Packers release Kirksey and Wagner

[Deleted member 6794]

LBs are very top heavy when it comes to sure things IMO...but I think Gute and Co are quite confident in Kamal and Barnes and will build additions to them - message of Kirksey leaving confirms this.

While that might be true the cap space saved by releasing Kirksey was the main reason the Packers moved onfm from him.

Wagner was a great signing. They viably replaced Bulaga inexpensively and with a deal that they can now get out of without a lot of damage.

While Wagner was a decent right tackle for most of the season I don't think him earning $6.75 million and being released after only one year should be considered as a great signing.

 

[GleefulGary]

I dunno Cap. Outside of Tampa, Wagner played really well. He has some limitations that showee, but a starting caliber OT for under $7 million a year is a bargain.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

I dunno Cap. Outside of Tampa, Wagner played really well. He has some limitations that showee, but a starting caliber OT for under $7 million a year is a bargain.

I understand why fans might consider the Packers signing Wagner ended up being a great move. For me, they needed to bring him back for another season to put it up there.

There's no doubt it was a good move at least though.

 

[thequick12]

I understand why fans might consider the Packers signing Wagner ended up being a great move. For me, they needed to bring him back for another season to put it up there.

There's no doubt it was a good move at least though.

Well if the cap had gone up like normal, I'm sure they would be keeping him for another season...*

He's from west allis wi, so there's always a chance he could end up back at a vet min rate to win a sb. Probably only if he doesn't find suitors elsewhere to his liking. Although that's doubtful as I saw the ravens and bengals may have interest.

 

[gopkrs]

While Wagner was a decent right tackle for most of the season I don't think him earning $6.75 million and being released after only one year should be considered as a great signing.

He was good enough during the regular season. But he got killed in the big game. I think you just have to keep trying to find an adequate fill in. That will be good against the better teams. I don't think his game is going to improve. So prefer to keep looking. But if you just want to get to the playoffs...sure.

 

[RicFlairoftheNFL]

I dunno Cap. Outside of Tampa, Wagner played really well. He has some limitations that showee, but a starting caliber OT for under $7 million a year is a bargain.

I keep going back to Lomas Brown's interview with Bill Michaels on 1250 in Milwaukee about how Lomas didn't see him as a starter anymore. Granted at times he proved it wrong but at times he really proved it right.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

I think Wagner provided and delivered the insurance you want from a reasonably priced OT. I agree with those who said that if it wasn't for the cap situation, I think he doesn't get cut. Yes, the OL sh*t the bed both times against the Bucs, but I didn't see many other teams shut them down either. Give the Bucs the credit they deserve. Had the Packers had the same front 7, Super Bowl.

 

[Deleted member 6794]

Well if the cap had gone up like normal, I'm sure they would be keeping him for another season...*

You're right, that's entirely possible.

He was good enough during the regular season. But he got killed in the big game. I think you just have to keep trying to find an adequate fill in. That will be good against the better teams.

It's extremely tough to find a backup tackle capable of performing at a high level against elite competition though.

 

[PackerfaninCarolina]

No way. Wagner was at least an average OT this year, Kirksey was subpar. Plus OT is a far more valuable position.

Against better defensive fronts he got exposed. I didn't think Kirksey was that bad, but with how Barnes and Martin performed this year, I'm perfectly fine letting him walk.

 

[PackerfaninCarolina]

I hope it means that we will be looking to take care of both positions in the draft. With the OT going first. I have read that OT is pretty strong this year and am hopeful Gute can come up with an inside backer to compliment Barnes or at least for depth. Don't really want to get a vet that is mediocre. That would be just more of Kirksey.

Which is likely why Wagner was let go. Not to mention he kept whiffing on blocks in the nfccg

 

[Mondio]

Wagner doesn't have much left and he was a stopgap. Kirksey's biggest attribute was he was decent when healthy and Pettine was familiar with him and as was kirksey with the defense. Once Pettine wasn't renewed and left his biggest reason for being on the team was gone.

I mean he was fine, i don't think this defense missed Martinez at all with they guys we had in there

 

[Deleted member 6794]

Which is likely why Wagner was let go. Not to mention he kept whiffing on blocks in the nfccg

The Packers needing to get under the cap was the main reason Wagner was let go.

Kirksey's biggest attribute was he was decent when healthy and Pettine was familiar with him and as was kirksey with the defense. Once Pettine wasn't renewed and left his biggest reason for being on the team was gone.

I mean he was fine, i don't think this defense missed Martinez at all with they guys we had in there

Unfortunately the Packers didn't significantly improve at inside linebacker either. With Martin and Barnes there's some reason to believe that might change going forward though.

 

[Mondio]

while they weren't a lot better, they didn't have to pay a guaranteed amount of around 20 million and put a 30 million dollar contract around their necks to keep that level of play either. My only point was Martinez wasn't missed at all.

 

[Pokerbrat2000]

Unfortunately the Packers didn't significantly improve at inside linebacker either. With Martin and Barnes there's some reason to believe that might change going forward though.

Sadly I agree with this. Kirksey was a bust, given what they paid him. Yes Martin and Barnes showed some abilities, but the position is still rather weak IMO. But short of spending big bucks or a first rounder, how do you fix it and does it need fixing or just more time to develop Martin and Barnes? We have see some flashes from other guys in the past and then nothing. Would love to see the Packers put one more solid guy next to Kenny Clark and then use another mid rounder on an ILB to provide some competition and depth. Then cross your fingers and hope that a better DL and development at ILB strengthens the entire defense.

 

[gopkrs]

Unfortunately the Packers didn't significantly improve at inside linebacker either. With Martin and Barnes there's some reason to believe that might change going forward though.

I agree with this and am more optimistic than you about Barnes. I think he will be very good. I think he made Kirksey a much better player the latter part of the season. Just don't know that much about Martin. A lot of people said he was hitting wrong holes too much and really that is a very big deal. Hope he plays better and hope The Gute can come up with another linebacker like Barnes. We need 3 at least and doesn't look like we have another one. imo

 

[Deleted member 6794]

while they weren't a lot better, they didn't have to pay a guaranteed amount of around 20 million and put a 30 million dollar contract around their necks to keep that level of play either. My only point was Martinez wasn't missed at all.

Don't get me wrong, I definitely agree it was the right decision to let Martinez sign with another team.

 

[PackerDNA]

What do you all think of Zaven Collins LB from Tulsa? Casserly picked him for the Packers in his NFL Network mock draft.

 

[thequick12]

Sadly I agree with this. Kirksey was a bust, given what they paid him. Yes Martin and Barnes showed some abilities, but the position is still rather weak IMO. But short of spending big bucks or a first rounder, how do you fix it and does it need fixing or just more time to develop Martin and Barnes? We have see some flashes from other guys in the past and then nothing. Would love to see the Packers put one more solid guy next to Kenny Clark and then use another mid rounder on an ILB to provide some competition and depth. Then cross your fingers and hope that a better DL and development at ILB strengthens the entire defense.

I don't think either barnes or martin is ever going to develop into a star ILB. While I suppose anything is possible I believe their ceiling is more really good than great.

Unfortunately I think you're right, outside of signing bucs free agent Lavonte David who many were in favor of signing last time he was free...there's really not many sure things even if they spend a first on the position. Which I certainly see as a possibility and hopefully the Packers FO does too. A zaven collins, Nick bolton, the dude from notre dame. There could still be some impact guys in the 2nd maybe even 3rd.

In the first right now tho I think you gotta take the best player available between wr, ilb, ot, cb, dl
Because that guy is gonna be, has gotta be, a day one starter

 

[Deleted member 6794]

I don't think either barnes or martin is ever going to develop into a star ILB. While I suppose anything is possible I believe their ceiling is more really good than great.

Unfortunately I think you're right, outside of signing bucs free agent Lavonte David who many were in favor of signing last time he was free...there's really not many sure things even if they spend a first on the position. Which I certainly see as a possibility and hopefully the Packers FO does too. A zaven collins, Nick bolton, the dude from notre dame. There could still be some impact guys in the 2nd maybe even 3rd.

In the first right now tho I think you gotta take the best player available between wr, ilb, ot, cb, dl
Because that guy is gonna be, has gotta be, a day one starter

I really have no clue why you continue to act as if inside linebacker is the only position in need of an upgrade on the Packers roster.

Gutekunst proved last year that he doesn't believe in the conept of a first round pick having to be an immediate starter.

 

[thequick12]

I really have no clue why you continue to act as if inside linebacker is the only position in need of an upgrade on the Packers roster.

Gutekunst proved last year that he doesn't believe in the conept of a first round pick having to be an immediate starter.

"In the first right now tho I think you gotta take the best player available between wr, ilb, ot, cb, dl
Because that guy is gonna be, has gotta be, a day one starter"

I'm a little confused... because in what you quoted I clearly implied I think the Packers need to add starters at wr, ilb, ot, cb, dl. I would ammend ot to ol because of jenkins versatility. But otherwise I stand by my statement of what this teams major needs are. So I'm not sure how I "continue to act as if ilb is only position in need of an upgrade". ?

And yes I get gute took Love in the 1st knowing he wouldn't see the field at all if things went as planned. And Gary knowing he would be a backup to start.

He did get savage (day one starter) in the first. And Alexander who became a starter very early on in his first season (11 of 13 games)

I get he's shown his first pick doesn't "have" to be a starter. But I think this year with him being in win now mode, the first round pick will be a starter at one of the 5 positions I mentioned.

 

[tynimiller]

I think the one thing Gute has shown is if he sees a guy at his pick he feels has zero business being there he will draft him irregardless of how deep on the depth he is.

I kid you not if Preston doesn't get cut, and a TOP edge guy falls to #29, expect Gute to either trade or draft that Edge guy that will be fourth on our depth.

 

[PikeBadger]

I think the one thing Gute has shown is if he sees a guy at his pick he feels has zero business being there he will draft him irregardless of how deep on the depth he is.

I kid you not if Preston doesn't get cut, and a TOP edge guy falls to #29, expect Gute to either trade or draft that Edge guy that will be fourth on our depth.

Totally agree. Draft the best talent on the board and develop him. If you need to fill in holes later, sign a veteran later. The street will be packed like sardines with un-signed veterans this year.
I haven’t seen it mentioned but Veldheer should still be available if we need him for depth at RT..

 

[Deleted member 6794]

"In the first right now tho I think you gotta take the best player available between wr, ilb, ot, cb, dl
Because that guy is gonna be, has gotta be, a day one starter"

I'm a little confused... because in what you quoted I clearly implied I think the Packers need to add starters at wr, ilb, ot, cb, dl. I would ammend ot to ol because of jenkins versatility. But otherwise I stand by my statement of what this teams major needs are. So I'm not sure how I "continue to act as if ilb is only position in need of an upgrade". ?

I get he's shown his first pick doesn't "have" to be a starter. But I think this year with him being in win now mode, the first round pick will be a starter at one of the 5 positions I mentioned.

My bad, it seems I missed the part about you mentioning other positions aside of inside linebacker to be a possibility in the first round.

I fully expected Gutekunst to be in a win now mode last offseason as well but that didn't happen.

 

[tynimiller]

Best of luck to Kirksey as it seems he is signing with Texans.

 

[OldSchool101]

While I wish all players well, I was disappointed with Kirksey. He’s went 3 consecutive seasons missing 5+ games. The Texans got him back more in line with what I would consider is his performance area.. in that 4+mil range. I’d rather have a younger, ascending player there and maybe consider giving Barry input at drafting an ILB in that late day 2-early day 3 area.

I’m feeling a best available OL between #25-#50 overall arena (possibly in conjunction with a day 3 selection if necessary). Ideal would be another OL with length that has successfully played OT, along with at least 1 more position. I like having a strong OL for both Run as Pass and we would then have lots of depth.
If we could free up some more cap and get semi aggressive with a deal on Casey Hayward or someone similar that’s plug n play who might consider a
5-8mil annual range? Then I’d use our remaining top draft selections in some capacity to go after a DL early or finally nail a legit long term WR.
FA.. CB

1. OT
2. DT
3. LB
4a WR
4b. RB
5a Etc..
5b