Final 53 -- Play GM and build your roster link

[Pokerbrat2000]

Let me jog your memory. He had 7 catches for 145 yards and 2 TDs. He was also wide open for what should have been a 3rd TD.

The 2 nice catches, which I acknowledged, accounted for 101 of those 145 yds. If you want to get excited about the other 5 catches for 44 yards, so be it. But my point was and still is, one game doesn't change my perception of Janis as a wide receiver that much. But if he continues to have those kinds of games, can prove he can run routes, adjust to balls and free himself at the los, I'm keeping my eye on that guy.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

but to be fair he had zero starts at a WR and He was only targeted 25 times in 2015 in 18 games including playoffs. How do we promote (or dismis) a guy that averaged 1 catch a game in the entire season?

Hard to promote him based on his WR work, hard to dismiss him based on his work as gunner, would be my answer.

However, you kind of answered the WR part of the question with your statement. Even with as depleted as our WR group was at times, why did Janis get zero starts? Even though he was basically the only WR that didn't have some type of injury all year long. Why was Abby immediately put ahead of him when he was promoted off the PS? Why was Janis only targeted 25 times during the year? Why did he only have 2 regular season catches? Most of his targets came in the playoff game against AZ, when the Packers were down to only 2 other healthy WR's (Jones and Abby) and forced into having to play Janis as well as pass him the ball. The answer to most of these questions is, the coaches and AR were not confident in his abilities and therefore didn't play him or target him much, until they basically were out of options. Has this confidence in Janis changed enough to get him some playing time and targets? I guess we will find out.

 

[LarrysCrookedFinger]

The 2 nice catches, which I acknowledged, accounted for 101 of those 145 yds. If you want to get excited about the other 5 catches for 44 yards, so be it. But my point was and still is, one game doesn't change my perception of Janis as a wide receiver that much. But if he continues to have those kinds of games, can prove he can run routes, adjust to balls and free himself at the los, I'm keeping my eye on that guy.

And that game was the very first opportunity he had gotten to show what he is capable of doing. He played the entire game and did exactly what was asked of him. Unless he implodes and has a terrible camp, I don't see any other way he doesn't make the team, especially given his prowess as a gunner.

 

[LarrysCrookedFinger]

Hard to promote him based on his WR work, hard to dismiss him based on his work as gunner, would be my answer.

However, you kind of answered the WR part of the question with your statement. Even with as depleted as our WR group was at times, why did Janis get zero starts? Even though he was basically the only WR that didn't have some type of injury all year long. Why was Abby immediately put ahead of him when he was promoted off the PS? Why was Janis only targeted 25 times during the year? Why did he only have 2 regular season catches? Most of his targets came in the playoff game against AZ, when the Packers were down to only 2 other healthy WR's (Jones and Abby) and forced into having to play Janis as well as pass him the ball. The answer to most of these questions is, the coaches and AR were not confident in his abilities and therefore didn't play him or target him much, until they basically were out of options. Has this confidence in Janis changed enough to get him some playing time and targets? I guess we will find out.

These are all good questions. They are questions that had been asked throughout the second half of last season. And they're questions that MM has yet to answer. IMO, it was a big mistake to not give him a chance earlier in the season. Arizona has one of the best, if not THE best secondary in football. If Janis could do what he he did in a playoff game in Arizona, with nobody else but Jones and Abbrederis on the field with him, then common sense would dictate that he could have been helpful earlier on as well.

Personally, I'm beginning to think MM and AR had a personal vendetta against the guy, for whatever reason, and it's time for them to get the **** over it already.

 

[RRyder]

These are all good questions. They are questions that had been asked throughout the second half of last season. And they're questions that MM has yet to answer. IMO, it was a big mistake to not give him a chance earlier in the season. Arizona has one of the best, if not THE best secondary in football. If Janis could do what he he did in a playoff game in Arizona, with nobody else but Jones and Abbrederis on the field with him, then common sense would dictate that he could have been helpful earlier on as well.

Personally, I'm beginning to think MM and AR had a personal vendetta against the guy, for whatever reason, and it's time for them to get the **** over it already.

Arizona does not have the best secondary in the NFL. They aren't really in the discussion either. Good yes. Not the best.

Can we stop acting like Janis didn't get any snaps at WR before the Cardinals game please?

He had one big drive were he came up with two huge catches. Perhaps he can use that as a springboard but people shouldn't assume that it proves anything

 

[Luca]

Graphically my first prediction would look like this:

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[Deleted member 6794]

As much as I want to be able to say Janis finally proved himself to be a good WR in the AZ game, I can't get myself to go that far. Two really nice catches, for long yards, in clutch situations, that he had. However, the first play, he was pretty much left wide open and the second was a hail mary. Neither showed he has improved his route running or playbook retention. AR deserves as much, if not more credit for both of those plays. However, I am with everyone on hoping that those catches help his confidence and nudges his game forward.

I don´t expect Janis to ever turn into a crisp route runner but against the Cardinals proved to be able to get open and come down with the ball nevertheless. Maybe the coaching staff and Rodgers have to stop putting too much stock into him running the correct route but benefit from his athleticism to involve him more often.

Silverstein doesnt think hes a lock to make the 53 either. PFF thinks hes one of the worst WRs in the league if I remember correctly.. my membership expired if anyone wants to check that.

I have a hard time believing the Packers will release Adams before the start of next season. If he continues to struggle during the regular season though it´s possible he won´t be on the roster in 2017.

Can we stop acting like Janis didn't get any snaps at WR before the Cardinals game please?

Janis got a total of only 136 snaps in 17 games on offense before the Cardinals playoff game. Hardly a significant amount of playing time.

 

[Luca]

Therefore these 53 would make the roster:
QB: Aaron Rodgers, Brett Hundley
RB: Eddie Lacy, James Starks, John Crockett
FB: Aaron Ripkowski
TE: Jared Cook, Richard Rodgers, Justin Perillo, Kennard Backman
WR: Jordy Nelson, Randall Cobb, Jeff Janis, Ty Montgomery, Davante Adams, Trevor Davis
OT: David Bakhtiari, , Bryan Bulaga, Jason Spriggs, Kyle Murphy
INT-OL: Josh Sitton, Corey Linsley, T. J. Lang, J. C. Tretter, Lane Taylor

NT: Kenny Clark, Letroy Guion
DE: Mike Daniels, Dean Lowry, Josh Boyd
LEO: Julius Peppers, Nick Perry, Datone Jones
OLB: Clay Matthews, Jayrone Elliott, Kyler Fackrell
ILB: Sam Barrington, Jake Ryan, Blake Martinez, Joe Thomas
CB: Sam Shields, Damarious Randall, Quinten Rollins, Ladarius Gunter, Robertson Daniel, Makinton Dorleant
S: Morgan Burnett, Ha Ha Clinton-Dix, Micah Hyde, Chris Banjo
SPEC: Mason Crosby, Rick Lovato, Peter Mortell

QB: This is a no brainer.
RB: The competittion will be between Crockett and the UDFA rookies for the 3rd spot.
TE/FB: My assumption is that we will keep 4 TE's since we only have 1 FB this year. I think Perillo is the frontrunner of the bunch. Backman is athletic but has to show he can play. My prediction is that he will make the team. However Henry showed some good stuff in camp last year and Grinnage is a priority UDFA that might make the team. This battle will be interesting.
WR: This one is very interesting. Only Nelson and Cobb are locks in my book. I consider Janis a near lock for his special teams play, not for his wide receiver play. Montgomery looked good in the few games he played last year. My assumption will be that Adams bounces back, if not he might be gone. My prediction is that it will come down to Davis and Abby.
OL: My prediction is that the Packers keep 9 guys. 7 of them are lock or near locks. It will come down to Murphy, Barclay, Walker and Taylor. I think the Packers keep Taylor, since he is the best guard, and Murphy because of his upside.

DL: I think that the packers keep 5 D-lineman, and add a sixth later with Pennel. 4 of them are locks or good bets. My prediction is that this will come down to Boyd vs Ringo. Boyd might win, because they need a run stuffer early in the year. Datone could still 3 tech, if he has to.
OLB: I think that the Packers keep 6 OLB, because of all the FA's next year. I don't think that McCray will make the team. It is possible, but not very likely, that Peppers (or Perry) is a cap casualty after camp.
ILB: 3 locks. The battle will be between Thomas, Bradford and Brown. Thomas played some good snaps last year and is a good special teams guy. My bet is that he will be the fourth guy.
DB: 8 locks. The packers usually keep 10 defensive backs. My guess is that Daniel makes the team (he was promoted to the 53 last year). Moreover I expect Dorleant to be sixth guy, but that might also be Brice. Goodson will take this spot after 4 games.
SPEC: This one is 50/50. Masthay is horrible. So my prediction is that Mortell wins. Unlike Cody Mandell this guy takes holding seriously (and declared himself "Holder of the Year", LOL).

 

[HardRightEdge]

Silverstein doesn't think he's a lock to make the 53 either. PFF thinks he's one of the worst WRs in the league if I remember correctly. My membership expired if anyone wants to check that.

http://www.jsonline.com/sports/pack...ackers-wr-position-b99718246z1-377978341.html

Whether it's a beat reporter or posters on this forum, to comment on Adams' 2015 performance without mentioning he was playing injured is a meaningful oversight. After the initial injury he came back too early; he was limping around the field in that game, and diminished speed and breaks were evident throughout the year.

What Silverstein said was, "Adams, Abbrederis, Montgomery, Janis, Davis and developmental players Williams and Johnson are going to be battling for their lives."

He also said, "The return of Nelson (ACL) and Montgomery (ankle surgery) to full health might make a huge difference, but it's not a sure thing they'll regain their Pro Bowl form (Nelson) and potential (Montgomery)."

If Montgomery would be singled out as a potential Pro Bowler, which is a stretch to begin with, how can he be fighting for his life?

There's another bit of strangeness in that piece: "Even though the Packers signed free agent tight end Jared Cook and are expecting more from tight end Richard Rodgers, this 2016 offense might wind up revolving around the receivers."

"Might"? How would it be anything else? This isn't New England.

I like Silverstein, but there are oddities in this piece.

I would regard Adams and Montgomery locks if they are fully recovered from injuries and stay healthy through preseason. If past injuries show some meaningful, permanent diminishment of skill, of course they'd be question marks, as would any player.

Of course, a "f*ck off" attitude disqualifies anybody.

C'mon...this is Green Bay. Young 2nd. and 3rd. round picks are given the benefit of the doubt.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

What Silverstein said was, "Adams, Abbrederis, Montgomery, Janis, Davis and developmental players Williams and Johnson are going to be battling for their lives."

He also said, "The return of Nelson (ACL) and Montgomery (ankle surgery) to full health might make a huge difference, but it's not a sure thing they'll regain their Pro Bowl form (Nelson) and potential (Montgomery)."

If Montgomery would be singled out as a potential Pro Bowler, which is a stretch to begin with, how can he be fighting for his life?

I don´t think Silverstein was singling out Montgomery as a possible Pro Bowler but questioned his ability to play up to his potential because of the injury suffered last season.

 

[HardRightEdge]

I don´t think Silverstein was singling out Montgomery as a possible Pro Bowler but questioned his ability to play up to his potential because of the injury suffered last season.

Upon second reading, you may be right. We'd have to ask him because that wording is ambiguous.

 

[HardRightEdge]

I don´t think Silverstein was singling out Montgomery as a possible Pro Bowler but questioned his ability to play up to his potential because of the injury suffered last season.

If that is the correct reading, it is hardly news.

That goes without saying with any injured Packer player, the status of which we (and probably Silverstein) are in the dark given how mum the Packers are regarding status short of broken necks.

What puzzles me is when both fans or beat writers don't recognize injuries manifesting themselves on the field as if they never existed. This is the case with Adams.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

What puzzles me is when both fans or beat writers don't recognize injuries manifesting themselves on the field as if they never existed. This is the case with Adams.

There´s no denying Adams played hurt last season and that contributed to his struggles. It doesn´t explain his drops though.

 

[HardRightEdge]

s

There´s no denying Adams played hurt last season and that contributed to his struggles. It doesn´t explain his drops though.

It might explain his drops, actually. There are three possible factors at work:

1) The body functions as whole: A receiver meeting the ball is matter of timing. Feet, hands, body position working in concert. If something is off, you're not meeting the ball at the precise spot and in the precise way to which you are accustomed.

2) Confidence: When you can't do what you know you need to do, confidence can be shaken.

3) Fear of re-injury: A receiver does not know where the DB is going to engage him and it's at the ankles as often as the torso. If a guy is thinking, "after I catch this thing I'll try to protect my injury", which is more reflex than conscious thinking, the odds of a drop increases.

I just cannot get over my surprise that while it was evident Adams should not have been on the field at times, and more subtle at others, it is given no consideration.

The fact the guy would want to take the field with an injury should be regarded as admirable. It's up to the coaches to decide if they have a better option. They didn't.

 

[Mondio]

I'm excited for Adams this year. I think it was a physical injury that started the ball rolling, then it crept into his mind and he was affected mentally and physically. Too much, too soon, and 100 other variables all came down on a guy that just wasn't ready physically. I didn't think there was any way he'd salvage that season, it looked like it got him. Then he looked to be overcoming it, but that was cut short by a season finishing injury right before the playoffs.

So, I'm not sold he overcame it, because he never got to "finish" it. But I saw signs, and if what i saw was correct, he's going to be just fine for us. Any player that can overcome what he did, in season and beat his mental demons that crept in has what it takes to get it done in this league. I hope he does because he seems like a good kid and of course it helps our team.

 

[ivo610]

There´s no denying Adams played hurt last season and that contributed to his struggles. It doesn´t explain his drops though.

you still have a PFF account? if so, where did he rank as far as WRs go last season? My account expired

 

[Deleted member 6794]

you still have a PFF account? if so, where did he rank as far as WRs go last season? My account expired

PFF graded Adams (50.1 out of 100) 109th out of 121 qualifying wide receivers.

 

[HardRightEdge]

PFF graded Adams (50.1 out of 100) 109th out of 121 qualifying wide receivers.

Which, in my opinion, is irrelevant.

 

[ivo610]

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.co...source=FB - SNF on NBC&utm_tags=srm[football]

Derp

 

[PackerDNA]

I'm excited for Adams this year. I think it was a physical injury that started the ball rolling, then it crept into his mind and he was affected mentally and physically. Too much, too soon, and 100 other variables all came down on a guy that just wasn't ready physically. I didn't think there was any way he'd salvage that season, it looked like it got him. Then he looked to be overcoming it, but that was cut short by a season finishing injury right before the playoffs.

So, I'm not sold he overcame it, because he never got to "finish" it. But I saw signs, and if what i saw was correct, he's going to be just fine for us. Any player that can overcome what he did, in season and beat his mental demons that crept in has what it takes to get it done in this league. I hope he does because he seems like a good kid and of course it helps our team.

I don't know what happened with Adams, although I suspect part of the dissapointment with him is that he was overrated to begin with. Adams play sucked across the board last season. Probably more than one reason, but When someone is that bad, I'm not buying any excuses.

 

[RepStar15]

I am really excited to see the battle for TE and WR begin. At this point in time, aside from Jordy and Cobb, every spot is up for grabs. It comes down to who is willing to work. Is Richard Rodgers working on his speed and agility? Is Davante Adams working on learning how to catch a football? Did Jeff Janis build confidence to become a successful receiver? Will Ty Montgomery have the year I thought he was going to have last year? Is Trevor Davis the fastest player in the WR corp? This group is stocked if they want to work.

 

[tynimiller]

Is Richard Rodgers working on his speed and agility?

Speed at this point in someone's life is not something you can create leaps of growth at, refine his breaks sure, but RR is kinda what he is. His value is his ability to locate soft spots in coverage and turn. Reading defenses and shoring up his blocking are what will make RR an awesome #2 TE. He'll never be a burner, but we don't need him to be.

 

[OldSchool101]

Graphically my first prediction would look like this:

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If I were drafting today from our available WR group and Jordy and Cobb were already taken? I'd go Montgomery next and I'd even trade up to get him. He looks more polished as a rookie WR/RB utility type player and add to that him being an asset at KR. In his first 6 starts before his injury we also went 6-0. I think he's our #3.
I'm more excited about the upside of Trevor Davis but naturally skeptical if his talent will transfer to the pros.
I also think Abby and Davante are on the fence, it's up to them which side they land on

 

[HardRightEdge]

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2016/05/04/davante-adams-may-struggle-to-make-packers-roster/?utm_network=facebook&utm_post=5686633&utm_source=FB - SNF on NBC&utm_tags=srm[football]

Derp

Echo chamber...one guy says it, it shows up here, then another media guy repeats it, and it bounces right back, then around and around it goes. I'm sure this will not be the last time somebody in the media says it, and it will be without attribution, as though it was an independently determined opinion.

That's why, to take one example, the draft grades and mocks are so far off. A guy doesn't know, he hears somebody he thinks might know, so he repeats it.

Unless you can tell me his injury will have a permanent impairment, or he's a drug suspension in waiting, or he told some coach to f*ck off, there's no basis for this.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

I read an article written by HRE today that Adams injury is permanent and he is awaiting drug suspension.....more details at 5.....