Gruden Resigns/Fired!

[Pkrjones]

After the supposed 2011 racist email regarding NFLPA President D. Smith the NFL investigated other Gruden emails from 2011-2014. They found derogatory descriptive words about Goodell, Obama, Biden and more about Smith. Gruden's been cancelled 4 years into his 10 year $100Mil contract. Hope he was a saver...

 

[Mondio]

Wasn’t It guaranteed?

Anyway, I don’t know anybody that hasn’t used some bad words against someone. I’m tired of the witch hunts over words.

 

[longtimefan]

Wasn’t It guaranteed?

Anyway, I don’t know anybody that hasn’t used some bad words against someone. I’m tired of the witch hunts over words.

I heard since he broke league and Raider conduct rules they dont owe

 

[Mondio]

If that's the level of "breaking rules" they're holding people to society is completely off the rails. It's so out of control.

 

[thisisnate]

If that's the level of "breaking rules" they're holding people to society is completely off the rails. It's so out of control.

Whether you like the rules is a completely different discussion. I don't know whether this is the case, but if he broke conduct rules of his employer and/or the league and that means his money isn't guaranteed, there's nothing "out of control" about that. That's how it's supposed to work. What's out of control is when people flout rules because they don't agree with them and/or think they don't or shouldn't apply.

 

[I asked LT to delete my acct]

So what will happen to Gruden now ? Will he appeal or is that the end of his career ?

 

[PikeBadger]

Wasn’t It guaranteed?

Anyway, I don’t know anybody that hasn’t used some bad words against someone. I’m tired of the witch hunts over words.

We've become a nation of creampuffs and candy ***es.

 

[thisisnate]

We've become a nation of creampuffs and candy ***es.

You could just as easily say we've become a nation of people that can't handle the idea of being held accountable for bad behavior. Two sides of the same coin.

 

[PikeBadger]

Sticks and stones are held now held unaccountable.
Mere words are suddenly worse than nuclear weapons.

People have become totally effed up.

 

[Mondio]

Whether you like the rules is a completely different discussion. I don't know whether this is the case, but if he broke conduct rules of his employer and/or the league and that means his money isn't guaranteed, there's nothing "out of control" about that. That's how it's supposed to work. What's out of control is when people flout rules because they don't agree with them and/or think they don't or shouldn't apply.

sure.

I know people at every level of society and none of the would pass the scrutiny of going thru old letters, emails, private conversations or conduct as teenagers that wouldn't get some people upset by what they did or said. It doesn't define person, or at least it shouldn't.

I guarantee nobody writing stories about Gruden being all sorts of things we'd consider derogatory will lose their job, but he did because he used the *****. BFD. they're here, they're *****, get used to it. chanted in the streets for a decade, probably still is, but this guy used it in a private email 10 years ago, his career is over.

It's out of control.

 

[thisisnate]

If he broke rules of his employer (and that is an "if" because I don't know), then he should be held accountable. Your issue appears to be that you don't like the rules, which is a whole different discussion.

 

[Mondio]

ahh yes, the rules that say if you say something we later find out we don't like, society will dictate we fire you. Those are always good rules. Like I said, NONE of us would survive them if people went looking. Especially when they can go digging in times long before the present or your present employment.

 

[thisisnate]

I would survive fine. I don't know what the heck you're doing on your work emails lmao. And Gruden was not a child when he sent these emails. He was a grown man representing himself as a grown man saying very bad things about the Commissioner of the NFL, owners, and others. I'm sorry you don't like the rules, but times change. In whatever time you live, follow rules, be decent, and you'll be fine.

 

[Mondio]

sure you would. Everyone on the internet is pretty perfect while they sit and judge everyone else. I bet the Commissioner has done and said some very bad things about people too. I don't believe you never have either, even as an adult. I know too many people across all walks of life to believe people are perfect.

 

[thisisnate]

sure you would. Everyone on the internet is pretty perfect while they sit and judge everyone else. I bet the Commissioner has done and said some very bad things about people too. I don't believe you never have either, even as an adult. I know too many people across all walks of life to believe people are perfect.

I didn't say I was perfect. I said I'd be fine if someone dug through my work emails or social media, because I don't send awful things through work email... because that's a very foolish thing to do. And you wouldn't find me making disparaging remarks about my past and likely future employers in my emails or social media... because that's a very foolish thing to do. This is not some bar that's hard for people to clear. It's very simple. Don't use work emails to talk crap about your future employer. If you do, you may have to own it. Gruden is owning it.

 

[Mondio]

Goodell isn't his employer. he's not an emperor. I don't even use work email. and were they work email? Thought they were private and the NFL had them for TWO YEARS. it becoming public is what made him leave/get fired.

WE are out of control as a society.

If you say something to your friend or write it in an email, does one make you a better person than the other? it's time people recognize it. Besides, when this stuff was done, maybe ESPN should be the one firing him, as that's when it happened.

 

[thisisnate]

All of your comments are "I don't like the rules" or "I don't like the direction our society is moving." These things are completely subjective. Focus on the objective things and maybe we can agree to something. If he broke rules of his employer, should he be held accountable? If it's within the rights of his employer to terminate an agreement if an employee has broken these rules, should they not be able to do that? Maybe we can at least agree on those things. I don't know what rules he's broken or what rights his employer has, but assuming these things are true, what is the issue aside from not liking the rules?

 

[Mondio]

All of your comments are "I don't like the rules" or "I don't like the direction our society is moving." These things are completely subjective. Focus on the objective things and maybe we can agree to something. If he broke rules of his employer, should he be held accountable? If it's within the rights of his employer to terminate an agreement if an employee has broken these rules, should they not be able to do that? Maybe we can at least agree on those things. I don't know what rules he's broken or what rights his employer has, but assuming these things are true, what is the issue aside from not liking the rules?

ok, he was employed by ESPN, what's their punishment? they won't air Chucky on TV? good, never cared for sideline shots of coaches anyway.

He wasn't fired for breaking rules, he's fired because a media giant broke a story. That is the issue.

and NO, I don't think disagreeing with someone you work with and calling them a name is grounds for losing your job even if that would be a rule. I have much higher standards.

 

[thisisnate]

ok, he was employed by ESPN, what's their punishment? they won't air Chucky on TV? good, never cared for sideline shots of coaches anyway.

He wasn't fired for breaking rules, he's fired because a media giant broke a story. That is the issue.

and NO, I don't think disagreeing with someone you work with and calling them a name is grounds for losing your job even if that would be a rule. I have much higher standards.

If you knew for certain that he didn't break any rules of his employer, you should have led with that and saved us the back-and-forth. If you're just saying that and don't know for certain he didn't break any rules of his employer, then I don't know why you've suddenly injected that into the conversation.

As to the last point, not trying to be rude still, but nobody in Gruden's sphere of influence or the circle of this story cares about your standards. You keep introducing your feelings into a discussion of whether Gruden deserves to be held accountable by his employer for breaking company rules of conduct. But like you just now said, if you know for fact he didn't break any rules, then no, he has nothing to be held accountable for and this conversation was a big ole waste of time.

 

[Mondio]

I know nothing for certain, do you?

i know what they presented and see what happened after and I think society is out of control. I'm sure you think the way you do because of your feelings as well, are we not allowed to have thoughts, you can mock me because you think my "feelings" are in the way. I can handle it.

He wasn't fired because he broke rules, he was fired because the media broke a story. You disagree? if you have nothing, then you're right, you can stop wasting time.

Otherwise, i'm still on MY point. Society is out of control. Sit back and judge when the only reason they aren't is nobody is looking that hard.

 

[El Guapo]

I see this type of behavior all of the time. Act one way in public or at work but bellied up to the bar, sitting on a boat with a line in the water, in "private" emails, people say stuff that they shouldn't be saying. Years ago I kicked a buddy out of our hunting group because I was sick of all the black jokes. This buddy got sensitive about it and asked why I was mad. He said he thought that he was making us laugh to which I responded that there are other ways to make people laugh than to disparage others. He disagreed and therefore doesn't hunt or fish with us anymore.

Most people who don't get offended by this type of language, have never been on the receiving end of it. The old walk-a-mile-in-their-shoes notion is appropriate.

 

[Mondio]

I see this type of behavior all of the time. Act one way in public or at work but bellied up to the bar, sitting on a boat with a line in the water, in "private" emails, people say stuff that they shouldn't be saying. Years ago I kicked a buddy out of our hunting group because I was sick of all the black jokes. This buddy got sensitive about it and asked why I was mad. He said he thought that he was making us laugh to which I responded that there are other ways to make people laugh than to disparage others. He disagreed and therefore doesn't hunt or fish with us anymore.

Most people who don't get offended by this type of language, have never been on the receiving end of it. The old walk-a-mile-in-their-shoes notion is appropriate.

completely different situation. that's your group or circle of friends. His circle of friends didn't kick him out. Neither did his employer or the governing body of his employer. Nobody said boo until a story was broke.

I can respect telling a friend, acquaintence, co-worker etc that their behavior isn't going to be tolerated and when it persists telling them to take a hike. That's not what this is. This would be more like you laughing at the jokes and having a good old time for years and years and years. But he moved far away and was now in a different camp and someone uninvolved in any of it decided to go to your boss so you had his new boss fire him.

I can assure you, i've had all sorts of things directed at me over the years LOL

 

[milani]

Wasn’t It guaranteed?

Anyway, I don’t know anybody that hasn’t used some bad words against someone. I’m tired of the witch hunts over words.

So anyone anytime in the last 100 years says anything objectionable and it is discovered then your career is over. We probably should live in caves again. Reggie spoke adamantly against homosexuality publicly...And he is in the HOF.

 

[Mondio]

So anyone anytime in the last 100 years says anything objectionable and it is discovered then your career is over. We probably should live in caves again. Reggie spoke adamantly against homosexuality publicly...And he is in the HOF.

He'd be canceled today. I'm surprised the petition to remove him hasn't already started.

 

[El Guapo]

What's the bottom line here? Should he have said these things or not as a public face of the NFL? This sounds like the old let-boys-be-boys carp that people toss out there. Had Gruden said this stuff as a young assistant coach or player, he deserves a second chance. As a coach or ESPN announcer he should have known better.

On top of all of it, how was he going to be able to lead a team comprised of black and gay players?