Fire Joe Barry -- Updated -- he's gone

[AmishMafia]

The Packers' defense is terrible. If you take out their week 9 game against Brett Rypien (cause let's be honest, that wasn't a real game) the packers' defense ranks a solid 32nd(!!) in the NFL by DVOA. That's right, when accounting for opponent, the Packers defense this season has been worse than the Commanders or the Cardinals. They are the worst in the NFL.

And if you take out the Carolina game then they are the 22nd rated defense by DVOA in the NFL (cause let's be honest, they had lots of injuries and such an early lead they began experimenting with pressure packages)

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

Do you think those same players who vote for captains also want to see Justin Jefferson torch a depleted secondary to the point it costs them a game? I would venture to say no. Alexander showed poor judgement but the whole team gets penalized with him out. Is that fair? I think a fine that penalizes a single player instead of a suspension that penalizes the entire team would've been appropriate.

I think letting Alexander play hurts the team in the long term. $35K is chump change to Alexander and if that is all you are going to dock guys, not much of an incentive or signal to others. As far as "hurting the team" in the Viking game, it could go either way. Maybe guys step-up and they don't miss JA. Hell, how many wins do we already have without JA?

You start letting players do crap like JA did, with very little consequences and I think you hurt the team in the long run.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

I have honestly wondered if firing Barry was discussed pre-season or even in-season and someone said "let's keep him, we could use a few extra losses to improve our draft position".

I never said that to MLF or Gute during our dinner together!

You must be logged in to see this image or video!

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

Crosby reform a new band? I recall it being Crosby, Stills, Nash, & Young. Who are the other two dweebs?

You must be logged in to see this image or video!

Kenny Rodgers and Jim Capers-Nabors

You must be logged in to see this image or video!

 

[Sanguine camper]

You really think this is the 1st time something has happened with Jaire this season? That everything has been great and suddenly the Packers went stupid and suspended him for a once time transgression? Even JJ Watt on Mcafee said there was something else there and they agreed with him.

Even MLF said in his press conference that the suspension wasn't just about the coin toss. I thinks it's fair to surmise that Jaire has been disgruntled for much of the season and has likely questioned coaching decisions behind closed doors. The FO obviously doesn't want to be confronted with their big mistake of retaining Joe Barry. Rather than do the right thing and send Joe Barry packing for lack of performance, the FO has decided to punish a player and in the process, the whole team. Chicken **** if you ask me.

 

[Sanguine camper]

I think letting Alexander play hurts the team in the long term. $35K is chump change to Alexander and if that is all you are going to dock guys, not much of an incentive or signal to others. As far as "hurting the team" in the Viking game, it could go either way. Maybe guys step-up and they don't miss JA. Hell, how many wins do we already have without JA?

You start letting players do crap like JA did, with very little consequences and I think you hurt the team in the long run.

I don't think Jaire's actions have hurt the team. What has hurt the team is retaining Joe Barry. Good luck replacing Alexander with free agents and 7th rounders. Not going to happen. Jaire hasn't made BS excuses like MLF when they've lost games and blamed players when poor coaching had a huge role.(see aftermath of the Tampa game) Its likely he is still popular with his peers on the team.

 

[Pugger]

Do you think those same players who vote for captains also want to see Justin Jefferson torch a depleted secondary to the point it costs them a game? I would venture to say no. Alexander showed poor judgement but the whole team gets penalized with him out. Is that fair? I think a fine that penalizes a single player instead of a suspension that penalizes the entire team would've been appropriate.

I get what you are saying but reading between the lines it appears there have been other things going on with him and the captain stunt was the straw that broke the camel's back.

 

[longtimefan]

The Packers' defense is terrible. If you take out their week 9 game against Brett Rypien (cause let's be honest, that wasn't a real game) the packers' defense ranks a solid 32nd(!!) in the NFL by DVOA. That's right, when accounting for opponent, the Packers defense this season has been worse than the Commanders or the Cardinals. They are the worst in the NFL.

Cant just take out one game unless you take out similar games for all the rest to make it even

Thats not saying I think the Def is good. Just need to compare properly

 

[milani]

Whoever coached the defense in the 70's and 80's were the worst defensive coordinators in history!

We had a top D in 1972 with Dave Hawg Hanner running the show. After that it was a sunken ship.

 

[milani]

Kenny Rodgers and Jim Capers-Nabors

You must be logged in to see this image or video!

Shazam! Shazam!

 

[Schultz]

Golly!

 

[PackAttack12]

Otherwise, feel free to continue taking a victory lap on something I've changed my mind on and realize that it's that exact attitude on the Internet that lead a lot of people to NOT changing their minds. Rather than being happy someone has changed their mind, it appears all some people want to do is double down and insult them for something they no longer think.

So true.

 

[Sunshinepacker]

And if you take out the Carolina game then they are the 22nd rated defense by DVOA in the NFL (cause let's be honest, they had lots of injuries and such an early lead they began experimenting with pressure packages)

I think it's fair to remove a game that should have been a walk over from the defensive ranking (it's basically a mulligan) but what's the logic behind removing the Carolina game? The packers aren't the only team that has had injuries.

 

[Sunshinepacker]

Cant just take out one game unless you take out similar games for all the rest to make it even

Thats not saying I think the Def is good. Just need to compare properly

Which other games against a QB that started one game before being cut from their team should we take out?

 

[milani]

I think it's fair to remove a game that should have been a walk over from the defensive ranking (it's basically a mulligan) but what's the logic behind removing the Carolina game? The packers aren't the only team that has had injuries.

And a lot of teams have not played all the second rate QBs we have played.

 

[longtimefan]

Which other games against a QB that started one game before being cut from their team should we take out?

You need to find a game from each defense that had a similar out come that you said the Packers had. Then remove that game from each team

This is like the other debates of, take out the run of 80 yards and he only averaged 3 yards per carry

You just can't pick and choose what stats to omit unless it's applied similar to other teams results.

But you know this

 

[Sunshinepacker]

You need to find a game from each defense that had a similar out come that you said the Packers had. Then remove that game from each team

This is like the other debates of, take out the run of 80 yards and he only averaged 3 yards per carry

You just can't pick and choose what stats to omit unless it's applied similar to other teams results.

But you know this

It's really not but I don't know that I see a lot of value in going into any kind of in-depth analysis of the Packers ranking 32nd or 30th by DVOA...either way the defense has been terrible and Joe barry is a terrible, terrible, TERRIBLE defensive coordinator.

 

[PikeBadger]

I don't think Jaire's actions have hurt the team. What has hurt the team is retaining Joe Barry. Good luck replacing Alexander with free agents and 7th rounders. Not going to happen. Jaire hasn't made BS excuses like MLF when they've lost games and blamed players when poor coaching had a huge role.(see aftermath of the Tampa game) Its likely he is still popular with his peers on the team.

You know what is going on in the locker room?

 

[PikeBadger]

I think it's fair to remove a game that should have been a walk over from the defensive ranking (it's basically a mulligan) but what's the logic behind removing the Carolina game? The packers aren't the only team that has had injuries.

I don't think it's fair and I think it's very intellectually dishonest. You have to do the same thing for all 32 teams and re-rank.

 

[Magooch]

It’s a needlessly pedantic argument in any case. We have assembled one of the most costly defenses in the league (money+draft capital invested). We’ve had an average-to-below average SoS for the season on the whole, with one of the easiest schedules in the league for the back end of the season. When looking at just the offenses we’ve faced, we should’ve had one of the easiest slates in the league. And now our best-case interpretation has us at 30th in defensive DVOA rather than 32nd. What difference does that make beyond being pedantic in an attempt to be able to claim “technically correct” in an internet argument? Who cares? 30th vs 32nd is wholly immaterial no matter how you slice it.

I think we’re all mature enough here to be able to let it be when someone says “we have the worst defense in the league,” instead of being unable to resist correcting them with a “well ACKSHUALLY we only have the 30th ranked defense, so it’s really not the very worst in the league”

 

[Magooch]

It's really not but I don't know that I see a lot of value in going into any kind of in-depth analysis of the Packers ranking 32nd or 30th by DVOA...either way the defense has been terrible and Joe barry is a terrible, terrible, TERRIBLE defensive coordinator.

Exactly this.

Great example of missing the forest for the trees.

 

[Sunshinepacker]

I don't think it's fair and I think it's very intellectually dishonest. You have to do the same thing for all 32 teams and re-rank.

Sure thing! As I said before, which other teams have played against a first time starter that their team immediately let go? I'll be happy to re-rank those teams as well.

 

[AmishMafia]

Sure thing! As I said before, which other teams have played against a first time starter that their team immediately let go? I'll be happy to re-rank those teams as well.

Well, I went through it for each team and threw out any game that didn't matter and the Packers are now the #4 defense based on DVOA. We need to extend Barry not fire him!

 

[Pugger]

It’s a needlessly pedantic argument in any case. We have assembled one of the most costly defenses in the league (money+draft capital invested). We’ve had an average-to-below average SoS for the season on the whole, with one of the easiest schedules in the league for the back end of the season. When looking at just the offenses we’ve faced, we should’ve had one of the easiest slates in the league. And now our best-case interpretation has us at 30th in defensive DVOA rather than 32nd. What difference does that make beyond being pedantic in an attempt to be able to claim “technically correct” in an internet argument? Who cares? 30th vs 32nd is wholly immaterial no matter how you slice it.

I think we’re all mature enough here to be able to let it be when someone says “we have the worst defense in the league,” instead of being unable to resist correcting them with a “well ACKSHUALLY we only have the 30th ranked defense, so it’s really not the very worst in the league”

And because we have such a lousy defense I really won't mind if we don't make the playoffs this year. I don't need to see more of Barry's ineffective passive defense more than absolutely necessary.

 

[games]

We had a top D in 1972 with Dave Hawg Hanner running the show. After that it was a sunken ship.

While Hanner's successor, John Meyer, was terrible, those early 1980s teams were FUN. Lynn D1(key throwing to Lofton, Jefferson and Coffman was a three-ring circus.

Revealing my age a bit, my youth was marked by two incredible TV sporting events: The Miracle on Ice and the 1983 Monday Night Football game versus the Redskins. The first Monday night game ever played at Lambeau. That game started off with a Mike Douglass sack-strip-six of Joe Theismann and only sped up from there. 48-47 Packer win. Crazy game. Defense optional.