Free Agency: ILB

[ThePerfectBeard]

Miles Killebrew (6'-1", 220 lb SS) could be the guy to fill this role if MM/TT wanted to continue the hybrid experiment. AZ had success with Buchannon and that seems to be the NFL role of this kid. 4.5 40 (hopefully), hard hitting in the box Safety/LB. Passing-situational substitute with a bigger/slower/thumper ILB for running downs?

Could have sworn he's 6'3"/230lbs. Plus he runs an unofficial 4.4 40 yard dash.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

Sure, I'm all for that. However, if people are worried about the coverage element for the ILB, then what's the problem with putting a guy that's been in coverage most of his career in at ILB on passing downs?

It's fine on obvious passing downs but on early downs or short yardage situations teams could take advantage of a smaller guy lining up inside and run the ball at him.

 

[TJV]

What they need is one three down ILB who can cover. The only problem is acquiring one...

 

[Mondio]

What they need is one three down ILB who can cover. The only problem is acquiring one...

I am volunteering my services for the position and they can have me cheap. Now to get younger, stronger and much faster by September

 

[Pkrjones]

Could have sworn he's 6'3"/230lbs. Plus he runs an unofficial 4.4 40 yard dash.

I started looking at him as 6'-3", 230 Lbs and other articles said he dropped weight to become quicker before 2015 season. The combine measurements will be official, and it shows he's willing to "morph" himself to fill a team's desired-role. He'd probably stay in 220 range if a team wanted him at Safety, but would probably go back to 230 or 235 with some weight room work if a team wanted him closer to the line.

 

[Crockett&Tubbs]

People forget that before Matthews was moved to ILB due to TT failing to address the ILB hole, that Clay didn't line up at ROLB 100% of the time. They did move him around sometimes.

Clay is an OLB. He's not an ILB. We don't want him in there. He's not a Kuechly, Wagner, Bowman, Willis type. He's Khalil Mack, Demarcus Ware, Von Miller, Justin Houston. QB's blind side nightmare.

When was the last time you can remember Matthews taking over a game? He used to a few games a season. I don't remember him doing so recently.
We want Clay off the edge rushing the passer. He creates more turnovers with blind side sacks, strips, rushing the QBs etc.... McCarthy finally realizes this... even though it was not our D's fault we struggled this season...


You guys remember games like this?

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[jrock645]

The last time clay took over a game was the home game against chicago when he was moved to ilb. Before that, he hdnt taken over a game since 2010. He flat out disappeared as an edge rusher for 3 years. As to moving him around... They stopped doing that after the SB. Not sure why.

I agree completely that we need to get better at ILB so tht clay doeant HAVE to play inside. But i dont believe at all, and the numbers dont support the argument that clay was better outside full time. He shouldnt even be mentioned with ware and miller. After 2010, everyone knew who he was and they doubled him, and his numbers dropped sharply. Double teams didnt stop ware from being productive. Clay is good, but nowhere near as good purely as an edge rusher as Ware was. Hell, i think peppers is better off the edge than clay.

The defense got night and day better after clay moved inside. Sure, it filled a void of talent inside but it also gave clay more room to show his versatility. He was all over the firld after that, not just absorbing double teams and getting lost in the play after not getting to the qb.

People forget that before Matthews was moved to ILB due to TT failing to address the ILB hole, that Clay didn't line up at ROLB 100% of the time. They did move him around sometimes.

Clay is an OLB. He's not an ILB. We don't want him in there. He's not a Kuechly, Wagner, Bowman, Willis type. He's Khalil Mack, Demarcus Ware, Von Miller, Justin Houston. QB's blind side nightmare.

When was the last time you can remember Matthews taking over a game? He used to a few games a season. I don't remember him doing so recently.
We want Clay off the edge rushing the passer. He creates more turnovers with blind side sacks, strips, rushing the QBs etc.... McCarthy finally realizes this... even though it was not our D's fault we struggled this season...


You guys remember games like this?

You must be logged in to see this image or video!

 

[Deleted member 6794]

The last time clay took over a game was the home game against chicago when he was moved to ilb. Before that, he hdnt taken over a game since 2010. He flat out disappeared as an edge rusher for 3 years. As to moving him around... They stopped doing that after the SB. Not sure why.

I agree completely that we need to get better at ILB so tht clay doeant HAVE to play inside. But i dont believe at all, and the numbers dont support the argument that clay was better outside full time. He shouldnt even be mentioned with ware and miller. After 2010, everyone knew who he was and they doubled him, and his numbers dropped sharply. Double teams didnt stop ware from being productive. Clay is good, but nowhere near as good purely as an edge rusher as Ware was. Hell, i think peppers is better off the edge than clay.

The defense got night and day better after clay moved inside. Sure, it filled a void of talent inside but it also gave clay more room to show his versatility. He was all over the firld after that, not just absorbing double teams and getting lost in the play after not getting to the qb.

Matthews had 26.5 sacks over three seasons rushing from the edge after the Packers won the Super Bowl. While that number for sure isn't elite you're exaggerating by saying he completely disappeared.

 

[Sunshinepacker]

The last time clay took over a game was the home game against chicago when he was moved to ilb. Before that, he hdnt taken over a game since 2010. He flat out disappeared as an edge rusher for 3 years. As to moving him around... They stopped doing that after the SB. Not sure why.

I agree completely that we need to get better at ILB so tht clay doeant HAVE to play inside. But i dont believe at all, and the numbers dont support the argument that clay was better outside full time. He shouldnt even be mentioned with ware and miller. After 2010, everyone knew who he was and they doubled him, and his numbers dropped sharply. Double teams didnt stop ware from being productive. Clay is good, but nowhere near as good purely as an edge rusher as Ware was. Hell, i think peppers is better off the edge than clay.

The defense got night and day better after clay moved inside. Sure, it filled a void of talent inside but it also gave clay more room to show his versatility. He was all over the firld after that, not just absorbing double teams and getting lost in the play after not getting to the qb.

I'm gonna guess that you're referring to sacks only, right? Because Clay's numbers when it comes to actually pressuring the QB (sacks, hits and hurries) have been "elite" every year he's been at OLB except his rookie season (and he was simply very good his rookie year). So yes, the Packers defense has certainly missed having one of the best OLBs in all the NFL.

 

[Sunshinepacker]

It's fine on obvious passing downs but on early downs or short yardage situations teams could take advantage of a smaller guy lining up inside and run the ball at him.

If the Packers think they can find Luke Kuechly in the draft, then I'm for them drafting him. Outside of him though, I'm not sure how many ILBs there are in the NFL that are great against the run AND in coverage. As I've been saying, the other option (more realistic) would be to get an actual good NT that can help in the run game and let the lighter ILB (who would be better in coverage) play without having to fight olinemen. Reiterating however, that I fully agree that the Packers DO need to get better at ILB. There isn't an ILB on the roster right now that would satisfy any real "role" for a legit starting ILB.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

If the Packers think they can find Luke Kuechly in the draft, then I'm for them drafting him. Outside of him though, I'm not sure how many ILBs there are in the NFL that are great against the run AND in coverage.

The Packers mostly need an inside linebacker great in coverage as the team should be fine defending the run with Barrington and Ryan.

 

[PackerDNA]

When talking defense in any sport, you'll almost always hear about the importance of being 'strong up the middle'.
Apparently, the Packers aren't big subscribers to that theory.

 

[Crockett&Tubbs]

The Packers mostly need an inside linebacker great in coverage as the team should be fine defending the run with Barrington and Ryan.

True, and I really like Barrington. The issue is that too often, we don't know what the other team is going to do on offense. Run or pass.... they don't tell us, so we don't know when we should have the run guys Jake Ryan in. He was exposed as a cover guy a few times this year badly. Of course, so was Nate Palmer. He was clueless.

Sure would be nice to invest in a premium ILB who can be good at both. But there aren't many of them to go around. In fact, apparently there wasn't a single one in last year's draft, as TT had his choice of any in the whole draft, sitting there at #30.

 

[TJV]

In fact, apparently there wasn't a single one in last year's draft, as TT had his choice of any in the whole draft, sitting there at #30.

Because Thompson selected Randall at #30 does not mean he and his staff believed there wasn't a three down ILB on the board. What they obviously believed was Randall was a better prospect for the Packers than any of the ILBs available.

 

[Crockett&Tubbs]

Because Thompson selected Randall at #30 does not mean he and his staff believed there wasn't a three down ILB on the board. What they obviously believed was Randall was a better prospect for the Packers than any of the ILBs available.

Most likely yes. There are many times when a team has similar grades on players who are available, but they choose one or the other for various reasons.

It's been said that in 2009, the Packers had Michael Crabtree rated highest on their board (available at the pick), but still selected NT BJ Raji at #9 overall. Remember that was the year when Capers' 3-4 defense was being installed, so the NT was an important addition.

Also, in 2010, it's been written that the Packers may have had Dez Bryant and Jerry Hughes rated ahead of Bryan Bulaga. But the grades were close enough, and the Packers went with the position TT wanted filled more. Also, character issues sway them one way or the other.

Also in defense of the Randall over all ILB picks: Had they known they'd select Quinten Rollins in Rd 2, perhaps they'd have gone ILB with the 1st pick. But you can never know if QR will be there in Rd 2.

I still kept wanting them to grab Paul Dawson as he slid down towards #100.... I actually had read one scouting report with analytics and data which said he was THE best of all those ILBs.

 

[Crockett&Tubbs]

We need to get Clay back at OLB 100% of the time so he can harrass and pressure the QBs like we saw Ware and Miller do last night.... which can and does lead to strip sacks, and possible defensive TDs.

We have to find one great INSIDE linebacker. I can't believe we didn't do this last draft when we had any one we wanted in that whole draft.....

 

[jrock645]

Clay is nowhere near as good as ware or miller. Never was.

 

[tynimiller]

Clay is nowhere near as good as ware or miller. Never was.

I don't believe he is saying he is. He is simply stating if we want to have a similar attack and utilize our best rusher we gotta get him outside.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

True, and I really like Barrington. The issue is that too often, we don't know what the other team is going to do on offense. Run or pass.... they don't tell us, so we don't know when we should have the run guys Jake Ryan in. He was exposed as a cover guy a few times this year badly. Of course, so was Nate Palmer. He was clueless.

Even when playing base defense you don't need both inside linebackers to cover a RB or a TE, that's why the Packers should be fine with either Barrington or Ryan on the field as long as they're paired with an ILB excelling in coverage.

I still kept wanting them to grab Paul Dawson as he slid down towards #100.... I actually had read one scouting report with analytics and data which said he was THE best of all those ILBs.

Dawson isn't a coverage linebacker and therefore wouldn't have fit the Packers needs.

 

[PackerDNA]

I'm not too thrilled with Barrington or Ryan either, but you can't have everything at every position.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

I'm not too thrilled with Barrington or Ryan either, but you can't have everything at every position.

No, you can't. But depending on what happens with signing our own FA's, linebacker has to be deemed the weak link of the Packers defense and really needs to be addressed this off season.

 

[PackerDNA]

On D, it's all about the front seven. We have a young, up and coming secondary. A strong pass rush and stopping the run are a secondary's best friends.

 

[Pkrjones]

Could Zach Brown from the Titans be a solid coverage ILB upgrade? 6'-1", 240 lbs and ran 4.50 40 at the combine. Said to have struggled in Tennessee stopping the run but had no problems in coverage. Anybody have eyes on this guy since he's been in the NFL?

Torn pectoral in 2014 but otherwise (I think) relatively injury free. 3 year starter who lost gig as '15 season went on. Turns 27 in October.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

Could Zach Brown from the Titans be a solid coverage ILB upgrade? 6'-1", 240 lbs and ran 4.50 40 at the combine. Said to have struggled in Tennessee stopping the run but had no problems in coverage. Anybody have eyes on this guy since he's been in the NFL?

Torn pectoral in 2014 but otherwise (I think) relatively injury free. 3 year starter who lost gig as '15 season went on. Turns 27 in October.

I haven´t watched him play since he´s been in the league but I´m not sure the Packers should go after a guy who lost his starting job on the worst team in the league.

 

[Pkrjones]

I haven´t watched him play since he´s been in the league but I´m not sure the Packers should go after a guy who lost his starting job on the worst team in the league.

Brown is very good in coverage but not a thumper against the run. He lost his job to Williamson who filled-in for Brown after '14's early-season injury. Titans still couldn't stop the run, even with Brown a reserve and Williamson playing, so some of the blame can be shared by the D-line and maybe coaching/scheme. Not starting on a crappy team doesn't necessarily mean it's the player, but it could.

Davon House couldn't crack the starting line-up in GB but was signed for $6.5Mil/yr by Jax and ended up starting 15 games, 60 tackles, 23 passes defensed, 4 Ints and 1 forced fumble.

In the TE thread we're all gushing over Ladarius Green who couldn't crack the starting line-up on a marginal SD team, yet will be the top FA TE. Scheme, coaching, player doesn't "fit" rather than using his strengths... change of scenery and a new team utilizing Brown's strength (coverage) may be what the kid needs?