athletic enough to overcome his pass coverage skills, until the game slows for him....this could be a guy depending on where TT thinks he falls could allow us to not go ILB with our 1st pick or even our 2nd pick.
***OVERALL***
These are just a portion of the my personal short list but there are more guys on the radar....add people, share thoughts....and GO!
Some good stuff there and as a Georgia fan I think Ramik is definitely underrated. However, I know Dawson is getting too much of a bad rep for his 40, but I also don't think he's the most athletic LB in the draft.