Sacks All Around!

[gopkrs]

What happens when the TE lines up on his side? And I am mainly talking about pretty obvious passing situations when we need to get pressure. We can't just keep doing the same things if they aren't working. That is one of the reasons why there are coaches. To make adjustments during the game. In theory.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

And I am mainly talking about pretty obvious passing situations when we need to get pressure. We can't just keep doing the same things if they aren't working. That is one of the reasons why there are coaches. To make adjustments during the game. In theory.

Once again, Matthews provides the best option to rush from the right side of the defense. It's on Thompson to provide Capers with better players if Clay isn't able to perform up to his contract and constantly beat good left tackles.

 

[Sky King]

Personally, I don't keep tabs on which posters gave "Mulligans" to Adams, Cobb and others for their sub-par performances due to their injuries, so how many of those same posters are also equally as understanding about Matthews' injuries (relative to his play) remains a mystery to me.

But this I do know: No matter how big a player's contract may be it is irrelevant to "curing" what ails that player physically. I prefer not to ignore that Matthews' performances may have been greatly affected by those significant injuries same as any other player, regardless of their salaries.

 

[Arthur Squires]

This season our defense will forever be known as the Green Bay Sackers defense. You heard it hear first, laugh all you want but its gunna happen!

 

[Deleted member 6794]

But this I do know: No matter how big a player's contract may be it is irrelevant to "curing" what ails that player physically. I prefer not to ignore that Matthews' performances may have been greatly affected by those significant injuries same as any other player, regardless of their salaries.

Unfortunately the problem being that while the shoulder injury that significantly hampered Matthews late last season most likely won't happen again I don't feel optimistic about his hamstring holding up playing on the outside.

 

[Sky King]

Unfortunately the problem being that while the shoulder injury that significantly hampered Matthews late last season most likely won't happen again I don't feel optimistic about his hamstring holding up playing on the outside.

Casey Hayward had that really bad hamstring a few years back and if I recall correctly they treated it with some kind of needle therapy to relieve the chronic tightness. It must have worked. Matthews goes all-out, all the time. If strategically reducing his snaps to reduce fatigue to his aging legs is not viable option then he may need that therapy himself someday real soon. However, either old-fashioned rest or contemporary treatment takes him out of the lineup, probably for several games at a time.

That's what concerns me about this upcoming season. If Elliott and Fackrel don't satisfactorily raise their levels of play and if Beigel performs at no more than at a typical rookie level, a significant injury to one or both of the OLB starters or primary backups could end-up making this position group resemble last year's secondary and the prior season's receiver group. I suppose that's generally true of any position group but OLB seems to be particularly at risk going into this season. Without a top-notch pass-rush this team probably can't go deep enough in the playoffs, let alone get to them.

TT sure seems to be relying too heavily on good health for two guys that have had chronic injuries and, as yet, the unproven progression of their backups - plus, a totally unproven rookie who also has had a chronically injured foot himself. That's a heckuva lot optimism on TT's part. Let's all hope his gamble pays-off.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

Casey Hayward had that really bad hamstring a few years back and if I recall correctly they treated it with some kind of needle therapy to relieve the chronic tightness. It must have worked. Matthews goes all-out, all the time. If strategically reducing his snaps to reduce fatigue to his aging legs is not viable option then he may need that therapy himself someday real soon. However, either old-fashioned rest or contemporary treatment takes him out of the lineup, probably for several games at a time.

The difference being that Hayward injured his hamstring once missing most of the 2013 season but it seems Mattmews has had chronic troubles with it while playing on the edge.

That's what concerns me about this upcoming season. If Elliott and Fackrel don't satisfactorily raise their levels of play and if Beigel performs at no more than at a typical rookie level, a significant injury to one or both of the OLB starters or primary backups could end-up making this position group resemble last year's secondary and the prior season's receiver group. I suppose that's generally true of any position group but OLB seems to be particularly at risk going into this season. Without a top-notch pass-rush this team probably can't go deep enough in the playoffs, let alone get to them.

TT sure seems to be relying too heavily on good health for two guys that have had chronic injuries and, as yet, the unproven progression of their backups - plus, a totally unproven rookie who also has had a chronically injured foot himself. That's a heckuva lot optimism on TT's part. Let's all hope his gamble pays-off.

I absolutely agree that there's concern about the quality of the depth at outside linebacker. Thompson is taking a huge gamble relying on Elliott, Fackrell and Biegel to develop into constant impact players. Unfortunately those mostly haven't panned out on the defensive side of the ball over the past few years.

 

[Sunshinepacker]

The difference being that Hayward injured his hamstring once missing most of the 2013 season but it seems Mattmews has had chronic troubles with it while playing on the edge.

Hey, let's be optimistic, maybe it's not playing inside that's helped his hamstrings, maybe he's figured out an exercise program to keep them healthy in the last couple years and it's just been coincidental that he's also played ILB those seasons.....that's possible, right?

 

[Mike McCarthy]

Gave some thought to the idea of Matthews staying healthy, at first I chuckled a bit, but seriously now how bout passing the shrooms around. I'll continue to be realistic, not going to happen.

 

[easyk83]

That would be a lot of guys setting career highs in the same season.

Negative waves Dantes, negative waves.

 

[easyk83]

I don't like Matthews to line up on the strong side as he struggles defending the run though.

Perhaps in passing situations? He did have his best season of pass rushing at LOLB... granted he was a wee bit younger then.

 

[easyk83]

Wow...Well if you really look at it Clay and Perry are capable of double digits, Daniels has had 5+ season before so why not now. Both Dix and Burnett both have had season of 3 and 2 sacks. Blake had 1 last year so I have him getting 2 this year. So the main problem I guess is me having Elliott having a breakout season and I guess Fackrell and Biegel have many doubters here. So what is 35 sacks more reasonable? Personally I think we can crack the 50 mark!

For Clay and Nick to notch double digit sacks a piece youre not leaving a lot of snaps for guys like Biegs Fackrell and Elliot. Imo the only way that more than one of those guys gets 3 or more will be if either Nick or Clay wind up missing a lot of time. Granted Clay might wind up rushing a lot between the tackles.

 

[easyk83]

Hey, let's be optimistic, maybe it's not playing inside that's helped his hamstrings, maybe he's figured out an exercise program to keep them healthy in the last couple years and it's just been coincidental that he's also played ILB those seasons.....that's possible, right?

Then he was all like F it im giving up this new workout regime so I can go back to being limited or injured all the time.

 

[easyk83]

Once again, Matthews provides the best option to rush from the right side of the defense. It's on Thompson to provide Capers with better players if Clay isn't able to perform up to his contract and constantly beat good left tackles.

I always thought that Perry looked the most explosive coming off the right side, compared to his play on the left. We might have seen him there more last season if he didnt bust his left hand.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

Perhaps in passing situations? He did have his best season of pass rushing at LOLB... granted he was a wee bit younger then.

I always thought that Perry looked the most explosive coming off the right side, compared to his play on the left. We might have seen him there more last season if he didnt bust his left hand.

It's true that it's easier to rush the passer from the left side against most opponents but defensive coaches tend to use their best pass rushers against left tackles.

Maybe Capers will use Perry on the right side more often if he indeed has leapfroged Matthews on the depth chart. Unfortunately that would further confirm that Clay is overpaid.

 

[easyk83]

It's true that it's easier to rush the passer from the left side against most opponents but defensive coaches tend to use their best pass rushers against left tackles.

Maybe Capers will use Perry on the right side more often if he indeed has leapfroged Matthews on the depth chart. Unfortunately that would further confirm that Clay is overpaid.

I don't know that I'd agree with that, rather I look at it as where is Clay most effective and where Perry is most effective. This is one of those fans "keen eye" type arguments, so be warned, but I get the impression that Matthews is more versatile as where he can rush from whereas Perry has always been at his best coming from the defensive right. The best OTs tend to be on the left side, but it's also more of a finesse position whereas RTs tend to be more of a stiffer power breed like with Bakh and Bulaga. IMO Perry might better be able to use his bull rushes against LTs and Matthews might better be able to use his quickness and fluidity against RTs.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

I don't know that I'd agree with that, rather I look at it as where is Clay most effective and where Perry is most effective. This is one of those fans "keen eye" type arguments, so be warned, but I get the impression that Matthews is more versatile as where he can rush from whereas Perry has always been at his best coming from the defensive right. The best OTs tend to be on the left side, but it's also more of a finesse position whereas RTs tend to be more of a stiffer power breed like with Bakh and Bulaga. IMO Perry might better be able to use his bull rushes against LTs and Matthews might better be able to use his quickness and fluidity against RTs.

Unfortunately I currently don't have access to PFF's premium stats to either support or refute your claims about Matthews and Perry.

 

[Poppa San]

Unfortunately I currently don't have access to PFF's premium stats to either support or refute your claims about Matthews and Perry.

 

[Dantés]

I've been thinking about the pass rush issue, and I'm wondering if perhaps Dean Lowry is a sleeper to step up and provide a bigger contribution. Fackrell, Elliott, and Biegel are the names that get mentioned most often because of their position, but Lowry is essentially an EDGE as well. He will likely spend the majority of his time somewhere from the 5 to the 7 as a down end in sub package.

Lowry has been an underrated athlete going all the way back to his pre-draft process. The size speed dynamic is comparable to JJ Watt (he certainly is not Watt, but there is some athletic overlap). His jumps and agility drills were all in the average range, but when size adjusted, they were all quality marks.

I think perhaps because fan bases still tend to think in terms of base defense, it's easy to think of Lowry as a 34DE and thereby overlook what he may bring as a pass rusher. In reality, he's a good athlete who flashed as a rookie and should spend quite a bit of time in 2017 as an elephant edge, while also siding inside at times.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

I've been thinking about the pass rush issue, and I'm wondering if perhaps Dean Lowry is a sleeper to step up and provide a bigger contribution. Fackrell, Elliott, and Biegel are the names that get mentioned most often because of their position, but Lowry is essentially an EDGE as well. He will likely spend the majority of his time somewhere from the 5 to the 7 as a down end in sub package.

Lowry has been an underrated athlete going all the way back to his pre-draft process. The size speed dynamic is comparable to JJ Watt (he certainly is not Watt, but there is some athletic overlap). His jumps and agility drills were all in the average range, but when size adjusted, they were all quality marks.

I think perhaps because fan bases still tend to think in terms of base defense, it's easy to think of Lowry as a 34DE and thereby overlook what he may bring as a pass rusher. In reality, he's a good athlete who flashed as a rookie and should spend quite a bit of time in 2017 as an elephant edge, while also siding inside at times.

It would be huge for the Packers if Lowry could provide some consistent pass rush. He showed some flashes as a rookie and might surprise a lot of people.

 

[Sanguine camper]

I just don't see Lowry providing much of a pass rush. He just doesn't appear to be explosive enough. If edge rushers flush the qb he may get some sacks but at this point his best attribute may be tipped passes with his height advantage. Unless CM3 and Perry stay healthy, the Packers could be hard pressed to get off the field and generate a pass rush. When healthy both CM3 and Perry can disrupt the qb and get their share of sacks.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

I just don't see Lowry providing much of a pass rush. He just doesn't appear to be explosive enough. If edge rushers flush the qb he may get some sacks but at this point his best attribute may be tipped passes with his height advantage. Unless CM3 and Perry stay healthy, the Packers could be hard pressed to get off the field and generate a pass rush.

Lowry was actually decent rushing the passer during his rookie season. If he's capable of building on that he might add another much needed presence to the roster.

There's no doubt the team could struggle in that area if Matthews or Perry can't stay healthy all season though as quality depth is definitely an issue.